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Old 2013-04-25, 16:33   Link #321
ganbaru
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnimeFan188 View Post
The Thin Red Line:

"Chemical weapons — the ‘red line’ which President Obama said he would so
resolutely oppose — have emerged in Syria. Blood tests have confirmed the
exposure of patients in hospitals to these weapons. Readers will recall that
President Obama issued a stern warning against their use. Now they’ve been
used. The problem is now how ignore them. The National Journal’s article is
headlined: “Obama Is Looking for Reasons to Delay Response to Syria’s Chemical
Weapons Use.”"

See:

http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/...thin-red-line/


Ok, the Red Line's been crossed.

Now what?
Probably trying to get others countries to go with them into that mess.
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Old 2013-04-25, 18:48   Link #322
Badkarma 1
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Reports via the news feeds say it might be sarin nerve gas, but these reports are "tainted" as the tests passed through "too many hands".

If anything Zippy will wait to see if the U.N. steps in first before committin troops or U.S. firepower.
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Old 2013-04-25, 20:27   Link #323
kyp275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnimeFan188 View Post

Ok, the Red Line's been crossed.

Now what?
Now to the PR room to try to spin the impending backtracking!
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Old 2013-04-26, 02:06   Link #324
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Look, in the end no one cares that Syria broke international law. America torture people, but it's not like anyone did anything about it. There is a lack of pro-America forces in Syria that the CIA can aid, so there is really no benefit in simply replacing one anti-America government with a different anti-America government.

I don't see the USA gaining anything by interfering. I say let Israel go at it alone and see what happens.
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Old 2013-04-26, 02:11   Link #325
Ithekro
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Unless the Saudi or Turks want in on it.
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Old 2013-04-26, 02:15   Link #326
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Unless the Saudi or Turks want in on it.
At least they would have a reason to. After all, they ARE neighbouring nations. Unlike the US, The likes of Turkey do have real incentive to want Syria to stop the damn fights. It is all about what you had to gain vs what you lose.
USA have nothing to gain in charging into Syria, but Turkey and Saudi do get genuine benefits if the civil war ends.

Much like how the United States have a vested interest in aiding the Mexican government. Even when the war isn't about you, having fighting next door is bad in general.
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Old 2013-04-28, 16:56   Link #327
AnimeFan188
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Defected Syrian general claims he was ordered to use chemical weapons:

"Former Assad army general asserts he used harmless substance instead;
statement aired on an anti-Assad TV channel, raising questions over veracity of
claims; Syrian rebels claim Assad used chemical weapons near Damascus last week."

See:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-e...apons-1.517952


================================================


Alleged chemical arms use in Syria appears to fit pattern of gradual introduction of weapons:

"The instances in which chemical weapons are alleged to have been used in Syria
were purportedly small in scale: nothing along the lines of Saddam Hussein's
1988 attack in Kurdish Iraq that killed thousands.

That raises the question of who would stand to gain as President Bashar Assad's
regime and the opposition trade blame for the alleged attacks, and proof remains
elusive.

Analysts say the answer could lie in the past — the regime has a pattern of
gradually introducing a weapon to the conflict to test the international
community's response."

See:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/04...-introduction/



================================================


DIY gas masks as Syria rebels wary of chemical attack:

"An empty soda bottle, crushed charcoal and cola-soaked gauze -- Syrian rebels
are scrambling to protect against chemical attacks by regime forces by cobbling
together DIY gas masks from household items."

See:

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/DIY_...ttack_999.html


================================================


Reports: IAF Aircraft Fly over Damascus:

"According to various reports from Syria, Israeli Air Force aircraft flew earlier today
this morning above the presidential palace in Damascus, potentially as a message
of sorts intended for Bashar al-Assad."

See:

http://www.israeldefense.com/?Catego...ArticleID=2088
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Old 2013-04-28, 17:30   Link #328
ganbaru
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Lawmakers press Obama to take action on Syria
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...93R0FA20130428
Quote:
Republican senators on Sunday pressed U.S. President Barack Obama to intervene in Syria's civil war, saying America could attack Syrian air bases with missiles but should not send in ground troops.
Nobody really want to send ground force but the question of the usefullness of a ''air/missiles strike only'' as to be proven, no ? It would had more impact if it would had been done a year ago .
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Old 2013-04-28, 17:41   Link #329
Ithekro
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The problem is that we are actually really good at the war part of the story. We've not gotten very good at the aftermath part. It worked better for Germany and Japan than anyplace else we've been since the 1950s.
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Old 2013-04-28, 17:56   Link #330
AnimeFan188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Lawmakers press Obama to take action on Syria
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...93R0FA20130428

Nobody really want to send ground force but the question of the usefullness of a ''air/missiles strike only'' as to be proven, no ? It would had more impact if it would had been done a year ago .
One of the main objectives (perhaps THE main objective) of intervening in Syria would
be to keep Assad's chem weapon stockpile out of the hands of terrorists.

Can this be done without "boots on the ground"?

