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Old 2012-06-01, 11:27   Link #1121
Kanon
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
Anger isn't rational and I'm sure Fleur had to deal with survivor's guilt since her living meant another had to die.
I can understand why she'd feel guilty, but blaming her father is going too far, unless he was somehow responsible for the accident.
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Old 2012-06-01, 11:41   Link #1122
morbosfist
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
I can understand why she'd feel guilty, but blaming her father is going too far, unless he was somehow responsible for the accident.
You're thinking about it from his point of view, or that of an outsider. As she sees it, he sacrificed her mother to save her life. It's not rational, but as noted that sort of anger usually isn't.
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Old 2012-06-01, 11:50   Link #1123
sikvod00
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Even though we don't know the reason why, the episode implies that Ao's anger/resentment towards Renton is equally as petty and irrational as Fleur's. But it's natural for teenagers to be overly-judgmental of their parents and to do things out of spite, as a sign of defiance.
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Old 2012-06-01, 13:55   Link #1124
Destined_Fate
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Ao has reason to hate his Father because he never met him and that if his Father was a great guy than why wasn't he there when the villagers were treating Eureka, his mother, like ****? I'm sure Ao, as a kid, strongly believes that the man should protect his girl. I mean he is just a teenager after all and he doesn't know why his Father left his Mother behind to raise him in that environment.

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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
You're thinking about it from his point of view, or that of an outsider. As she sees it, he sacrificed her mother to save her life. It's not rational, but as noted that sort of anger usually isn't.
Correct, besides this lets them use that plot point for a "Touching moment" later in the series when she realizes her Father did it out of love and it was a hard choice for him. From the way he's acting I'm sure he's putting up a front for her and she sees it as him being cold to the long departed. It's simply anger, guilt, and a lack of communication for why she hates her father. I'm sure they haven't even bothered trying to talk about what happened because it's a very touchy subject while talking about clear everything up.
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Old 2012-06-01, 14:07   Link #1125
Xagzan
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The thing I don't understand for this episode is, how is it that Ao's kidnapped-by-the-evil-villain childhood friend disappears from his mind so quickly. For all he knows, she could be getting tortured, or already killed even, and after he's caught once trying to go find her, just completely forgets about her. There is kind of a sense of urgency here, Ao. The hell?
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Old 2012-06-01, 15:53   Link #1126
ttdestroy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xagzan View Post
The thing I don't understand for this episode is, how is it that Ao's kidnapped-by-the-evil-villain childhood friend disappears from his mind so quickly. For all he knows, she could be getting tortured, or already killed even, and after he's caught once trying to go find her, just completely forgets about her. There is kind of a sense of urgency here, Ao. The hell?
He's got a hot piece of blond tail to chase now. Why should he be concerned with some girl who, if the events of Ao's "dream" are true, chose to go with a terrorist? I'd be all up in that Fleur shake, she's got daddy issues and if she does forgive her father eventually, the President's a huge Ao fan for whatever reason. Listen to Elena and go elope.
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Old 2012-06-01, 16:15   Link #1127
Xagzan
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Really though aside from Elena's elope comment, I certainly didn't see any Ao/Fleur flags raised. The fact that they had a more personal scene together doesn't mean it was an impetus for romance, and the two of them even now have really shown no romantic interest in each other. On the other hand, it's pretty obvious Fleur's still got a little crush on Gazelle.

Poor characters. If it wasn't so obvious that Ao and Naru will be the end couple (unless that OP is just a massive troll), I'd feel bad for how everybody has unrequited love. It'd be a straight line of romance! It'd go Naru > Ao > Fleur > Gazelle > Rebecca > ....Naru?

But seriously, I don't understand how he just doesn't even think about it anymore. He doesn't know if the dream events were true, just that she was kidnapped or whatever that report said. Even if things did play out exactly as his dream showed, I can't imagine him not assuming Truth would hurt her regardless, and wanting above all to get her back.
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Old 2012-06-01, 16:53   Link #1128
Guardian Enzo
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Another example of the superb writing this series has consistently provided (screenplay was by the esteemed Kawasaki Hiroyuki, who wrote the adaptation of Hyouge Mono). Once again Astral Ocean displays a philosophical similarity with it’s predecessor handled in much different style, and that’s the moral ambiguity of the authority figures (and power figures too – not necessarily the same thing). In some ways I think E7 was told from Renton’s POV – it was that world as seen from the POV of an angry 14 year-old boy. Well, we have an angry 12 year-old boy at the center of AO, but the narrative perspective here is more reflective – in a sense, it’s as if the story is being told by an adult Ao looking back at these events.

Some clever references this week - among them Elena's to "A hot day in Little Russia", which is from Mussorgsky's "The Fair in Sorochyntsi", an opera about a devil, a red jacket and temptation. Also, the reference to Philadelphia 1752 is a continuing theme - implying that The Secret have been present at critical moments in mankind's development (in this case, Ben Franklin and discovering electricity).
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:03   Link #1129
Jerseykid
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I want fleur to give ao a kiss soooo bad!
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:08   Link #1130
SQA
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Ao hasn't forgotten Naru. They just aren't letting him take a military weapon on a trip 1/2 way around the world to go searching for her. That's what the first scene was setting up.

