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Old 2012-07-01, 15:12   Link #1741
tsunade666
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Teru playing first is already a surprised for me because the whole point of Saki going to nationals is too fight her but Saki is captain and Teru is vanguard. They won't be able to match up. Plus on the first season where Saki isn't even getting serious or not even planning to go on nationals in the individual matches. What if Nodoka didn't gave her a wake up call. Then she won't be even playing against her sister.

So seeing Sumire playing 2nd doesn't surprise me at all. Though she is probably a power house too. I think the whole Shiratodai are power house on their own. Its more choking time.
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Old 2012-07-01, 15:54   Link #1742
Sol Falling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsunade666 View Post
Awesome finally for the series run. That 3 turns ahead is really something though it looks like Toki didn't expect Kuro to call riichi but she expect for her to finally let go of her dora. And I don't understand on the part about Teru's reaction on Kuro's discarded tile. I din't play majhong so I can't tell but it looks like she can ron it? based on the commentator but from what the pro said its because of her ability. She didn't see her letting go of dora base on her analyzes.

Finally Achiga and Nodoka met though it didn't felt much because they depart a lot sooner and its because of Shizu. She really want to met them at the finals. OH God poor girl. Will get curb stomp by Saki. Though it looks like their is a small fire on Shizu even not not a tornado or lightning storm from the miyanaga sisters.

And Saki is still moping around and here I thought she will met her sister >_>

Teru having a reaction to the fallen Toki!!!! its good that she still cares on her prey.
Regarding the specific mechanism by which Teru played into Kuro's hand:

- Okay so first of all, you of course remember that at the start of the battle, Teru used her "mirror" ability to analyse the playstyles/abilities of every player in the game. So on that basis Teru realized (not only that Kuro would get all of the dora, in every game, but also) that Kuro would never discard any dora.

- So in that last match later on in the game, Teru managed to reach tempai and had the opportunity to call riichi. At this point Teru's hand was:

So, there were a number of possibilities Teru could have chosen to discard for her riichi. For example, if Teru had discarded the 7 pin, she would have had:
456 678 67
And would therefore be waiting for either a 5 or an 8 to complete the last straight to win. Alternatively, we have the option Teru did end up choosing, which was to discard the 4 pin. This left:
567 678 67
Which as you can see leaves the same wait for Teru, either 5 or 8. Finally, though, we have a last possibility, which was discarding the 8 pin. This would have left:
45 666 777
Which as you can see leaves her waiting on either a 3 or a 6 to complete the first triplet. However, regarding the 6s you can see that Teru already had three of them in her hand, making it unlikely for her to draw the last one, and similarly, the 3 pin for this game was actually the dora, which would be hoarded by Kuro. Since Teru knew that it was unlikely that Kuro would ever play one of the dora, Teru decided to use the other wait because this one would be useless.

So basically in this scenario, Teru chose a hand which wasn't dependent on the dora hoarded by Kuro. Furthermore, because Teru is forced by her playstyle to keep increasing the value of her winning hands consecutively, Teru called riichi in order to increase the points she would get for winning. Recall that, if you call riichi, your hand becomes locked in and you can no longer change your wait.

Anyway, so basically because of this assumption, when Kuro actually did play the dora, it was a safe tile. If Teru had chosen a different wait, she would have ronned and won off of Kuro. Alternatively, since by discarding the dora Kuro managed to reach tempai, this also meant that Kuro could win at any moment and thus put an end to Teru's streak. In particular: because Teru had declared riichi, in the case that Teru drew Kuro's winning tyle, she would have to discard it and therefore play into Kuro's hand.
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Old 2012-07-01, 16:02   Link #1743
Proto
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Old 2012-07-01, 16:27   Link #1744
Kyuu
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Hell. If Teru was feeling bossy -- she'd take a shot @ getting Suu Ankou.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
- Okay so first of all, you of course remember that at the start of the battle, Teru used her "mirror" ability to analyse the playstyles/abilities of every player in the game. So on that basis Teru realized (not only that Kuro would get all of the dora, in every game, but also) that Kuro would never discard any dora.
Funny thing about Mirror. I don't remember Teru invoking it other than after the first hand. Yet, I don't know if it is an "always on" ability. Right now, my mind is too centered on Toki to even remember.
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Old 2012-07-01, 17:00   Link #1745
The Green One
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This is from the Achiga news website.


