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Old 2013-02-08, 02:48   Link #1341
Anime Online
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
tat is the point, the Southern Countries don't normally have the resources to keep a large standing army. They are being subsidize. by richer countries who use the Southern Countries as shields to the effect of the war. The downside of which is that the Southern Countries are completely dependent on the subsidies form the rich countries. If the war stops no more subsidies. The Southern Countries would then fall into chaos.

A standing army means it exists in both wartime and peacetime. My point is how exactly is the southern kingdoms supposed to afford keeping that army around in peacetime? The southern kingdoms has no means to keep that army sitting around and the central kingdom certainly isn't going to pay for its upkeep once the fighting has ended.

Therefore, I'm saying it is not logical that army is a standing army.
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Old 2013-02-08, 02:56   Link #1342
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A standing army is an army of full time soldiers. It can grow or shrink according to need.
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Old 2013-02-08, 03:03   Link #1343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor
So, Hero correcting Maou is only for the terms used to refer the almighty, while both “God” and “Light Spirit” are basically the same.
OK. Thanks for clarifying that .
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anime Online View Post
A standing army means it exists in both wartime and peacetime. My point is how exactly is the southern kingdoms supposed to afford keeping that army around in peacetime? The southern kingdoms has no means to keep that army sitting around and the central kingdom certainly isn't going to pay for its upkeep once the fighting has ended.

Therefore, I'm saying it is not logical that army is a standing army.
Yeah. In that sense they are probably closer to mercenaries rather than a standing army.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
A standing army is an army of full time soldiers. It can grow or shrink according to need.
If they can be shrunk then perhaps. Point is, that army would cease to exist at all ;not merely shrinking; should Central funds were cut off.
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Old 2013-02-08, 09:04   Link #1344
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Actually, maybe I'll refrain from posting and asking here if people keep relying on spoilers to prove a point.
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Old 2013-02-08, 09:09   Link #1345
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Mate, this is an anime thread. Please put the materials not-yet-revealed in the anime under spoiler tags before a Mod does it for you and give you an infraction bonus.
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Old 2013-02-08, 13:52   Link #1346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anime Online View Post
A standing army means it exists in both wartime and peacetime. My point is how exactly is the southern kingdoms supposed to afford keeping that army around in peacetime? The southern kingdoms has no means to keep that army sitting around and the central kingdom certainly isn't going to pay for its upkeep once the fighting has ended.

Therefore, I'm saying it is not logical that army is a standing army.
A standing army means an army of professional soldiers. Existing in the peace time is a correlated condition, but not a necessary one. The distinction is important in some circumstances, including:

1. In extended conflicts, where no peace is achieved within a significant fraction of a soldier's productive life time.

2. In periods where peace time is ill-defined because no formalities of war exist.

Both these conditions apply to Maoyu. We know that the Central Nations have been funding the Southern Nations continuously, because the Winter Prince fears the Central Nations shutting off their aid. It is more rational to assume that the Central Nation has been funding a standing army than to assume that they are funding various peasant militias that were raised for small border skirmishes then disbanded as soon as the skirmish ends. Certainly a standing army is more consistent with the troop deployment around Gate City than a peasant militia that goes home for the winter.

Relating back to the original reason a standing army was mentioned: For the purpose of analyzing whether there will be a lot of people who cannot return to civilian life, a mercenary army and a national standing army are exchangeable.
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Old 2013-02-08, 14:02   Link #1347
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Onna Kishi kicks some serious ass.
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Old 2013-02-08, 15:08   Link #1348
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Hero's scare tactics were pretty LOL but effective.
The whole Dead Knight thing was ingenious.
Somehow there's too much discussing and less battles.
The front lines are where the action is.
So far this anime has been just mediocre.
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Old 2013-02-08, 15:46   Link #1349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEroKing View Post

Onna Kishi kicks some serious ass.
But it looked ugly =02. Plenty of moments in this ep where the animation quality took a big nosedive(not the 1st time in the series, but still..). This being the 1st "real" battle shown in terms of stronger powers, they could have at least choreographed and animated it much better than they did. According to Hero and Demon Queen, the Arctic General was supposed to be one of the strongest demons in the demon world, yet, it barely looks like Female Knight broke a sweat; and she's not even as strong as Hero(which is very unusual for humans to be greatly superior than demons). They should have at least given the impression that he is a force to be reckoned with aside from knocking off a few grunts, and the show failed to give me that impression. And I say this with no regard to the manga version mind you. The music and FK's banter during that fight was superb though.

