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Old 2013-09-01, 14:33   Link #3521
SHINOBI-03
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Join Date: May 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnimeFan188 View Post
During that episode, there's a brief scene where Killua looked like was pointing at
something on his brain scan. Maybe that was his first clue about what his brother
did to him.
You know what, you're right! Killua's brain does look like it's split from the front!
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Old 2013-09-01, 14:42   Link #3522
Arkeus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHINOBI-03 View Post
-EPISODE 94-
Spoiler for Gon's current age:
Actually, Gon was "Almost Twelve" in the hunter exam.
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Old 2013-09-02, 05:10   Link #3523
Toto y Moi
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The needle was def foreshadowed. I wish I had the time to upload a bunch of screencaps, but I'll just list some relevant info.

1. Killua's fight with Illumi in episode 20. When we're given Killua's POV, everything surrounding Illumi is distorted. Though Killua resists, the closer Illumi puts his hand toward Killua's forehead, the more his will starts to break.

2. Killua is exposed to Wing's aura. He's the first to run at the sign of danger, unlike Gon.

3. Gon and Killua are caught by the Phantom Troupe. Killua is seriously freaking out because he knows who the "Chain Dude" is and Nobunaga is keeping them until Chrollo comes back. If he's questioned again, it's over. As he's thinking about his follies, something strange happens: a voice enters his head.
[IMG][/IMG]

The formatting of the text shows a few things. For one, the speaker isn't the same as Killua's voice. The second point is that that same voice is overpowering his own thoughts and filling him with self doubt. Specifically, the voice is saying pretty much the exact same things as it did in this episode.

Flip back to volume 5 and you'll remember that it's Illumi's dialogue. But Killua's behavior in this scene is clearly irrational. He attempts to fight against his brother's words but ultimately fails and gives in...thereafter punching a wall and whispering to himself about the futility of even attempting to fight Nobunaga.

This scene is probably Togashi's biggest indication that something clearly isn't right with Killua, though he doesn't revisit it again until this arc.
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Old 2013-09-02, 06:09   Link #3524
Gan_HOPE326
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto y Moi View Post
The needle was def foreshadowed. I wish I had the time to upload a bunch of screencaps, but I'll just list some relevant info.

1. Killua's fight with Illumi in episode 20. When we're given Killua's POV, everything surrounding Illumi is distorted. Though Killua resists, the closer Illumi puts his hand toward Killua's forehead, the more his will starts to break.

2. Killua is exposed to Wing's aura. He's the first to run at the sign of danger, unlike Gon.

3. Gon and Killua are caught by the Phantom Troupe. Killua is seriously freaking out because he knows who the "Chain Dude" is and Nobunaga is keeping them until Chrollo comes back. If he's questioned again, it's over. As he's thinking about his follies, something strange happens: a voice enters his head.
[IMG][/IMG]

The formatting of the text shows a few things. For one, the speaker isn't the same as Killua's voice. The second point is that that same voice is overpowering his own thoughts and filling him with self doubt. Specifically, the voice is saying pretty much the exact same things as it did in this episode.

Flip back to volume 5 and you'll remember that it's Illumi's dialogue. But Killua's behavior in this scene is clearly irrational. He attempts to fight against his brother's words but ultimately fails and gives in...thereafter punching a wall and whispering to himself about the futility of even attempting to fight Nobunaga.

This scene is probably Togashi's biggest indication that something clearly isn't right with Killua, though he doesn't revisit it again until this arc.
If it's true, Togashi just got a little bit more amazing in my eyes. Anyone remembers if the brain MRI scene was in the manga too?
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Old 2013-09-02, 07:05   Link #3525
Clarste
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto y Moi View Post
The needle was def foreshadowed....
None of that stuff foreshadows a needle though. It foreshadows intense psychological issues, but nothing about the physical (or nen) needle embedded in his head. As far as I know no one was complaining about the psychological issues, which as you've noted were well foreshadowed, but instead they were complaining about the needle, which arguably is a too-simple resolution to Killua's entire character arc that started from the very beginning. Is Killua "cured" now? It was all the needle's fault so he'll have no more doubts from now on?
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Old 2013-09-02, 10:13   Link #3526
Dengar
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I think Toto's points were that his behavior at several points was irrational, hinting at someone tampering with him. Which ends up being the case. Ergo, the needle WAS foreshadowed, you just didn't know that it was a needle yet.
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Old 2013-09-02, 10:25   Link #3527
Clarste
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You don't need needles to be irrational though.
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Old 2013-09-02, 10:53   Link #3528
orion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHINOBI-03 View Post
You know what, you're right! Killua's brain does look like it's split from the front!
They're not images taken at the same level so you really can't compare them. Gon's image appears to be from a lower level than Killua's image. Plus you don't know the "normal" for that world setting.
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Old 2013-09-02, 13:27   Link #3529
Dengar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
You don't need needles to be irrational though.
Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it wasn't there.
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Old 2013-09-03, 16:18   Link #3530
zeniselv
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if hisoka fooled the spiders with its dokkiri texture, i dont think it would be hard for illumi to hide a needle even from killua in its own skull.
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Old 2013-09-03, 18:02   Link #3531
TooPurePureBoy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeniselv View Post
if hisoka fooled the spiders with its dokkiri texture, i dont think it would be hard for illumi to hide a needle even from killua in its own skull.
This.

