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Old 2012-02-10, 11:07   Link #141
Hunter
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The fact that the author is making sure that Naruto has his work cut out for him is pretty damned obvious.
He decides to spare Nagato? Well then the previously crazy baby killer won't leave and return to finish off the survivors a week later, no he will rather resuscitate everybody and conveniently commit suicide doing so.
Konoha is rulled by Danzou who wants Sasuke dead? Well he will be killed quickly and no Konoha ninja will come close to try and suffer for it.
He wants peace? The war will be about all the ninja in the world fighting together (forgetting generations of mutual slaughter after one cheesy speech) against a thousands of clone that nobody will miss.
He wants Sasuke back? The guy will somehow never kill any named good guy and suddenly decide he won't touch anyone before he kills Naruto for no discernible reason.
And the list goes on for every decision Naruto has ever made.

Naruto's choices will always be right and he will never suffers any adverse consequences from his actions. He can have his cake and eat it too, that's the way he rolls.
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Old 2012-02-10, 11:23   Link #142
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After watching episode 248, Naruto should just concentrate on Tobi. His dad made like work of him afterall. He aint so bad!
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Old 2012-02-10, 11:47   Link #143
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Originally Posted by Sharfan View Post
But, the encounter to me didn't seem like Naruto was all ready to let Nagato run away. I mean, Naruto can be dense, but I don't think he's that stupid. To me, it felt like he only said he wouldn't just outright go for the kill because of revenge, but he would still defend his village. Whether or not Nagato died in this altercation would be irrelevant, because Naruto had already proven that he could break the cycle of hatred, which I think he was really just trying to prove to himself. So, after that point, anything that happened to Nagato would be pure self-defense, and I have no doubt that Naruto would try his hardest to just capture him alive. The villagers wouldn't fault Naruto for any of this, even though at least half the village would still be dead.

So, while I get what you're trying to say, it just doesn't feel like that's how it would have gone down to me. But, honestly, it's just conjecture by this point, so you can say just about anything would happen and there wouldn't be any real evidence to disprove it.
yes, I have to agree here. there's no way naruto would have let nagato escape if there was any chance he could come back and hurt the village. naruto understands his dream to be hokage well. he's not just spouting nonsense about some childish fantasy. protecting konoha comes first and he made the choice that ending the cycle of hatred with nagato would ultimately protect konoha the best in the future. he chose to understand his enemy as opposed to giving in to what nagato originally wanted and perpetuating the hatred between ninja.

and he did all this despite nagato killing his precious master. it's not something to cast aside like people are trying to say. and the village definitely mourns jiraiya. we don't need to have a funeral scene and people crying in the manga to know this. he was a beloved character, especially to the current hokage, elders, naruto, kakashi and gai. the younger generations didn't know him very well, but the older ones sure did.

all this hypothetical storyline talk is pointless. the fact is that naruto and the village did have a reason to hate nagato despite him resurrecting the people he recently killed. let's not forget that he was also the supposed head of akatsuki at that time as well.

so here's a hypothetical of my own. lets say orochimaru was still alive and killed half the village. then naruto talked to him, orochimaru was changed and resurrected the people he just killed before he died. are you guys saying that naruto and the village would have absolutely no problem forgetting that orochimaru killed the 3rd hokage? that it would be easy to forgive him since it happened a while ago? that just doesn't make sense... nagato killed jiraiya fairly recently in the story compared to his attack on konoha too. it's not like it was so long ago that people have forgot their feelings for him already
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Old 2012-02-10, 12:34   Link #144
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Originally Posted by HayashiTakara View Post
He's headed the opposite direction, unless Kishi screwed up somehow. The direction everyone is headed has no tree line, Sasuke's direction is towards the woods.
Sasuke was walking out of the woods. He is heading to the battlefield. At this point the only place he could cause carnage is against all the divisions moving toward Naruto. Everything else is wrapped up in the war outside of the Kage-Madara fight, which only has a handful of characters present.
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Old 2012-02-10, 13:32   Link #145
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Yeah, there really wouldn't be any point for Kishi to have Sasuke go to Konoha because there aren't any developements occurring there anyway for him to get involved.
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Old 2012-02-10, 14:03   Link #146
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Originally Posted by Ulquiorra View Post
All of them get it. Not just Naruto. Gaara and Shikamaru already talked about the cycle of hate. Knowing the system is broken doesn't mean you look the other way either. Nagato and Sasuke were products of the system. But they also had free will and are responsible for their actions. Sasuke had options, but chose the dark path.

