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Old 2013-10-19, 01:17   Link #561
0utf0xZer0
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Age: 27
From the demos I looked up it's not clear to me if apps in the virtualized OS can be independently positioned and resized within the host OS, which is what I'd need for my workflow. Some of the VMWare demos did appear to allow this but I'm not sure which versions allow it (ie. paid or free).

Might look into some of this stuff more when my profs aren't utterly swamping me with readings.
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Old 2013-10-19, 09:14   Link #562
SeijiSensei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 0utf0xZer0 View Post
From the demos I looked up it's not clear to me if apps in the virtualized OS can be independently positioned and resized within the host OS, which is what I'd need for my workflow. Some of the VMWare demos did appear to allow this but I'm not sure which versions allow it (ie. paid or free).
Yes, they can, at least using VirtualBox. It just uses the host's window manager to display the applications. I can post a screenshot if you're curious.

I'm not sure VMWare is the best choice for a desktop virtual machine manager. I've worked with clients who use it to deploy servers, but I've not seen it on desktops. VirtualBox seems more oriented toward desktop users. And, of course, VB is entirely free. There is a add-on package that provides some things that cannot be distributed under the General Public License. In particular, because USB is a proprietary technology, the guest OS cannot emulate the host's USB ports without the "Extension Pack."

One day when you're not busy (!), install the Windows version of VB on your desktop, then create a Linux VM and run the two in seamless mode. Naturally your performance will depend in large part on the amount of physical memory available. I have a 8 GB machine and devote at least 2-3 GB for a Windows VM. CPU power seems less critical, as I've run VB on machines like this i5 and an eight-year-old Inspiron with a Pentium dual-core.

If you're strapped for memory, choose a version of Ubuntu like Lubuntu or Xubuntu that have less-demanding desktop environments.
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Old 2013-10-19, 10:59   Link #563
0utf0xZer0
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Ah okay, I looked up 3-4 videos of it and nobody was actually moving or resizing windows, so I was thinking it was probably looked to the VM's fullscreen res.

VMWare Player is free for personal use and that's where ym past experience with using VMs lies. I just haven't updated in a while so I don't know which features the newer versions have and don't have compared to the paid.

I'll look into experimenting with Seamless mode when I get the chance.
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Old 2013-10-19, 21:44   Link #564
TurkeyPotPie
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I continue to have very mixed feelings about Windows 8. Every time I start to like it, some annoyance causes me to want to revert all my systems back to 7. I upgraded 3 of my PCs to 8.1 from 8 recently. I had gotten used to 8 and my PCs with it were running smoothly. The upgrade process was a chore since you have to download the update on each system. So that was around 9-10 GB, when it should have been around 3GB. The upgrade process also took a looong time (the initial install of 8 was very quick from what I remember, this upgrade to 8.1 took several times as long).

Once I got into 8.1, I liked pretty much all the changes and improvements. Windows 8 really was half-baked, with 8.1 MS is getting a lot closer to where they need to be (still not there IMO though). The Metro side is a lot more complete, and the desktop changes mean you can pretty much ignore the modern UI if you want (so glad to be able to turn off hot corners on the desktop!) I never had much of a problem with the Start screen, probably because my SOP on Win 7 was to hit Start and type the name of the program I wanted to run, which works the same on 8.

The big issue I am having with 8.1 right now is driver problems, specifically for Intel graphics. I have a Thinkpad T420 and a Dell Latitude 10 tablet with Intel graphics. The current drivers suck under 8.1. On the tablet the driver tends to lag several seconds on waking from sleep (whereas it used to wake instantly before) and many times it will crash on waking. On both systems, there are graphical problems in some applications, mainly Firefox, where parts of the windows will blank out, go black, or flicker. Quite annoying. I am tempted to just run the Nvidia graphics on the Thinkpad (it has Optimus) all the time, even though it kills the battery. On the tablet I am stuck until Intel or MS gets a decent driver out. I don't understand why Intel's drivers tend to suck ass on Windows; they're actually quite good for Linux.

Edit: I have also had the graphics driver on the tablet crash a few times while watching videos in MPC-HC. Never happened before with 8. On reading the net, seems I'm not the only one having a graphics problem with Clover Trail and 8.1. C'mon Intel, get your act together!
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Old 2013-10-20, 17:53   Link #565
-KarumA-
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkeyPotPie View Post
I continue to have very mixed feelings about Windows 8. Every time I start to like it, some annoyance causes me to want to revert all my systems back to 7. I upgraded 3 of my PCs to 8.1 from 8 recently. I had gotten used to 8 and my PCs with it were running smoothly. The upgrade process was a chore since you have to download the update on each system. So that was around 9-10 GB, when it should have been around 3GB. The upgrade process also took a looong time (the initial install of 8 was very quick from what I remember, this upgrade to 8.1 took several times as long).