I don't understand why people are having such a negative reaction to the needle. It makes perfect sense, and is even masterfully foreshadowed by Togashi in the earliest parts of the story.

Killua's (or the Illumi/mother faction at least) family have always sought to shelter and protect Killua (albeit in a twisted obsessive way). Manipulating his brother into staying away from danger fits Illumi's character perfectly.

As far as taking away from Killua's development... Huh?

He was able to focus and sense the foreign Nen of another user, that is a huge step for Killua's towards becoming a Pro Hunter.

The finding of the Needle symbolizes Killua taking yet another step towards surpassing his brother. He is almost his equal in the use of Nen. He just needs more battle experience. This is probably something Illumi knows and that's why he has left the needle in this long. He doesn't want his little Killua to grow up so fast and blow by him. Everyone in the family knows that Killua is the most talented of the Family in a long time. So it makes perfect sense that his doting (psycho) older brother would take steps to prevent him from getting too strong too fast.

It all makes perfect sense story wise.
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Old 2013-09-03, 22:41   Link #3532
Sugetsu
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So since this arc is supposed to spam for at least 40 episodes I assume we will be hearing from Hisoka, the spiders, Kilua and Leorio sometime soon. I am quite interested in how all of these characters will deal with the spider threat.
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Old 2013-09-04, 00:06   Link #3533
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asdagafgdafgasfgafgfadgagfafdgaes

Go Killua! You crazy son of a bitch! When he just pulled that shit out of his head, and was just time for epicness.

The bromance between the two is off the charts. I absolutely love their dynamic and find it endearing. Who says you need female characters and moe to pull something like that off? And lol @ Palm
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Old 2013-09-04, 09:47   Link #3534
Gan_HOPE326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TooPurePureBoy View Post
As far as taking away from Killua's development... Huh?
The idea is that it looks like a simple solution to a complex problem. The problem being Killua's education-induced fear of overwhelming opponents, the solution simply "oh well it was all a plot of his evil brother, now he's fine!". Which I don't think is really the case - I think the needle was just one more element, not the whole deal - but I can understand as a worry. Either way, I do believe this is the weakest part of Chimaera Ant arc for certain aspects. The part I am definitely looking forward to is the ending.
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Old 2013-09-04, 16:15   Link #3535
TooPurePureBoy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gan_HOPE326 View Post
The idea is that it looks like a simple solution to a complex problem. The problem being Killua's education-induced fear of overwhelming opponents, the solution simply "oh well it was all a plot of his evil brother, now he's fine!". Which I don't think is really the case - I think the needle was just one more element, not the whole deal - but I can understand as a worry. Either way, I do believe this is the weakest part of Chimaera Ant arc for certain aspects. The part I am definitely looking forward to is the ending.
Ok I can get that. People wanted a realistic solution to Killua's fear. The thing is though, Killua's fear was never realistic. It was out of character for him to be that afraid of strong people, even if he was trained as an assassin, not a warrior. It was always irrational and a little bit strange. Especially when we've all seen how overpowering Killua himself is for most. He was always sizing up his situation like someone impaired by an irrational sense of self preservation. This was always going to be because of a foreign nen manipulating him.

People who thought Killua's fear was a natural thing (myself included) were always going to be surprised by it being caused by Nen, but that's because we were forgetting what we were watching. All the little hints are there in the story, we just didn't see them till after.

Lets be clear though. There was nothing simple about killua pulling that needle out. He had to fight harder mentally than most people ever could. He had to stand there and take a terrible beating when every instinct told him to run. This desperation and mental strain was what allowed him to noting Illumi's needle. It wasn't easy or simple at all. I for one am glad Togashi didn't try and cure real human paranoia here. This story involves Nen so why not use it.
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Old 2013-09-04, 18:52   Link #3536
Guardian Enzo
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It never seemed unrealistic to me that Killua would have that fear. That it seemed so realistic was on of my favorite elements of his character.
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Old 2013-09-04, 18:55   Link #3537
Haak
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I even argued that it seemed totally rational when he met Pitou...
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Old 2013-09-04, 19:05   Link #3538
TooPurePureBoy
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Pitou and say Hisoka is one thing. Nobunaga and some of the other spiders while super dangerous really shouldn't have made Killua paralyzed with fear. He grew up next to insanely dangerous people like his grandfather and father (not to mention the rest) his nerves should be like steel.

Quote:
It never seemed unrealistic to me that Killua would have that fear. That it seemed so realistic was on of my favorite elements of his character.
I agree. It all felt totally realistic until we see the needle. Then looking back you can actually see where it was totally irrational. Togashi is really just that good.
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Old 2013-09-04, 19:27   Link #3539
Guardian Enzo
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Mmm kay...

Agree to disagree on this one. He is that good, but this isn't one of his shining moments.
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Old 2013-09-04, 20:22   Link #3540
TooPurePureBoy
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Then I will cordially agree to disagree.

I for one was happy to look back at all the little details that were in the story that I never noticed. It seems to be the general consensus of the interwebz that it was not so great so w/e I'll be on the outside on this one.

I have to ask though, what is it exactly you think Togashi should have done in this situation? If the pen is in your hand how does the story look different? What was it you wanted Killua to do in order to overcome his "fear"?
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