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Old 2010-12-12, 19:55   Link #10601
Frenchie
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Not my point. What I deplore is when I see Americans calling someone guilty of a crime before a trial takes place. Part of American justice and its culture was that someone was innocent until proven otherwise.

When people call for assassinating someone, that does not sound like it's contradicting any American values to you?

When two parties use lies and misinformation about their opponents to win elections and US Citizens seemingly do not care? Is that also part of American culture? The cultivation of lies?

And did you know Justinstrife lived in San Diego California? Ain't that a coastal state? Don't be so eager to draw lines in the sand, because what you just said only confirms how conflicted and self-destructive your people are.
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Old 2010-12-12, 20:25   Link #10602
Kamui4356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
Not my point. What I deplore is when I see Americans calling someone guilty of a crime before a trial takes place. Part of American justice and its culture was that someone was innocent until proven otherwise.

When people call for assassinating someone, that does not sound like it's contradicting any American values to you?

When two parties use lies and misinformation about their opponents to win elections and US Citizens seemingly do not care? Is that also part of American culture? The cultivation of lies?

And did you know Justinstrife lived in San Diego California? Ain't that a coastal state? Don't be so eager to draw lines in the sand, because what you just said only confirms how conflicted and self-destructive your people are.
It's not that Americans don't care, it's that they believe the lies their own side is putting out while thinking even the truth from the other side is a lie. Lies have become so common that it's hard for people to tell them from the truth. Not that this is a problem limited to Americans, mind you.
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Old 2010-12-12, 20:27   Link #10603
Frenchie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamui4356 View Post
It's not that Americans don't care, it's that they believe the lies their own side is putting out while thinking even the truth from the other side is a lie. Lies have become so common that it's hard for people to tell them from the truth. Not that this is a problem limited to Americans, mind you.
I haven't seen the problem being as exacerbated in France, England or Australia, though. In England, an election can be rolled back. In France you'd have a revolution on your hands, and in Australia people are a little more complacent, but nothing near as bad as the stream of crapola I'm getting from the US.
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Old 2010-12-12, 20:57   Link #10604
GundamFan0083
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Has anybody else seen these "public service announcements" at Walmart yet?



Suddenly America seems more like a movie then real.
That wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't THIS movie:

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Old 2010-12-12, 21:02   Link #10605
flying ^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamui4356 View Post
It's not that Americans don't care, it's that they believe the lies their own side is putting out while thinking even the truth from the other side is a lie. Lies have become so common that it's hard for people to tell them from the truth. Not that this is a problem limited to Americans, mind you.
also... we sure do know how to play with words and catchy catchphrases that gets attention

example... obama calling republicans "hostage takers"

the "hostage takers" term is just whatever tested best from DNC polling. there are politicians using it right now, and they magically all started using it at about the same time. they invest lots of money in planning precisely which specific words to use.
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Old 2010-12-12, 21:06   Link #10606
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Has anybody else seen these "public service announcements" at Walmart yet?

Isn't this the bitch who thought TSA's violation of the Indian Ambassadors diplomatic immunity completely reasonable?
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Old 2010-12-12, 21:47   Link #10607
GundamFan0083
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I don't know.
I didn't hear about that.
Do tell Roger Rambo, you've got me curious.
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Old 2010-12-12, 22:14   Link #10608
Kamui4356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flying ^ View Post
also... we sure do know how to play with words and catchy catchphrases that gets attention

example... obama calling republicans "hostage takers"

the "hostage takers" term is just whatever tested best from DNC polling. there are politicians using it right now, and they magically all started using it at about the same time. they invest lots of money in planning precisely which specific words to use.
The republicans are masters at political terminology to frame an issue. For example, "cut and run" for withdrawing from Iraq, or more recently "death panels" and "Obamacare" over the healthcare debate. Now for classic ones, the abortion issue, which I am not discussing one way or another, just the terminology used, is the best with "pro-life" and "pro-choice." Neither side wants an "anti" associated with their position.
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Old 2010-12-12, 22:52   Link #10609
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Don't forget "gay agenda" to describe a movement for equality and protection from discrimination.
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Old 2010-12-13, 05:52   Link #10610
ganbaru
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Israel rabbi's edict targets Arabs
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1834933/
Quote:
“Their ultimate goal is a theocratic state,” says Nachman Ben-Yehuda, a Hebrew University sociology professor whose book Theocratic Democracy has just been published. “In the meantime, they want to enforce division between the ultra-Orthodox and everyone else.”
Like they really need this...
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Old 2010-12-13, 05:56   Link #10611
ZephyrLeanne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenchie View Post
I haven't seen the problem being as exacerbated in France, England or Australia, though. In England, an election can be rolled back. In France you'd have a revolution on your hands, and in Australia people are a little more complacent, but nothing near as bad as the stream of crapola I'm getting from the US.
Australia... well, with Tony Abbott, Barn'y Joyce, Julie Bishop and The Australian, what's there to say it won't hit our shores soon?
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Old 2010-12-13, 06:01   Link #10612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Israel rabbi's edict targets Arabs
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1834933/