放送時間変更のお知らせ
2012
6.28
カテゴリ:おしらせ
Twitterにツイートする Facebookでシェアする はてなブックマーク

放送時間変更のお知らせになります。

テレビ北海道(TVh)
7/6(金)26:23~26:53 *通常より30分押し

It's apparently talking about something airing this Friday. I can't really translate it well enough to determine what specifically but it's about "Airtime modification". The new timeslot for the remaining three episodes of the anime perhaps?
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Old 2012-07-01, 17:08   Link #1746
kona~chan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
Regarding the specific mechanism by which Teru played into Kuro's hand:

- Okay so first of all, you of course remember that at the start of the battle, Teru used her "mirror" ability to analyse the playstyles/abilities of every player in the game. So on that basis Teru realized (not only that Kuro would get all of the dora, in every game, but also) that Kuro would never discard any dora.

- So in that last match later on in the game, Teru managed to reach tempai and had the opportunity to call riichi. At this point Teru's hand was:

So, there were a number of possibilities Teru could have chosen to discard for her riichi. For example, if Teru had discarded the 7 pin, she would have had:
456 678 67
And would therefore be waiting for either a 5 or an 8 to complete the last straight to win. Alternatively, we have the option Teru did end up choosing, which was to discard the 4 pin. This left:
567 678 67
Which as you can see leaves the same wait for Teru, either 5 or 8. Finally, though, we have a last possibility, which was discarding the 8 pin. This would have left:
45 666 777
Which as you can see leaves her waiting on either a 3 or a 6 to complete the first triplet. However, regarding the 6s you can see that Teru already had three of them in her hand, making it unlikely for her to draw the last one, and similarly, the 3 pin for this game was actually the dora, which would be hoarded by Kuro. Since Teru knew that it was unlikely that Kuro would ever play one of the dora, Teru decided to use the other wait because this one would be useless.

So basically in this scenario, Teru chose a hand which wasn't dependent on the dora hoarded by Kuro. Furthermore, because Teru is forced by her playstyle to keep increasing the value of her winning hands consecutively, Teru called riichi in order to increase the points she would get for winning. Recall that, if you call riichi, your hand becomes locked in and you can no longer change your wait.

Anyway, so basically because of this assumption, when Kuro actually did play the dora, it was a safe tile. If Teru had chosen a different wait, she would have ronned and won off of Kuro. Alternatively, since by discarding the dora Kuro managed to reach tempai, this also meant that Kuro could win at any moment and thus put an end to Teru's streak. In particular: because Teru had declared riichi, in the case that Teru drew Kuro's winning tyle, she would have to discard it and therefore play into Kuro's hand.
just a little add, don't forget she also had haneman ( 6/7 han) restriction for this hand.
from that hand alone she already guaranteed with riichi (1), honitsu(3), and chun(1), she need at least one yaku more for her to able to win
and also when she did declare riichi with discarded 8 pin she actually also have wait for pei too and had the potential for san an kou (2) yaku as well but since all the 6 pin and pei already shown in the table (just look closely at the kirame's and toki's discard piles) so the only hope for her to win is 3 pin with most unlikely will come because of kuro's ability.

and by discarding 4 pin she got iipekou (1) yaku that she need, make her hand had 5 and 8 pin wait with guaranteed haneman no matter she got it by herself or from other player discard.

cmiiw
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Old 2012-07-01, 17:57   Link #1747
Peanutbutter
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Good episode. Well, what Kuro can do was basically that. And we see Teru's control is not absolute either.

Actually, Shiraitodai's lineup has been revealed more or less throughout the anime:

Teru - 1st (West Tokyo Preliminaries)
Sumire - 2nd (in the playing records Yumi gave to Hisa)
Awai - 5th (West Tokyo Preliminaries)

The other two has also been revealed in their exact positions, except that's a manga reveal, not anime.

