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Old 2012-06-29, 15:24   Link #881
Anh_Minh
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I don't feel like anything was resolved at the end. I mean, sure, it's nice for the three of them to see they're all doing fine, but they've all built their lives apart from each other. What are they supposed to do now?

Especially Kaoru and Ritsuko. It's not like they couldn't have gotten in touch if they wanted to. We're supposed to believe that now they're going to reconnect? That their "love story" meant anything after high school? Is Ritsuko Kaoru's beard or something?
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Old 2012-06-29, 15:42   Link #882
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flawnalyst View Post
I will never understand why this is a negative. The father's actions with giving Sen a pen (I forgot why that was significant, but I'm pretty sure the anime explained it) was more than enough to resolve things. It's that Watanabe style of "show don't tell" that I want to scream at Fate/Zero, Tatami Galaxy, and especially Makoto Shinkai to do.
I've never really thought introspection on emotions counted as "telling". Rather, I thought giving ones thoughts that otherwise can't be conveyed counted as "showing".
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Old 2012-06-29, 16:13   Link #883
deadite
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I was hoping this would get animated
Spoiler for final jam session:
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Old 2012-06-29, 17:41   Link #884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haak View Post
I've never really thought introspection on emotions counted as "telling". Rather, I thought giving ones thoughts that otherwise can't be conveyed counted as "showing".
Tatami Galaxy, maybe. But the others, you could easily show the emotions. I could clearly see them in 5 cm per second. But then the characters narrated and killed all subtlety.
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Old 2012-06-29, 17:55   Link #885
Haak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flawnalyst View Post
Tatami Galaxy, maybe. But the others, you could easily show the emotions. I could clearly see them in 5 cm per second. But then the characters narrated and killed all subtlety.
Really? I thought introspection was what made that film. For me, good introspection means I can feel more emotional attachment to a character because I know exactly what he's thinking. If all I'm seeing are faces then I'll just feel like a spectator. But for the record, 5 Centimetres is still in my personal top five so maybe it's just a matter of taste.
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Old 2012-06-29, 19:09   Link #886
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I'm so conflicted on Kaoru as a character. I didn't think it was possible for someone to be such a bitch half the time and a pretty awesome person the other half. I think this is the main reason I disliked the romance angles with this show, it seemed to bring out the worst in the characters, while the friendship's left me feeling a lot happier. I feel Kaoru would of been a bunch better character if he wasn't always trying to get with Rii-chan.

And like others, I'm conflicted on the last few episodes as well. I wasn't too happy with episodes 10 and 11, and the first half of 12 was incredibly infuriating with the usual Kaouri/Rii-chan ackward awfulness that they have to jam into every episode, but I quite enjoyed the last half, even if it was incredibly ambiguous. I haven't read the manga so I can't comment on how different is was.


Quote:
Originally Posted by deadite View Post
I was hoping this would get animated
Spoiler for final jam session:
Fitting that the artsyle is so close to Nodame, and I even see some Usagi drop in there. Or maybe it's because Shoujo/Josei Mangaka seem to have very similar artstyles a lot of times.(not that that's a bad thing.)
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Old 2012-06-29, 20:43   Link #887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haak View Post
Really? I thought introspection was what made that film. For me, good introspection means I can feel more emotional attachment to a character because I know exactly what he's thinking. If all I'm seeing are faces then I'll just feel like a spectator. But for the record, 5 Centimetres is still in my personal top five so maybe it's just a matter of taste.
Hey, my favorite anime is My Neighbor Totoro, so what do I know?

Still, I've made it clear in the past that I hate narration with a passion.
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Old 2012-06-29, 23:10   Link #888
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I liked the church jam session. Similar things happen at my church several times a year. And since I'm the archivist for the music department, I can share one of them with you:

Spoiler for Musical selection...:


I also like that Ri-chan showed up at the end. After seeing this final episode, I now think that the primary focus of this story was not the Kaoru/Sentaro relationship, but rather the relationship between all three of them. Together they are family, and the bond runs between all three.
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Old 2012-06-29, 23:40   Link #889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
I am fully aware of your and others' longstanding and oft-repeated opinion. I just felt like mentioning that. In fact, I have come to share your opinion, since they did so little with the romance side of the story, after getting it going pretty well. In fact, I feel they did precious little with the friendship side of the story, and even the personal development side of the story, which were evidently the sides they wanted to emphasize, after getting them well set up.
Funny, I thought this was the first time I mentioned that. Anyway, sometimes romances are fleeting and just don't work out because people aren't willing to commit. I think this was one of those. It's kind of one of those life experiences. Personally I'm okay with this and am actually quite pleased that the story didn't go the obvious route with a cheesy love triangle and instead opted for the status quo.