Like they really need this...
He does have a point because if you look at the majority of arab countries. The level of separation between religion and government there is very low if there's no separation to begin with. Arab countries aren't know for being secular the way western countries are, although the way he's bringing it out may be rather biased and he's trying to put them in a negative light. While arab countries aren't that secular, that's not to say they're all the same in their intent to turn the world muslim. Most of them aren't even after that at all.
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Old 2010-12-13, 06:48   Link #10613
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsuyoshi View Post
He does have a point because if you look at the majority of arab countries. The level of separation between religion and government there is very low if there's no separation to begin with. Arab countries aren't know for being secular the way western countries are, although the way he's bringing it out may be rather biased and he's trying to put them in a negative light. While arab countries aren't that secular, that's not to say they're all the same in their intent to turn the world muslim. Most of them aren't even after that at all.
Here is a solution. Any country which recognises religion should be branded as a terrorist state and nuked from the face of the Earth.

Problem solved.
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Old 2010-12-13, 06:53   Link #10614
ZephyrLeanne
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Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Here is a solution. Any country which recognises religion should be branded as a terrorist state and nuked from the face of the Earth.

Problem solved.
Try telling the UK that. IT HAS NUKES, btw...
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Old 2010-12-13, 06:57   Link #10615
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrLeanne View Post
Try telling the UK that. IT HAS NUKES, btw...
It is predominantly Christian if I am not wrong...otherwise why do they sing "God Save the Queen"?
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2010-12-13, 07:13   Link #10616
bladeofdarkness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Israel rabbi's edict targets Arabs
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1834933/

Like they really need this...
for the record, me and most other Israelis think these people are disgusting bigots.
the fact that they are rabbi's just makes it worse.

but don't confuse a "Rabbi" for "someone who's actually elected and holds real power derived from a popular mandate"
these people represent themselves, and at best, SOME of their own communities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsuyoshi View Post
He does have a point because if you look at the majority of arab countries. The level of separation between religion and government there is very low if there's no separation to begin with. Arab countries aren't know for being secular the way western countries are, although the way he's bringing it out may be rather biased and he's trying to put them in a negative light. While arab countries aren't that secular, that's not to say they're all the same in their intent to turn the world muslim. Most of them aren't even after that at all.
completely wrong.
groups like Islamic jihad, Muslim brotherhood, and other such groups get pounded into the dirt in much of the Arab world, because they represent a threat to the ruling parties.
there is a much greater level of separation between religion and government then you think.

Arab states, all of them, are authoritarian regimes.
the guy in charge doesn't need to answer to their people, and hence, even if the population is religious, the rulers generally aren't ruling according to religious edict.
every Arab state has its own varient of Hamas or the Muslim brotherhood, and they are all suppressed by the rulers, and are usually supported by large parts of the population.
its part of the reason why the Arab world rejects Democracy as much as possible, since the rulers know that if the people had a real chance to decide who gets to lead them, the current rulers would be out and the Islamics would be moving right in.

just last week you had elections in Egypt, and to absolutely nobody's surprise, the Ruling party won 95% of the votes.
the Muslim brotherhood, which was allowed to take part in the LAST elections (stupid G.W Bush politics), won 21% last time (and thats after considerable effort on the ruling parties part to limit their ability) and now they were not allowed to even participate.
why ? : because organizing a political party around a religious platform was suddenly outlawed.

and i don't even want to go into what Syria did to their own "Muslim brotherhood" faction when it dared to raise its ugly head in 1982, other then to say that the death toll in one month is much higher then the death toll of the entire Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

things in the middle east are MUCH more complex then you think.
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Old 2010-12-13, 08:23   Link #10617
Haak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
It is predominantly Christian if I am not wrong...otherwise why do they sing "God Save the Queen"?
Tradition.

I'd say England has mostly an agnostic view on religion, hence Alastair Campbell's "We don't do God" thing. I mean people may say we're Christian, but it's more like "*shrug* My religion? Christian, I guess..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Here is a solution. Any country which recognises religion should be branded as a terrorist state and nuked from the face of the Earth.

Problem solved.
And honestly, you shouldn't joke about that kind of thing. It's poor taste.
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Last edited by Haak; 2010-12-13 at 08:37. Reason: typo
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Old 2010-12-13, 08:28   Link #10618
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrLeanne View Post
Try telling the UK that. IT HAS NUKES, btw...
The US is in the same situation ...
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Old 2010-12-13, 08:35   Link #10619
ZephyrLeanne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
It is predominantly Christian if I am not wrong...otherwise why do they sing "God Save the Queen"?
My point exactly. So, do you REALLY want to declare UK "terrorist" as per your quote:

Quote:
Any country which recognises religion should be branded as a terrorist state and nuked from the face of the Earth.
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Old 2010-12-13, 09:04   Link #10620
Kaze
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The UK sings "God Save the Queen" because it's been written in 1745, when like;
90% of europe was Christianity, fighting Islam and whatnot (Battle of Vienna ring any bells?).

It has nothing to do with being christian or not.

However, I am not agreeing with anybody, and branding countries that recognize religion as terrorists?

Try telling the US that

God Bless America somewhat?



I am an Atheďst, and I strongly advise anybody to watch this, as it adresses 70% of everything "Freedom of Speech" related:

Warning, contains very strong language






Now back on topic, religion is not the topic of debate here
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