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View Poll Results: Penguin Drum - Episode 22 Rating
Perfect 10 22 39.29%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 20 35.71%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 8 14.29%
7 out of 10 : Good 2 3.57%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 1.79%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 1.79%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 1.79%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 1.79%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-12-09, 05:06   Link #21
Nikkan
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Spoiler for 22:
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Old 2011-12-09, 06:19   Link #22
Kyuu
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Looking back... didn't Kanba and Masako have this kind of moment?

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-12-09, 06:33   Link #23
SoFarGone
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So is Mario going to do anything with two episodes left? I don't see it so Mario with the penguin hat has been pointless.
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Old 2011-12-09, 07:50   Link #24
Sides
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Why Masako? Why! ;_;
Looking forward how the series will pan out. Are two episodes enough to create a satisfying ending? Only time will tell.
As for Mario he seem to have a roll to play in the whole story, but I really hope he will not just turn up at the last moment and save the world, in 5min screen time.
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Old 2011-12-09, 09:57   Link #25
klare
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Kanba lost 2 sisters in one day... now where to find the other half of the diary?

this eps is full of sadness, as for Kanba's phone, i am guessing he used it to issue commands
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Old 2011-12-09, 11:49   Link #26
-Sho-
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I wish Shouma moved his ass. He only was good in his childhood , well with Ringo's part too but that's it...
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Old 2011-12-09, 13:51   Link #27
mark1246
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Not to be Negative or anything, BUT What if we Get a “LOST” ending here. If no one get what i mean it a reference to that ABC show “Lost” that ran for 10 yrs and even at the end they left out more then THOUSANDS of question Unanswered!! NOW I’m scare it going to do that with Penguin Drum! that we get the ending but have soooo many question left Unanswered

What are your thoughts people?
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Old 2011-12-09, 14:40   Link #28
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To defend Shouma a bit, I'm not sure what can realistically be expected of him given the circumstances.

I mean, we're talking nothing less than serious urban warfare here, with Kanba now the notorious leader of the terrorist side of that. Episode 21 made it clear that Shouma is no physical match for Kanba, let alone for Kanba and his entire organization. And Shouma has already tried reasoning with Kanba, and that didn't work.

For all the speculations that Shouma would be the main main protagonist in the end, maybe that's not going to be the case after all. The current situation simply seems beyond him to me.

That might change. Shouma could rush off to where Kanba is, and try one more time to talk him out of his madness, and that might actually work this time. But barring that, or Shouma getting his hands on some sort of magical plot device, it's hard to see what Shouma can reasonably be expected to do here.


Now, as for Kanba, I more or less agree with these two posts...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
I'm no longer rooting for Kanba to be redeemed. He doesn't deserve redemption. No amount of manic obsession with a theoretically worthy cause can justify the actions he's taken. Kanba simply uses people and throws them away for what he sees as a noble goal.

If he lives, Ikuhara has created a pretty nihilistic universe here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken_Infinity View Post
It's more about the degree of redemption imo. There's no way Kanba can go back to being a happy-go-lucky playboy Aniki again. But that he can see the errors of his ways, be forgiven at least by his "family" (no bloody way anyone else would, could or should) and repent in some way is possible and for me, that's still redemption.
I find it fascinating, and laudable, how Ikuhara has turned Kanba from the cool and suave proactive protagonist to an increasingly insane yet decently competent antagonist. What's particularly laudable here is how this hasn't felt jarring to me. It actually fits. Probably because it was foreshadowed so well, and the core of Kanba's character (and his motivation) has been consistent.

Nonetheless, my appreciation for Kanba the character doesn't mean I want his coldly destructive and murderous actions to be downplayed and easily forgiven. It's fine if his family, and perhaps even Ringo, forgive him a bit for this (I can imagine a scene where Shouma, possibly accompanied by Ringo, visit him in prison, and he makes up with his brother there), but that's it. Any character redemption beyond that would seem out of place to me now, and might leave a bitter taste in my mouth for the reasons that Guardian Enzo mentioned.


