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Old 2012-08-04, 15:47   Link #781
Sakanaka Shouko
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The episode was interesting, we got to see the characters reaction to an extreme situation. I hope the next episode be even more interesting.
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Old 2012-08-04, 15:52   Link #782
Flawfinder
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Originally Posted by HandofFate View Post
Yea, looking back the 5 episodes, they did come full circle pretty smoothly.
The five episodes was most likely the first light novel, so it doesn't really surprise me.

Quote:
I'm going to be cynical here and say that this is due to the guys (and specially the MC) being proxies for the audience. The more "empty" they are, the easier for the audience to project themselves on them.
I'll never understand the sort of thinking that being "empty" makes you more relatable. That's like me saying females relate to Inori from GC because of how empty she is, and I know that's not true. And it doesn't exactly help that this episode points out this flaw several times, but doesn't do anything about it.

@GuardianEnzo Regarding Tsubaki, besides his situation, I didn't see any difference from the dime-a-dozen guys I can get from an anime cheat sheet. I like him more than the guys here, but not to the extent that I actually like him.
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Old 2012-08-04, 15:53   Link #783
Vena
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
The fundamental difference is that while we’re always shown exactly why the girls do what they do, the guys simply do, because that’s what’s necessary for the plot. Taichi reveals himself to be, effectively, a masochist – but why?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
It's a matter of balance. The girls are arguably complex characters. We get to know what makes them tick and all that. The guys are just there. They just do what the plot needs them to do, but we don't know why.
But this episode, through Inaba, told us flat out that there definitely is something very wrong with Taichi.

I cannot help but wonder how much of this isn't a bit of preemptive judgment. The way this show is structured, this arc was meant to attack people who have problems with others in a very direct way: Inaba and trust, Yui and men, and Iori and identity (around people). All three of these issues are fit into the idea of body swapping and, as such, the girls would gain center stage in an arc that is built around exemplifying, magnifying, and tackling their issues. Taichi (and by extension Aoki) doesn't seem to have an issue with people, and this episode built on the idea that his problem is deeply internal and people (and helping then) are simply his medicine. His disease (so to speak) is not with people as it is for Yui, Inaba, or Iori, people are his medication, putting him in a distinctly different field than the girls and, as such, with problems that don't get nearly as much play in an arc that is about problems with people. (The fact that people are Taichi's medication for his still hidden problem, goes in full swing as to why he's so ready to help others because (again straight from the episode) in helping people he helps himself.)

If the next arc focuses on internal strife, I'd expect to see Taichi (and perhaps Aoki) at the focus rather than the girls. So, as I said, I think people are jumping to conclusions based on arc that focuses on issues that only some of the cast have and, by seeing this, deciding that the rest of the cast simply has no (concrete) problems. I think, if this pans out, is a strength in the story telling rather than a weakness because your cast are given more varied problems that do not all have the same (or similar) basic trigger. It'd be a bit underwhelming if the whole cast were just a bunch of kids that simply didn't work well with people for reason X, Y, or Z (see BokuTomodachi). As Heartseed said, he picked them for fun and that means that they have to have enough problems to satisfy his fun. With the body swapping seemingly over, that means he has other ways of getting to them which means that we've only just skimmed the surface.

That said, it does seem to be getting laid out that the only person who can seemingly help Taichi is Inaba because she won't put up with his masochistic bullshit. So we have, Inaba > Taichi > Iori, Yui <> Aoki (maybe on the latter).
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Old 2012-08-04, 15:58   Link #784
Blonto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
I'm going to be cynical here and say that this is due to the guys (and specially the MC) being proxies for the audience. The more "empty" they are, the easier for the audience to project themselves on them.
Welcome to the world of anime, where teenage males have no right to be complex beings with a purpose other than serving as self-inserts for the audience, a world where they must have a bland personality otherwise they risk stealing screentime and drawing attention to themselves rather than moe/tsundere/boobielicious chicks. A world where their best friend is bound to be an even bigger loser, just so they could be jealous and more shallow than them. We don't want any competition for the character into whom the audience is supposed to project themselves. We don't want them to get jealous.
Welcome to the world of anime, where you’re a cardboard cutout if you don’t have boobs. Not that having boobs means you’re a good character, but at least you have a chance of being memorable.

