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Old 2012-03-22, 21:38   Link #20401
synaesthetic
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The violence didn't seem to be there as much because the communications tools available at the time were much worse than what we have today.

Today, in a nation where three out of five people own a smartphone, most of those having constant internet connections and cameras capable of recording video... not to mention the other segments of the population with ordinary mobile phones. We have blogs, e-mail, SMS, Twitter, social media...

The moral of the story is when something happens, everybody knows about it almost immediately and it's very hard to truly destroy information in this world of insane data redundancy.
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Old 2012-03-22, 21:45   Link #20402
Ithekro
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It is however difficult to thread out the real information from the fake information as there are thousands of versions of everything...both real and fake, put out every minute on the Internet.

Information is not destroyed....but finding it can be a problem when it is hidden in three millions pron site hits verse one real piece of data.
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Old 2012-03-22, 21:52   Link #20403
Ledgem
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Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Though it does show the point I made some time ago about why I think the military will defend us if our government goes bad...they do remember that their oath is to the Constitution first, and will question illegal orders. because "i was only following orders" is not a defense that holds in court.
I wish I shared your optimism. In the case of this marine, I think he would defend members of the Tea Party and those who share their beliefs. Those of us who think the Tea Party members are crazy would probably be outright attacked simply for our views. It's like the Civil War all over again.
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Old 2012-03-22, 21:54   Link #20404
Urzu 7
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@Ithekro: That is definitely a problem. Who to trust for information? With just news alone, it is hard sometimes to get the best story, or something unbiased. At least many people know to discount Fox News. I'm not saying CNN and others aren't perfect, they sure aren't, but we here know Fox News likes to purposely report things in a biased manner, probably worse than any major liberal news outlet.

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Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
I wish I shared your optimism. In the case of this marine, I think he would defend members of the Tea Party and those who share their beliefs. Those of us who think the Tea Party members are crazy would probably be outright attacked simply for our views. It's like the Civil War all over again.
I definitely get the feeling that some extreme GOP'ers (which is a lot of GOP'ers these days) would love to "take the country by force from the liberals". United we stand. Unless you are a liberal, or a moderate, or non-Christian, or gay, or pro-choice (I could add more), then you aren't really an American.
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Last edited by Urzu 7; 2012-03-22 at 22:05.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:11   Link #20405
synaesthetic
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Every year I ask Santa if I can have an alien invasion for Christmas.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:13   Link #20406
Urzu 7
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Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
Every year I ask Santa if I can have an alien invasion for Christmas.
At least it'd unite humanity.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:18   Link #20407
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At least it'd unite humanity.
Not if they took the form of humans, infiltrated the political system, and began to spout polarizing hatred that demonized anyone who held different values.

Hmm...
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:33   Link #20408
Urzu 7
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Not if they took the form of humans, infiltrated the political system, and began to spout polarizing hatred that demonized anyone who held different values.

Hmm...
So Rick Santorum is Xenu? Maybe 'Rick' can conquer the liberals and democrats with his mighty cosmic sword (that isn't what you think it is, it is an actual sword, I swear!).
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:35   Link #20409
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Originally Posted by Urzu 7 View Post
@Ithekro: That is definitely a problem. Who to trust for information? With just news alone, it is hard sometimes to get the best story, or something unbiased. At least many people know to discount Fox News. I'm not saying CNN and others aren't perfect, they sure aren't, but we here know Fox News likes to purposely report things in a biased manner, probably worse than any major liberal news outlet.



I definitely get the feeling that some extreme GOP'ers (which is a lot of GOP'ers these days) would love to "take the country by force from the liberals". United we stand. Unless you are a liberal, or a moderate, or non-Christian, or gay, or pro-choice (I could add more), then you aren't really an American.
the 5th Crusade

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At least it'd unite humanity.
don't bet on it.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:40   Link #20410
Ithekro
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11th Crusade...technically.

I figured the 5th Crusade would have started in 2001.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:47   Link #20411
Urzu 7
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don't bet on it.
I don't know, part of the problem with the world is that so many have a real heavy "Us vs. Them" mentality, and so many forget we are all human beings. Put all human beings up against aliens from other star systems, and those people would realize it is then humanity vs. aliens, and that might really put things into perspective for them. Everybody would have a common enemy. People won't really care about different cultures and ethnic groups when we are all fending off some hostile aliens.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:56   Link #20412
aohige
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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Even worse... the self-appointed watchman (not voted on by the neighborhood) stalked him, disregarded police orders to stay in his car, approached the young man, quite likely scared him enough he made some move that the twit (who had prior record of violent behavior) then shot him.

And nope, the boy had broken no law, was on public ground, not near the guy's house, you name it, the checklist item was unchecked.

I'm all for self-defense and gun ownership - but this is the kind of jackass that makes it hard not to want a sanity check on basic requirements for gun ownership and self-defense laws not written by dumbasses.

(For a facepalm, google the legislator's "we didn't intend for it to be used like this" foot in mouth... another jackass but one who fails at legal language.)

