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View Poll Results: Another - Episode 6 Rating
Perfect 10 31 43.06%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 19 26.39%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 13 18.06%
7 out of 10 : Good 8 11.11%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 1.39%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-02-15, 16:34   Link #161
Dextro
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Spoiler for space:

Aside from forgetting the bit where we've been told that the memory-altering effect has a cellphone-like range this is a pretty much spot on list of some important "facts" we know about the event so far.

As for who the Another is I don't have a particular theory so far but I think that the hints towards Sakakibara-kun being it are red herrings meant to distract us from the real clues. For me Mei isn't out of the woodwork yet and the cellphone conversation that put Sakakibara in town 1.5 years before actually drove me to suspect Akazawa Izumi as the another mostly due to the fact that she seems to remember our MC who apparently had his memory altered to forget he was ever in town. My basis for this is simple: what if the fact that these two knew each-other would help in figuring out who the dead person was? Maybe one was close to the other and Sakakibara left town due to Izumi dying. Maybe it wasn't one of them but someone else who they both knew and was responsible for their connection.

I personally think this is a much better train of thought than speculating outside of what we "know" so far and going for theories like claiming Reiko is the Another.

And on the Reiko subject I have a different theory: I think that she was the one who found out how to deal with the another back when she was in class 3-3 and what she had to do resulted in considerable trauma for her. That would also fit in with the comments by her father ("Poor Reiko") and the bird ("Why Rei-chan? Why?") in my humble opinion. I'll go ahead and say it: the way to get rid of the Another was to actually kill him again and Reiko either did it or witnessed it with her own eyes but I'm leaning on the first one.

And before anyone claims that this would set off all kinds of problems with the law remember that when the year ends the another simply vanishes back out of the roster and people's memories so there would have been no actual crime in practice.

Those are my theories so far, can't wait for more episodes to see if I got them right.
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Old 2012-02-15, 16:39   Link #162
warita
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Originally Posted by totoum View Post
While that is an interesting catch,like Skyfall says,if you're going to go with the theory that these are hallucinations.Why would it matter if i's a cellphone or a landline?They could be hallucinations either way.
I agree it is probably a bit of a stretch....

BUT, I dont think it is irrelevant if the dad calls the landline or cellphone exclusively.

If he calls the landline, we can see him interacting with other members of the family, which he hasnt done so far.....

I base my theory mainly on the gut feeling, that Kouichi is the another.... I could be wrong of course.
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Old 2012-02-15, 16:44   Link #163
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Originally Posted by Skyfall View Post
With that in mind, Koichi's father's phone calls actually gain a very specific purpose - he has been in India for a while now (he didn't even know Koichi was hospitalized), and as such is well beyond the phenomenon's range. As such, he is the single person involved in the story whose perspective isn't suspect to manipulation. Most of it might seem like silly chatter, but I think it really is worth to take note of everything we can derive from his conversations - because his position within the show is unique compared to everyone else located in Yomiyama, as the single shred of information we can assume as being true.
This is quite an important observation I think, and one I agree with. I'm trying to restrict my speculation to what I can reasonably assume is true, and towards that end I think the information the show has presented needs to be sorted into three piles - relevant, irrelevant and intentionally misleading. I think Mei and Tatsuji both believed what they told Kouichi in the last two eps, but it almost doesn't matter whether they do or not - what matters is how much of it is true. I think there are elements of both testimonies that are true, but enough falsehood in each that if the entire testimony is taken as read, it would actually lead us further from the truth.

That's why I agree with Skyfall that Yousuke's phone calls are important, and that they're included in the story for the very specific purpose of providing a clue that Kouichi is not the Another, contradicting what I think is a lot of intentionally misleading hinting that he is. As someone outside the range of The Phenomenon, his information needs to be interpreted differently than what Mei, Tatsuji and anyone in Yomiyama says. My take on Tatsuji is that he believes what he tells the children in the library, but he incorrectly assumes that he's "immune" from the distortion because he's not "directly involved" with Class 3. I think his memories and perceptions are being altered more than he thinks, and it's very possible that his actions have a direct bearing on future events, even if he believes otherwise.
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Old 2012-02-15, 17:02   Link #164
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He never said he was immune to the memory altering effects. He just won't die.
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Old 2012-02-15, 17:13   Link #165
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
He never said he was immune to the memory altering effects.
Quite right. If the librarian was immune to the memory altering effects, he could look at class 3 at any time and know who the Another is. It would be the person who wasn't a student the year before but is now. (Hm, that way of describing the situation implicates Kouichi big time, doesn't it? But that wasn't my intent.)
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Old 2012-02-15, 18:07   Link #166
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I see no other explanation for his belief that he can retroactively determine who the Another is than that he thinks he has a sort of immunity. If everyone's memories revert at the same time the class record does, than he should theoretically not remember what the register looked like while The Phenomenon was distorting it, and this be unable to determine who the Another was.