However, I felt Taichi was pretty decent. I mean everyone’s development was rushed and at least they discussed a strong personality trait of his, which is more than I can say for Aoki. I was hoping his confession scene would be a flashback, to maybe at least give him some history, how and why he came to like Yui so much. If they didn’t want to develop him as a character on his own, I hoped we could at least have that, but apparently not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marower View Post
Does anyone else feel like this light novel could've been adapted differently, perhaps just using the source material as a base, while fleshing it out and such?
YES!
For starters, we could've been given more chance to get to know the characters, at least remember their names before the body-switching started (At the start of ep 2, I was all: "Who? Who? Who?"). It's like creators today expect instant emotional investment just because of moe designs. I wanted issues brought upon by the switching to be explored more, I wanted to see more of their home life, I wanted everyone to be everyone else and deal with eachother's problems. I wanted more body swapping tricks (like what Iori did). This way it just felt like a way-too-early body swapping episode, rather than the deconstruction of the trope I was hoping for.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:15   Link #785
Triple_R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandhy88 View Post
WHY!!! why Iori must switch from Aoki -> Yui -> Inaba!!!

If She stay at Aoki's body, we can get Yaoi route!!
If Taichi (while Yui) and Aoki (while Inaba or Iori) said to each other "Dude! This is an excellent way for us to help each other achieve our sexual dreams!" and proceeded to do it, would it be yaoi or would it be yuri or would it be het?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakanaka Shouko View Post
The episode was interesting, we got to see the characters reaction to an extreme situation. I hope the next episode be even more interesting.
I agree. Heartseed's stunt made this a very interesting episode!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
I don't know about the LN, but the series looks like a harem to me right now. It'd be great if it ends up being something different though.
If you define "harem" loosely, Kokoro Connect is just barely harem.

But it's harem the way that True Tears is - It's really mainly a love triangle, and the third girl (the one with the least chance with the main guy) may well end up with the wingman instead.

That's my impression based purely on the anime so far, anyway.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:26   Link #786
creb
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This episode was hilarious, well, other than Taichi. Gosh, talk about first world problems when you start ranting about how seeing other people in pain is the most painful thing ever.

It's too bad it isn't going to be all grim/dark, but I guess a comedy is fine as well.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:37   Link #787
zeniselv
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F-ing great, ive como to love this, i usually hate the merry solution to a grim development, but this time even the characters noted that things migth not had been as said, this probably has the best ED this season, also i dont understand the bitching about this, its true the characters peak their minds instead of going passive-aggresive leaving hints of their thougths/personality, first: things havent got melodramatic, second: if they did things that way, and we had to play psychologist with the characters, it wouldnt work in this setting.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:42   Link #788
Netto Azure
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Oh wow, that was quite a shocker.

Love this series so much.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:46   Link #789
Blonto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Have you tried watching a shoujo series?
I force myself to give them a try every once in a while, but they just end up on my sister's watchlist because I can't finish them. Even when I manage to look past the (to me) creepy art style and the sparkles, I can't stand the characters because they usually suffer from pretty much the same problems as I mentioned, only gender bent. The girls are boring and the guys are effeminate seduction machines (which for me means equally boring+repulsively designed with horrible anatomy). Not to mention so much pointless drama. I won't judge the whole genre, but so far I haven't seen a single one I liked and I've tried at least 15 titles.
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Old 2012-08-04, 17:55   Link #790
ZGMF-X10A
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I'm so glad Iori didn't die. I found it weird why Heartseed, pasted over the cell phone. Does that mean Iori and Taichi are going out now? Iori is my favourite female character in this series, Inaba coming in really close. Her smile laugh is so cute.
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Old 2012-08-04, 18:15   Link #791
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZGMF-X10A View Post
I'm so glad Iori didn't die. I found it weird why Heartseed, pasted over the cell phone. Does that mean Iori and Taichi are going out now? Iori is my favourite female character in this series, Inaba coming in really close. Her smile laugh is so cute.
It is a rather complicated situation- Iori confessing to Taichi in Inaba's body, and Taichi kissing Iori through Inaba

The whole passing the phone reminded me of what my friends did before tossing one of their own into the pool Obviously it's abit different from jumping off a bridge but somehow I made the connection
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Old 2012-08-04, 18:27   Link #792
Guardian Enzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vena View Post
But this episode, through Inaba, told us flat out that there definitely is something very wrong with Taichi.

