[Console] Playstation 4 or Orbis

[Sides]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

I'm kinda confused about the HDD. If it's "built-in," can I still swap it out?

Same as with PS3, and older PS2, you should be able to swap them out. I can't see sony solder them directly on the the mainboard, nor did they mention a buildin flash memory, like Wii/Wii u or some of the 360s.

[Arturia Polaris]

I'm a 360 fanboy. Or was.

I'll explain my course of gaming so I can come across a bit better with my message. My gaming started with a SNES, which later went on to a PSX which I enjoyed a lot and a N64. After those I got a Gamecube and an xbox later on. Xbox won me over the PS2 (which I never bought), so I stuck with the 360 when the PS3 vs 360 war came on.

As the years dragged on (2006 buyer) I realized that XBL was a flawed closed system which severely limited me playing games I wanted. Besides it being a paid service... and PS3 offered the PSN and that "home" thingy which I found really... charming when hearing about it.

Games like MAG and Dust514 which could NOT be replicated on the 360 due to the closed system of the XBL which is not even all that good made me seriously reconsider my next choice.

But the PS4 announcement the other day completely made me go HNNNGGGGHHHH over it. I was just checking it out due to my gaming curiosity, but the PS4 has come out with a huge announcement and a lot of stuff which I'm still drooling over (using my tablet as another screen? win. Besides free interwebz)

TL;DR: This 360 fanboy finds himself being extremely attracted to the PS4. (despite the HORRIBLE controllers you PS guys have to deal with. Honestly they are extremely small, I have a few friends with PS and It's a complete nightmare to get adapted to it. Dualshock 4 doesn't look like it made any big improvements either)

*hands in his 360 fanboy credentials*

*takes out his gamer credentials*

Your move Microsoft. Make it count...

Arty

[kyp275]

Originally Posted by Tong

It's all about how many pixels you can fit in a single space. I kinda agree with this point when it comes to consoles, but on PC the difference is noticeable between 720p (1280x720) and 1080p (1920x1080).

But before 4K, I'd preffer my console games to run at 60fps on Full HD. It's REALLY weird how every game is rendered at different resolutions (Most are sub 720p) and TV Up/Downscalling just... screws with everthing

PC monitors have much higher dot pitch, but the key here is that you also sit much closer to your PC monitor than your TV. While I'd guess most people's eyes are around 2 ft. away from their monitor, I doubt many sits merely 2 feet in front of their TV.

The jump to 4k is also much higher than 720P to 1080P @ 3840 × 2160. While useful for 30"+ PC monitors for extra screen real-estate, for consumer TV it has no tangible benefits until you start going to screen size of over 80".

Originally Posted by Arturia Polaris

(despite the HORRIBLE controllers you PS guys have to deal with. Honestly they are extremely small, I have a few friends with PS and It's a complete nightmare to get adapted to it. Dualshock 4 doesn't look like it made any big improvements either)

Funny, I always thought the xbox controller was too big. But then I do have small hands

[RRW]

[Zoel]

Originally Posted by Arturia Polaris

I'm a 360 fanboy. Or was.

I'll explain my course of gaming so I can come across a bit better with my message. My gaming started with a SNES, which later went on to a PSX which I enjoyed a lot and a N64. After those I got a Gamecube and an xbox later on. Xbox won me over the PS2 (which I never bought), so I stuck with the 360 when the PS3 vs 360 war came on.

As the years dragged on (2006 buyer) I realized that XBL was a flawed closed system which severely limited me playing games I wanted. Besides it being a paid service... and PS3 offered the PSN and that "home" thingy which I found really... charming when hearing about it.

Games like MAG and Dust514 which could NOT be replicated on the 360 due to the closed system of the XBL which is not even all that good made me seriously reconsider my next choice.

But the PS4 announcement the other day completely made me go HNNNGGGGHHHH over it. I was just checking it out due to my gaming curiosity, but the PS4 has come out with a huge announcement and a lot of stuff which I'm still drooling over (using my tablet as another screen? win. Besides free interwebz)

TL;DR: This 360 fanboy finds himself being extremely attracted to the PS4. (despite the HORRIBLE controllers you PS guys have to deal with. Honestly they are extremely small, I have a few friends with PS and It's a complete nightmare to get adapted to it. Dualshock 4 doesn't look like it made any big improvements either)

*hands in his 360 fanboy credentials*

*takes out his gamer credentials*

Your move Microsoft. Make it count...

Arty

I actually prefer my controller to be small and light and possible. Thats probably why I loved the Snes controller a lot and also the PSX controller was easily adapted. Then the Sega Saturn controller was literally perfection for fighting games, I don't even know why Sega didn't stick with that design for the Dreamcast.