(also, the police basically failed in multiple ways as well...) which is why the DoJ is now investigating.
What's even more disturbing is, the whole "self defence" BS the killer claimed and police bought, made no sense.
One, when the scuffle happened, screams of the CHILD was heard by nearby neighbhors. When they told that to the police, the police told them no, that must have been Zimmerman screaming.
WHAT THE HELL? Who are you, officer, to be correcting a witness?

Second, if a scary big white guy stalked me as a teenage boy going home, in his car, then approached me apprehensively, you bet your money I'm gonna be terrified and on defensive side. Not to mention he was armed, and was clearly "going after those people" as he said on the call.

The Sanford Police Dept has skeletons in their closet. Perhaps more than one.

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Means they might have to let him go by that law, and then repeal that law as they would have found a flaw in it. They can't try the man again for the same crime...unless they can make a different charge (Civil court or something...remember O.J. Simpson getting two long ass trails...one for murder and one for something else. He got off for murder, but was guilty of something else that stripped him of pretty much everything he ever owned or will own).
The huge difference between OJ and this is, OJ was arrested, and tried in court.
This killer, who shot an innocent person and took INITIATIVE to approach the conflict, is neither detained or arrested with any kind of charges.
That's a massive difference.
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Old 2012-03-22, 23:59   Link #20413
Urzu 7
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What's even more disturbing is, the whole "self defence" BS the killer claimed and police bought, made no sense.
One, when the scuffle happened, screams of the CHILD was heard by nearby neighbhors. When they told that to the police, the police told them no, that must have been Zimmerman screaming.
WHAT THE HELL? Who are you, officer, to be correcting a witness?
Oh man, I forgot about a detail I read. Zimmerman said to the police that the one screaming for help was him, not Trayvon, which is bullshit.
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:29   Link #20414
Vexx
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Unless he screams like a young boy (people who heard the screams) and has instantly completely shifted personalities from the voice talking to the dispatcher ... okay, every thinking person's BS meter should be pegged. Any *useful* police officer would have his eyebrows cocked and start following up.
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:33   Link #20415
Ledgem
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Originally Posted by Urzu 7 View Post
I don't know, part of the problem with the world is that so many have a real heavy "Us vs. Them" mentality, and so many forget we are all human beings. Put all human beings up against aliens from other star systems, and those people would realize it is then humanity vs. aliens, and that might really put things into perspective for them. Everybody would have a common enemy. People won't really care about different cultures and ethnic groups when we are all fending off some hostile aliens.
I used to think that the appearance of an alien race - especially a hostile one - would unite all of humanity. Thinking about it now, I doubt it. You would probably have people demanding military action, people demanding some form of peaceful action, and people wanting to worship the aliens even if it meant turning against humanity. I don't even know if such an event would pull people outside of the shell of their lives, or if it would make them feel closer to other humans.

Actually, don't we already have a historical example of how this would play out? Consider how indigenous populations reacted to the various colonists and merchants a few hundred years ago. Even though their appearance, language, customs, technology, and even skin color was alien to those populations, they didn't cease fighting each other and unite, even when the colonists/merchants were outwardly hostile. You could make the argument that for all their differences they were still recognizably human, or that news traveled a lot slower in those days... but I'd imagine that the reaction then would be fairly similar to how humanity would react today.


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Originally Posted by aohige View Post
Second, if a scary big white guy stalked me as a teenage boy going home, in his car, then approached me apprehensively, you bet your money I'm gonna be terrified and on defensive side. Not to mention he was armed, and was clearly "going after those people" as he said on the call.
It doesn't really change the case, but just as a correction, Zimmerman is hispanic, not caucasian.
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:38   Link #20416
Vexx
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Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post


It doesn't really change the case, but just as a correction, Zimmerman is hispanic, not caucasian.
Aye, the assumption most people are making that he's caucasian is probably because of his name (or they just assumed it was a white guy in some sort of ironic feedback loop of stereotyping). But hey, prejudiced thinking comes in all packages
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:39   Link #20417
Sumeragi
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Hmmm.... Just figured I should mention something about simplification of East Asian characters: I'm against it.
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:41   Link #20418
aohige
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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Aye, the assumption most people are making that he's caucasian is probably because of his name (or they just assumed it was a white guy in some sort of ironic feedback loop of stereotyping). But hey, prejudiced thinking comes in all packages
No, it's because the police reported him to be a white man.
His familiy later corrected it.
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Old 2012-03-23, 00:59   Link #20419
Vexx
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No, it's because the police reported him to be a white man.
His familiy later corrected it.
There's something sadly funny there.... the police don't do due diligence ?because the dead one is black? and they don't get the perp's ethnic right because they didn't ask.

Last edited by Vexx; 2012-03-23 at 00:59. Reason: can't write, time for sleep
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Old 2012-03-23, 01:02   Link #20420
Urzu 7
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There's something sadly funny there.... the police don't do due diligence ?because the dead one is black? and they don't get the perp's ethnic right because they didn't ask.
Maybe they just wanted to go with the assumption he is white because a black teen who was said to be suspicious is dead, and they don't mind giving slack to a white man.
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