Poor Toki. But it's rather obvious now.

Spoiler:
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Old 2012-07-01, 18:00   Link #1748
Myssa Rei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyuu View Post
Funny thing about Mirror. I don't remember Teru invoking it other than after the first hand. Yet, I don't know if it is an "always on" ability.
It doesn't seem so, since Teru uses that first glimpse to tailor her tactics for the rest of the match. It's why she seems to have been genuinely surprised that Kuro discared a dora tile when she did.
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Old 2012-07-01, 18:06   Link #1749
King-Slayer
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Wow Toki's barely hanging on isn't she? Teru being suprised by Kuro and eventually Toki's condition was shocking to me because that may be the first time she's showed any kind of emotion (the real teru). I also thought it pretty cool that Kuro finally decieded it was time to part with a dora and she finally kicked ass.
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Old 2012-07-01, 18:25   Link #1750
Julio C
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Did the show finally end? This is one of the shows I put on hold until the season is over. I got all the episodes so far, but haven't seen it. How is the show turning out? What's good about it and what's bad about it without spoiling anything major?
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Old 2012-07-01, 19:01   Link #1751
Soraya21
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Great episode. That Teru, man. You know you're an absolute beast when the other players conspiring against you are just happy to survive and/or take one hand away from you.

Though the MVP of these past few episodes has definitely been Toki. Just loved the scene of Teru picking up Kuro's winning tile. The green backdrop, her staredown from across the table, everything about it does a good job in emphasizing that it was Toki who fully orchestrated the end of the champion's winning streak.

And even though it's highly unlikely, I would love it if the author broke manga protocol and allowed Senriyama to advance into the finals instead of Achiga.
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Old 2012-07-01, 19:29   Link #1752
Kyuu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myssa Rei View Post
It doesn't seem so, since Teru uses that first glimpse to tailor her tactics for the rest of the match. It's why she seems to have been genuinely surprised that Kuro discared a dora tile when she did.
Thus, in a sense, in order to beat Teru -- just do a change up.
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Old 2012-07-01, 19:34   Link #1753
Scarletknive
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyuu View Post
Thus, in a sense, in order to beat Teru -- just do a change up.
... That will be a problem with those constant skill abilities without any backfires...

In Kuro's case, she doesn't discard the doras at all during her playthrough before the last. So Teru has no surprise since thats is according to plan. However, once she throw the dora, not only she was surprised, the tornado spin has been stopped... But if its tacos, hmm... She will have good data that she is good at the East round and there is no way to change it...

Oh, when you have Veda added inside Setsuna's 00 Raiser GN Sword 3(Constant Trans-am Burst), you get this!

Spoiler for 12, photoshopped with many Ikedas...:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Not just any change up, something that you would (normally) never do.
Yeah, if you change up with constant skill ability, there is no way to beat Teru... Thats why, to beat her, you must not have:
1. constant ability skill, that includes upgrades.(E.g Toki.)
2. No ability at all...(e.g Kirame)

The only people that FITS the bill is those who can get their skill backfired that they have to continue their old ways.(E.g Kuro)
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Old 2012-07-01, 19:34   Link #1754
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Not just any change up, something that you would (normally) never do.
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Old 2012-07-01, 19:55   Link #1755
Kyuu
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Yep. Tacos will cost Kiyosumi the win. Damn, this conceited Kugimiya character.
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Old 2012-07-01, 20:01   Link #1756
Qilin
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Now that I've seen the complete subbed version, I have a whole lot more to say.

Firstly, I'd say that some of the the highlights of the episode for me were the different changes in Teru's facial expression. I mean, after watching her violate everyone for three whole episodes, seeing some humanity in her is a bit of a surprise. Still, I'm not just going to hastily assume that she was concerned over her fallen foe, but then again, I guess it's a perfectly normal reaction.

Whatever the case, she still qualifies as this series' most badass character. In fact, she's probably the one character that takes Saki and Koromo's "table control" to whole new levels. Her only vulnerability is when she declares riichi.