But then again I do have small hands, so perhaps thats the main reason why I never like XBOX controller much.

The controller to me feels almost perfect is the Wii U Pro Controller, it seems to take the best out of the 360 controller and the PSX controller in 1. Of course some people really hate the controller for being too light.

[Westlo]

Ps4 did enough and they saved enough big stuff for e3.... also liking that it makes my vita purchase a lot better since it will be able to stream every ps4 game, something the Wii U can't even do.. (lol monster hunter)

Also sleep mode is awesome, one of the best things they could grab from handhelds...

Originally Posted by Sides

Holy cr@p this system is a monster! 8GB of GDDR5 RAM. I really hope the system is affordable...
Some of the "social" features are kind of off-putting to me. i hope those parts don't take up much system resources, so we can get really visually stunning looking solo games, like RPG, without coop gimmicks and that kind of thing

The thing you just praised should ease what you're worried about... after all it seems the NextBox needs 3gig out of it's 8 for it's OS/Kinect bullshit and GDDR5 is superior and I doubt Sony will need as much OS bloat....

Originally Posted by Magin

Just reading some news articles, Sony is already shooting itself in the foot if they don't fix things up- it appears to not be backwards compatible, or at least can't play PS3 games... as for PS2 or PS1, I haven't seen anything about those... yet

And if this isn't changed, if Sony adds this on top of not being able to play used games 9which again, nothing was said about )... Sony is going to alienate so many people that they might as well just go out of business

If you bothered to look at the specs for both systems it should've been obvious that it was never going to have BC, here's a shocker, nether will the next Xbox.

Also for all we know it can now bruteforce Ps2 games...

Originally Posted by blakstealth

how long is this fuckin gif hhaaha

NeoGAF went insane with the Kaz gifs in the leadup to the Ps4 reveal... best one was the Asura Wrath one by demonite, gotta find it.. it's like a 15 meg gif, just amazing.

Originally Posted by Solace

"Not always online" is misleading. For one, it's up to developers.

Duh

If Bungie want to make a Online FPS like they do with Destiny it will be online required, but that's nothing new. Otherwise it's just going to be like it is now and to say otherwise is just pure scaremongering. You know like the it doesn't play used games, has no Bluray drive, games will cost $80 (oh wait Tretton just confirmed $0.99-$60) and all the other crap the gets spread around for various reasons. The no BC was the only legit thing and that was obvious in the first place.

As for BC, no, not directly. Gaikai will supposedly stream old games to your PS4, but how big that library will be, how well it will play, the costs (do you have to rebuy? most likely) are all up in the air.

Of course they will, you expect them to open up their massive PSX/PS2/PS3/PSP library to people for nothing?

]quote]Expect a paywall too, like Live. You'll be able to get online, do multiplayer, and probably have some of the share features too. But to get the fancier stuff, expect heavy pushing to get customers to buy into PS+, or whatever they'll call it. Don't expect it to be the value it is now.[/quote]

Gaikai not being behind a paywall would be dumb as hell for Sony.

As for the price point, the system is going to be 300 at a minimum, especially if it is launching this year. Those specs aren't cheap, even subsidized. Expect Sony to introduce, and MS to expand, contract based models to tempt people with poor financial judgement into long term monthly payments. 150 to buy the system, pay for years, company gets more than if you paid upfront. Upfront costs? I expect nothing less than 400, and more likely closer to 500. Sony can't afford to eat big losses on each console again, as the company is the brink of bankruptcy.

Also include the extra costs. Controllers and other accessories, the increased costs of games, etc. We're heading back to the era of 70 and 80 dollar gaming, sadly, for the big budget AAA stuff at least..

People were swearing the Vita was going to be $400 and than Sony launched it at $250. I still expect this to be $399, maybe $430 and only because of the increased ram from 4gig to 8gig unless Sony wants to wear that loss.

A $399 Ps4 is far better value than a $350 Wii U, lol @ that still selling at a lose because of a $180 controller.

As for games prices...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=514952

As you can see they definitely plan to be selling more than likely Android games, which makes the touchpad inclusion make sense. (lol @ people thinking this is biting the Wii U, the Vita has rear touchpads, my laptop has a touchpad, if you want to talk about biting look at the Wii U Classic Controller compared to the 360...)

[Duo Maxwell]

Originally Posted by Arturia Polaris

TL;DR: This 360 fanboy finds himself being extremely attracted to the PS4. (despite the HORRIBLE controllers you PS guys have to deal with. Honestly they are extremely small, I have a few friends with PS and It's a complete nightmare to get adapted to it. Dualshock 4 doesn't look like it made any big improvements either)

Years of fighting gaming made me hate the Xbox360's controller and nowaday I can't use anything else aside from the Dualshock (well, arcade stick is exceptional).

