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Old 2013-11-27, 11:15   Link #8901
Fwarlord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feng Lengshun View Post
No. That's Godou under the influence of a mind-altering spell, not the completely sane Godou. Besides, had he didn't have his girls, he would have still stuck with that spell. He would be forced to continue to battle against Alec, whom even he admits to be scary, and then he would have to battle against Lancelot as well. The slayer of God of Victory or not, that's not a good chance there.

There's also how many, many times he really needs the girls to actually win or do something. Imagine him without the girls when thrown to the past. How much harder will it be? Can he goes through all of them regardless? Possible, but the chances aren't good. From the [Sword], the [Ram], and negotiation... he relies on the girls a lot. Without them, he CAN still function, just not effectively.

And really, Godou without his "Common Sense" and fake pacifism aren't Godou. That's an entirely different character because those two are a defining trait in Godou.
You misunderstood. [Insane Rush] is no mind-altering spell, it's spell to remove all unnecessary restrictions in one's mind. And in Godou's case, it removed those "common sense", or more correctly, some kind of brainwashes that was put on him by his family and society. In other words, [Insane Rush] is no mind control spell, but a spell to remove mind control and make one become his true self.

Actually, the real Godou is a savage warrior who fight for the sake of fighting alone, not the fake personality with common sense and pacifism Godou himself create base on typical Japanese men.

The girls' real purpose isn't to help Godou to survive or win his fights, but to prevent him from fully become a merciless devil king like Uldin or Voban. Without them, he will be more cruel in battle. The [Sword] or the [Ram]? Just enslave some mikos, witchs or knights using the [Youth]. Negotiation? Just brutally kill some guys to make examples and make the rest obey. It's very easy to a real devil king...
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Old 2013-11-27, 11:54   Link #8902
Gore17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feng Lengshun View Post
Of course not, there's the usual route of "fade to black" after all. Sex is an important turning point in a story, I am more interested in the development more than the scene itself. As I have once said, if I ever wrote a sex scene, it would focus more on the emotional part with the physical part as minimal as possible. It's just that how much emotions can be brought with just a single scene is just amazing, and it's much easier to set up than the usual "breaking down the wall" scene too.

Sides, while DxD didn't do that, Kikou Shoujo did that... in the anime. Kind of. Well, it's a welcome fresh air to me, that's all.
Actually, I was talking about that the publishers wouldn't allow it. Even if the author wants to include it, I don't think the publishers will let them. That clearer?

And yes, I'm including the usage of "fade to black" in that statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Feng Lengshun View Post
Law of conservation don't really matter. It's just a matter of pure logic that it must have came from somewhere, either produced or generated by something. So, could it be the soul? The body? An organ? Is it just a natural/biological reaction that bends of laws of reality to do so? As usual, questions.
The soul would normally be the safe bet, but I'm thinking it's a natural process supercharged by being a Campione.
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Old 2013-11-27, 12:14   Link #8903
Feng Lengshun
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Oh. Well, that kind of made sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fwarlord View Post
You misunderstood. [Insane Rush] is no mind-altering spell, it's spell to remove all unnecessary restrictions in one's mind. And in Godou's case, it removed those "common sense", or more correctly, some kind of brainwashes that was put on him by his family and society. In other words, [Insane Rush] is no mind control spell, but a spell to remove mind control and make one become his true self.

Actually, the real Godou is a savage warrior who fight for the sake of fighting alone, not the fake personality with common sense and pacifism Godou himself create base on typical Japanese men.

The girls' real purpose isn't to help Godou to survive or win his fights, but to prevent him from fully become a merciless devil king like Uldin or Voban. Without them, he will be more cruel in battle. The [Sword] or the [Ram]? Just enslave some mikos, witchs or knights using the [Youth]. Negotiation? Just brutally kill some guys to make examples and make the rest obey. It's very easy to a real devil king...
Read that bolded sentence again and tell me it isn't mind-altering. With a straight face. The 'normal' Godou would never do that so it is mind-altering. That thing about 'Actually, the real Godou is a savage warrior who fight for the sake of fighting alone' ? That's practically just one of his side. A human isn't just made of a single trait or subconscious desires. No, that's not it, that's just PART of it. That's the same with Godou. Godou isn't just a lump of powers and desires. That would be Voban and the Heretic Gods. Godou still has a mind and a personality. One that includes more than just that trait you said.

And yet Kusanagi Godou will NOT do those actions you said. Because he still has 'common sense'. Can you call a Kusanagi Godou that do all of the above to be Kusanagi Godou? No. No, I can't. A man is not his power, clothes, or name. A man is what his beyond all of those, his personality, his mind, and what he use those powers for. That's why, that Godou is no longer Kusanagi Godou as much as Counter Guardian EMIYA is not Emiya Shirou.