As for the friendship side of the story, a lot of that was conveyed through the jazz jam sessions as well as the ways that they supported each other. They also fought on occasions and came back together after like happens in pretty much any friendship and unlike a lot of stuff I've seen the fighting didn't really feel like an attempt to inject tension into the story, because the tone of the story never really changed so much as shifted gears.

I don't know, I guess this one just clicked with me in a way these types of shows often fail to do and thus I just can't be disappointed in it. It felt genuine and heartfelt and decidely non-commercial and that to me is more important than how well a show follows the source or how "rushed" it feels, which is I understand of utmost importance to a lot of people. That's cool, but the way I look at it is that It's never going to be it's source material, it was evident at the beginning of production when it was announced as a noitaminA. Thus I simply did not expect it and instead chose to take the story as it was presented to me which frankly was fine.

I guess I'll let that be my final word on the overall show. Between this and Chihayafuru I'd say good character drama is alive and strong in anime.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soconfused View Post
I think this is the main reason I disliked the romance angles with this show, it seemed to bring out the worst in the characters, while the friendship's left me feeling a lot happier. I feel Kaoru would of been a bunch better character if he wasn't always trying to get with Rii-chan.
It definitely did bring out the worst in them. I even think they probably realized it which was why they slowly backed away from it.
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Old 2012-06-30, 04:11   Link #890
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When I was informed that the series was 12 episodes, I was kinda worried, because I was wondering what the hell could they do resolve this, and naturally this episode had plenty of whiplash, with Kaoru almost going into emo-mode, but thankfully this show is actually well written and averted disaster. Still, with the time skip it was pretty rough, but the musical performance at the end was just too awesome to ignore.

I suppose there were no grand plots to resolve, battles to be won, romances to be cemented, but that's not what Kids on the Slope is about. It's just about life itself, and we just got a piece of it for our wonderful cast; like I've said, this show is about the experience. I suppose I wasn't truly into any of them, but they were memorable, execution was great especially concerning the music and lord knows we need more quality male characters. This season has done well in providing them. That ending with Sen and Kaoru running back meeting up with Ritsuko and the very excellent OP (best one thus far this year) in the end, is really something.

8/10 for that finale, and 8.5/10 for the series overall. It's been a great ride.
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Old 2012-06-30, 05:14   Link #891
Lilith
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Ep 11 + Ep 12
OH, that was breathtaking!

You just know, KNOW, that Sen will run away after his step-dad is back wether it was a car accident, or a school festival incident or anything else that might affect the fragile connection.

The 8 years time skip was quite jarring. I wish they dedicated a whole episode rather than just half, because the coincidences seemed forced. As for the open-ending... I can always wish for extras or something. (moar SEN x KAORU~ )

Over all, I absolutely loved this series! I'll never forget the jam sessions, I'm beginning to like Jazz.

TRACK IDENTIFICATION REQUEST:
In the last episode (12), When Ri-chan is with her friend in the cafe (around 2:37), what's that song in the background? It sounds awfully familiar...
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Last edited by Lilith; 2012-06-30 at 05:41.
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Old 2012-06-30, 05:48   Link #892
bbee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flawnalyst View Post
I'm pretty sure Sen's issues with his father were explained in Episode 4. The reason he left can also be attributed to Episode 4
...
The father's actions with giving Sen a pen (I forgot why that was significant, but I'm pretty sure the anime explained it) was more than enough to resolve things. It's that Watanabe style of "show don't tell" that I want to scream at Fate/Zero, Tatami Galaxy, and especially Makoto Shinkai to do.
I didn't forget that bit. The way the reunion with the father went in the anime, it felt like there was a lot more to it than that. It just didn't feel like something this long-standing, something that would cause Sen to abandon his family, could be resolved simply by handing over a gift, and without any words wasted. "Show, don't tell" should always be the MO, but in this case.. You can't resolve such deep, long-standing issues so simply.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flawnalyst View Post
Actually, no. I'm pretty sure that the loss of a friend can drive people apart just as much as it drives them closer together. I've heard of couples that divorced because of the loss of a child and such. Besides, it wasn't just Sentaro leaving. Kaoru was going to a college in Tokyo, far away from Ritsuko. There's no way their relationship could work with him so far away. In fact, it's an exact carbon copy of Jun moving far away, so he tried to break things up with Yurika.
I will never understand this train of thought. To me, it feels like one of those moments in horror movies when someone does something incredibly stupid, and everyone ends up hating them for it. One of those moments that has you screaming at the screen. You DON'T let anything come in the way of love. You just don't.
I can understand that the loss of a child or some other external event could cause a person to change. But if this was the case with Kaoru, then the anime should have spent more time exposing this change and making us understand it. As is, he just seemed to throw away all his feelings for Ritsuko along with Sen's departure. He seemed to decide he could no longer be with Ritsuko, and started being deliberately hurtful, cold, and distant just so she would be soured to him. It IS possible he decided to go to Tokyo and he did all this in an attempt to make his departure easier for her. But in that case, at the very least, there should have been an internal monologue scene describing his internal strife about this. You could again argue that would run counter to the "show, don't tell" principle, but IMO this is such a crucial point to the ending of the show, that it would have been entirely appropriate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Casey View Post
The 'Show, don't tell' thing is carried so far sometimes that it makes it sound as though people just like dry stories because apparently anything except muted emotion is too much emotion. :/
I don't see how these two things are related. If anything, I feel *more* involved with the characters if I'm allowed to interpret what they're thinking.

