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Old 2012-06-19, 22:49   Link #2241
monster
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Originally Posted by Rising Dragon View Post
The real problem are the undamaged enemies who decide to take advantage of whatever disabled mobile suits are within range after Kira's moved off.
Three things:

1. Sure, but this is still a battle, and yes, cases like Heine's death will happen. People sometimes forget that Kira did not try to get other people to fight the way he does. This is just a personal decision for him. (That's why people who call Kira a hypocrite when he does kill is wrong.)

2. If Kira is interfering in another people's battle, he disables everyone from both sides as quickly as he can. So when you have two opposing mobile suits near each other, it is more likely that they're both disabled rather than one disabled and the other free to take advantage. (Although, again, deaths like Heine's can still happen.)

3. Kira is still one person. He can affect a battle, but he can't guarantee everyone's safety, nor should he be expected to.
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Old 2012-06-19, 22:52   Link #2242
Rising Dragon
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Oh I'm aware. I meant in the real large-scale battles like Jachin Due and Messiah. He certainly isn't able to disable ALL of the mobile suits in one go, and he can't beat them all. That combined with him having to move into other sectors and with tensions between sides being what they are in SEED, there's always going to be plenty of vultures waiting to move in for the kill after Kira's done his part. War's just ugly like that.
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Old 2012-06-19, 22:56   Link #2243
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Originally Posted by Rising Dragon View Post
Oh I'm aware. I meant in the real large-scale battles like Jachin Due and Messiah. He certainly isn't able to disable ALL of the mobile suits in one go, and he can't beat them all. That combined with him having to move into other sectors and with tensions between sides being what they are in SEED, there's always going to be plenty of vultures waiting to move in for the kill after Kira's done his part. War's just ugly like that.
He's at least giving them a chance to survive. If Kira wanted to he could kill a LARGE number of people on the battlefield. He lets them live and gives them a chance to survive. Some of those will make it, others fate will be against them but at least they had a chance to survive after meeting the freedom.
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Old 2012-06-19, 22:59   Link #2244
monster
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War's just ugly like that.
Indeed, and back with AGE, it seems this whole "understanding" or "no-kill policy" or whatever has been overblown over what seems to be a good thing: Kio possibly knowing the real state of the Vagans. It doesn't mean he will forgive them for the invasion or anything, but we'll see what happens.
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Old 2012-06-20, 00:31   Link #2245
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Originally Posted by cyberdemon View Post
He's at least giving them a chance to survive. If Kira wanted to he could kill a LARGE number of people on the battlefield. He lets them live and gives them a chance to survive. Some of those will make it, others fate will be against them but at least they had a chance to survive after meeting the freedom.
Looking at it this way, he's actually disabling their chance to survive. He takes away other pilots' way to protect themselves. The problem is he doesn't care about people who have been disabled. Can they survive or not, it's like that's not his concern. The only thing matter is he did what he want. How is it better than just let them continue to fight in the battlefield, I can't understand.

That's what I call a hypocrite.

I know it has nothing to with AGE, or Kio to the extend. It's way too soon to jump on that train yet.
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Old 2012-06-20, 00:40   Link #2246
monster
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Looking at it this way, he's actually disabling their chance to survive. He takes away other pilots' way to protect themselves. The problem is he doesn't care about people who have been disabled. Can they survive or not, it's like that's not his concern. The only thing matter is he did what he want. How is it better than just let them continue to fight in the battlefield, I can't understand.

That's what I call a hypocrite.
Why does it have to be better? Or rather, why is it not enough that it's better for Kira?

You may call it selfish, but you can't call it hypocritical because Kira's not trying to act like he has the moral high ground.
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Old 2012-06-20, 00:50   Link #2247
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Originally Posted by Duo Maxwell View Post
Looking at it this way, he's actually disabling their chance to survive. He takes away other pilots' way to protect themselves. The problem is he doesn't care about people who have been disabled. Can they survive or not, it's like that's not his concern. The only thing matter is he did what he want. How is it better than just let them continue to fight in the battlefield, I can't understand.

That's what I call a hypocrite.

I know it has nothing to with AGE, or Kio to the extend. It's way too soon to jump on that train yet.
So your saying it's just better for him to take their life than to give them a chance to survive? believe it or not. Some people do take the moral high ground in a fight.

was it really necessary to de rep me for an honest response?
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Old 2012-06-20, 01:19   Link #2248
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So your saying it's just better for him to take their life than to give them a chance to survive? believe it or not. Some people do take the moral high ground in a fight.

was it really necessary to de rep me for an honest response?
I'm not, and I didn't do anything about the rep.