In any event, Episode 22 was another excellent one. It wasn't quite as awesome to me as Episode 21 was, but it was still very very good. The character drama in this anime is truly top-notch, and the action scenes are often amusingly surreal yet also appropriately dramatic and intense.

There's probably no anime currently airing that I'm more eager to see the conclusion of than this one. Mawaru Penguin Drum has truly been an exciting and memorable viewing experience.
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Old 2011-12-09, 15:07   Link #29
ars89
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Double H finally appeared! Looks like the penguin drum will finally be relevant again. Masako was awesome. Shouma really has to do something now. So is Mario dead as well?
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Old 2011-12-09, 15:38   Link #30
Utsuro no Hako
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ars89 View Post
Double H finally appeared! Looks like the penguin drum will finally be relevant again. Masako was awesome. Shouma really has to do something now. So is Mario dead as well?
I think Mario has to be alive so the PotC can have some channel into this world.
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Old 2011-12-09, 16:24   Link #31
mysh
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BTW, has anyone mentioned that apart from Double H Ringo AND Shouma have their own scarves as well? I guess it was Ringo now, not Himari, who knitted them.
And I have very strong Momoka vibes for her right now, poor girl...

Last edited by mysh; 2011-12-17 at 10:05.
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Old 2011-12-09, 16:46   Link #32
mellomarie
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omg kanba

i don't feel his actions are character assasination in the least--i think he's a great vechile in understanding WHY people become terrorists and kill others. all along, kanba's resolution to save his sister and protect his family made him a sympathetic, tragic character in the beginning and it's now made him a (still tragic) villain. not to say that i'm not a kanba fan cause i am.

and in no way is that justifying his actions, but it makes you understand why disturbed people do the things that they do.

that said, sanetoshi is the true deplorable character here, mainly because I DON'T understand why he's doing this. he used kanba in the worst way possible--he gave him increasingly despicable ways to save his sister, always stating that "there's one way you can save her".

i really do feel like that this episode made some strong parallels between himari and masako. they both are giving up their lives to save their brother--i just felt like masako's was just so much more tragic, considering how she's been trying to save mario too. i've grown to love masako since her flashback episode and she's just frigging amazing.

shouma on the other hand...I GET IT, i get that he's emotionally distraught and has crippling guilt, but i wanted his big shining moment to happen earlier in the series, not two episodes away from the finale. it makes it less believable.

oh tabuki and yuri

and it's so funny how things change, but seeing bits of ringo in my weekly mawaru is like some sunlight in a dark cave or something lol. she's just so funny and sane now.

finally shoma in the same box as the penguins? hmm.

amazing episode!
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Old 2011-12-09, 20:11   Link #33
Kirarakim
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I love Shouma but yeah I am definitely disappointed how long it took for them to do anything with him in the present storyline. It doesn't help that the last chapter of the 2nd novel made me think things would change for Shouma sooner (maybe they will in the novels).


As for Kanba it's really hard for me to be sympathetic for him at this point. I am actually hoping there is more to it then saving his sister because sorry killing all those people just to save one girl from a natural death, no matter how much you love her is not sympathetic in the least in my view. I do love his Trench coat and his Penguin though.

And I did love the scene of Himari praying to die like she should to save Kanba. I love that she accepts her death, I just wish Kanba could as well.

Masako was just awesome and I pray she is not dead. Although I did love when Kanba finally acknowledged her, I still don't think Kanba deserved dedication like that.

I am glad that it looks like Yuri & Tabuki will get a happy ending (as long as Tabuki survives). I am certainly hoping for that.

Finally although Ringo didn't do much in this episode I still love her dearly. Man Shouma wake up and see what a wonderful girl you have supporting you.


Anyways Shouma in the cage...I don't even know where to begin speculating but I am dying to know what that is all about.

Looks like next week will be another confrontation between the brothers, and I am hoping for more development for Shouma.


edit Also I love how No. 1 was reading Faust...that was just perfect!
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Old 2011-12-09, 20:11   Link #34
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Oh man, this is going to bother me all week. Who the heck is Shoma?

