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Old 2011-12-06, 08:18   Link #61
Om Nerabdator
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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i can pick up around 20 words without subs, i have no idea about grammer and what not, but i know the most basic words like, amazing, monster,father,mother,sorry,thanks,idiot,girlfrien d etc
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Old 2011-12-06, 12:35   Link #62
JediNight
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Anime is a good general supplement to books, but a very poor replacement. You can learn general vocabulary from anime, but be very careful with trying to copy grammar or phrases. They are often rude, overly familiar, if you are a male watch for female speech styles, etc.

Things anime is good for:
- Learning proper pronunciation and fluency (suki is pronounced ski not sookey, etc)
- Picking up general vocabulary like nouns or verbs

You may be able to pick up some grammar/phrases, but just make sure you are looking up the phrase or words you hear before repeating them. Or if you happen to know a translator, ask them if they don't mind being bothered

Jeffrey's J-E Online Dictionary is my preferred search tool, but there are others:
http://www.gokanji.com/cgi-bin/j-e/utf8/dict

I believe the Genki book series is still the go-to text for beginning Japanese, as well. It's written in such a way that you should find it useful even if you are just doing self-study.

While taking Japanese classes in college, the listening comprehension and fluency from anime helped put me several semesters ahead of everyone else in vocabulary and how I sounded while speaking.
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Old 2011-12-07, 03:18   Link #63
Aaerul
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Let me guess. did anybody actually read the guide?

http://visualnovelaer.wordpress.com/...h-vn-or-anime/

If you would actually read it, you would see how realistic the methodology is.
yes according to the guide you DO learn to read through Anime or visual novels. You learn enough so much so that you can pick up a manga or a light novel and start reading it just as I have become able.
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Old 2011-12-07, 03:30   Link #64
Raiga
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Originally Posted by Aaerul View Post
Let me guess. did anybody actually read the guide?

http://visualnovelaer.wordpress.com/...h-vn-or-anime/

If you would actually read it, you would see how realistic the methodology is.
yes according to the guide you DO learn to read through Anime or visual novels. You learn enough so much so that you can pick up a manga or a light novel and start reading it just as I have become able.
First off, everyone learns differently, and I honestly don't think your guide will work for everyone.

Second off, how do you define "knowing a language"? This sounds like a stupid question but I'm sure anyone who's actually studied another language will agree it's not a black-and-white matter. Perhaps you can read manga and visual novels, but how much practical Japanese do you know? The rules of everyday formality? How about writing style and writing in general? With all due respect there's an obvious grammar error in your "about" blurb at the bottom of the page.

Third off, your tutorial involves using external learning resources anyway, such as Tae Kim's guide. People have been saying that anime, manga, etc. work as supplements... which seems to be exactly what you're saying.

I've said this before, but generally speaking the question isn't whether it's "possible", the question is whether it's "practical" to learn Japanese using anime. I for one won't deny it's possible, but I'll be damned if you can convince me it's practical.
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Old 2011-12-07, 10:56   Link #65
chikorita157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaerul View Post
Let me guess. did anybody actually read the guide?

http://visualnovelaer.wordpress.com/...h-vn-or-anime/

If you would actually read it, you would see how realistic the methodology is.
yes according to the guide you DO learn to read through Anime or visual novels. You learn enough so much so that you can pick up a manga or a light novel and start reading it just as I have become able.
From personal experience of studying Japanese for two months, it's more practical to focus on the hiragana/katakana and then jump to the grammar instead of memorizing 2000 kanji in one shot. This way, you can get a general feeling of the grammar and learn the vocabulary with its Hiragana and then Kanji combinations while having a basic understanding of what they saying in supplemental material. If you don't know the kanji in a word, you can practice using radicals to look it up and then copy it to a list or put it on a flash card... Even so, using the Genki textbooks (or other reputable Japanese Textbooks) for most people is a more practical approach than giving a dump of Kanji without knowing the vocabulary or the combinations and focusing on the grammar afterwards. Then again, everyone has different learning styles, so there is going to be methods that work or don't work for people.

Not saying that it's impossible to learn from Anime, but I don't think it's a reliable, one-shot solution as I hardly learn anything until I learn from a textbook.
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Old 2011-12-07, 15:07   Link #66
christinemarie
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The only thing that hinders anyone from learning correct japanese from subbed anime is the right translation.
Not all subbed anime have the right translation even two famous licensed sites that grants access to licensed anime have problems with their subs, while the other site requires feedback from others to improved their subbing by frequently changing translators.