And Kira is a hypocrite. He's telling other what's better and what's not, while he's himself doing thing that isn't anything better. What he's doing is not giving them a chance to survive, but take away their chance to survive. You can't expect there is no stray shot, or advantage abusing people on the battlefield.
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Old 2012-06-20, 01:24   Link #2249
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I'm not, and I didn't do anything about the rep.

And Kira is a hypocrite. He's telling other what's better and what's not, while he's himself doing thing that isn't anything better. What he's doing is not giving them a chance to survive, but take away their chance to survive. You can't expect there is no stray shot, or advantage abusing people on the battlefield.
and i suppose killing them would solve the matter all together?
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Old 2012-06-20, 01:27   Link #2250
monster
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And Kira is a hypocrite. He's telling other what's better and what's not
What? When did Kira tell others that it's better to disable than to kill?
Quote:
What he's doing is not giving them a chance to survive, but take away their chance to survive.
Episode 13 of GSD: Was Kira taking the would-be assassins' chance of surviving by disabling their mobile suits instead of killing them?
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Old 2012-06-20, 01:29   Link #2251
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There's no real right choice here, be it killing or disabling. But war is war, deaths will happen, be they at Kira's hands or not.

Getting back on topic, I can't see Kio really pulling off the same kind of tactic without the AGE-FX. The AGE-3 is... ill-equipped for precision strikes against heads and limbs, what with its BFGs and sword-throwing rifle.
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Old 2012-06-20, 01:33   Link #2252
monster
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Getting back on topic, I can't see Kio really pulling off the same kind of tactic without the AGE-FX. The AGE-3 is... ill-equipped for precision strikes against heads and limbs, what with its BFGs and sword-throwing rifle.
You forgot the AGE System. It'll come up with something if that's what they want.

But no, I agree with you that it's probably not where they're going with Kio's character. He's never really had any problem killing in battles.
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Old 2012-06-20, 03:39   Link #2253
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Originally Posted by Rising Dragon View Post
The real problem are the undamaged enemies who decide to take advantage of whatever disabled mobile suits are within range after Kira's moved off.
well, honestly, have we ever been shown such a scene? if anything, Kira disables everything in range because, well, he is Kira Yamato.
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Old 2012-06-20, 05:29   Link #2254
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Oy oy oy! Shouldn't that discussion go in another thread?
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Old 2012-06-20, 12:49   Link #2255
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How is disabling the better option? What happens if you drift away from friendly units, run out of oxygen and suffocate? Or if some sadistic fuck sees you and decides to kill you slowly, Hallelujah style? You'd wish Kira had given you a quick death. Getting blown up is instant, you probably don't even feel it, it's quick and painless. Suffocating in the other hand is a horrible way to die...

Kira just does that to make himself feel better and be able to sleep at night. He's deluding himself into thinking that since he "gave them a chance to live" he's not actually responsible for their lives. The fact was that no side took prisoners, so all those disabled pilots would've been killed when found by the enemy, and their blood was in Kira's hands.
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Old 2012-06-20, 12:59   Link #2256
monster
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Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
How is disabling the better option?
Again, who says it has to be the better option?
Quote:
What happens if
If Kira kills instead of disables, there's no what if: They're dead.
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Old 2012-06-20, 13:00   Link #2257
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This should be taken to the SEED thread.
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Old 2012-06-20, 13:12   Link #2258
cyberdemon
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Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
How is disabling the better option? What happens if you drift away from friendly units, run out of oxygen and suffocate? Or if some sadistic fuck sees you and decides to kill you slowly, Hallelujah style? You'd wish Kira had given you a quick death. Getting blown up is instant, you probably don't even feel it, it's quick and painless. Suffocating in the other hand is a horrible way to die...

Kira just does that to make himself feel better and be able to sleep at night. He's deluding himself into thinking that since he "gave them a chance to live" he's not actually responsible for their lives. The fact was that no side took prisoners, so all those disabled pilots would've been killed when found by the enemy, and their blood was in Kira's hands.
Kira only aims for the weapons, head, arms, and legs. He doesn't really aim for the thrusters. He lets them keep the ability to move around.
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Old 2012-06-20, 13:17   Link #2259
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Thrusters are generally mounted on arms and legs on mobile suits, including in SEED, and are often necessary to aid in flight and zero-g environments. Crippling arms and legs often cripple flight for mobile suits.

But again, this has long stopped being about AGE. Time to take it elsewhere.
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Old 2012-06-20, 13:32   Link #2260
monster
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Thrusters are generally mounted on arms and legs on mobile suits, including in SEED
I don't think there are many CE mobile suits with thrusters on their arms.
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