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Old 2013-01-16, 17:41   Link #25781
Zakoo
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Though blaming everything would be the right solution, it's impossible to find one causis for the gun culture developped. Video game may be one factor, but I doubt it's the only one. Maybe it's because I'm an european, when I talk about firearms with an american I feel like talking with a moudjahidin sometime. It's as if the guns where a part of their body, maybe their child, the blood of their blood, the flesh of their flesh. When I see people being happy receiving a weapon for chrisman of birthday, as if they achieved a goal in their life, as if you can't be an american citizen without possessing a weapon, I find it quite ... pelicular.

I'm like "yeah ... I only know the AK 47 why you try to give me a whole lesson?"
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Old 2013-01-16, 19:24   Link #25782
Lost Cause
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zakoo View Post
Though blaming everything would be the right solution, it's impossible to find one causis for the gun culture developped. Video game may be one factor, but I doubt it's the only one. Maybe it's because I'm an european, when I talk about firearms with an american I feel like talking with a moudjahidin sometime. It's as if the guns where a part of their body, maybe their child, the blood of their blood, the flesh of their flesh. When I see people being happy receiving a weapon for chrisman of birthday, as if they achieved a goal in their life, as if you can't be an american citizen without possessing a weapon, I find it quite ... pelicular.

I'm like "yeah ... I only know the AK 47 why you try to give me a whole lesson?"
There are plenty of American families who don't worship guns, or own them. For some receiving a BB gun or their first .22 at Christmas is like a passage to adult hood, and the mark of being responsible with said weapon.
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Old 2013-01-17, 00:40   Link #25783
Yahiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Cause View Post
There are plenty of American families who don't worship guns, or own them. For some receiving a BB gun or their first .22 at Christmas is like a passage to adult hood, and the mark of being responsible with said weapon.
Agreed, it is like a right to passage. Even though I am not American my brother was given a BB gun when he was of a decent age. My family saw it as him becoming more of an adult. Here we have a lot of wild animals and things (and many werewolf stories too) so him having a gun made him feel like he was now able to take care of the family. It's all about the mind set really. My brother used it for a few months and hasn't touched it since.
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Old 2013-01-17, 01:49   Link #25784
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zakoo View Post
Though blaming everything would be the right solution, it's impossible to find one causis for the gun culture developped. Video game may be one factor, but I doubt it's the only one. Maybe it's because I'm an european, when I talk about firearms with an american I feel like talking with a moudjahidin sometime.
I'm not sure how those guys would talk about their weapons. Probably in a more workmanlike manner?

Quote:
It's as if the guns where a part of their body, maybe their child, the blood of their blood, the flesh of their flesh. When I see people being happy receiving a weapon for chrisman of birthday, as if they achieved a goal in their life, as if you can't be an american citizen without possessing a weapon, I find it quite ... pelicular.

I'm like "yeah ... I only know the AK 47 why you try to give me a whole lesson?"
You've just described every serious (or semi-serious) hobbyist.

Though I suppose that leaves the question of why guns are so popular a hobby compared to, say, knitting.
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Old 2013-01-17, 01:54   Link #25785
Ithekro
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Knitting might be a popular hobby as well, but it doesn't generate news worthy stories very often (rather few needle massacres or yarn killing sprees.)
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Old 2013-01-17, 09:36   Link #25786
ganbaru
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Floods paralyze Indonesian capital, heavy rains continue
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...90G05Q20130117
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Old 2013-01-17, 10:11   Link #25787
konart
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35 hostages, 15 kidnappers killed by Algerian airstrike
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...isis-live.html

Algeria hostage siege
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-21063558
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Old 2013-01-17, 11:21   Link #25788
SeijiSensei
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Originally Posted by konart View Post
35 hostages, 15 kidnappers killed by Algerian airstrike
The situation seems a bit more muddled than that headline suggests:

Quote:
The [Algerian military] official said reports that Algerian army helicopters had strafed the gas field and had killed 35 hostages and 15 kidnappers were “exaggerated.” He said that some kidnappers had been killed but he would not say whether any hostages had been killed.