Spoiler for episode 22:
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Old 2011-12-09, 20:47   Link #35
Kirarakim
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On another note I am getting really tired of seeing people say if they use the diary as a fate transfer it will be a Deus ex machina (and I've been seeing it everywhere)

Now I am not saying this is how the series will end or even my preferred end but it's not a deus ex machina because

1) We have known what the diary could do for awhile so it does not come out of nowhere. There is nothing contrived about it.

2) Use of the diary requires some type of payment/sacrifice, so even if it is used something will be lost. Hence it's not really a magical fix everything.

I mean personally I hope Ikuhara will go with a less predictable route or perhaps he could use this route in a unpredictable way. However, the very fact that we know about this route means it's been set up and it's not a deus ex machina (that term is way overused).
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Old 2011-12-09, 21:08   Link #36
Kazu-kun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
On another note I am getting really tired of seeing people say if they use the diary as a fate transfer it will be a Deus ex machina (and I've been seeing it everywhere)
People use that term loosely. It doesn't mean they're wrong though. Personally, my problem with this "solution" is on the thematic department:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
2) Use of the diary requires some type of payment/sacrifice, so even if it is used something will be lost. Hence it's not really a magical fix everything.
Even if there's a payment, it's still an easy way out, because it removes the need for the characters to take responsibility for their own actions. This is specially true for Penguindrum, where many of the characters fucked up their lives on their own accord. To bail them out with magic or whatever is most definitely a cop-out.
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Old 2011-12-09, 21:23   Link #37
Kirarakim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
People use that term loosely. It doesn't mean they're wrong though. Personally, my problem with this "solution" is on the thematic department

I never said it would be a "good ending". It just not a deus ex machina so yes they are wrong. The term is being used incorrectly.



Quote:
Even if there's a payment, it's still an easy way out, because it removes the need for the characters to take responsibility for their own actions. This is specially true for Penguindrum, where many of the characters fucked up their lives on their own accord. To bail them out with magic or whatever is most definitely a cop-out.
I am not arguing whether it's an easy way out. I don't disagree with anything you said here but that was not the point of my post.

However, I do think it is important to realize that when using the diary something is lost. Yes it is a magical solution (and I personally don't like those either) but it's not a magical solution where "everything" is fixed. It's a magical solution where things are fixed but something has to be lost in the process.

My main problem with that ending is it's way to predictable and seeing as how Ikuhara in a commentary laughed gleefully that he changed the Utena ending because he thought people would figure it out; well I just can't see him going that route.


And I mean come on through this entire series Ikuhara has been trying to fool the audience (and largely succeeding). Probably the one thing Penguindrum has been predictable about is its unpredictability.
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Old 2011-12-09, 21:57   Link #38
Kazu-kun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I never said it would be a "good ending". It just not a deus ex machina so yes they are wrong. The term is being used incorrectly.
Well, I don't think the meaning of this term is that rigid and clear, but I think today most people just use that term to describe an ending where the "solution" to the conflic isn't earned. Since the main conflict of Penguindrum doesn't revolve around Ringo, if it is resolved by her then it would seen like deus ex machina.

I personally wouldn't use the term "deus ex machina" myself but I don't think its usage in this context is necessarily wrong.
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Old 2011-12-09, 22:06   Link #39
Kirarakim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
Well, I don't think the meaning of this term is that rigid and clear, but I think today most people just use that term to describe an ending where the "solution" to the conflic isn't earned.
The meaning is rigid and clear it is just often used incorrectly. What you are saying is not a deus ex machina.

A deus ex machina is a contrived plot device that comes out of nowhere to save the characters from a hopeless situation. I just can't see how the diary (which has been clearly set up beforehand) is a deus ex machina.

I am sorry that this is turning a bit off topic, I just had to get that off my chest. I don't care if people complain about that possible ending, I just wish they wouldn't use that term.
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Old 2011-12-09, 22:22   Link #40
Kazu-kun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
The meaning is rigid and clear it is just often used incorrectly. What you are saying is not a deus ex machina.
I would say there's no such a thing as something "rigid and clear" when it comes to semantics, specially concerning such informal term, but meh... let's just agree to disagree and call it a day.
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