The MAIN problem is that Kishi avoids the difficult choices. He brought back everyone in Konoha that Nagato killed. So of course it was easy for Naruto to be the hero and redeem Nagato. But imagine if Naruto forgave Nagato with half of Konoha still dead? I am sure he wouldn't be a hero to many families. And Sasuke has still yet to cross that line. He still hasn't killed anyone. Would things be different if Kirabi were dead through Sasuke's actions? Kishi still has a chance to make Sasuke that character. He keeps teasing he will bring carnage and be the monster the ninja system created. Well do it!

Let's see Sasuke injure and kill half of the Konoha 12. Including Sakura. Then would you say that Naruto should still try to redeem Sasuke? Now that would be a nice little bit of pathos and end the world bending to Naruto.


We already sort of have an inter-village couple like that in the manga. And Karui is too irrelvent a character. Something we use to say about Hinata.

Karui does need to join the Church as a non-believer, but now it looks like this will be done in one panel near the end of war where she praises Naruto like every other living being.
to your point about shika, its not about looking past sasuke actions, but as nagato said its about understanding anothers pain. naruto is now ready to face sasuke because he now really understands not only sasuke pain but the power it now gives him. if shika would put half his super intellgence into the real situation here, the broken ninja world instead of one i repeat one single ninja. maybe the problem would be solved. my point is the ninja world atitude of just kill them doesnt work. the concept of business as usual isnt going to cut it. its like cutting off a limb but the person still has cancer, you have to deal with the real problem. all the ninja world has done is deal with the effects.
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Old 2012-02-10, 14:53   Link #147
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Originally Posted by Hunter View Post
The fact that the author is making sure that Naruto has his work cut out for him is pretty damned obvious.
He decides to spare Nagato? Well then the previously crazy baby killer won't leave and return to finish off the survivors a week later, no he will rather resuscitate everybody and conveniently commit suicide doing so.
Konoha is rulled by Danzou who wants Sasuke dead? Well he will be killed quickly and no Konoha ninja will come close to try and suffer for it.
He wants peace? The war will be about all the ninja in the world fighting together (forgetting generations of mutual slaughter after one cheesy speech) against a thousands of clone that nobody will miss.
He wants Sasuke back? The guy will somehow never kill any named good guy and suddenly decide he won't touch anyone before he kills Naruto for no discernible reason.
And the list goes on for every decision Naruto has ever made.

Naruto's choices will always be right and he will never suffers any adverse consequences from his actions. He can have his cake and eat it too, that's the way he rolls.
Also Onoki said he wanted to join the ninja villagers together for peace which is something Naruto has never mentioned even though it would be good for peace.

Its possible Sasuke will kill someone before he fights Naruto since he may be heading in a different direction to Naruto.
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Old 2012-02-10, 15:26   Link #148
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Its possible Sasuke will kill someone before he fights Naruto since he may be heading in a different direction to Naruto.
obviously I could be wrong, but I still think he's going after the elders. this is the perfect time. they seem to be alone or at least unprotected by konoha's finest. sasuke was completely bloodthirsty to kill danzou (and the other 2 responsible for the massacre/itachi decision) so why would he all of a sudden have a more valuable target? especially when he has the highest chance of fighting them without interference
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Old 2012-02-10, 15:34   Link #149
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obviously I could be wrong, but I still think he's going after the elders. this is the perfect time. they seem to be alone or at least unprotected by konoha's finest. sasuke was completely bloodthirsty to kill danzou (and the other 2 responsible for the massacre/itachi decision) so why would he all of a sudden have a more valuable target? especially when he has the highest chance of fighting them without interference
I would also prefer Sasuke to fight the elders before Naruto since he may never get a chance to fight them if he fights Naruto 1st.