“We are waiting for official confirmation,” he said.
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Old 2013-01-17, 15:09   Link #25789
ganbaru
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Anderson Cooper Rips James Tracy For Newtown Conspiracy Theories
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0....html?ir=Media
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Anderson Cooper responded to claims made by a Florida professor who said the devastating shooting in Newtown, Conn., was part of a government and media conspiracy related to gun control
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Old 2013-01-17, 15:56   Link #25790
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Barack Obama 'says Benjamin Netanyahu doesn't know what is good for Israel'

Quote:
The damning assessment of the Israeli prime minister, relayed by senior White House officials to an American journalist, Jeffrey Goldberg, is the most graphic sign yet of the toxic relationship between the two men, who have clashed continually over the stalled Middle East peace process.
Writing on the Bloomberg website, Goldberg quoted Mr Obama as repeatedly saying, "Israel doesn't know what its own best interests are" in response to a spate of recent announcements for thousands of new Jewish settler homes in east Jerusalem and the West Bank on land the Palestinians want for a future state.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/9803...or-Israel.html
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Old 2013-01-17, 17:01   Link #25791
Vexx
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Actually, I think a sizable number of Israelis have the same opinion.
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Old 2013-01-17, 17:27   Link #25792
Roger Rambo
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I really don't see how anybody can argue against that. Those settlements really do nothing to further Israels national aims. They're solely pursued because of the ultra orthodox radicals in Israel. What's even more disgusting is that as the primary settlers, they're the group within the Israeli population that requires the most protection from the Israeli army, while also being the group most adamant against being required to contribute manpower to national defense through conscription.


Realpolitik should tell Israel that pandering to the settlers is detrimental to Israel. At most, Israeli politicians seem to think that the settlement issue can be used as a club to bludgeon the Palestinians with when they do something they don't like. But that's been the Israeli response to everything the Palestinians do, and it's clearly not working. the only way force can settle this matter now would be if the Israeli's opted for outright extermination or conquest...something that has about no chance of being a politically viable option. Not for a state that gained international legitimacy as being a bastion to victims of genocide, not in today's world. Now they could try outright conquest...but that'd lead the problem of how you'd integrate hostile Palestinians into Israel. Make them second class citizens and Israel abandons ALL pretext (as minimal as that might be in the minds of some people) of not being another South Africa. And if all the Palestinians were integrated, the basis of Israel as a majority Jewish democracy goes right out the window.


The Two state solution is really the only viable long term plan. There needs to be a viable Palestinian state that Israel can make peace with, maintain order and prevent further attacks, as well as helping to improve living and social conditions enough so that the inclination to wage war against Israel subsides. But this is inherently impossible when Palestine cannot get recognition as a state, or ensure that radicals in Israel won't slice off more and more of its territory.



Obama has every right to think the Israeli's have no idea what's in their best interest.
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Old 2013-01-17, 17:49   Link #25793
Ithekro
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There was an arguement that there are no new settlements, just natural expansion of teh existing ones. The problem with this is that if you are negotiating for borders and such, you don't go and keep pushing your marker farther into the other guy's territory and not expect there to be a fight about it.

If you are going to claim all the lands, so it, don't try to take it meter by meter via construction projects. (I still consider that Israel should have just taken it all reguardless of what the UN said in 1967, as that was the traditional way of things/ Spoils go to the victor.). Because the world won't allow the "defender" to claim territories it won in a war, the Palestinian are kind of noplace and Israel has settlements in mind. Meaning that the only solution left if a two state solution, or another war where Israel takes the lands and keeps them (the UN still won't allow it).

The worse response from Israel on the settlements though would be "we need breathing room".
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Old 2013-01-17, 18:16   Link #25794
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
There was an arguement that there are no new settlements, just natural expansion of teh existing ones. The problem with this is that if you are negotiating for borders and such, you don't go and keep pushing your marker farther into the other guy's territory and not expect there to be a fight about it.

If you are going to claim all the lands, so it, don't try to take it meter by meter via construction projects. (I still consider that Israel should have just taken it all reguardless of what the UN said in 1967, as that was the traditional way of things/ Spoils go to the victor.). Because the world won't allow the "defender" to claim territories it won in a war, the Palestinian are kind of noplace and Israel has settlements in mind. Meaning that the only solution left if a two state solution, or another war where Israel takes the lands and keeps them (the UN still won't allow it).

The worse response from Israel on the settlements though would be "we need breathing room".
The thing is Ithekro, that's EXACTLY why Israel didn't just claim everything as part of the spoils of war. Possession is four fifths of the law afterall....the problem though, is that if Israel HAD just flat out conquered all of Palestine and claimed it for their own, they'd have to officially outline what the status was of the Palestinians was. This is HIGHLY problematic, cause once incorporate all this new territory in one stroke, you need to recognize all those Palestinian residents you've conquered as being part of your country. The thing is, you need to decide HOW they're part of your country.