It's easy to learn Romaji by using anime, but it's difficult to learn hiragana/katakana itself but if you're have some habit of learning those opening/ending english subbed songs with hiragana/katakana/romaji included from anime then its possible since you probably want to learn hiragana/katana as well to master the song completely.

Another method is to watch unsubbed versions of the subbed anime you have just watched. It requires repetitive watching to get the exact voice/understanding.
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Old 2011-12-07, 15:52   Link #67
LeoXiao
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I tried teaching myself, using instruction tapes, both Russian and Japanese. I know better Japanese than Russian, and I'm guessing that me watching lots of anime must have something to do with it. It may be able to get you to a certain level, but it then plateaus and is thus no replacement for an actual course.

The way it's been useful for me, in a specific sense, is because anime introduces to me a lot of Sino-Japanese words that I otherwsie wouldn't have heard of that stick in my head easily since I already know Chinese.
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Old 2011-12-07, 21:42   Link #68
xxanimefan4_ever
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it works as long as you don't use english subs. if you want to watch the ep with english subs then at least be sure to listen to it later or watch it later without any english text whatsoever. it's all in AJATT. the end.
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Old 2011-12-09, 02:01   Link #69
serenade_beta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediNight View Post
Anime is a good general supplement to books, but a very poor replacement.
On the other hand, I wasted my money buying a couple of books...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JediNight View Post
Jeffrey's J-E Online Dictionary is my preferred search tool, but there are others:
http://www.gokanji.com/cgi-bin/j-e/utf8/dict
The nasty background color... (∀`;)
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Old 2011-12-19, 07:34   Link #70
Shinji01
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I think if you like anime, and watching it motivates you to go study more using textbook, then, thats great.

i know a lot of Japanese people who watch english speaking tv shows to get used to conversation and situations. Of course what Jack Bauer says in 24 is not going to be useful, nor is trying to understand ER fully anywhere near possible, but it is a great motivator.

好きこそものの上手なれ (Suki koso mono no jyozu nare) is the best term for this.
No matter how talented you are, or how skilled you are, someone who has passion and really likes the language/sport/ skill is the one who will advance the most.
If you like anime, this may be the one factor that may push you to a whole different level compared to people who are learning it for business necessities/ academics etc.
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Old 2011-12-19, 08:42   Link #71
Xenio
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinji01 View Post
好きこそものの上手なれ (Suki koso mono no jyozu nare) is the best term for this.
No matter how talented you are, or how skilled you are, someone who has passion and really likes the language/sport/ skill is the one who will advance the most.
If you like anime, this may be the one factor that may push you to a whole different level compared to people who are learning it for business necessities/ academics etc.
agree with you here, before watching anime, i often play game in english that i don't understand, but as i play more and more with my basic english learned at school, i gradually get better that now i can understand english without thinking twice or translate to my language, my english grade are among the best at my school (most student in my country can't even make a full sentence after graduate high school ),i fully undrestand english movie by listening alone without any translation or sub. in other word, "a whole different level compared to people who are learning it for business necessities/ academics etc"

so i guess to get really good in a language, you need to learn the basic grammar first, and passionate enough to watch/read a ton of movie/book in that language, you will good at it before you even know it, i think this apply to japanese too
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Old 2011-12-19, 09:01   Link #72
Ak3mi
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About 10 years ago when I went to Japan for a competition I only knew a handful of greetings,phrases and questions all from watching anime. It will get you from A to B in the most minimal way( Not practical)

However now I can speak Japanese(sort of ), I only just got serious with it about 2 years ago. This was from a private tutor twice a week for a year in a half. Learning from anime will be extremely hard and you may find that you don't have the will power or the required information to learn. So I recommend a tutor.

Also very important...
Quote:
BUT. I love the Japanese language. Once I started, I was hooked by its beauty, structure, and complexity. If you don't actually like the language, and if this is just an extension of your interest in anime, then STOP while you're still ahead.
My job, sort of force me to learn the language, to find out the best places to go and were I can go to get my necessary items. If I didn't have this, I would be dead in the water. (My job is Surfing competitively, Also teaching people how to surf )
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Old 2011-12-20, 05:38   Link #73
Shinji01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ak3mi View Post
About 10 years ago when I went to Japan for a competition I only knew a handful of greetings,phrases and questions all from watching anime. It will get you from A to B in the most minimal way( Not practical)

However now I can speak Japanese(sort of ), I only just got serious with it about 2 years ago. This was from a private tutor twice a week for a year in a half. Learning from anime will be extremely hard and you may find that you don't have the will power or the required information to learn. So I recommend a tutor.

