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Old 2012-05-01, 19:07   Link #30481
Nightmare637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
Basically Cao Cao is an extremist who thinks anything goes for reaching his final goal.
If that road is paved with the bodies of other humans, so be it. He thinks his way is the true way, reinforced by the knowledge he has TL, the will of God of the bible.
He is meticulous and plans ahead for every step of the way to reach there, but in the end he's nothing more than an extremist following his own notions of grandeur. For him, "heroes" are humans that kill legendary monsters. As such, he goes out of his way to kill said legends.
He's a dangerous fellow and should be dealt with permanently, that's how I see it.
You just discribed all our military leaders in the world including america(but instead of monsters there other people) The history of the world is paved atop the bodies of the fallen, so if you ask me Cao cao is a very realistic hero all things considered.

iK@r0s@ Your forgetting Cao cao isen't the "main" boss that would be ophis, and even though we all love her i doubt she'd see a problem with experimentation if another gave her the ide that it would further her goal.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:09   Link #30482
Awrya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Log View Post
Not confirmed to be Cao Cao so I wouldn't assume anything yet.
Remember that shadow sg user in Vol. 9? He had one of Ophis's snakes in his sg and he serves Cao Cao.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vol. 7 New life
"Cao Cao, I think we're going to be discovered."
"Really, is that so. Oh well, that's fine. We've gathered enough talent, let's enter the next phase."
"Right. Our preparations are almost complete, it's time."
"--Good, so who should we approach first?"
"Let's start outside to break apart the alliance, how's that?"
"Of course. Total war is no longer popular, that's why the Old Maou faction lost.
First start with diplomacy. Siegfried."
"Understood. Defeating Maou, Demonic Beasts and Dragons."
"Has always been the job of heroes and warriors."
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:13   Link #30483
Darth SpiderDen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare637 View Post
You just discribed all our military leaders in the world including america(but instead of monsters there other people) The history of the world is paved atop the bodies of the fallen, so if you ask me Cao cao is a very realistic hero all things considered.

iK@r0s@ Your forgetting Cao cao isen't the "main" boss that would be ophis, and even though we all love her i doubt she'd see a problem with experimentation if another gave her the ide that it would further her goal.
That's not a Hero.
That's just another human aiming at the top position.
The only thing setting him apart from regular humans is the SG and power that comes from it and knowledge of the mythological entities.
Other than that he just thinks he's something more when basically he's the same. Just another human with power.
No "hero", no "great warrior", just a battle-maniac going at it creating conflict when there was no need for that, only for his owns delusions and view-points.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:13   Link #30484
Nightmare637
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Originally Posted by Awrya View Post
Remember that shadow sg user in Vol. 9? He had one of Ophis's snakes in his sg and he serves Cao Cao.
and all of chaos brigade follows ophis and i see the word "Diplomacy" in there.

now explain to me why someone as evil as you all describe seek Diplomacy hmm?

Darth SpiderDen@ your "Hero" doesen't exist, heros like superman are pure fallacy and there actions in real life would lead to self-destruction.(just look at issei his actions in vol.11 led to his death, he was lucky GR was there or Cao cao would have won)

Eliminating a few lives for the whole of a species is a small price in the greater picture.

no one can survive that way any great leader will tell you that.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:18   Link #30485
Darth SpiderDen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare637 View Post
and all of chaos brigade follows ophis and i see the word "Diplomacy" in there.

now explain to me why someone as evil as you all describe seek Diplomacy hmm?
He's being ironical in the use of the word. Instead of coming out and declaring open-war like the old-Maou faction, he would start by the inside and destroying the newly-formed alliance in order for conflict to once again reign and to test his own powers and strength.
Causing something that could led to an all-out war between angels, fallen-angels and devils to test your power his kinda evil I think.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:19   Link #30486
Log
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
That's not a Hero.
That's just another human aiming at the top position.
The only thing setting him apart from regular humans is the SG and power that comes from it and knowledge of the mythological entities.
Other than that he just thinks he's something more when basically he's the same. Just another human with power.
No "hero", no "great warrior", just a battle-maniac going at it creating conflict when there was no need for that, only for his owns delusions and view-points.
Hero depends on your interpertation of things. Anybody that kills millions to defend their country are renowned as "heros" while the other side calls them monsters. Realistically real heros are almost non-exsistent in history.

