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Old 2013-04-26, 16:21   Link #61
kyp275
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
Art is hideous. Won't buy, ever.

I'm not even talking about objectification. This goes beyond Gag Boobs. Everyone looks like a deformed mutant. It's horrible and ugly.

I'll stick to Ys for my hack-and-slash action, thanks.
/shrug, your loss.
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Old 2013-04-26, 16:32   Link #62
Xagzan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vigo View Post
Schreier is a tool and nothing more. First writing an insulting blog post (I refuse to call it article) and then acting as a victim and white knight. What a joke.

But what can you expect from someone who calls part of the Sorceress "lolicon fantasy".

Can't believe Kamitani apologized. At least he is the better man.
You do realize his first response was a pretty puerile gay joke
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Old 2013-04-26, 16:38   Link #63
kyp275
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Originally Posted by Xagzan View Post
You do realize his first response was a pretty puerile gay joke
no more than the original kotaku article, if anything, I consider that article to be the more insulting of the two.
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Old 2013-04-26, 16:45   Link #64
Xagzan
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If you mean the 14 year old boy comment, I'd hardly call that an article either (though I also wouldn't call it more insulting than tongue in cheek gay bashing). But regarding his subsequent, more fleshed out post, I agree with what Syn said in the other thread about him having a point.
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Old 2013-04-26, 16:56   Link #65
kyp275
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Originally Posted by Xagzan View Post
But regarding his subsequent, more fleshed out post, I agree with what Syn said in the other thread about him having a point.
I haven't seen anything posted by him that can be considered "fleshed out", it's basically just a continuation of him going "lololol i iz right".

Is there a point to be made? of course, is cherry-picking designs from DC and bash it w/o the proper context the way to go? no.
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Old 2013-04-26, 17:07   Link #66
Vigo
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Game Developers Really Need To Stop Letting Teenage Boys Design Their Characters
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As you can see, the sorceress was designed by a 14-year-old boy. Perhaps game development studios should stop hiring teenagers? At least they're cheap, I guess
That's supposed to be not insulting? Seriously? Give me a break.

Kamitanis reaction was not really mature but I sure can understand. I would have reacted much worse. It was a jab at Schreier and nothing more that was overblown because the latter had to act all offended as if he was a victim. Kamitani already apologized on Facebook.


What more fleshed out article? All of his points view the Sorceress in a vacuum. He ignores everything else about the game. No context, he cherry picks what fits his agenda, insults people that like this game, ignores every criticism thrown at him, gives some straw man arguments or pulls shit out of his ass (lolicon fantasy lol). And because people are not agreeing with him he acts all offended and runs off to twitter. Just go to Neogaf and read his post there. Guy is a joke.

That doesn't mean that there is not a deeper problem in the industry that should be ignored but DC is certainty not the game that should be the target. And especially not in this batant and ignorant way Schreier does.
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Old 2013-04-26, 17:15   Link #67
cronnoponno
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I think if they didn't respond with a gay joke he wouldn't have any grounds to stand on at all.


The mere fact that it was homosexual content is just a big trigger, also it's clear it was a joke because anyone seriously hoping to sit there and draw a bunch of burly men on each other would get his ability to draw such ''gay'' art so well laughed at and the entire insult would backfire.

I think he makes some good points, but I also think he got REALLY lucky that the joke-jab they gave to him was a gay joke, because that gave him a little more credibility in the eyes of some people.
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Old 2013-04-26, 17:38   Link #68
kyp275
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Originally Posted by cronnoponno View Post
also it's clear it was a joke because anyone seriously hoping to sit there and draw a bunch of burly men on each other would get his ability to draw such ''gay'' art so well laughed at and the entire insult would backfire.
Actually, those 3 dwarves was not drawn in response to the kotaku article, but something Kamitani already drew:

Quote:
In regards to the Dwarf image I posted on my Facebook page: This image was never intended to attack Jason. Originally, it was a promotional image that I created for my fan base in Japan, which I posted to the official Vanillaware Twitter account earlier.

We receive many requests from companies to create publicity illustrations for the game, but we never received any requests for the Dwarf. Also, as the game’s street date nears, most retail shops start requesting exclusive art for their retailer-exclusive bonus items. In Japan, these illustration requests can even be as specific as something like female characters in swimwear. In these requests as well, the Dwarf was nowhere to be seen.

So, I decided to unofficially draw a sweaty Dwarf in a bathing suit, with a bit of cynicism towards those retailer requests. I drew 3 of them to show that there are character color variations available.

However, this image is something I created on my own, and will not see the light of day in any publication. I felt it was a shame to just throw it out, and thought I’d just post it on my own Facebook. That’s when I remembered Jason’s article and thought that I’d post it as a little joke with a comment. I used an automated translator to try and make a lighthearted joke in English, but clearly that wasn’t the case. I was very surprised to see the crazy aftermath.
It is my firm believe that extremist/over-zealous pursuit of any ideals is generally counter-productive to their goal, this includes the everything-must-be-up-to-my-standard-of-political-correctness crowd. I'm sympathetic to women's right and I very much believe in equal rights for all regardless of race, gender, religion and sexual orientation. But stunts like this only makes me annoyed at these "feminists", and inspires me to do little more than thinking "lolwtf? gtfo".
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Old 2013-04-26, 18:39   Link #69
kyouray
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vigo View Post
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dof0X3EP75s

About time. The best character in the game
This Elf video is convincing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vigo View Post
Schreier is a tool and nothing more. First writing an insulting blog post (I refuse to call it article) and then acting as a victim and white knight. What a joke.