If you simply destroy the chem sites from the air, it's gonna suck for any civvies who
are downwind of that.
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Old 2013-04-28, 21:14   Link #331
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnimeFan188 View Post
One of the main objectives (perhaps THE main objective) of intervening in Syria would
be to keep Assad's chem weapon stockpile out of the hands of terrorists.

Can this be done without "boots on the ground"?

If you simply destroy the chem sites from the air, it's gonna suck for any civvies who
are downwind of that.
I see no point. "Keep weapons out of the hands of terrorists" is a slogan that means nothing, that was never the reason to go to war with anybody. Any effort to secure it is more effort than the actual risks it suppresses.

Less people will die by not attacking Syria, than worry about the chemical weapons falling in the "wrong hands", whatever that means.
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Old 2013-04-30, 21:40   Link #332
AnimeFan188
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Hezbollah’s Challenge:

"Hezbollah’s Hassan Nasrallah has openly upped the ante in Syria by declaring his
organization on the side of Syrian President Assad. ”Nasrallah – a close ally of
Assad – also hinted that Russia and Iran, Syria’s principal supporters, would
intervene militarily to prevent his defeat.”

By throwing his turban into the ring Nasrallah served notice that the Syrian conflict
might drag in Israel via Lebanon or the long-range rockets Hezbollah has aimed at
the Jewish state. In short, Hezbollah has escalated the Syrian conflict and
internationalized it. The Guardian writes “‘Nasrallah just made sure Syria will get a
lot worse,’ quoting analyst Emile Hokayem of the International Institute for Strategic
Studies.”"

See:

http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/...ahs-challenge/
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Old 2013-04-30, 23:40   Link #333
achirist
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Intervention will turn a civil war (with both sides already being backed/funded by foreign countries) into a world war. The US, Saudi Arabia and Quatar need to stop funding the rebels and pressure them into a political process instead.
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Old 2013-05-01, 00:46   Link #334
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by achirist View Post
Intervention will turn a civil war (with both sides already being backed/funded by foreign countries) into a world war. The US, Saudi Arabia and Quatar need to stop funding the rebels and pressure them into a political process instead.
I am still terrified at American Hawks trying to demand war. What are they trying to gain from this anyway? The government is resisting, but who knows how long it can last. It is amazing that there are people crazy enough to want the US government to get involved with a civil war where neither side are worth aiding.

Seriously, the main issue of Syria is that I don't see any improvements in an overthrow. Assad is no saint, but no one ever suggests that the rebels are any better. If the country isn't going to have a better government, then what's the point of throwing away human lives only to change nothing?

I can never consider intervention a good idea for as long as I see no long term positives. There just is no point to any of it unless you are in the weapons manufacturing business. And don't even bother getting started on chemical weapons; no one really cares about that.
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Old 2013-05-01, 02:48   Link #335
SaintessHeart
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It is a Muslim conflict - Shia vs Sunni. It is best anyone who's not a Muslim, or is a moderate, stay out of it.
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Old 2013-05-01, 05:05   Link #336
ganbaru
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There's already a lot of non-syrians implicated into this conflict, even if they aren't fighting.
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Old 2013-05-01, 05:19   Link #337
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
There's already a lot of non-syrians implicated into this conflict, even if they aren't fighting.
Precisely. That is why I say this problem doesn't concern anyone else other than those with interests there, even then they should just contain and let them kill each other.
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Old 2013-05-01, 06:03   Link #338
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Precisely. That is why I say this problem doesn't concern anyone else other than those with interests there, even then they should just contain and let them kill each other.
Alternatively some kind of peace deal should be made. But we know enough blood has being spelt by now that it probably going to end in bloodbath one way or another.

Of course it is best if the fighting ends. But no one knows HOW. And until someone come up with a solution that is plausible, intervention without a plan is foolishness.
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Old 2013-05-01, 07:32   Link #339
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Precisely. That is why I say this problem doesn't concern anyone else other than those with interests there, even then they should just contain and let them kill each other.
Some of the ''outsider'' bigger concerns might be in fact to simply contain this in Syria only. They saw what happened in Libya and the inpat on some of the countries around it. Plus the possibility of the chemical weapon falling into the hand of terrorist groups is kind of a danger. Just think about what kind of attack could do the Hezbollah either in Israel or Liban with some Sarin ?
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Old 2013-05-01, 07:36   Link #340
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Some of the ''outsider'' bigger concerns might be in fact to simply contain this in Syria only. They saw what happened in Libya and the inpat on some of the countries around it. Plus the possibility of the chemical weapon falling into the hand of terrorist groups is kind of a danger. Just think about what kind of attack could do the Hezbollah either in Israel or Liban with some Sarin ?
The Sarin would be no more dangerous than backpack bombs. At this point old school explosives is far more effective at inciting terror than chemical weapons that are far less reliable and harder to deploy.

If and when the civil war ends, there would be negotiations with whoever wins, to secure the chemical weapons. But until then there is too much risks trying to jump into the conflicts just for that.

Intervention in Syria right now would kill more people than you potentially save. That's the long and short of it.
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