I cannot help but wonder how much of this isn't a bit of preemptive judgment. The way this show is structured, this arc was meant to attack people who have problems with others in a very direct way: Inaba and trust, Yui and men, and Iori and identity (around people). All three of these issues are fit into the idea of body swapping and, as such, the girls would gain center stage in an arc that is built around exemplifying, magnifying, and tackling their issues. Taichi (and by extension Aoki) doesn't seem to have an issue with people, and this episode built on the idea that his problem is deeply internal and people (and helping then) are simply his medicine. His disease (so to speak) is not with people as it is for Yui, Inaba, or Iori, people are his medication, putting him in a distinctly different field than the girls and, as such, with problems that don't get nearly as much play in an arc that is about problems with people. (The fact that people are Taichi's medication for his still hidden problem, goes in full swing as to why he's so ready to help others because (again straight from the episode) in helping people he helps himself.)

If the next arc focuses on internal strife, I'd expect to see Taichi (and perhaps Aoki) at the focus rather than the girls. So, as I said, I think people are jumping to conclusions based on arc that focuses on issues that only some of the cast have and, by seeing this, deciding that the rest of the cast simply has no (concrete) problems. I think, if this pans out, is a strength in the story telling rather than a weakness because your cast are given more varied problems that do not all have the same (or similar) basic trigger. It'd be a bit underwhelming if the whole cast were just a bunch of kids that simply didn't work well with people for reason X, Y, or Z (see BokuTomodachi). As Heartseed said, he picked them for fun and that means that they have to have enough problems to satisfy his fun. With the body swapping seemingly over, that means he has other ways of getting to them which means that we've only just skimmed the surface.

That said, it does seem to be getting laid out that the only person who can seemingly help Taichi is Inaba because she won't put up with his masochistic bullshit. So we have, Inaba > Taichi > Iori, Yui <> Aoki (maybe on the latter).
The show might indeed switch to deconstructing the boys' psyche now (I'm skeptical). But I'd argue that it's really too late to do so - better, but still too late. The show is basically half over, and for the kind of series this is trying to be - a serious drama about teen psychology - to ignore the motivation of the guys for half the show is definitely a fault. Not one that overwhelms the show's many good points, but a fault.

It seems to me that rather than a clever build, this is a classic example of a recurring problem in anime today, where teen males simply aren't allowed to be complicated or interesting. And it's one that plagues good shows as well as bad, and this is a good show. I'll give it up for Hyouka here, because the guys actually have more complexity than the girls (although that show isn't exactly a serious character study most of the time, I admit).
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:02   Link #793
Vena
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
The show might indeed switch to deconstructing the boys' psyche now (I'm skeptical). But I'd argue that it's really too late to do so - better, but still too late. The show is basically half over, and for the kind of series this is trying to be - a serious drama about teen psychology - to ignore the motivation of the guys for half the show is definitely a fault. Not one that overwhelms the show's many good points, but a fault.

It seems to me that rather than a clever build, this is a classic example of a recurring problem in anime today, where teen males simply aren't allowed to be complicated or interesting. And it's one that plagues good shows as well as bad, and this is a good show. I'll give it up for Hyouka here, because the guys actually have more complexity than the girls (although that show isn't exactly a serious character study most of the time, I admit).
Perhaps it is too late, personally I don't think so because (at least the in the case of Taichi) we've known everything was not 100% (no normal man will get kicked in the balls or be such a masochist). So its not like the show is pulling his issue out of its ass, its just a more gradual build up to a problem that you know has existed but has been left to simmer. Now Aoki is a bit outside of this and I'd likely agree with you that for him, a problem and resolution may be a little too little to late.

I think the pacing issue isn't the same here as per the standards of anime (for one isn't this series 17 episodes? So its more like we're 1/3 of the way in not 1/2) but more that they are working off a bigger medium and story. The LN is certainly not episodically restricted and likely took its time developing things, and there the staggered development would be perfectly fit. With the anime probably being faithful to the LN (as far as I've heard, I wont be reading it until this is over), then this is a transitory weakness rather than the pandemic that grips anime in general these days.

