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Old 2012-04-02, 09:05   Link #181
Blackbeard D. Kuma
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Originally Posted by Poetic Justice View Post
I really hope Law reveals why he saved Luffy back in the war.
Law: "So we meet again, strawhat Luffy! By the way, the reason why I saved your ass 2 years ago at the war is because you're the main character and the plot demands that you survive."
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Old 2012-04-02, 10:19   Link #182
marvelB
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^Blackbeard D. Kuma's response says it all.



But on a more serious note, I'm actually starting to doubt the theory that Law delivered Luffy's heart to the WG, because if so, then his body would probably be "dead", like Smoker's. I mean, so far we didn't get any indication that the body could function after the heart is stolen, but somehow I doubt that it's a similar case as with Moria's power, where the victims went into a temporary coma after having their shadows stolen. Chances are good that unless it's properly preserved, the body will just plain wither away after losing its heart, just like.... y'know, what would happen to any person who would suffer such a fate in real life.....
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Old 2012-04-02, 10:24   Link #183
golgo13
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Originally Posted by marvelB View Post
^Blackbeard D. Kuma's response says it all.



But on a more serious note, I'm actually starting to doubt the theory that Law delivered Luffy's heart to the WG, because if so, then his body would probably be "dead", like Smoker's. I mean, so far we didn't get any indication that the body could function after the heart is stolen, but somehow I doubt that it's a similar case as with Moria's power, where the victims went into a temporary coma after having their shadows stolen. Chances are good that unless it's properly preserved, the body will just plain wither away after losing its heart, just like.... y'know, what would happen to any person who would suffer such a fate in real life.....
Anything done by Law must dupe chopper as well. As the ships doctor I'm sure he does regular check-ups with the crew, or the like.
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Old 2012-04-02, 10:54   Link #184
paradox13
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I'm actually starting to doubt the theory that Law delivered Luffy's heart to the WG, because if so, then his body would probably be "dead", like Smoker's.
Smoker isn't dead and he isn't in a coma.

You can still move with your limbs all over the place, with your head in one place and your body in another, so why not without your heart?
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Old 2012-04-02, 10:55   Link #185
Talendra
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Originally Posted by marvelB View Post
^Blackbeard D. Kuma's response says it all.



But on a more serious note, I'm actually starting to doubt the theory that Law delivered Luffy's heart to the WG, because if so, then his body would probably be "dead", like Smoker's. I mean, so far we didn't get any indication that the body could function after the heart is stolen, but somehow I doubt that it's a similar case as with Moria's power, where the victims went into a temporary coma after having their shadows stolen. Chances are good that unless it's properly preserved, the body will just plain wither away after losing its heart, just like.... y'know, what would happen to any person who would suffer such a fate in real life.....
It's quite the opposite, we actually did get indication that a body would work when the heart is seperated by Laws technique: namely, all the other cases where bodyparts where seperated (e.g. in this very arc we have a certain samurai head, torso and lower body screwing around indepedently from each other). Why would the heart by any different? Doesn't make sense to say a body could work with a seperated brain but not with a seperated heart. Unless of course, the specific part actually gets destroyed, thats a place where the manga didn't go yet in regards to Laws power, iirc that is.
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Old 2012-04-02, 11:23   Link #186
marvelB
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Originally Posted by paradox13 View Post
Smoker isn't dead and he isn't in a coma.

You can still move with your limbs all over the place, with your head in one place and your body in another, so why not without your heart?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talendra View Post
It's quite the opposite, we actually did get indication that a body would work when the heart is seperated by Laws technique: namely, all the other cases where bodyparts where seperated (e.g. in this very arc we have a certain samurai head, torso and lower body screwing around indepedently from each other). Why would the heart by any different? Doesn't make sense to say a body could work with a seperated brain but not with a seperated heart. Unless of course, the specific part actually gets destroyed, thats a place where the manga didn't go yet in regards to Laws power, iirc that is.