On the other news, seems like Sony don't even know what their PS4 will look like currently. I guess they still haven't decided on the final design yet.

[Westlo]

360 dpad is horrible... you can thank Nintendo for that patent though... Vita dpad is awesome though it seems the ps4 is not using it sadly.

Originally Posted by Duo Maxwell

On the other news, seems like Sony don't even know what their PS4 will look like currently. I guess they still haven't decided on the final design yet.

It could still be 9 months off, it's not like the Wii U's initial reveal design didn't get changed....

[Tempester]

Originally Posted by Arturia Polaris

despite the HORRIBLE controllers you PS guys have to deal with.

Sony's insistence to keep the left analog stick in the middle of the controller rather than switching it with the D-pad is mind-boggling. The Dualshock's design is nicely symmetrical in appearance, but it leads to unsymmetrical gameplay for your thumbs (since the majority of Playstation games use the left stick much more often than the D-pad). Both Nintendo and Microsoft have the left analog stick on the upper left side where it belongs, and Nintendo has been doing that since the 90's. I'm assuming that Sony favors consistence between console generations, so much that it comes to a fault in this area.

I've read of many people having sore thumbs due to this controller design, but thankfully I'm used to it.

[blakstealth]

I guess I'm grateful for my medium-sized hands. They're big enough for the 360 controller but small enough for the dualshock controller. lol

[kayos]

Originally Posted by Tempester

Sony's insistence to keep the left analog stick in the middle of the controller rather than switching it with the D-pad is mind-boggling. The Dualshock's design is nicely symmetrical in appearance, but it leads to unsymmetrical gameplay for your thumbs (since the majority of Playstation games use the left stick much more often than the D-pad). Both Nintendo and Microsoft have the left analog stick on the upper left side where it belongs, and Nintendo has been doing that since the 90's. I'm assuming that Sony favors consistence between console generations, so much that it comes to a fault in this area.

I've read of many people having sore thumbs due to this controller design, but thankfully I'm used to it.

I play a lot of FPS which requires the used of both stick, everything seems fine. Also MLG CoD players prefer convex design on their stick similar to what you find on a PS controller.

So I'm sure Sony knows what they're doing. It's not like they just designed this controller last year.

Of course if you want a more high end controller that's capable of swapping the Dpad with a left stick, someone will probably make it and sell it like this. madcatz ps3 controller

[Tempester]

Originally Posted by kayos

I play a lot of FPS which requires the used of both stick, everything seems fine. Also MLG CoD players prefer convex design on their stick similar to what you find on a PS controller.

So I'm sure Sony knows what they're doing. It's not like they just designed this controller last year.

So they're catering to the games like FPSs that rely on frequent camera control coupled with R1/R2 use? I guess that makes sense.

Originally Posted by kayos

Of course if you want a more high end controller that's capable of swapping the Dpad with a left stick, someone will probably make it and sell it like this. madcatz ps3 controller

There's no need to wait for it to happen. There are many custom PS3 controllers that have that scheme already. And they're easy to get hold of if you have a Gamestop store near you. I'll buy one if I ever have the need to replace my Dualshock 3.

[Tong]

Originally Posted by kyp275

PC monitors have much higher dot pitch, but the key here is that you also sit much closer to your PC monitor than your TV. While I'd guess most people's eyes are around 2 ft. away from their monitor, I doubt many sits merely 2 feet in front of their TV.

The jump to 4k is also much higher than 720P to 1080P @ 3840 × 2160. While useful for 30"+ PC monitors for extra screen real-estate, for consumer TV it has no tangible benefits until you start going to screen size of over 80".

That's only because we're talking about screens! I'm talking about internal resolutions more specifically. That's how "HD Remakes" are made, they just up the internal resolution and "wow look at that all HD ". I can do the exact same thing in PCSX2...

Before 1080p became viable (and honestly, was rather unnecessary for most games), HD was something that everyone wanted... In PS2 era I'm pretty sure almost no one bothered with Component cables since such displays weren't exactly cheap. Then, everyone got hyped about TRUE HD and HD was pretty much very common.

As you said, 4K may not make a real difference but it WILL set a new stardard, since it seems that 1080p and 3D are very common.

You heard here first!

[kayos]

Originally Posted by Tempester

So they're catering to the games like FPSs that rely on frequent camera control coupled with R1/R2 use? I guess that makes sense.

No it's not just catered to FPS. Having your thumbs parallel to each other as you move and adjust the camera (view point) is not a bad thing. I'm sure Sony had testers try out the prototype before they decided on a final design.