Also very important...


My job, sort of force me to learn the language, to find out the best places to go and were I can go to get my necessary items. If I didn't have this, I would be dead in the water. (My job is Surfing competitively, Also teaching people how to surf )

Tutors are great!

Ever noticed that people with girlfriends and boyfriends that speak that language are the people who learn the fastest and end up being near fluent?

i think this is because 1) they have a tutor and 2) they are passionate about the language because you want to communicate with them, 3) you spend a lot of time with that person.
So, you will be shooting three birds with one stone

For Japanese people learning English, finding a tutor is easy and inexpensive because we have a huge abundance of teachers in japan, and very affordable online tutors from places like the Philippines.

I guess this is not the case with people learning Japanese...
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Old 2011-12-21, 17:54   Link #74
LifeILL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediNight View Post
They are often rude, overly familiar, if you are a male watch for female speech styles, etc.


This is a huge misconception.

Most of anime speech is just normal Japanese.
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Old 2011-12-21, 21:52   Link #75
Raiga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeILL View Post
This is a huge misconception.

Most of anime speech is just normal Japanese.
While it's not as bad as many people have been led to believe, it's still not the best idea to pick up speaking styles from anime. Let's be honest: nobody on TV, East or West, speaks normally. Fictional characters talk in ways you'd never talk in real life.

Plus the variety and flexibility of Japanese in terms of register and speaking style (for lack of a better term) means a lot of speaking styles are exaggerated in fiction (esp. masculine/feminine distinctions) and a lot of speaking styles are entirely made-up.

~de geso
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Old 2011-12-21, 22:38   Link #76
LifeILL
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Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
While it's not as bad as many people have been led to believe, it's still not the best idea to pick up speaking styles from anime. Let's be honest: nobody on TV, East or West, speaks normally. Fictional characters talk in ways you'd never talk in real life.

Plus the variety and flexibility of Japanese in terms of register and speaking style (for lack of a better term) means a lot of speaking styles are exaggerated in fiction (esp. masculine/feminine distinctions) and a lot of speaking styles are entirely made-up.

~de geso

Well no one talks normal in real life either. Everyone has their own speaking style.

And most of the stuff you hear in anime is stuff you will hear in real life. If you're fluent in Japanese you will know. Most of the vocabulary they say are just normal vocab that everyone knows. The whole thing is a misconception.

Especially the male-female speech thing, is one of the most overblown debates out there. 98% of what they say are exactly the same, it's just some little changes at the end of sentences here and there.
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Old 2011-12-22, 00:22   Link #77
Raiga
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Forgive me if I doubt that you're likely to encounter an overblown ojou-sama or hyper-formal samurai warrior or thuggish yakuza goon in your everyday life.

I agree that it's not as different from normal speech as many people think it is, but there are definite quirks that stay strictly within the realm of fiction.
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Old 2011-12-22, 00:35   Link #78
LifeILL
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Well I wouldn't be scared if that happened because they use normal Japanese in Samurai films as well.

Yes they sprinkle in things like でござる or もうす at the end but most of it is normal stuff.

There's nothing to worry about.
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Old 2011-12-22, 04:31   Link #79
Dragonar Fan
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Ive been learning some Japanese through Videogames , Book guides & manuals from my sisters failed Japanese classes & the bad habit of putting sentences together side to side & actually sub translated a few games but alas i became consumed with root origins & now i mutter altered,hacked & spliced words from various languages now im doomed to be even more odd in society
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Old 2011-12-23, 09:10   Link #80
Cytrus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LifeILL View Post
Well I wouldn't be scared if that happened because they use normal Japanese in Samurai films as well.

Yes they sprinkle in things like でござる or もうす at the end but most of it is normal stuff.

There's nothing to worry about.
LIFEILL uses strong words, but I generally agree. Normal speech patterns appear much more often than heavily stylized ones, so the standard will be the one to ultimately stick in your head. It really helps, I think, that the characters who use non-standard speech tend to do so in an exaggerated fashion, to the point that even non-natives with intermediate language ability easily notice that's there's something weird going on.

Anime speech does err towards the casual, though, so you might want to take a look at a textbook sooner or later. Varied sources = solid knowledge.
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