However Sasuke appears to be in a very similar looking place to were Naruto is which suggests he may be close to Naruto, maybe he could fight Hinata's group 1st? they all wanted to fight Sasuke so it would be interesting to see their reaction to meeting him.
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Old 2012-02-10, 19:42   Link #150
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Sasuke isn't heading to Konoha to kill the elders. "Carnage comes to the battlefield" certainly doesn't fit with Sasuke then.

Sasuke did say he would kill Naruto first before dealing with Konoha. So heading toward him fits in with the story. Running into Naruto's backup also seems likely since it delays any Sasuke and Naruto confrontation till after the war.

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Originally Posted by 23 gundam fan View Post
to your point about shika, its not about looking past sasuke actions, but as nagato said its about understanding anothers pain. naruto is now ready to face sasuke because he now really understands not only sasuke pain but the power it now gives him. if shika would put half his super intellgence into the real situation here, the broken ninja world instead of one i repeat one single ninja. maybe the problem would be solved. my point is the ninja world atitude of just kill them doesnt work. the concept of business as usual isnt going to cut it. its like cutting off a limb but the person still has cancer, you have to deal with the real problem. all the ninja world has done is deal with the effects.
You can chew bubblegum and walk at the same time. You can begin to change the ninja world AND deal with Sasuke.

If Sasuke finally acts on his threats, wipes out thousands of Alliance ninja, kills the K12, and destroys Konoha, then Naruto simply cannot forgive him and walk away. It is one thing to understand one's pain. To understand why they have fallen. That doesn't mean you can justify their actions because of their pain. You cannot allow them to take out their pain on someone else. Kishi clearly has shown that Sasuke and Nagato are and were in the wrong. But he wiped away Nagato's sins against Konoha so Naruto wouldn't have to deal with his decision. And likely never have Sasuke do anything where he cannot be redeemed by Naruto. It would make Naruto a much more compelling and mature character if he were forced to deal with those difficult decisions. But as Hunter said, he will never suffer any adverse consequences from his actions. It is easy to play Jesus when everything falls in place around you.
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Old 2012-02-10, 20:32   Link #151
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Originally Posted by HayashiTakara View Post
Karui is just a minor side character who might as well be nameless.
-What are you talking about man? Karui is totally relevant. She gave Naruto the beating of his life. But not just ANY beating. This was a beating he received because Sasuke was involved. Therefore, by virtue of that connection, Karui is a relevant enough character for a love interest.

-Matter of fact, so is Karin, for basically the same reason. Though I hold her in higher regard than say Sakura because it only took Karin 1 attempt on her life by Sasuke to make her to make her open her eyes.

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If a diplomatic marriage was to be made to make a difference it'd have to be with the sexy Mizukage, it's obvious she wants a man
-...Or that. Sure I could see that too .

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Sasuke did kill some of the Samurai, Waterboy even made mention of it. He also killed the cloud nin Jay (chapter 417-418) tracking him after Killer-Bee's supposed capture.
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Old 2012-02-11, 12:12   Link #152
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Originally Posted by Ulquiorra View Post
Sasuke isn't heading to Konoha to kill the elders. "Carnage comes to the battlefield" certainly doesn't fit with Sasuke then.

Sasuke did say he would kill Naruto first before dealing with Konoha. So heading toward him fits in with the story. Running into Naruto's backup also seems likely since it delays any Sasuke and Naruto confrontation till after the war.


You can chew bubblegum and walk at the same time. You can begin to change the ninja world AND deal with Sasuke.