Look at the Wii and Wii U controllers, both sticks are parallel to each other as well. Maybe it just feels comfortable with a sense of uniformity by holding something with both hands and thumbs evenly across from each other.

If the majority are comfortable with it why fix what's not broken. Sure not everyone will like it but the point is they're trying to please the majority.

Originally Posted by Tempester

There's no need to wait for it to happen. There are many custom PS3 controllers that have that scheme already. And they're easy to get hold of if you have a Gamestop store near you. I'll buy one if I ever have the need to replace my Dualshock 3.

If we're talking about the PS4, I remember reading you can't use the PS3 controllers on it. So that might include 3rd party controllers too. But yeah there should be options later on by 3rd party sellers.

[Benoit]

Originally Posted by Dextro

There's a bit of great news here though: since the new ps4 is by all accounts just a decent current gaming pc ports will be amazing from now on.

No "decent current gaming pc" has 8 GB of GDDR5 RAM. Also, within a couple years PC gamers will complain again as PCs get more upgrades.

Originally Posted by Vigo

Not confirmed yet. But I honestly doubt it will be region locked. The Vita isn't. Why change now?

That doesn't mean much, considering that portable game consoles have historically been region free. Until the 3DS, that is.

Originally Posted by Solace

Nintendo remains quite strong with their BC, but all three really lack the ability to run old software like PC's can.

When it comes to running old software on PCs, there are always strings attached as it's not a standarised platform, so please don't compare it.

[Rising Dragon]

The only true concern I have for the PS4 right now, other than potential price, is the lack of backwards compatibility and its replacement. On one hand, I'm fine with the whole "streaming" idea, assuming it works. On the other hand, it means those who have already bought the game for the PS3 will have to buy it all over again, and I don't think that's right.

I do think that if you don't have the game, yes you should pay for it. But I think there should be some method to get the access for free if you can prove you already bought the game. Is there something like that in effect that I'm unaware of (since I haven't got a PS3 due to its price and lack of a job, and thus unfamiliar with all of its functions)?

[Benoit]

Originally Posted by Tong

Now that I think about it, Insta-pause has been around since the PSP!

Try Nintendo DS.

Hope 4K resolution sets new standards for High Definition.

Let's all buy new TVs again!

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

The PS1 and PS2 were perfect when it came to balancing tech and sensible price for their time, so I'm not sure what happened this gen.

It looks like you already forgot about the insane price the PlayStation 2 had at launch.

[Tokkan]

Bah, already have a HDTV for 720p and 1080p. I don't need to be going out and getting a UHDTV for 4K (and 8K) considering nothing uses those UHD resolutions yet.

[felix]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The only true concern I have for the PS4 right now, other than potential price, is the lack of backwards compatibility and its replacement. On one hand, I'm fine with the whole "streaming" idea, assuming it works. On the other hand, it means those who have already bought the game for the PS3 will have to buy it all over again, and I don't think that's right.

I do think that if you don't have the game, yes you should pay for it. But I think there should be some method to get the access for free if you can prove you already bought the game. Is there something like that in effect that I'm unaware of (since I haven't got a PS3 due to its price and lack of a job, and thus unfamiliar with all of its functions)?

You have PS3 games, but don't have a PS3? What?

And I don't think you understand backwards compatiblity. THE hardware is different enough the GAME MAKERS have to PORT it over if you want to run it. It's not that "sony doesn't allow you to play them" the thing just doesn't run it. It's like sticking a DVD in a USB drive.

This has been mentioned all over the place but basically just keep your damn PS3, perfect backwards compatibility. Also this move towards more "standard" hardware means all future console releases will be backwards compatible, and the console can also more easily mingle with the PC market (in theory).

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by felix

You have PS3 games, but don't have a PS3? What?

And I don't think you understand backwards compatiblity. THE hardware is different enough the GAME MAKERS have to PORT it over if you want to run it. It's not that "sony doesn't allow you to play them" the thing just doesn't run it. It's like sticking a DVD in a USB drive.

This has been mentioned all over the place but basically just keep your damn PS3, perfect backwards compatibility. Also this move towards more "standard" hardware means all future console releases will be backwards compatible, and the console can also more easily mingle with the PC market (in theory).

Lol, no, I have neither the games nor the console. I'm just thinking of others who would have such games. A lot of people trade in their machines to get some money towards the next console (personally I believe in keeping all consoles you've acquired; comes with starting off with an NES, I suppose). I wanted a PS3 but couldn't afford it (and still can't) and had been hoping if I got a PS4 I could use that for the PS3 games I had wanted to play.

I care little for the difference behind the lack of backwards compatibility. It still boils down to the fact that the older games won't work on it, correct?