The whole reunion between Nodoka and team Achiga felt very underwhelming, but on the other hand, it looks like Achiga has a renewed determination to win. This is probably going to be another case of "speaking through mahjong".

The same determination could probably be applied to Senriyama. I can already imagine the delicious tears that would fall once Senriyama loses the victory that their ace risked her very life to obtain.

Lastly, we will finally get to see Sumire in action, and from the looks of it, she's going to be just as deadpan as Teru is at the mahjong table.

And to close off this reaction post, here's a bit of unintentional comedy on the episode's part:
Spoiler for size:
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Old 2012-07-01, 20:02   Link #1757
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Spoiler for final thoughts:
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Old 2012-07-01, 20:04   Link #1758
Kyuu
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Originally Posted by Qilin View Post
The whole reunion between Nodoka and team Achiga felt very underwhelming, but on the other hand, it looks like Achiga has a renewed determination to win. This is probably going to be another case of "speaking through mahjong".
It's like those awkward moments -- where you see an old friend... except that old friend is now associated with other people. Only way to make the encounter more awkward -- is to have Saki around. But, the Achigas already met her - somewhat.
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Old 2012-07-01, 20:24   Link #1759
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Excellent conclusion.

They did a great job of showcasing Toki (and her school) but while also letting Kuro and the Achiga girls have their moment in the sun. The way Toki's powers were displayed was truly fantastic and intense - I thought I was watching Fate/Zero or Madoka Magica for a few seconds there.

The way they humanized Teru was interesting, and actually surprising. I'm a bit divided on it, because I have to admit that "monster antagonist Teru" was really starting to grow on me, but on the other hand, showing some hints now of a kinder/more human Teru might be helpful in foreshadowing Teru and Saki eventually making up with one another (which presumably will happen).


I felt the Nodoka/Achiga reunion was as good as it could have been. Almost any conceivable Saki scene would have seemed anti-climatic after that match (and its immediate aftermath), so I don't think this could have been helped much. I thought it was a nice aftermath scene that did a good job of putting the final note on the TV airing of Saki Achiga-hen. That scene did a nice job of tying things back together, and reminding us of just what is pushing the Achiga girls forward (and it's good to have that reminder after a long match like this).


Anyway, I largely enjoyed Saki Achiga-hen. I'm not a fan of this "internet-only episodes aired long after the TV airing finishes" approach (I didn't like it with Bake, either), but this TV airing works reasonably well on its own anyway.
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Old 2012-07-01, 20:35   Link #1760
Scarletknive
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Excellent conclusion.

They did a great job of showcasing Toki (and her school) but while also letting Kuro and the Achiga girls have their moment in the sun. The way Toki's powers were displayed was truly fantastic and intense - I thought I was watching Fate/Zero or Madoka Magica for a few seconds there.

The way they humanized Teru was interesting, and actually surprising. I'm a bit divided on it, because I have to admit that "monster antagonist Teru" was really starting to grow on me, but on the other hand, showing some hints now of a kinder/more human Teru might be helpful in foreshadowing Teru and Saki eventually making up with one another (which presumably will happen).


I felt the Nodoka/Achiga reunion was as good as it could have been. Almost any conceivable Saki scene would have seemed anti-climatic after that match (and its immediate aftermath), so I don't think this could have been helped much. I thought it was a nice aftermath scene that did a good job of putting the finale note on the TV airing of Saki Achiga-hen. That scene did a nice job of tying things back together, and reminding us of just what is pushing the Achiga girls forward (and it's good to have that reminder after a long match like this).


Anyway, I largely enjoyed Saki Achiga-hen. I'm not a fan of this "internet-only episodes aired long after the TV airing finishes" approach (I didn't like it with Bake, either), but this TV airing works reasonably well on its own anyway.
Did you watch 00? What happen if you put Veda in 00 Raiser and 00 Raiser do a trans-am? I was shocked there when I see that look alike Trans-am Burst... I swear... That is too much Trans-am when she did the 2nd time... For that second there, I thought I am watching 00...

So all those answers cleared out...

Spoiler for The answer is...:


Though, yeah thats what I usually do though, throw the non-dora and keep the doras...
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