I'm not saying it makes sense... There was a fundamental disconnect in what he was telling Kouchi and Mei - it just doesn't add up.
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Old 2012-02-15, 18:34   Link #167
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For some reason I'm always like "Who's gonna die next?" while watching this show. I thought his dad was going to die over the phone, nope. Thought Reiko was going to die while the bid was making lots of noise, nope. lol
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Old 2012-02-15, 18:49   Link #168
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Originally Posted by warita View Post

I base my theory mainly on the gut feeling, that Kouichi is the another.... I could be wrong of course.
To me its far to obvious considering he's basically the main character. I mean it's possible, yes but I'd be highly disappointed if it turns out to be him.
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Old 2012-02-15, 19:02   Link #169
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Originally Posted by warita View Post
I agree it is probably a bit of a stretch....

BUT, I dont think it is irrelevant if the dad calls the landline or cellphone exclusively.

If he calls the landline, we can see him interacting with other members of the family, which he hasnt done so far.....

I base my theory mainly on the gut feeling, that Kouichi is the another.... I could be wrong of course.
The death of Kouichi's mother could have ruined the relationship within the family, so it could be that his father calls on the cellphone to avoid interactions with the other members of the family.

So basically the memory alteration affects only inconsistencies due to the add-up and those memories who can drive them to a sort of solution. So as stated by Guardian Enzo what we get from each person inside the calamity range are memories without the salient points. A well made mix of red herring truths and false hints.

For Kouichi last visit to the village, it could be for the Reiko's funeral, as well explained by Skyfall (there are really a lot of hints), or even Izumi's funeral, if his brother died two years before, maybe Izumi died too, they knew each other, or so Izumi hinted in the first episode. But for now it has no consistency, I know. But for no reason I tend to give to each character only one role, I mean, so far it seems that Reiko knew/knows how to stop the curse, so the another has to be someone else.


Ah, almost I was forgetting about Kouichi/mei delusion TER-RI-FIC
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Old 2012-02-15, 19:12   Link #170
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Lol wtf was that noise that he made, creeped me out a little since I watched this at like 2am. And what's the point of commiting suicide in class, isn't he supposed to be used to the whole curse thing?


Also, they made it clear that his collapsed lung was hereditary, clearing speculation. But misaki said she nearly died in an operation, I'm really worried and hope it isn't her but her background says otherwise.
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Old 2012-02-15, 20:26   Link #171
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
I see no other explanation for his belief that he can retroactively determine who the Another is than that he thinks he has a sort of immunity. If everyone's memories revert at the same time the class record does, than he should theoretically not remember what the register looked like while The Phenomenon was distorting it, and this be unable to determine who the Another was.

I'm not saying it makes sense... There was a fundamental disconnect in what he was telling Kouchi and Mei - it just doesn't add up.
Unless there is another record that is immune to the Phenomenon. Most likely that was it.

He seems surprised when he hear Kou's mom died there.
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Old 2012-02-16, 00:30   Link #172
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Unless there is another record that is immune to the Phenomenon. Most likely that was it.
Or simply that the survivors don't lose their memories of the Another once the year ends. That is, the students and teachers of Class 3 look around and go, "Whafrag? X just vanished, and the school register doesn't show his/her name any more? Oh, crap!"* It's said that the memories, documents, etc. surrounding the current Another are altered, but even though the documents revert to their "normal" state, that doesn't mean that somebody couldn't just remember who the 30 students in Class 3 were, then read down the list the next year and see which name is missing. Since the Another changes from year to year, the information of who was the dead one the previous year is more of a curiosity rather than significant, except that repeatedly doing this is probably how they figured out that the Another is always someone who had a previous connection to Class 3.

Incidentally, since Reiko isn't a student, I'd think that would rule her out completely as a possible Another.

