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Old 2011-12-18, 13:05   Link #141
Sackett
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Originally Posted by omimon View Post
Wait...the novel, game and movie were already all announced.....

I honestly can't think of any other medium....Oh god....don't tell me it's a Madoka stage show.....
Ballet.

There must be a Madoka Magica Ballet!

Honestly, I think ballet is one of the mediums best suited for the story of Madoka Magica.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Unless they're announcing that Madoka Magica is going to get a live-action movie/TV show/stage show adaptation, but nah, it's too early for that... I would think...
I used to think that Madoka just couldn't work as a live action movie. At least not Hollywood live action, and I think it would have to be Hollywood to get the level of special effects you'd need.

But then I did some more thinking. Magical Girls aren't really that outside the American experience. There are actually only three changes that I think would have to be made to make it more palatable to American audiences.

1: Instead of making QB an alien without emotions trying to fight entropy, leave him as a more mysterious demonish figure. I don't think there is the need to explicitly make him the devil, but a devil type character in this type of story would fit Western sensibilities better. You don't need to change his personality at all, and could probably even leave him as an alien, but he couldn't be trying to fight entropy. Just leave it as his race feeding off of the girls despair somehow. (You already have him eating the grief seeds.)

2: At the ending, instead of Kyubee just granting Madoka's wish have him refuse. Have Kyubee point out all the costs and try to dissuade Madoka from making the wish. Have Madoka insist that this is her wish and that she will pay the price. Have a disembodied voice say "Granted" and then Madoka's wish is granted. Kyubee is thus never reconciled in the epilogue and is banished instead.

Essentially you would be heightening the Christian archetypes (which don't really damage the story since it's rooted in Faust and those very Christian archetypes). It also makes Kyubee a more explicit dark power that must be banished instead of subverted (which in this type of story is what Western audiences will expect and require).

3: This is the one I expect people to object to, but it's just the way things are. There would need to be a race lift on at least some of the characters.

American media tastes aren't nearly as racially driven as other cultures, but a movie with all Japanese characters when the plot makes no such requirement would be rather strange, particularly for the character of Madoka. Part of Madoka's symbolism is that of the typical normal white bread girl next door. And the truth of the matter, no matter how much we may object to it, is that in America white bread means white. To fully use the same symbolism in America, Madoka would have to be the generic blonde haired blue eyed white girl. (All visual characteristics associated with purity and innocence in American media). Might as well change her name to Mary while we are at it.

Homura however, in both of her persona, actually goes very well with the American image of a Japanese/Asian girl. Thus I expect Homura would be left unchanged.

Mami of course being blonde and upper class would work very well with being white.

Hitomi is also upper class, but being a less important character it really doesn't matter that much what her race is.

Kyōko would be fun to keep as a redhead, but I think it might fit best to make her Black. It's obvious Kyoko comes from a family with a lower economic status, but in a very faithful and religious community that takes religious doctrine seriously. It fits with her background I think. Plus I think it would be more powerful for Kyoko to come from a different race than Sayaka. I think Madeline (with Maggie for short) would be the most fitting name for her.

That would leave Sayaka open to take the redhead slot- fitting with her personality and joining a long tradition of tomboy heroines. I think Deborah (Debbie) would be a good name for her.

-------

At first I thought it would be nice to organize it into four short movies. Subtitled Mami, Sayaka, Kyoko, and Homura.

But after thinking about it I just can't see a way to effectively complete Sayaka's story without flowing into Kyoko's. So I think three movies would be best: Mami, Sayaka, and Homura.

1: Mami's movie I'm thinking would be around 100 minutes long, covering the events from episode 1 to the late-middle of episode 4 (ending about where Sayaka is tempted by Kyubee while at the hospital). With an expansion around the following areas:

A: Add more to the background of Mami and let us know more about her.
B: As part of this add some further confrontations between Mami and Homura, more fully developing this aspect of the series. Make sure to add some scenes that will take on new meaning (preferably tragic) once it is revealed about Homura's nature and her past dealings with Mami.
C: Add in the fact that Mami knows Kyoko and that they are on semi-friendly terms (if possibly in disagreement about some matters). A possible way to bring this about would be to have Homura warn Mami about Walpurgis Night during one of their confrontations, and for Mami to write Kyoko about it asking for her help. (Which of course would be the main reason Homura warns Mami, is because Homura wants Kyoko around to help out in fighting it- although we won't realize this until later). This would also make it more poignant that Sayaka (who idolizes Mami) is fighting Kyoko who only showed up because Mami wrote her.
D: A minor note, but add a little scene to hint that Hitomi has feelings for Kyōsuke, but is restraining herself because of Sayaka's affections. It's be better if that didn't come out of nowhere.