Also take note that Cao Cao seems to be taking his ancestors definition of hero and the actual Cao Cao's definition of hero doesn't fit with what people typically see heroes as.

Again you don't have anything definite to nail Cao Cao for. Everything you mentioned are just vague interpertations coming from a biased view.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:19   Link #30487
Darth SpiderDen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare637 View Post
and all of chaos brigade follows ophis and i see the word "Diplomacy" in there.

now explain to me why someone as evil as you all describe seek Diplomacy hmm?

Darth SpiderDen@ your "Hero" doesen't exist, heros like superman are pure fallacy and there actions in real life would lead to self-destruction.(just look at issei his actions in vol.11 led to his death, he was lucky GR was there or Cao cao would have won)

Eliminating a few lives for the whole of a species is a small price in the greater picture.

no one can survive that way any great leader will tell you that.
Especially when your species is in no risk at all.
Really, that's the time where you start eliminating a few lives.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:21   Link #30488
Log
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
Especially when your species is in no risk at all.
Really, that's the time where you start eliminating a few lives.
And how do we know humans aren't at stake? Look at my "alternative interpertion" post a page back.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:23   Link #30489
Nightmare637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
Especially when your species is in no risk at all.
Really, that's the time where you start eliminating a few lives.
Did you read Logs post at all?

There are a bunch of beings that could wipe out this species on a whim.

So your saying that he should have waited for them to just one day say lets destroy humanity.

There is no way he'd know how they think so Humanity is always on the cutting board in his eyes, so he tried to get rid of that potential danger.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:25   Link #30490
Darth SpiderDen
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Everything is biased.
Your entire view of the world and universe is biased. If you got there, then you find out no interpretation is valid and reality is something we say it's there with no real proof of it.
I'm just stating my opinion. Of course heroes don't exist in the real world.
It's just that seeing a character like Cao Cao, that knows how the world of the LN works and functions, knows what is happening there, is intelligent and still decides to take the route he chose just makes me feel some sort of hatred and displeasure towards the character itself.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:28   Link #30491
Log
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
Everything is biased.
Your entire view of the world and universe is biased. If you got there, then you find out no interpretation is valid and reality is something we say it's there with no real proof of it.
I'm just stating my opinion. Of course heroes don't exist in the real world.
It's just that seeing a character like Cao Cao, that knows how the world of the LN works and functions, knows what is happening there, is intelligent and still decides to take the route he chose just makes me feel some sort of hatred and displeasure towards the character itself.
I agree. Everything is just based on your opinion of characters by how they act. I'm just saying that until we know Cao Cao's character for sure we shouldn't go on a hate rampage against him.

Also we don't know the full extent of what Cao Cao understands. For all we know he has been brainwashed from a young age to believe all devils are bad.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:30   Link #30492
Nightmare637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
Everything is biased.
Your entire view of the world and universe is biased. If you got there, then you find out no interpretation is valid and reality is something we say it's there with no real proof of it.
I'm just stating my opinion. Of course heroes don't exist in the real world.
It's just that seeing a character like Cao Cao, that knows how the world of the LN works and functions, knows what is happening there, is intelligent and still decides to take the route he chose just makes me feel some sort of hatred and displeasure towards the character itself.
Yes i'm biased and so are you so please don't act like your unbiased and i'm not since also in reality there is no such thing as a unbiased opinion.

And who said Cao cao understands everything?

Do you understand everthing about the world you live in? no you don't

Cao cao is just a human with power, in more ways then one he is one of the most selfless humans ever.

because i can guarentee you if you or anyone else had that power they woulden't do shit for nobody. Plus what other route do you see? because i don't see it

Log@ agree, Indra said himself that hes had an eye on him so whos to say he diden't push in a cerain direction, or that some event in his past caused his hatred, we'll never know until it's explained so theres no point on hating on someone you don't even try to understand.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:32   Link #30493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare637 View Post
Yes i'm biased and so are you so please don't act like your unbiased and i'm not since also in reality there is no such thing as a unbiased opinion.

And who said Cao cao understands everything?