If Sasuke finally acts on his threats, wipes out thousands of Alliance ninja, kills the K12, and destroys Konoha, then Naruto simply cannot forgive him and walk away. It is one thing to understand one's pain. To understand why they have fallen. That doesn't mean you can justify their actions because of their pain. You cannot allow them to take out their pain on someone else. Kishi clearly has shown that Sasuke and Nagato are and were in the wrong. But he wiped away Nagato's sins against Konoha so Naruto wouldn't have to deal with his decision. And likely never have Sasuke do anything where he cannot be redeemed by Naruto. It would make Naruto a much more compelling and mature character if he were forced to deal with those difficult decisions. But as Hunter said, he will never suffer any adverse consequences from his actions. It is easy to play Jesus when everything falls in place around you.
you are kind of jumping the gun with sasuke. we can not play what if games about his future actions until kish shows us whats in store for sasuke. i get that it would push the story to have sasuke kill and put naruto on the spot as far as what he would do. but it seemed like naruto had decided not to kill nagato before the people of konoha were brought back to life(at least that is the impression i got) so if sasuke does kill a host of people we still dont know how kish will write naruto response to that. we just have to wait and see. and what about konoha actions to be honest much of right and wrong is about p.o.v. if we think sasuke is wrong then so were the elders if we think sasuke should be punish so do the elders, remember an entire clan was wiped out and we know not every single one of the unchiha were involved. even if the elders thought it was for the best. sin is a sin and both sides have there reasons for there actions at the end of the day.
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Old 2012-02-11, 13:11   Link #153
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Originally Posted by bakAnki View Post
First few pages with Tobi in denial was great. The conveying process was also good. But after that it bored me, especially with that splash page and two pages after >.>

Spoiler for Sasuke:
ROFL. As much as I HATE the Sasuke HATE in this thread (not because I like Sasuke but because I find it unreasonable that everybody and their grandma seems to put all the fault of this messy story sucking on him and not the overly confusing plot and nobody seems to take heart to the fact that the rest of the characters aren't very bright in comparison either), this made me chuckle.

I wish the manga focused on Kakashi instead ;_;. Naruto Manga's highpoint was Kakashi Gaiden imo. Thankfully, Naruto himself is rather fun despite being overly cliche. But oh god everybody around him is so bland and boring.

As for the chapter, I felt a part of me die despite being a Hinata fan. I don't want her stupid crush to come true, I want her to truly grow and that means growing out of her stupid childish crush. But yeah what gives, I hate NaruSaku pairing even more so I will settle for this I guess.

Tobi is getting boring... very boring. He used to be fun, man. Both as the wacky new recruit and as the evil, omniscient villain. But now his place in the plot just seems lost. I hope he gets killed off soon because I can't stand this butchering of his character for much longer.

Guy and Kakashi are so much more interesting than Naruto and Sasuke but they are just too far behind now, now that the plot has evolved into nothing but who screams louder shounen shit. I hope we see them do something soon though.

As for Sasuke's return bla bla, I really was hoping he wouldn't be brought in yet because I didn't see a place he'd fit in. He isn't actually allied to Tobi and the Alliance don't really need to fight him either because they are irrelevant to his cause. So bringing him in right now feels just like bringing him there for the sake of bringing him into plot and feels forceful to me. I don't hate Sasuke nearly as much as the vocal haters on this thread and elsewhere but geez, Kishimoto Sensei really should reorient his approach to this character.

I am looking forward to Kabuto vs Itachi though. Itachi is pretty awesome so it might just be fun.

And I am pretty sure next chapter will actually feature Edo Madara vs Kages.
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Old 2012-02-11, 14:02   Link #154
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This what might probably happen to Sasuke:
He will walk out of the forest. He sees a battle and he sees Madara. Then Madara will start talking to SAsuke saying: So you finally reach THAT LEVEL. Speaking in code terms.