As it is, for 'Kusanagi Godou' to be able to function effectively, he would need the girls help. Provided that he don't have any of the girls from the start, he might have become a strong shounen action hero. But with the level of the enemy now, no, he can't. He is too much dependent on the girls' helps. The latest chapter shows it brightly. Imagine him without Liliana or Yuri helping him. He'd have a hard time. Sure, he 'might' win in the end, but the chances are slim. And there're no doubt be some big repercussions too.

I think you are the one who misunderstand. What you have to remember, my point of view is mostly meta and not in-universe. If it was in-universe then my opinion it would be "Godou will always win and will only have minor problems at best" but there's no way you could apply that out-universe. Pit him with, say, Galactus and that opinion is thrown right out of the window. That's why, things like "Chances doesn't matter" or "He did the impossible" doesn't really make sense to me. Because if it can be done, it isn't impossible. If it has been done repeatedly, it isn't even a miracle but a real possibility.

And the thing is that he has gotten into several troubles without the girls, he might have gotten into more without the girls (if given the chances). He has been beaten a few times before (regardless how cheap it was thanks to [Ram]), and he might be defeated permanently. Like, say, a certain "God of Victory".
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Old 2013-11-27, 13:40   Link #8904
Fwarlord
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To Feng:
Like you said, a human being is make of many aspects, not just one. That's the very reason why you should only look at the innermost personality, not the normal one a person use everyday to face society, if you really want to judge him. You said "Godou isn't this", "Godou isn't that"... but which Godou you were talking about? The "normal" Godou you talked about is just hollow shell he create under the influences of people around him. You call that "Kusanagi Godou", but no matter how I much look, it just a mask he wear to please his family and society, it has nothing to do with the "real" Godou. To find out a person's real personality, you must remove all influences that were put on his mind, and that is [Insane Rush]'s role. As we know, those who capable of becoming campiones are people with abnormal mind and aren't actually sane, those who can never fit with a modern and civilize society. Godou is no exception, the only difference is he wearing a mask to make him look more like a normal human, which he definitely isn't. And if he never became a campione, he would has misunderstood that mask is his real self. But no more, after becoming a campione, that mask were gradually falling apart as Godou accepting his true self more and more. After reading volume 1, could you ever believe Godou could do what he did in those recent events of volume 14 and 15?
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Old 2013-11-27, 16:11   Link #8905
Breimoon
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Just go read "uno nessuno e centomila" if you want an answer about social masks
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Old 2013-11-27, 18:31   Link #8906
Vezon
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So Aisha is stepping into the ring eh? Nah Godou will probably intervene and Aisha will run away. I'm having a difficult time imagining Aisha fighting.
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Old 2013-11-27, 18:44   Link #8907
bakapervert
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Btw, where does Erica and Ena run off to? Kinda worried that those two just disappear without trace like that.
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Old 2013-11-27, 18:53   Link #8908
Von Himmel
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^
Searching for Godou? They probably also tried to get some information about Artio/Artos while at it too considering that it's them that we're talking about..
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Old 2013-11-27, 18:54   Link #8909
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Chapter 6 - Queen of Turmoil
this tittle really suits to aisha lol
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Old 2013-11-27, 18:54   Link #8910
Awrya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bakapervert View Post
Btw, where does Erica and Ena run off to? Kinda worried that those two just disappear without trace like that.
Quote:
"Much appreciated, Lady Erica. Well then, please feel free to let us know if Uldin's power is needed as well. We are all women in similar situations, so please allow me to offer the most of my meager assistance."
I think they might have gone to Uldin to ask for assistance, this would be the perfect moment to do so.

Quote:
"For the sake of Kusanagi-san who died to protect me, let us try hard and do our best. Kusanagi-san must have turned into a star in the sky and is now watching over us—That is what I believe!"
(...Umm. Isn't Godou-san clearly alive right now?)
(...Indeed. When was Kusanagi Godou killed?)
(Basically, she's the kind of person with excessive enthusiasm. She even gets along with Doni quite well. I also find her airheaded and prone to causing misunderstandings.)
This is getting better and better.
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Old 2013-11-27, 19:19   Link #8911
bakapervert
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What do we call the possessed Doni now? The body is Doni, but the one that control him is Artio, only the sword is from Artos. How can the bears called him Artos when the one inside Doni is Artio?
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Old 2013-11-27, 19:24   Link #8912
Von Himmel
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Originally Posted by bakapervert View Post
What do we call the possessed Doni now? The body is Doni, but the one that control him is Artio, only the sword is from Artos. How can the bears called him Artos when the one inside Doni is Artio?
...I'd suggest Ardios Probably just Artio considering that it's mainly her consciousness
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Old 2013-11-27, 20:08   Link #8913
Ophis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bakapervert View Post
What do we call the possessed Doni now? The body is Doni, but the one that control him is Artio, only the sword is from Artos. How can the bears called him Artos when the one inside Doni is Artio?
Ardonio?lol