Do you understand everthing about the world you live in? no you don't

Cao cao is just a human with power, in more ways then one he is one of the most selfless humans ever.

because i can guarentee you if you or anyone else had that power they woulden't do shit for nobody. Plus what other route do you see? because i don't see it
I think assuming "he's one of the selfless humans ever" is to much. We don't have any evidence to assume he's good and we don't have enough evidence to assume he's bad.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:32   Link #30494
Darth SpiderDen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Log View Post
I agree. Everything is just based on your opinion of characters by how they act. I'm just saying that until we know Cao Cao's character for sure we shouldn't go on a hate rampage against him.

Also we don't know the full extent of what Cao Cao understands. For all we know he has been brainwashed from a young age to believe all devils are bad.
May be, but he seems pretty knowledgeable on how the universe of the LN works, what players exist there and how to manipulate events to his own plans.
Brainwashing to believe all devils are evil already exists in the LN - the Church and exorcists from it.
Besides, he considers all beings capable of wiping out humanity on a whim as adversaries that he would like to take on, not just devils.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:35   Link #30495
Mars Mode
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Some of this beings probably have existed since the begining of time and they probably had wars among themselves, and they havent wiped humanity at all.

Yet humans have existed how many years, and they are in a state where they could end up wiping themselves clean.

What Reynaly did was bad, bur she didnt kill any human unrelated unfortunately. Ise may be unrelated and all but he did have the BG.

Cao Cao has complete knowledge of everything, if he didnt gathering the Longinus users is imposible.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:35   Link #30496
Nightmare637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Log View Post
I think assuming "he's one of the selfless humans ever" is to much. We don't have any evidence to assume he's good and we don't have enough evidence to assume he's bad.
ok maybe i went a little far but using power to help someone else is a very rare thing all over the world especialy that everyone helping another whants something in return.

Mars Mode@ he isen't a god his knowledge is limited at best, and whose to say how long this has been going on and that the Longinous users weren't part of Chaos brigade before he joined.

So no theres lots of other ways he could have met them other then finding them.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:38   Link #30497
Darth SpiderDen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare637 View Post
ok maybe i went a little far but using power to help someone else is a very rare thing all over the world especialy that everyone helping another whants something in return.
I don't think Cao Cao is using his power for the greater good.
He's been seen (at least in my point of view) creating fights to ascertain his own power level and he has shown (again I think he has) signs of seeking battle for his own personal reasons.
The whole notion of heroes killing legendary beings is more of an excuse for him to carry out his own personal plans.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:40   Link #30498
Log
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth SpiderDen View Post
May be, but he seems pretty knowledgeable on how the universe of the LN works, what players exist there and how to manipulate events to his own plans.
Brainwashing to believe all devils are evil already exists in the LN - the Church and exorcists from it.
Besides, he considers all beings capable of wiping out humanity on a whim as adversaries that he would like to take on, not just devils.
It never said that he considers beings that are capable of wiping out humanity as adversaries he would take on.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars Mode View Post
Some of this beings probably have existed since the begining of time and they probably had wars among themselves, and they havent wiped humanity at all.

Yet humans have existed how many years, and they are in a state where they could end up wiping themselves clean.

What Reynaly did was bad, bur she didnt kill any human unrelated unfortunately. Ise may be unrelated and all but he did have the BG.

Cao Cao has complete knowledge of everything, if he didnt gathering the Longinus users is imposible.
They were to busy fighting among themselves. What would happen if myths unionfied and started attacking their only target left: humans. Plus if even 1% of myths are real then gods are real jerkasses that killed many humans.

It wasn't just Reynalle. Diotroth has been kidnapping and raping nuns. These are only two incidents. Who knows how much mysteries killings and dispperence happened because of myth creatures.

Just because he gathered longinus users doesn't indicate knowledge so I'm not sure we're your going with that.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:40   Link #30499
Mistic
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no he wants to wipe out everything that doesn't follow his way of thinking and will hurt anyone if it makes his plans easier. He is a believer in the idea that the end will justify any means used to obtain it no matter how vile.
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Old 2012-05-01, 19:42   Link #30500
Log
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Originally Posted by Mistic View Post
no he wants to wipe out everything that doesn't follow his way of thinking and will hurt anyone if it makes his plans easier. He is a believer in the idea that the end will justify any means used to obtain it no matter how vile.
And yet we don't know what he wants to obtain. If he really thinks myths are a threat to humanity then in his eyes he is justified.

Would you say someone like Lelouch is evil because he killed tens of thousands to obtain world peace?
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