Second possibility that Sasuke will fight the Konoha cheer squad!
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Old 2012-02-11, 18:24   Link #155
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The only way carnage could happen, and this is especially true for Sasuke, is if the whole "carnage" happens in an illusion or a true rinnegan user returns them to life shortly after their death. The only way Kishimoto would make Sasuke kill someone like Hinata or Sakura is if they are either resurrected or it turns out to be an illusion. The illusion can happen if Tobi uses the gathered demon chakras to make a smaller amount a 10-tails chakra and uses his infinite tsukiyomi on the battlefield. The resurrection can happen only if either Naruto or Sasuke gain the rinnegan power of resurrecting people. If it turns out to be a Naruto vs Sasuke epic battle where Sasuke gains the rinnegan and Naruto converts him to the good side during the battle, then it can happen that with their combined power (Naruto's special chakra and Sasuke's rinnegan) they make a jutsu which resurrects those killed by Sasuke previously. But right now that epic battle can't happen since Naruto is too exhausted.
Also a Sasuke vs Naruto battle at this stage wouldn't be too interesting, i mean we have seen Tobi and Madara with rinnegans and other crazy stuff, epic battles with all 5 kages involved, even if Sasuke has the EMS he can't really make such a good show that would something more than what we have seen. I mean in shonen manga the next battle is usually even better than the previous ones, when involving the main characters. So in order for their battle to be more epic than a 5 kages vs Madara and Tobi+demons vs Naruto+friends both Naruto and Sasuke need one more powerup, i guess for Naruto it will be combining sage mode and kyuubi mode and for Sasuke the awakening of rinnegan.
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Old 2012-02-12, 00:45   Link #156
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I am surprised they didn't give Sasuke a new outfit.
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Old 2012-02-12, 08:52   Link #157
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ROFL. As much as I HATE the Sasuke HATE in this thread (not because I like Sasuke but because I find it unreasonable that everybody and their grandma seems to put all the fault of this messy story sucking on him and not the overly confusing plot and nobody seems to take heart to the fact that the rest of the characters aren't very bright in comparison either), this made me chuckle.

I wish the manga focused on Kakashi instead ;_;. Naruto Manga's highpoint was Kakashi Gaiden imo. Thankfully, Naruto himself is rather fun despite being overly cliche. But oh god everybody around him is so bland and boring.

As for the chapter, I felt a part of me die despite being a Hinata fan. I don't want her stupid crush to come true, I want her to truly grow and that means growing out of her stupid childish crush. But yeah what gives, I hate NaruSaku pairing even more so I will settle for this I guess.

Tobi is getting boring... very boring. He used to be fun, man. Both as the wacky new recruit and as the evil, omniscient villain. But now his place in the plot just seems lost. I hope he gets killed off soon because I can't stand this butchering of his character for much longer.

Guy and Kakashi are so much more interesting than Naruto and Sasuke but they are just too far behind now, now that the plot has evolved into nothing but who screams louder shounen shit. I hope we see them do something soon though.

As for Sasuke's return bla bla, I really was hoping he wouldn't be brought in yet because I didn't see a place he'd fit in. He isn't actually allied to Tobi and the Alliance don't really need to fight him either because they are irrelevant to his cause. So bringing him in right now feels just like bringing him there for the sake of bringing him into plot and feels forceful to me. I don't hate Sasuke nearly as much as the vocal haters on this thread and elsewhere but geez, Kishimoto Sensei really should reorient his approach to this character.

I am looking forward to Kabuto vs Itachi though. Itachi is pretty awesome so it might just be fun.

And I am pretty sure next chapter will actually feature Edo Madara vs Kages.
Sasuke's alliance is only to himself which makes things more interesting since he could end up fighting Tobi's side or the ninja alliance.

I preferred non rinnegan Tobi since before he was calm, did his plans slowly and he was more careful but now he's in self denial over a few words Naruto said.

Tobi should be the 1 who's using words to effect Naruto like a old school villain would but Naruto is the 1 who's getting under Tobi's skin.
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Old 2012-02-12, 12:37   Link #158
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Konoha 12's thoghts are pathetic, it just show how little kishimoto cares about any character that is not Naruto or Sasuke. What's the point of all these ninja dying? They should just let jesus naruto take care of every single figtht and do what they do best, talk about how wonderful naruto is.
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Old 2012-02-12, 17:36   Link #159
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my question is, and it might have been answered already. Where is sasuke going? is he going to the leaf to destroy it or is he going to the battlefield to face off with naruto?
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Old 2012-02-12, 18:06   Link #160
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my question is, and it might have been answered already. Where is sasuke going? is he going to the leaf to destroy it or is he going to the battlefield to face off with naruto?
To the battlefield where Tobi and Naruto are at, one person said he was going for Konoha but there really is no point since there really isn't any reason for him to.
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