Now, I don't think there'll be much romance in this incarnation of E7. The characters are noticeably younger and the feel is very different. They'll all be friends/on good terms, but Elena will keep trolling. (They finally dropped an Aquarion reference, which was funny. Aquarion's Kawamori designed the original Nirvash.)

We also got the first solid contrast between the way Ao will progress and the way Renton progressed. As much as Renton went "I don't want to kill people", he very much cast himself in the "I don't care if the world burns" camp. His intentions were to take care of himself, the Amita Drive and Eureka. That he needed to "save the world" was what he was forced into, not what he set out to do.

Ao, on the other hand, is very much in the 'Knight in Shining Armor" mode. He wants to "Save the World" yet really doesn't understand that world. So his progression is going to be more wrapped around what is actually means to "save" people, especially the "who do you save?" question. Which should probably raise a Death Flags for many characters. (This also ties into the "hard choices" theme with Fleur)

I did love Ao/Fleur getting a nice little comeuppance. They're still children with a lot to learn. And GenBleu has its priorities, but it has to operate in the real world. The world isn't so easy as just "saving everyone" all the time.
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:12   Link #1131
SQA
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I also liked the Kite Experiment reference and the Secrets being present. Though it opens a question of how long the Scub Coral have been showing up. Do Secrets only show up for Scub Coral or do they just show up randomly, period?
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:21   Link #1132
Destined_Fate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xagzan View Post
The thing I don't understand for this episode is, how is it that Ao's kidnapped-by-the-evil-villain childhood friend disappears from his mind so quickly. For all he knows, she could be getting tortured, or already killed even, and after he's caught once trying to go find her, just completely forgets about her. There is kind of a sense of urgency here, Ao. The hell?
Ao isn't your typical MC, he matured faster after getting a talking to. Where would he even start looking? He has no idea wher Naru is at and would be wasteing his time. Especially when he's reminded that the world needs his team more than ever because the Goldilocks are still out for the count.

Besides, he has a blonde chick wanting his attention and when the Goldilocks return to action I'm sure all 3 of them will be wanting his attention as well.
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:33   Link #1133
j4c06
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Some clever references this week - among them Elena's to "A hot day in Little Russia", which is from Mussorgsky's "The Fair in Sorochyntsi", an opera about a devil, a red jacket and temptation.
Congrats on spotting this one, but what is so clever about it beside its obscurity? Looks like another pointless reference for the sake of reference to me.
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Old 2012-06-01, 17:36   Link #1134
Xagzan
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Originally Posted by SQA View Post
Ao hasn't forgotten Naru. They just aren't letting him take a military weapon on a trip 1/2 way around the world to go searching for her. That's what the first scene was setting up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
Ao isn't your typical MC, he matured faster after getting a talking to. Where would he even start looking? He has no idea wher Naru is at and would be wasteing his time. Especially when he's reminded that the world needs his team more than ever because the Goldilocks are still out for the count.
You're misunderstanding me. I'm not implying I expected him to go out and search for her at any cost, even after being forbidden and put under constant watch. My confusion comes from how he doesn't even spare a thought to it afterwards; he doesn't seem the least bit worried about Naru, even though she's been taken by the guy who just attacked their base. It's weird.

Quote:
Besides, he has a blonde chick wanting his attention and when the Goldilocks return to action I'm sure all 3 of them will be wanting his attention as well.
You just said he's matured
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Old 2012-06-01, 18:01   Link #1135
Guardian Enzo
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Originally Posted by j4c06 View Post
Congrats on spotting this one, but what is so clever about it beside its obscurity? Looks like another pointless reference for the sake of reference to me.
You don't think stories of a Faustian nature are relevant to what's happening at GenBleu?
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Old 2012-06-01, 18:13   Link #1136
j4c06
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
You don't think stories of a Faustian nature are relevant to what's happening at GenBleu?
Sorry but there doesn't seem to be anything Faustian, more like a lighthearted folk comedy (nothing scarier than a pig shows up).
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Old 2012-06-01, 18:20   Link #1137
Guardian Enzo
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It's a farce, but it's not lighthearted. It's actually quite dark - there are temptation issues as well as a substantial focus on racism. In opera, "comedy" doesn't always equal "light".
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Old 2012-06-01, 18:24   Link #1138
duckroll
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
(screenplay was by the esteemed Kawasaki Hiroyuki, who wrote the adaptation of Hyouge Mono)
Lol. I never thought I would see those string of words put together in my entire life. :P
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Old 2012-06-01, 18:30   Link #1139
j4c06
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
It's a farce, but it's not lighthearted. It's actually quite dark - there are temptation issues as well as a substantial focus on racism. In opera, "comedy" doesn't always equal "light".
Racism? Where did you get that from?
And as far as temptations, nobody get to pay for them with their immortal soul or anything, i.e. nothing Faustian...
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Old 2012-06-01, 19:02   Link #1140
Guardian Enzo
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Moussorgsky (who was Jewish) incorporates anti-Semitism into the story. But honestly, this is getting off-topic.

Not a Hyouge Mono fan, Duck? I think it's magnificently written myself.
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