PS: Aisha's speeches are just hilarious haha
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Old 2013-11-27, 21:22   Link #8914
bakapervert
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New update again. zzhk, you rock. Looks like Erica and Ena is escaping due to a certain clueless godslayer. Man, their realization is quite terrifying.
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Old 2013-11-27, 21:25   Link #8915
edrey
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if i will be able to kill a campione i will murder aisha, she is to much terrifying with her authorities then maybe voban and his cage of dead servants( for the peace of the world of course, as reader, i don't care)
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Old 2013-11-27, 21:34   Link #8916
Feng Lengshun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fwarlord View Post
To Feng:
Like you said, a human being is make of many aspects, not just one. That's the very reason why you should only look at the innermost personality, not the normal one a person use everyday to face society, if you really want to judge him. You said "Godou isn't this", "Godou isn't that"... but which Godou you were talking about? The "normal" Godou you talked about is just hollow shell he create under the influences of people around him. You call that "Kusanagi Godou", but no matter how I much look, it just a mask he wear to please his family and society, it has nothing to do with the "real" Godou. To find out a person's real personality, you must remove all influences that were put on his mind, and that is [Insane Rush]'s role. As we know, those who capable of becoming campiones are people with abnormal mind and aren't actually sane, those who can never fit with a modern and civilize society. Godou is no exception, the only difference is he wearing a mask to make him look more like a normal human, which he definitely isn't. And if he never became a campione, he would has misunderstood that mask is his real self. But no more, after becoming a campione, that mask were gradually falling apart as Godou accepting his true self more and more. After reading volume 1, could you ever believe Godou could do what he did in those recent events of volume 14 and 15?
@Fwarlord

Yes, yes. That mask of normalcy Godou has? That is his persona, his facade to face life's hardship. That true desire thing? That is his shadow. A person doesn't just have a shadow, they also wears a mask in their life. Facade, status, roles. Everyone has them, not just the shadow and not just the mask either. The shadow might be the "true self" but it isn't the complete being either. A human isn't just his id, but also his ego and super-ego too. If, for example, a person wishes to be a Stu and yet decides not to follow his desires, would you ignore that part of him because his innermost desire is to be a Stu? There's more to than just desire, self-restraint is also an important part of a person's character.

And as I said, I am seeing Godou from meta POV, that means his characterization as fiction character. Not looking at what the author and narrsion said, but look at what he has *actually* done and chose in the story.

Yes, he did those thing in V14 and V15, but remember the circumstances. He is in the past, and not in public. Put him back on those situations back in the previous volumes and he'd probably back to his usual self again. I doubt he would accept being kissed like that in public. By the way, their relationship is surprisingly physical and for some reason there's not much emotional lows, getting to know history, and fights involved. Another peeve of mine towards Campione!'s how relationship works.

As for Artio+Doni nickname, following Japanese convention nicknaming it would be either Aldo/Arudo or Arudoni. Now it sounds like a pairing nickname...
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Old 2013-11-27, 21:35   Link #8917
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*snip*

Forget everything I just said, I just realized I was making a psychological assessment of a fictional character.
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Old 2013-11-27, 21:36   Link #8918
bakapervert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edrey View Post
if i will be able to kill a campione i will murder aisha, she is to much terrifying with her authorities then maybe voban and his cage of dead servants( for the peace of the world of course, as reader, i don't care)
No wonder Yinghua is more terrified to Aisha rather than Luo Hao. That charisma authority is truly scary. Just imagining what will happen to Erica and Ena if they don't come back to their sense make me shiver.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Feng Lengshun View Post
As for Artio+Doni nickname, following Japanese convention nicknaming it would be either Aldo/Arudo or Arudoni. Now it sounds like a pairing nickname...
Actually I'm more curious why the bear called him Artos when it is Artio that possess Doni. And from what I read, it looks like that Doni is also making an expression fitting for KotE, shouldn't he act feminine because he is possessed by a goddess?
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Old 2013-11-27, 22:50   Link #8919
kazzuya13
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By the way does Artio also able to wield Doni's authority?
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Old 2013-11-27, 23:01   Link #8920
Kioras
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Madam Aisha, she mind rapes you with a smile.

She is such an airhead that she doesn't understand that she is destroying your freewill, and thus sees nothing wrong with it.

I for whatever reason see that worse then the physical destruction that Godou produces, and almost on par with those cursed to serve Voban in death.
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