But what can you expect from someone who calls part of the Sorceress "lolicon fantasy".

Can't believe Kamitani apologized. At least he is the better man.
Kamitani is sure a nice guy to explain himself like this after these insultings posts.
I can understand the design isn't everyone's tastes but some interpretations are ridiculous. People are making a fuss about the design and it's really sad, the game doesn't need this kind of promotion. I hope it won't compromise overseas releases of some future japanese games.
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Old 2013-04-26, 21:40   Link #70
synaesthetic
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Streisand Effect will go into full play. The game will sell more as a result. Bad publicity is just as good as good publicity to a skilled marketing team.
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Old 2013-04-26, 23:03   Link #71
RRW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
Streisand Effect will go into full play. The game will sell more as a result. Bad publicity is just as good as good publicity to a skilled marketing team.
taalking about publicity . i am kinda astonish amount of doujin and fanart BEFORE the game released
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Old 2013-04-27, 03:29   Link #72
demino_hellsin
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Double standard at its finest... Rag on the huge jugs but not on the overly burly men. A controversy over something so obviously stupidly clear design choice. The image was most probably a little out of line, but the fact this even started makes me smash my head through my keyboard and computer table. Sorry to media majors about people demonizing media but it is what it is, a hodge-podge of people just wanting article traffic. If they have genuine concerns of women being objectified, go hunt down people who actually treat real women like proprty instead of teenagers oggling 2D images. Ibm sure that's a lot more productive.
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Old 2013-04-27, 03:55   Link #73
kyp275
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Originally Posted by demino_hellsin View Post
Double standard at its finest... Rag on the huge jugs but not on the overly burly men. A controversy over something so obviously stupidly clear design choice. The image was most probably a little out of line, but the fact this even started makes me smash my head through my keyboard and computer table. Sorry to media majors about people demonizing media but it is what it is, a hodge-podge of people just wanting article traffic. If they have genuine concerns of women being objectified, go hunt down people who actually treat real women like proprty instead of teenagers oggling 2D images. Ibm sure that's a lot more productive.
this comment I saw in another site sums it up pretty well:

Quote:
"The same Kotaku that regularly dedicates articles to creepily oogling near-naked cosplayers and anime figures.

The same Kotaku that's a part of Gawker, which runs a PORN site called fleshbot.

To tie it all together, a small tabloid blog network that oogles near-naked women and anime figures AND runs a porn website wants to regulate video games to make fictional women cover the fuck up.

The biggest, most female-objectifying pot (Gawker) in games journalism is calling a small kettle (Vanillaware) black."
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Old 2013-04-27, 07:01   Link #74
demino_hellsin
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Also, Schrier says women gaming journalists are regularly asked if they actually play videogames. When I personally want to ask EVERY SINGLE living soul that calls themselves GAMING JOURNALISTS if they actually play videogames. True that there might be sexism involved with that but generally it's an issue of competency. Gender roles be damned, if you're doing something that you were meant to do then do it right, if you are doing something that you aren't meant to do then show'em why you belong. Either way you have a reason to push yourself so do so.

The man gets a column to express his views, it's a little insulting. I guess that's cool. He gets paidback and he goes public with this nonsense. I'm not sure who's really wrong anymore.
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Old 2013-04-27, 15:49   Link #75
Shadow5YA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
Streisand Effect will go into full play. The game will sell more as a result. Bad publicity is just as good as good publicity to a skilled marketing team.
Tell that to Ninja Theory and DmC
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Old 2013-04-27, 19:04   Link #76
kenjiharima
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Kinda reminds me of Dungeon Fighter and Dungeons and Dragons.

Oh and yes the witch is the best
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Old 2013-04-27, 22:29   Link #77
Xion Valkyrie
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Tell that to Ninja Theory and DmC
I think the difference is, before this debacle most people haven't even heard of Vanillaware or Dragon Crown. The niche audience that was going to buy it in the first place aren't going to not buy it just because of the controversy. However, now that this game has had mainstream exposure more people are likely to buy it, especially if they don't buy the argument that Kotaku is making.

Compared to DMC where it was their core audience they were alienating.
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Old 2013-04-28, 01:53   Link #78
demino_hellsin
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the biggest difference is that Vanillaware dude isn't digging his own grave. He got janned, he threw a playful one back. Everyone started crowding around expecting a fight, he quickly backed out before thigns got out of hand. At the very least people have now crowded around. That is the effect Xion is prolly referring to.
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Old 2013-04-28, 13:24   Link #79
Jazzrat
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Kotaku, the shining beacon of yellow journalism. It's not like all Vanillaware's female character have melon tits and all these sexism issue in videogame is starting to turn retarded. How about they focus on the actual writing of a female characters, booth babes, unprofessional after expo party events or getting more women into gaming industry..

oh wait, it's Kotaku... it's like reading british tabloid.
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Old 2013-04-29, 01:34   Link #80
Soliloquy
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Tell that to Ninja Theory and DmC
It is also quite ironic too, the only girl in that Game Kat turned out to play the damsel in distress other than that she was bland and no one said much about that. Really I don't understand these moral crusaders.

Why can't they just shut up and turn the blind eye on it if they don't like the artwork? I personally don't even blame Kotaku since they lost all their credibility long time ago, it's these gamers who defend these journalists like they are not guilty at all. Game industry makes me
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