Uh.... limbs are one thing, internal organs are another. A heart would be a hell of a lot more fragile when compared to a head or legs, or whatever. And we saw Smoker keel over after getting his heart taken, so why can't it be assumed that he passed out? Of course, I'd be more than glad to retract my words depending on the next chapter's events, but the way I see it, once Law takes someone's heart, that person is naught but a lifeless shell, whether they're still breathing or not.....
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Old 2012-04-02, 11:58   Link #187
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Your heart should not matter at all. None of it should matter. If one body part can act alone then it should not matter if it is internal or external. Two the heart is still beating. I think what makes this affect different is it is a different technique. Law used Mes instead of his regular move like shambles. We don't know what kind of effect the Mes has on a removed part. If law used shambles then it would not matter for smoker but since law used mes it has a different affect. The heart is not the reason Smoker is passed out. If law used Mes on the lungs or other vital organs I think the affects would be just has crippling has the heart. To me it is the move that law used that is crippling smoker not the organ removed.
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Old 2012-04-02, 12:12   Link #188
Talendra
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Originally Posted by marvelB View Post
Uh.... limbs are one thing, internal organs are another. A heart would be a hell of a lot more fragile when compared to a head or legs, or whatever. And we saw Smoker keel over after getting his heart taken, so why can't it be assumed that he passed out? Of course, I'd be more than glad to retract my words depending on the next chapter's events, but the way I see it, once Law takes someone's heart, that person is naught but a lifeless shell, whether they're still breathing or not.....
Well, a heart might be more fragile than limbs, but that wasn't my point. Instead I want to emphasize that, if you're going by importance for the body, the brain should be #1, no question. So if a torso can work without a head, meaning without a connection to the brain, it shouldnt be far fetched to expect that a body should work without direct connection to the heart as well.

Also, yes, Smoker went to his knees at the end of last chapter. However, at this point we can't be sure if that is indeed meaningful or just a clever cliffhanger on Odas part. Given that we so far have *no* evidence at all, that seperating body parts with Laws technique is in any way lethal, imo hints are pointing towards the Smoker scene being a cliffhanger

e: what grey said in regards to the technique being different, that would actually make sense. wasn't there some confusion with the translation of mes tho?
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Old 2012-04-02, 12:19   Link #189
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^one thing that can not be denied is the fact that smoker clearly keeled over after his heart was taken. As we've seen normally no one keels over after a body part is taken, they are usually immediately responive and aware of the situation and able to panic or fight; Smoker did not. And Law is walking off like this battle is one and is not worried about smoker jumping him.

So even though we have seen other body part functioning despite being separated, its easy to assume that Law with his "mes" did something differently when he took smoker's heart.
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Old 2012-04-02, 12:54   Link #190
mochichan
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It would be lame if Smoker died just like that...D:
Maybe he'll wake up when Law's ability is off.
I don't want him to die so quick lol :P
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Old 2012-04-02, 15:17   Link #191
Randrak42
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I still find it amusing that some people still believe there is even the slightest possibility of Smoker actually being dead/dying for good.
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Old 2012-04-02, 17:37   Link #192
Mateus
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I don't think Smoker will die - but I also don't think that Law will just hand his heart over like nothing at all, there's going to be some comprises involved considering the effort he went through to stop/stall the Strawhats and prevent the Marines from getting any further on Punk Hazard.
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Old 2012-04-02, 17:44   Link #193
mochichan
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Smoker is too big a character to die like that.
But it's not like Law will just hand it back with just an "i'm sorry, here's your heart back"
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Old 2012-04-02, 17:51   Link #194
grey_1960
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I think it will be Luffy vs. PH and Zoro vs. Law. I don't see Law holding his own against Luffy or Zoro without the PH boss showing up. The only reason I think that this will be a one side fight is because of Haki. If haki does play a big role then Luffy and Zoro ( If Zoro has haki) should really be able to dominate the battle depending how strong there haki is. Smoker was the only one to hold his own. The fact that he was able to deflect Laws shambles with his weapons is a strong proof he has haki armor. Second I don't think Smoker has Mantra. He was not able to predict Law's move on the last page. Law on a one on one fight with smoker did pretty horrible if you look at the whole fight. Luffy and Zoro are both close quarter fighters. If Luffy and Zoro's haki are on par with Smokers or greater this will become a one sided fight. Also PH is no longer ignorant of the people who are on his Island. He will have to get into this fight. PH Boss original plan was to keep a low profile but there is no longer any options except for a fight or pack up and run.
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Old 2012-04-03, 01:21   Link #195
Poetic Justice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma View Post
Law: "So we meet again, strawhat Luffy! By the way, the reason why I saved your ass 2 years ago at the war is because you're the main character and the plot demands that you survive."
Eh Oda could have jyst had random medic A do it, Why Law specifically is what i want to know.
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Old 2012-04-03, 09:07   Link #196
golgo13
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Originally Posted by Poetic Justice View Post
Eh Oda could have jyst had random medic A do it, Why Law specifically is what i want to know.
Law has this specific skill, he was a doctor all along. Luffy was helped out by a lot of people during the war arc. Ivanov helped him out greatly and did it because he was inspired by him. There may not be some ulterior motive to Law helping out, other than simply one pirate helping another in the battle against the marines and recognition of Luffy's importance in the next era.