*I think it's significant, too, that Class 3 is a 3rd-year class, which means that at the end of the year, the class population graduates and leaves the school, and quite possibly the community. In that way, it's not immediately obvious to everyone else at school that there was an "extra" dead person, because they wouldn't be counting noses next year; you could only check it by comparing memories to photos (maybe not even those, if the Another shows up in them), class rosters, and so on.

Lastly, I seem to be in the minority here, but I myself am going out on a limb and saying that I trust that what Mei and the librarian have told Kouichi is the literal truth. Mind you, I'm not saying that they're offering complete explanations--a number of significant facts are, of course, missing (for example, how Reiko's class was able to stop the curse that summer, and any number of significant events), and they themselves say that it's not understood completely. But I'm going to put my faith in the narrative law of conservation of detail: we've been given these clues for a reason, to help shape the investigation/plot of the remaining six episodes. If the information we have is false, then we can't draw conclusions and make analyses from what we see in any kind of framework. And there's plenty of "wiggle room" left over for the writers to offer clues that seemingly mean one thing and lead us off down the garden path*. I'm actually going to be very disappointed if some or all of what we've been told in these past two episodes turns out to be out-and-out false.

*For example, when Heart Attack Guy was about to tell Kouichi the truth in Ep. 5 and dropped dead, this may have been because of the calamity, and it may instead have been a coincidence since he was previously established as having a weak heart. We can't be sure, and the explanation only states that at least one student or family member dies each month when the calamity is active, not what triggers the identity of specific deaths, so "talking about the curse" doesn't establish "immediate death flag for the talker" as a rule.

(Exception: if there are no supernatural forces at work at all, then I'd be fine if the ghost story was false. Though in that case they'd need to work very, very hard to explain some of the events.)
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Old 2012-02-16, 00:40   Link #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
He never said he was immune to the memory altering effects. He just won't die.
You know I just checked that scene after reading what enzo wrote. and he never says he thinks he's forgotten something.

He even said about the Another of 1996

Quote:
As I recall, her name was on the 1996 roster.But it was not on the roster for 1993
He couldn't possibly say that if he thought he wasn't immune to the memory altering affects.

So as LKK said if he recalls a 1993 name showing up on the 1996 roster,why the hell didn't he alert authorities at the time.Did nobody believe him?

If he's done so much research,why wasn't he aware of the death of Kouichi's mom 15 years ago.

On a sidenote,on his 1998 roster every death is noted except Mei's cousin,either Mei hasn't told him or he thinks the curse has nothing to do with it.

edit:

Quote:
Originally Posted by DezoPenguin View Post
but even though the documents revert to their "normal" state, that doesn't mean that somebody couldn't just remember who the 30 students in Class 3 were,
According to the explanation in the episode:

Quote:
In addition,all memories of her as the deceased are lost.All is forgotten
So they've got no memories of the Another once the year is over.
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Old 2012-02-16, 01:23   Link #174
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Originally Posted by totoum View Post

According to the explanation in the episode:

Quote:
In addition,all memories of her as the deceased are lost.All is forgotten
So they've got no memories of the Another once the year is over.
But that's flatly impossible. In that case, no one could ever know the identity of the Another, because they wouldn't recall the Another even being in the class in the first place. So they couldn't even remember things like the class having one too many seats or that a person of that name was ever in the class. (Unless, perhaps, someone left town before the year was up, and could phone back the information since they'd be out of range? Not sure if that would work...)

Parsing the sentence, I think the key words have to be as the deceased. Thus, I don't think the sentence refers to the "after the year is over reverter," but to "what happens during the year" (i.e. that no one could remember Mami Asakura as being a deceased person during the year she was up and walking around as a member of Class 3--even though some of them might have known her originally, attended her funeral, mourned her death, etc.).

Thus the conversation outlines like this:

I. School records
a. During the year, Mami's name vanished from 1993 and appeared in 1996
b. After the year the records reverted to their original state

II. Memories
a. During the year, all memories of Mami being deceased vanished. Everybody forgot her death three years ago.

...it's clumsy, but it's the only way that conversation can make any sense at all, because only someone who remembers that there was a "Mami Asakura" in Class 3 in 1996 could say that there was an Another by that name in that class.