Once I got into 8.1, I liked pretty much all the changes and improvements. Windows 8 really was half-baked, with 8.1 MS is getting a lot closer to where they need to be (still not there IMO though). The Metro side is a lot more complete, and the desktop changes mean you can pretty much ignore the modern UI if you want (so glad to be able to turn off hot corners on the desktop!) I never had much of a problem with the Start screen, probably because my SOP on Win 7 was to hit Start and type the name of the program I wanted to run, which works the same on 8.
I updated to 8.1 this weekend as well with my XPS 13 laptop. Thought it would be a walk in the park but was very wrong.

On the XPS machines seemingly the trackpad drivers disappear after the update. Because Start8 had a separate update for Windows 8.1 I purchased it, wasn't much which was good but still that fact that third party software is needed to have your OS running the way you wanted it is just bad IMO.

So after an extra hour twinking it and banning every single bit of the swipes, charms, hot corners and so on I finally have it working.

Metro still is a thorn in my eye. Handy for some perhaps but I use 0 apps, would rather use my browser to check my email since I already use it to go to websites anyway and so on. Many apps are just useless imo as the ones I would use are mostly mobile and guess what I use it on my mobile because that is the purpose of those I use.

8.1 may add the start button but still goes to the pesky Metro system which I find more of a visual distraction than a visual enhancement. Like checking a manual before knowing what menu or tab to pick so you have something open in your desktop mode. It distracts and not handy if you have a mouse.

I can life with it by using Start8. But I would never use it on desktop that does specific things such as video edit, cgi, graphic design because metro itself is such a distraction like doing math and seeing the picture of a giraffe every time you want to put something through. Besides the fact that third party software is needed to not have accidental menu's pop open because you move from left to right or whatever is just reason enough not to use it on a profession machine.

I am unsure whether to be glad with 8 or 8.1 or think it is just too consumer/casual mom/peasant to be taken serious in any way. I would rather have a pro version that gives back the start menu and that is more focused on the desktop mode than trying to be the tablet or phone OS that people already own.
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Old 2013-10-20, 19:51   Link #566
0utf0xZer0
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by -KarumA- View Post
I am unsure whether to be glad with 8 or 8.1 or think it is just too consumer/casual mom/peasant to be taken serious in any way. I would rather have a pro version that gives back the start menu and that is more focused on the desktop mode than trying to be the tablet or phone OS that people already own.
It should have been very easy for Microsoft to allow you to bypass the Start Screen and still be able to use Metro apps.I Take a look at some screenshots of ModernMix (which Stardock markets as a companion to Start8): it allows you to run Metro apps windows on your desktop. But then Metro apps - which, Microsoft would like you to remember, can be purchased in the Windows Store - wouldn't be in your face all the time, which is exactly why is probably why Microsoft didn't do that.

Like I said, most of the idiocy going on with this OS can be traced to trying to goad people into buying apps. Because hey, Apple makes a killing on it. (Somehow they totally ignore that Apple sells DESKTOP apps on the desktop, not mobile ones.)
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Old 2013-10-21, 09:01   Link #567
Vexx
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NEW YORK (AP) - Microsoft has pulled a Windows update from its website after it caused some customers' devices to crash.
The company said it removed the RT 8.1 update from the Windows Store during the weekend.
In place of the update, Microsoft posted an apology for the problem and said it's trying to resolve the situation quickly. The company says it will give updates as soon as possible. It says the problem affected only a limited number of users, some of whom had difficulty downloading the update.
Microsoft says RT 8.1 is an operating system for tablets and light, thin personal computers. It only runs built-in apps or apps downloaded from the Windows Store.
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Old 2013-10-21, 10:02   Link #568
npal
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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
NEW YORK (AP) - Microsoft has pulled a Windows update from its website after it caused some customers' devices to crash.
The company said it removed the RT 8.1 update from the Windows Store during the weekend.
In place of the update, Microsoft posted an apology for the problem and said it's trying to resolve the situation quickly. The company says it will give updates as soon as possible. It says the problem affected only a limited number of users, some of whom had difficulty downloading the update.
Microsoft says RT 8.1 is an operating system for tablets and light, thin personal computers. It only runs built-in apps or apps downloaded from the Windows Store.
Apparently they had trouble testing it in that vast sea of, what, 10 tablets? I means seriously, HOW many different tablets with RT are there? Then again, iPhone 5 was BSODing the other day...
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Old 2013-10-21, 13:09   Link #569
0utf0xZer0
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Looks like people have figured out how to download an 8.1 ISO with a Win8 key, an ISO you can then use to update your machines.
http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/wi...-8-product-key

But so far you can't clean install with a Win8 key - upgrade only. WTH Microsoft.
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Last edited by 0utf0xZer0; 2013-10-21 at 13:22.
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Old 2013-10-21, 14:30   Link #570
blaze0041
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 0utf0xZer0 View Post
Looks like people have figured out how to download an 8.1 ISO with a Win8 key, an ISO you can then use to update your machines.
http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/wi...-8-product-key

But so far you can't clean install with a Win8 key - upgrade only. WTH Microsoft.
So, for some reason, the Recovery partition is now too full to perform a system image backup. I decided to try doing a clean install with the Windows 8.1 ISO (creating it as shown in the method above) to see if it could fix the problem- it didn't (it's still too full, so I'm gonna need to try expanding the Recovery partition somehow), but I managed to get it to install.