Incorporating them as first class citizens is problematic. Both since it threatens the national Jewish character (something of subjective value, but I'm assuming the Israeli's think it's important), and also runs into the problem that a war of conquest where you give the conquered people full say in the government of the conqueror is bound to not end well.

...which leads us from the inconvenient option, to the down right ugly option. Making the Palistinians second class citizens. This is ultimately the real reason why Israel has tried to dominate Palestine without officially incorporating it into Israel. When Palestine is treated as a quasi separate state, Israel cannot be said to *officially* be violating the rights of it's own citizens. But the second they bring in all the Palestinians into their country, but continue treating them as they are currently? There really isn't any argument or pretext against Israel being nothing more than another South Africa.



Israel cannot destroy Palestine, and it cannot consume Palestine into itself. The only logical course of action is to make the Palestinians into as stable and amicable neighbors as possible.
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Old 2013-01-17, 21:36   Link #25795
DonQuigleone
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In fact, the Israeli policy reminds me a lot of the South African "Bantustan" policy, whereby they created "nation states" to contain all the the black citizens. Their aim was to justify the lack of Black rights by claiming they lived in independent nation states, all the while South Africa dominated them economically and politically.

The parallel between Palestine and the Bantustans is a bit uncanny.

Israel is fast running out of friends these days. They've already lost favor in most of Europe (even in Germany!), and the only reason they haven't yet in America is because Americans are poorly informed. But by all appearances, America's political class is already losing patience with Israel.

If Israel continues on it's current course, I think it's fairly doomed.
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Old 2013-01-18, 00:53   Link #25796
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
The worse response from Israel on the settlements though would be "we need breathing room".
The Breathing room argument doesn't even make any sense. This isn't back during the founding of Israel where the frontier Kibbutz represented an actual viable paramilitary defense against enemies. The modern day settlements consist of people who are the least martially inclined group within Israel (the orthodox jews who want to avoid being inducted in the Israeli army). If anything, they represent exposed targets that in the event of an actual war, the military would have to divert resources to evacuating/defending the settlements.

Frankly, to me it seems nonsensical that in the event of a serious open conflict that the settlements will enhance Israel's security.

Last edited by Roger Rambo; 2013-01-18 at 01:05.
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Old 2013-01-18, 09:51   Link #25797
andyjay729
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The grounding of the 787 is probably as big news in Japan as in America, and not just because the problems have surfaced in Japanese airliners. A third of it is made in Japan. It also seems that the batteries that have been especially problematic were made there.

And as you can see, Boeing products dominate their JAL and ANA's fleets.

Whether you think the 787 is just experiencing normal teething problems, or this represents a serious design problem, at least action was taking before a major accident could occur. As an American, I hope things turn out all right for Boeing and this plane, but I respect any decision world aviation authorities make, provided a fair trial occurs.
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Old 2013-01-18, 15:48   Link #25798
Vexx
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Most airplane releases in the last 50 years have had nail-biting issues. Aircraft are so complex now that the fundamental engineering process can't hope to catch all the bugs during the project in time to keep the management and stockholders happy.
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Old 2013-01-18, 15:49   Link #25799
Xellos-_^
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Chris Christie is immensely popular and is a huge favorite for reelection in New Jersey this year, with voters from across the political spectrum giving him the thumbs up.
When it comes to the national conservative base, though, the governor is at risk of earning a different one-finger salute.
Christie is already on probation with some conservatives for his praise of President Obama’s work on Hurricane Sandy in the closing days of the 2012 election — something a few critics have even suggested put the president over the top.
Now the potential 2016 presidential contender has lashed out at the National Rifle Association, calling a new ad from the group “reprehensible” for using Obama’s daughters to make a political point.
“To talk about the president’s children or any public officer’s children who have — not by their own choice, but by requirement — to have protection and to use that somehow to try to make a political point, I think, is reprehensible,” Christie said. He added: “I think it’s awful to bring public figures’ children into the political debate. They don’t deserve to be there. And for any of us who are public figures, you see that ad and you cringe. You cringe because it’s just not appropriate to do that, in my opinion.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...ing-with-fire/

Is Christie running for the Republican or Democrat Presidential Nomination?
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Old 2013-01-18, 15:51   Link #25800
Vexx
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
Is Christie running for the Republican or Democrat Presidential Nomination?
He's made the decision to jettison the "raving lunatic" faction of the GOP. We can only hope that it emboldens the other cowards/politicians of the GOP to do the same so we can return to having two relatively functional political parties. (wishing we had more - not a fan of either presently)
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