Take the wonderful Mashifony as an example, it staggered its girls and their problems (for what it covered) and they did a fine on, I thought, even though much of the real drama didn't start until past the halfway mark.
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:04   Link #794
Elestia
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In the end when Iori was switched with Inaba, Miyuki Sawashiro put in the extra effort to sounds more like Iori which really worked quite well in expressing her emotions. I loved the drama, even though it was kind of forced, but in the end it was worth it and well executed which tugged at my heart strings quite effectively. Inaban-chaaaaan~
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:08   Link #795
Dextro
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Originally Posted by Elestia View Post
In the end when Iori was switched with Inaba, Miyuki Sawashiro put in the extra effort to sounds more like Iori which really worked quite well in expressing her emotions. I loved the drama, even though it was kind of forced, but in the end it was worth it and well executed which tugged at my heart strings quite effectively. Inaban-chaaaaan~
That's true. For a moment there I was having a questioning myself if they hadn't actually changed the VA for that scene because the voice was spot on. An amazing job indeed.
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:09   Link #796
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elestia View Post
In the end when Iori was switched with Inaba, Miyuki Sawashiro put in the extra effort to sounds more like Iori which really worked quite well in expressing her emotions. I loved the drama, even though it was kind of forced, but in the end it was worth it and well executed which tugged at my heart strings quite effectively. Inaban-chaaaaan~
I don't think I've ever heard Miyuki Sawashiro sound like that Most of the characters she plays don't really let her do that.
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:48   Link #797
frivolity
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Heartseed is probably the troll with the biggest epic win so far.

1. Force 5 people to switch personalities
2. Pretend to kill one of them
3. ????
4. Profit!
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Old 2012-08-04, 19:56   Link #798
Blonto
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I feel like I should comment on the ep itself rather than just reply to others.

I found out the episode is out from a comment here that said "Iori's death was through no fault of her own" and I was kinda fooled by that. So I did wonder if she would die. Well, no, I didn't expect her to actually die, I just wasn't sure how they'd go around the death. Like maybe put a stranger's soul in (though that would be cruel)? Or maybe at the end they'd run out of time without noticing and Iori would stay in Inaba (cruel, too). Aside from that, I thought a reset was also a possibility, which was the only way they could have actually killed Iori. But frankly I'm glad it all ended well. Honestly if someone died it'd feel like Bokurano all over again.
We did get some fantastic acting. Especially when Iori was crying into Taichi's shoulder, it felt like a real person saying that. The whole atmosphere was really heavy and unnerving for me because I often wondered how I'd take the news of my own death. Would I panic, cry, stay calm, ignore it? I just really related to that part.
I felt the "dilemma" of whose soul should die in Iori's body to be really pointless. The only one who might have agreed was Taichi, and I knew that wouldn't happen.
I really wish this arc was longer. I feel a lot of things were rushed through and I wish Inaba and Iori's problems especially were more fleshed out and shown to us in action.
All in all, I'm disappointed from a storytelling POV, but strangely pleased emotionally. I'll see how it goes further.

Last edited by Blonto; 2012-08-04 at 20:17.
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Old 2012-08-04, 20:14   Link #799
serenade_beta
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Spoiler for ep5:
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Old 2012-08-04, 21:02   Link #800
Qilin
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You know, I really like what this show is doing and all with the whole body swapping thing, there really is something off about the writing.

Specifically, I'm talking about Heartseed and how he serves as such a contrived plot device. Somehow, I find it a lot less appealing to know that this show is pretty much some otherworldly entity's social experiment done for a few shits and giggles.

Now, I guess some people here were right in that I was a bit hasty in judging the character since this episode did address Taichi's selflessness as a problem, though I wish it could have dwelt on it more. On that note, the individual problems of the characters seem somewhat superficial for now, but I trust that at episode 5 there is still plenty of time to explore the deeper issues of each character, particularly Iori. I hope the next arc explores those aspects even more.
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Last edited by Qilin; 2012-08-04 at 21:25.
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