Alas, I did get stuck at the product key part, since the 8.1 installer doesn't accept Windows 8 keys. I punched in what was supposedly known as an "install-only" key, then once Win8.1 was back up and running, I changed back to my Windows 8 key in PC settings, which activated fine.
It seems the alternative is to use the Windows Deployment Kit/AIK (I forgot the exact name) to modify the ISO and remove the compulsory product key entry.

Still, it's a rather clumsy way of doing things...
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Old 2013-10-21, 14:58   Link #571
Vexx
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I no longer feel the need to be 'cutting edge' - suspect I'll wait for 8.2 or such. That seemed to be the ticket on nearly every other version of Windows. (avoid the X.1!!! Fly, you fools!)
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Old 2013-10-21, 15:36   Link #572
npal
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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I no longer feel the need to be 'cutting edge' - suspect I'll wait for 8.2 or such. That seemed to be the ticket on nearly every other version of Windows. (avoid the X.1!!! Fly, you fools!)
I've been spoiled enough not to want to return to 7 xP
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Old 2013-10-21, 22:41   Link #573
Vexx
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Originally Posted by npal View Post
I've been spoiled enough not to want to return to 7 xP
My desktop is 7 ... my "field disposable unit" laptop is a win8. After several attempts to "join the cult" I got tired of the notion of an advertising store app UI interfering with work. I made the desktop icon as big as I could and just step directly to that where all the stuff I need to do is.

Seriously, the metro UI is fine for small devices and tablets where the primary use is casual/consumer or even a specially designed warehouse app thing. It is like putting a bag over my head for the stuff I and people I work with do.
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Old 2013-10-22, 00:10   Link #574
SaintessHeart
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
My desktop is 7 ... my "field disposable unit" laptop is a win8. After several attempts to "join the cult" I got tired of the notion of an advertising store app UI interfering with work. I made the desktop icon as big as I could and just step directly to that where all the stuff I need to do is.

Seriously, the metro UI is fine for small devices and tablets where the primary use is casual/consumer or even a specially designed warehouse app thing. It is like putting a bag over my head for the stuff I and people I work with do.
Download StartisGone and ClassicShell. You can still explore Windows 8 that way while feeling the UI of 7.

I run my computers the same way as you do, basically my field unit is for schoolwork and trading. My desktop is for games and experimentation; had a HDD booted solely on Linux.
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Old 2013-10-22, 02:27   Link #575
npal
I desire Tomorrow!
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far from reality as possible
Age: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
My desktop is 7 ... my "field disposable unit" laptop is a win8. After several attempts to "join the cult" I got tired of the notion of an advertising store app UI interfering with work. I made the desktop icon as big as I could and just step directly to that where all the stuff I need to do is.

Seriously, the metro UI is fine for small devices and tablets where the primary use is casual/consumer or even a specially designed warehouse app thing. It is like putting a bag over my head for the stuff I and people I work with do.
What SaintessHeart said, although I don't use these. In 8.1, you can make the desktop tile even bigger, you can configure it to boot to desktop and disable charms and hot corners on the desktop. With a Start button replacement, like free Classic Shell, you hardly ever need to see Metro, lol
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Old 2013-12-22, 13:37   Link #576
RRW
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anybody know how to get japanese character in window 8.1?

this is what i get when i try to download official language pack



:<
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Old 2013-12-22, 13:49   Link #577
npal
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Originally Posted by RRW View Post
anybody know how to get japanese character in window 8.1?

this is what i get when i try to download official language pack



:<
Did you try just adding Japanese through the Add Language option in Languages? A large menu should appear there.
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Old 2013-12-22, 14:01   Link #578
RRW
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Old 2013-12-22, 16:49   Link #579
monster
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Either you are using a specific edition for some emerging market (which seems unlikely as you have US English installed, but I wouldn't know for sure) or there is something wrong with your Windows install.
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Old 2013-12-22, 17:47   Link #580
npal
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Why do you need to install the Japanese display language anyway? I have just the keyboard and the fonts are displaying correctly. Or do you need full Japanese display?
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