2: Sayaka's movie would tell both her story and Kyoko's and be around 120 to 130 minutes long. Covering events from the end of episode 4 through the end of episode 9. Expansion would be about:

A: Kyoko and Mami's backstory together.
B: Spend a little bit more time developing Sayaka's despair
C: A few more details about Homura and Kyoko's conversations, perhaps connected to Mami as well. I could see a scene where Kyoko wants to know who trained Homura (refusing to believe she didn't have a mentor) and Homura finally fingering Mami. If Mami in the previous movie had told Madoka and Sayaka that she didn't know Homura it would leave the audience in a state of speculation about why Homura claims to have been trained by Mami.
D: Just a small expansion on why Kyoko's father went mad and committed suicide. (Everyone always did what he said, every time he spoke people were deprived of their free will, he came to think that the devil was inside him and the only way to escape was death.)

3: Homura's movie would be around 100 minutes long, covering episodes 10 to 12, with a major expansion of Homura's Backstory (doubling at least), and showing more of the alternate timelines.
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Last edited by Sackett; 2011-12-18 at 14:32.
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Old 2011-12-18, 16:24   Link #142
bhl88
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I'd object usually but since nothing much is changed... I'll wait for the actual .

Can't think of any other medium with most/all of its foreign elements remaining.
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Old 2011-12-19, 04:35   Link #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sackett View Post

*Snipped a lot for space*

At first I thought it would be nice to organize it into four short movies. Subtitled Mami, Sayaka, Kyoko, and Homura.

But after thinking about it I just can't see a way to effectively complete Sayaka's story without flowing into Kyoko's. So I think three movies would be best: Mami, Sayaka, and Homura.
Well, those are very interesting and pretty good ideas you have. I think you're more or less right about the ways Madoka Magica would change in order to work as a Hollywood movie.

However, what I meant by Madoka Magica maybe getting a live-action movie is more like the Japanese Death Note live-action movie.

You are right though that on the special effects side of things at least, Hollywood would be the better route. I'm not sure if Gen, or even Shinbo, would be comfortable with that level of American localization though.

But hey, let's take this even further just for fun.


Make Kamijo ("Kent") a budding football Quarterback star that people expect to be the next Peyton Manning and have Sayaka ("Debbie") be a huge football fan. Kent's throwing hand gets viciously injured in a big high school tournament game, to the point that his career is over. All those NFL and College football scouts stop paying attention to him as they write him off, and the young man is thoroughly devastated as is his family.

Debbie brings videos of her and Kent's favorite NFL games to his hospital bedside to try to cheer him up, but all it does is enrage him as he can't play football as a Quarterback anymore.

Once Debbie makes her wish with Kyubey (oh, how appropriate he's called QB ), we see Kent arise victorious unto the field, as sports reporters flock around him about this miraculous comeback kid who NFL scouts are once again paying big attention to. We see Debbie cheer Kent on enthusiastically as he dominates his first big game back.

Alas, in the swirl of media attention, Kent starts to forget about Debbie and celebrity gossip hints at a relationship between him and the wealthy Hitomi ("Heather", maybe), who just happens to be the daughter of a NFL sports team owner. Heather never thought of Kent that way before, but the idea of dating him appeals to her now that she thinks of it (thanks to those tabloids), and she lets Debbie in on her plans to confess to Kent.


Maggie ("Kyoko") resents the frequently racist overtones of American football (as she sees it, at least; maybe have her reference what Rush Limbaugh once said about Donovan McNabb). This gives her added reason for hating Kent, not getting along with Debbie, and disagreeing with Debbie's sacrificial wish for him and his throwing hand.

After Debbie witchifies, her witch's realm is a giant football field, with all the pomp and circumstance of a Superbowl game surrounding it. "Octavia" remains the same in appearance, and the water theme of her name/appearance is due to Debbie being a Miami Dolphins fan.

Oh, and that final scene between Madoka and Sayaka in Episode 12? This time Mary and Debbie watch on from the stands as Kent leads the Miami Dolphins to the 2020 Superbowl Championship. Maybe have a couple sports commentators (real life ones, making cameo appearances in the movie) talk about how great it is that Kent's hand was miraculously healed as otherwise America would have been deprived of one of the 10 best Quarterbacks of all-time.