He may not have helped him for "free", there may be a string attached, it must be pretty good bc it would have to fool chopper.

Law's intentions are all over the place...
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Old 2012-04-03, 10:14   Link #197
paradox13
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fool chopper.
Did Luffy have a medical checkup at Chopper's, or does Chopper have an incredible CoO?

If not, how would Chopper be able to sense even if anythign was wrong with Luffy?
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Old 2012-04-03, 12:33   Link #198
marvelB
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^He's probably referring to around the time when Chopper was checking Luffy's body after Hyouzou poisoned him early in the last storyline. Undoubtedly he would have checked for a heartbeat or pulse, which further leads me to believe that Law didn't take his heart (if Oda really were going to foreshadow such an event, then we should have seen Chopper noticing something strange about Luffy's body at THAT time, putting aside his newfound resistance to deadly poisons).....



Quote:
Originally Posted by Poetic Justice View Post
Eh Oda could have jyst had random medic A do it, Why Law specifically is what i want to know.

Well, you're most certainly right about that. However, to add on to BDK's earlier post, aside from Oda using plot plot no mi on the main characters, he'll also bring back certain popular secondary characters for the fans at some points. And considering how insanely popular Law was even around the time of the war arc (I recall him being amongst the top 10 in the last character popularity poll), he merely decided to get him involved in the war. Whether or not he decided for there to be an ulterior motive for Law's actions at that time isn't really important, IMO.....




BTW, just want to put out a quick reminder that THERE IS NO CHAPTER THIS WEEK. Oda's taking a break this time around so we'll have to wait until next week for chapter 663. So until then, let the long, pointless debates continue!
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Old 2012-04-03, 12:41   Link #199
golgo13
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Originally Posted by paradox13 View Post
Did Luffy have a medical checkup at Chopper's, or does Chopper have an incredible CoO?

If not, how would Chopper be able to sense even if anythign was wrong with Luffy?
This is a total guess on my part, slightly informed.

Chopper is the ships doctor. He has been seen attending to the crew after a battle, Luffy was hurt during his battle with Hody so I'm assuming chopper checked him out. Chopper knew sanji's blood type and kept stock of various types, so there is a lot of stuff he does in the background.

Another reason is, if Law did indeed do something to Luffy, wouldn't one of the first questions be, hey chopper as the ships doctor how come you didn't know?
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Old 2012-04-03, 14:59   Link #200
ntherblast
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Originally Posted by Talendra View Post
It's quite the opposite, we actually did get indication that a body would work when the heart is seperated by Laws technique: namely, all the other cases where bodyparts where seperated (e.g. in this very arc we have a certain samurai head, torso and lower body screwing around indepedently from each other). Why would the heart by any different? Doesn't make sense to say a body could work with a seperated brain but not with a seperated heart. Unless of course, the specific part actually gets destroyed, thats a place where the manga didn't go yet in regards to Laws power, iirc that is.
Law was in a fight vs smoker and his life was on the line he wanted to end it so theres obviously a reason he took his heart probably to immobolize him doesnt mean hes dead. Also smoker kneeled over for a reason
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