Time to read the manga, I guess. I do feel that in retrospect, maybe I've been too negative about the show overall. Illustrates the imporance of good endings, I suppose.
It was an amazing ride, and without question one of the most memorable anime in recent memory.
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Old 2012-06-30, 12:30   Link #893
Master Chibi
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I don't think there's quite anything wrong with treating this show negatively, at least certain portions. It's clear that they had to cut and compress things into 12 episodes but that doesn't mean what we got worked out for the better. The pacing just fell apart after episode 10 (specifically when we went from Kaoru wildly confessing to Rii-chan and it suddenly being months later after the commercial) and the show suffered for it.

Personally the last half of episode 12 is practically inexcusable. Hell, the whole situation hurts my head thinking about it. It's why I can't willingly tell people to watch this show, the end just really fucking ruins it.
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Old 2012-06-30, 17:27   Link #894
karice67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredFriendly View Post
Like a lot of other very important scenes that would have helped the viewer have a greater understanding, the great "Show, don't tell" director simply ignored it. There was a scene in the manga
Spoiler for manga spoiler:
Spoiler for About the scene in the manga...:
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Last edited by karice67; 2012-07-06 at 07:31. Reason: added spoiler tag
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Old 2012-06-30, 18:51   Link #895
Reckoner
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I think people are blowing things way of proportion in regards to the ending episodes.

I haven't read the manga nor do I intend to, but seriously this wasn't ever going to be a 1-1 adaption of the manga and it couldn't realistically pack in everything people wanted it to.

If we look at the anime just by itself, there's honestly not that much of an issue.

Yes the time skip after the confession in episode 10 was a little jarring, but honestly what did we really miss? Was there some sort of plot line that was glossed over of much importance? Was there an emotional disconnection between the two parts, even knowing that the romance was hardly the main issue in the closing episodes? I honestly felt no problems otherwise, and it only made me stop for a moment before I got on and enjoyed the rest of it.

I felt the friendship of the main two characters was conveyed excellently, and the emotions in the last episodes were very real. Perhaps I find friendship more touching than others, but I really enjoy this sort of exploration we went through in this show.

I really felt this show was an easy and VERY enjoyable watch. I think what Watanabe set out to accomplish in his main priorities were masterfully done, and with that I didn't really feel I had to watch anymore at the end of the show. What more could I really say? I'd give this a 9/10.
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Old 2012-06-30, 19:20   Link #896
Anh_Minh
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I've only read the last volumes, and yes, it did change my perspective on things.

For one thing, it explained how Kaoru and Ristuko really parted ways, which makes the idea of their reunion less bizarre.

It also explains Kaoru's plans for his life.
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Old 2012-06-30, 19:45   Link #897
fertygo
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To be honest, I think its will be better idea if Nakamura and co just write original anime with similar theme instead adapting some manga and trim it to the death.

I adore all production aspect on this anime, the directing, art and especially the music.. but the story, not so much.. At first its looked strong but after a couple episode I think its just another story that you can easily found in other Jousei story, the fact they rush it isn't helping too in the end.

I know everyone saying about how different this anime, but I wonder if that still true if the media isn't anime, but an asian live-action for example.

Its still enjoyable ride though, and I look forward to Natsuyuki Rendezvous after this.
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Old 2012-07-01, 01:27   Link #898
Master Chibi
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Dude, jarring was skipping a few months ahead after Kaoru confessed to Ritsuko.

Going eight years into the future without any mention whatsoever of what happened within those eight years is absurd.

Oh look you just happened to run into Yuriko who just happens to have a photo of Sen.

Then the two of you play music together like nothing happened and Ritsuki comes out of nowhere (literally) and end credits.

Uh no lol
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Old 2012-07-01, 01:33   Link #899
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I blame noitamina for giving the series only 12 episodes to work with. Meanwhiles, they give Guilty Crown 22...

Really, if this was a 2cour series, it could have been a masterpiece.
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Old 2012-07-01, 02:30   Link #900
Julio C
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocari_Sweat View Post
I blame noitamina for giving the series only 12 episodes to work with. Meanwhiles, they give Guilty Crown 22...

Really, if this was a 2cour series, it could have been a masterpiece.
It was still a great show with some great directing.
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