Given how much America loves football, I can see this really hitting quite the chord with American movie-going audiences.

What do you think?


As it pertains to the Madoka Magica Hollywood trilogy, I think people would probably want semi-happy ends for the movies (or at least the first one).

So Movie 1 (the Mami movie) should probably end on the note of Debbie making her wish and saving her best friend Mary (Madoka) from getting killed by the witch of Episode 4. We see Homura watch on ominously after the rescue is completed. This is the perfect way to give Movie 1 a semi-happy end but also a cliffhanger feel to feed into Movie 2.

On Movies 2 and 3, I agree with you.


I have my doubts that Madoka Magica ever gets popular enough in the west to warrant a Hollywood movie, but it is fun to speculate about.
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Old 2011-12-19, 15:04   Link #144
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^ That sounds like an idea of a butchered live action Madoka movie to me.
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Old 2011-12-19, 15:33   Link #145
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I wonder how many would watch the butchered movie though. I'd rather not give Hollywood more ideas.
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Old 2011-12-19, 15:57   Link #146
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Originally Posted by bhl88 View Post
I wonder how many would watch the butchered movie though. I'd rather not give Hollywood more ideas.
I know I would be quite hesitant to anything Hollywood touches that hasn't shown to be utterly lacking in plot, characters, etc. thusfar.

And given that they're never satisfied (judging by the many remakes of the same movie [like The Thing and War of the Worlds], or the many reboots of a popular franchise [Batman]), even if they would do it, I wouldn't at all be surprised if they completely mess it up the first time.

Truth be told, they'd have to change a lot of the story to make it work, but I don't think it's impossible, either. Hollywood is not completely devoid of good script writers, it's just a matter of finding them and the right actors for the job.
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Old 2011-12-19, 19:21   Link #147
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OMG, I don't want to see another huge fail like Hollywood Dragon Ball ever again.
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Old 2011-12-19, 22:12   Link #148
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OMG, I don't want to see another huge fail like Hollywood Dragon Ball ever again.
Amen. Until I see Hollywood improve, I won't trust them at all.
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Old 2011-12-20, 00:44   Link #149
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Ugh...

Why are you giving them ideas?

I would oppose those changes because they would distract from the real story. The changes I suggested for localization are all so that the actual story (which is timeless and speaks to all cultures) comes through; instead of American audiences being distracted by the "foreign" aspects such as strange names.

Kamijo isn't important from a storytelling aspect except as a symbol of temptation and loss for Sayaka. Which is why he disappears from the story once Sayaka is broken,

Does Kamijo (aka Kent) have to be a violin player? No. But he does have to be a balanced (idealized) male figure. He can't be masculine dominant (which making him a football player would do without a bunch of time wasted on characterization with him petting kittens and playing with puppies). Making him an artistic or bookish type is the easiest way to do it. Additionally the plot requires it to be something that he can be crippled in, but in a way that won't make him an invalid for the rest of his life. He must be primarily crippled in soul. Which leads to violinist as the most plausible aspect to match the needs of plot, characterization, and symbolism with the minimum time spent on him.

Sigh...

Although I guess it could work... maybe... if you had a very emotive actor who could pull off Kent as a sincere Tebow type character.
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Old 2011-12-20, 02:34   Link #150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sackett View Post
Ugh...

Why are you giving them ideas?
I was half-joking. I did say I was writing that "just for fun".

That being said, I find the idea of a Hollywood movie version of Madoka pretty hard to swallow without some substantial changes, or the Madoka anime becoming way more popular in North America than I currently expect it to become.

Magical girls aren't outside the American experience, but I see no reason to think they can carry a Hollywood movie on their own. How many Hollywood movies involve magical girls in all the key roles?

Your ideas are interesting, and they were a good start, but I really doubt they'd be enough for a truly commercially successful Hollywood movie (and they need to be commercially successful if you're going with a trilogy).


Quote:

I would oppose those changes because they would distract from the real story.
Not in a trilogy, they wouldn't. They'd be after-thoughts in the final movie, and would only be front and center during the Sayaka-focused movie.


Quote:
Kamijo isn't important from a storytelling aspect except as a symbol of temptation and loss for Sayaka. Which is why he disappears from the story once Sayaka is broken,
That's actually part of the problem. More on that in a sec.