And now for something completely different:

Why, when Izumi is discussing why she thinks Kouichi is not the Another (before he joined the class, after she visited him in the hospital), does she list "He doesn't have siblings" as a reason for him to be a real person?
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Old 2012-02-16, 01:51   Link #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DezoPenguin View Post
But that's flatly impossible.
Congratulations!You've just understood why people have huge problem with this explanation



Quote:
Parsing the sentence, I think the key words have to be as the deceased. Thus, I don't think the sentence refers to the "after the year is over reverter," but to "what happens during the year"
Your explanation is a nice attempt but I don't think it's correct

Here's the full sentence:

Quote:
Then,at the end of the year,when the deceased disappears after graduation,the records revert to their original state,ultimatly revealing the extra student.In addition,all memories of her as the deceased are lost.All is forgotten.
Kouichi even adds

Quote:
The records and memories just go back to normal?
Memories going back to normal would imply that students forget the Another after graduation.

edit:

Reading that again,maybe you're right but that would be some REALLY awkward phrasing.

Maybe haguruma (or anyone fluent in japanese) can help us out and tell us if it's just awkwardness that comes from the translation.
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Old 2012-02-16, 02:40   Link #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DezoPenguin View Post
Why, when Izumi is discussing why she thinks Kouichi is not the Another (before he joined the class, after she visited him in the hospital), does she list "He doesn't have siblings" as a reason for him to be a real person?
Remember that as far as we have been informed that the prefix for being an Another you have to have died in connection to the events of a "year where it happens" and to die in such a year you have to have at least a 2nd grade relationship to somebody associated with class 3-3.
This is apparently what Izumi bases her countermeassures upon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by totoum View Post
Reading that again,maybe you're right but that would be some REALLY awkward phrasing.

Maybe haguruma (or anyone fluent in japanese) can help us out and tell us if it's just awkwardness that comes from the translation.
It's not really awkward phrasing it's more or less that there is a more elaborate background than what we were given in the anime this episode.
I'm kinda reluctant to comment on that during THIS episode because information can still be given at another point and maybe the anime is actually planing to include this at a later point to keep some more suspense going...or maybe it's going to drop it like Kouichi's experience with mobbing. It's not really a spoiler to the core story so I am planning on translating excerpts from the conversation with Chibiki from the novel (which is about 30 pages) and make it accessible as a reference, but I'll only post it here and right now if people want to (and even if anyway it will only be in spoilers).
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Old 2012-02-16, 02:57   Link #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haguruma View Post
Remember that as far as we have been informed that the prefix for being an Another you have to have died in connection to the events of a "year where it happens" and to die in such a year you have to have at least a 2nd grade relationship to somebody associated with class 3-3.
This is apparently what Izumi bases her countermeassures upon.
So basicly Izumi thinks that the Another "candidates" are not limited to students.

I'll add that she checked to see if Kouichi's hand was cold which is interesting because according to Mei and the librarian the Another has a normal living body no different from anyone else.So it seems Izumi has some other info.


Quote:
It's not really awkward phrasing it's more or less that there is a more elaborate background than what we were given in the anime this episode.
Right,so it is normal for the audience to be bewildered at this point.


Quote:
I am planning on translating excerpts from the conversation with Chibiki from the novel (which is about 30 pages) and make it accessible as a reference, but I'll only post it here and right now if people want to (and even if anyway it will only be in spoilers).
Best thing would probably be for you to post it in the novel thread and provide a link here for those that want to look (though I know I wouldn't now personally)
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Old 2012-02-16, 03:33   Link #178
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Uhm, I don't know if you guys consider this a stupid theory, but isn't it possible that Librarian Guy found out about that year's another (and only that year's another) through investigation rather than relying on his memory? Which he knows is easy to alter.
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Old 2012-02-16, 05:41   Link #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Uhm, I don't know if you guys consider this a stupid theory, but isn't it possible that Librarian Guy found out about that year's another (and only that year's another) through investigation rather than relying on his memory? Which he knows is easy to alter.
I can definatly get on board the idea this was the first year he managed to figure out who it was.
What I don't know is how he did it without his memories and no records,maybe he found a loop somewhere,we'll see.
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Old 2012-02-16, 09:04   Link #180
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Originally Posted by haguruma View Post
It's not really a spoiler to the core story so I am planning on translating excerpts from the conversation with Chibiki from the novel (which is about 30 pages) and make it accessible as a reference, but I'll only post it here and right now if people want to (and even if anyway it will only be in spoilers).
As long as it's not a spoiler, I'd love to read it. No matter how many times I listen to Chibiki's explanation in the anime, it just doesn't make sense. One way it could work is if you could retroactively remember everything you forgot if you leave the sphere of the influence of the phenomenon. That would explain how he was able to ascertain that it had a limited range too.
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