Quote:

Does Kamijo (aka Kent) have to be a violin player? No. But he does have to be a balanced (idealized) male figure.
An idealized male figure? Based on what I've read on this site and elsewhere, Kamijo was one of the least liked characters in Madoka Magica. If he remains unchanged for a Hollywood movie version of him, that'll almost certainly remain the same for American-watching audiences.


You can be sure that Hollywood Movie execs who hear that your only two human male characters of note are:

1) A stay-at-home father with virtually no presence whatsoever after the quarter-point of the first movie, and...

2) A violin-playing secondary cast character with very little screen-time

Are going to be horrified at the prospect of entirely failing to appeal to a mainstream American male demographic.

Hollywood action-movies with female leads have a very mixed record commercially as it is (I'm not saying I like that, but it is a fact of the matter). Having one with no strong major male character whatsoever in it is almost a certain recipe for financial disaster.

So how do you get around this problem? Make Kamijo/"Kent" a strong and important character in his own right is probably the best way, as then you don't have to bring in brand new important characters.

Having Kamijo/Kent be a character that would more directly and easily appeal to mainstream American male audiences would not only help, it would probably be downright necessary.


I was half-joking in the sense I was playing around with the idea, mostly (I doubt we'll ever see a Hollywood movie version of Madoka Magica, and maybe that's for the best). But in all seriousness, your changes would not be enough to make a commercially successful Hollywood version of Madoka Magica.

As for who I'd cast as Kent, that's easy: Tom Welling.

Now you have the Smallville/Superman fanbase supporting the film. It's likely not that hard for male comic book fans to transition to a Magical Girl movie, but you probably will need to give them a reason to.
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Old 2011-12-20, 20:28   Link #151
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Is it true that first 2 movies will be just a recap?
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Old 2011-12-22, 19:14   Link #152
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Yep. Plus drama CDs and other stuff like onsen

Yeah I like the idea of this. I wanna hear Kyoko shout Rosso Phantasma.
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Old 2011-12-23, 02:26   Link #153
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No Hollywood Live-action for madoka, it sure would suck, this happening i mean!! Enough with the butchering..
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Old 2011-12-23, 09:21   Link #154
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Yes, that would be enough. The only medium with most of its elements intact to be butchered by Hollywood? I'd vomit first
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Old 2011-12-23, 10:30   Link #155
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Just ran into this now, the first thing that came into my mind was Rebuild of Evangelion, I guess I was right.
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Old 2011-12-26, 11:58   Link #156
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I won't expect the movies to cover the story as well as a 12 episode TV season would, but I am expecting better and higher budget action scenes.
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Old 2011-12-26, 16:16   Link #157
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End of Madoka, now with three times the trolling, three times the mind screw and plenty of 'u suck lol' for the otaku.
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Old 2011-12-26, 16:26   Link #158
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I've thought about it for a little bit and I think in order for the first two recap movies to match the quality of the TV series, they have to do a couple of changes.

I think the first recap movies will cover episodes 1-9 of the TV series, however they will have to remake episodes 1-3's content, as the plot of Madoka doesn't actually kick off till episode 3. If they can shorten but still retain the important content of 1-3, this allows them to focus on Sayaka's arc much better, and also allows them to go more into detail about Kyouko's (and also Mami's) past. The only downside to this is that its actually cutting more screentime from Mami in the beginning, but to be honest, Mami's role in the story is more of a supporting character than a main character. This should be mitigated if they expand on Kyouko and Mami's past from Drama CD 3, which hopefully they will.

Then the 2nd recap movie will cover episodes 10-12, and this allows them to go into much more detail on Homura's past timelines of episode 10. I expect they will include Drama CD 1 content, and possibly more details on past timelines, or maybe introduce even unseen timelines. Either way, this allows for more development on Homura's part, and can also expand on Homura and Madoka's relationship in TL1. Episodes 11-12 don't need changes in content, so all I expect is redone scenes and maybe a flashier Walpurgisnacht battle, which I don't think anyone would mind.
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Old 2011-12-26, 20:10   Link #159
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Trouble is, that makes the second movie awfully short. Those 3 eps by themselves are just one hour of content. Putting in Drama CD 3 barely pushes it to 90 minutes.
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Old 2011-12-27, 06:02   Link #160
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Trouble is, that makes the second movie awfully short. Those 3 eps by themselves are just one hour of content. Putting in Drama CD 3 barely pushes it to 90 minutes.
Don't worry because the original script in episode 10 is about 45 min long.
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