One thing this ep did do right was the pacing; they managed to stay on one event for the whole episode. And, again, the best moment was Hero/DQ/FK moment which ALWAYS seems to put a smile on my face =03.
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Old 2013-02-08, 15:52   Link #1350
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Good episode, it felt longer than it actually was. But the lack of budget was obvious.

I don't mind because, in spite of its flaws, the anime is doing a good gob in portraying everything into the time constraints.

@Graveyard Duck
You're a generous guy, those posts are worth anyone's time to read.

Quote:
Originally Posted by frubam View Post
the Arctic General was supposed to be one of the strongest demons in the demon world, yet, it barely looks like Female Knight broke a sweat; and she's not even as strong as Hero(which is very unusual for humans to be greatly superior than demons).
We know only of 2 very strong humans so far: Hero and Female Knight. That's unusual enough.
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Old 2013-02-08, 16:28   Link #1351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frubam View Post
But it looked ugly =02. Plenty of moments in this ep where the animation quality took a big nosedive(not the 1st time in the series, but still..). This being the 1st "real" battle shown in terms of stronger powers, they could have at least choreographed and animated it much better than they did. According to Hero and Demon Queen, the Arctic General was supposed to be one of the strongest demons in the demon world, yet, it barely looks like Female Knight broke a sweat; and she's not even as strong as Hero(which is very unusual for humans to be greatly superior than demons). They should have at least given the impression that he is a force to be reckoned with aside from knocking off a few grunts, and the show failed to give me that impression. And I say this with no regard to the manga version mind you. The music and FK's banter during that fight was superb though.

One thing this ep did do right was the pacing; they managed to stay on one event for the whole episode. And, again, the best moment was Hero/DQ/FK moment which ALWAYS seems to put a smile on my face =03.
Actually, Female Knight is just that strong. She crushes him effortlessly in the manga as well. Hero and his companions exist on a different level of strength entirely.
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Old 2013-02-08, 16:29   Link #1352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frubam View Post
. According to Hero and Demon Queen, the Arctic General was supposed to be one of the strongest demons in the demon world, yet, it barely looks like Female Knight broke a sweat; and she's not even as strong as Hero(which is very unusual for humans to be greatly superior than demons).
The Hero is basically your main character in DQ when you are ready to go after the Main Boss.

if you play like he would be train to a insane level and have all the best gears.
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Old 2013-02-08, 17:11   Link #1353
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I haven't watched the last episode but I read that some are complaining about the "low tension" tone of the anime, or lack of action. Given that and that there is next to zero combat, it is probably intended that children are in the marketed audience. The first airing had such amazing animation that the rest is not much less than a let down.
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:12   Link #1354
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Spoiler for My thoughts of ep 5:


While Maou has her reason to do what she does, but she actually unite with her race's enemy to hit her own kind for her personal gain (I think it touch on briefly that the demon world is not an absolute monarchy, and she has no direct control over other powerful demon lords. If the war against human ended the demon lord will fight against each other, so maybe they will fight her tribe too, and her tribe is not known for battle prowness). In history we have Brutus, Benedict Arnold and Wang JingWei, all are considered classic traitors despite all of them have their own reasons. What makes Maou different?
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:24   Link #1355
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fukarming View Post
Spoiler for My thoughts of ep 5:


While Maou has her reason to do what she does, but she actually unite with her race's enemy to hit her own kind for her personal gain (I think it touch on briefly that the demon world is not an absolute monarchy, and she has no direct control over other powerful demon lords. If the war against human ended the demon lord will fight against each other, so maybe they will fight her tribe too, and her tribe is not known for battle prowness). In history we have Brutus, Benedict Arnold and Wang JingWei, all are considered classic traitors despite all of them have their own reasons. What makes Maou different?
Actually, Ice General could have chosen to retreat with his men. He'd probably have made it. (It's not detailed in the anime, but the crusaders weren't really in shape to fight the demons - they were just there to scare them into abandoning their position, not to actually cut off their escape).

As for you question regarding Maou, two things:
- she's technically the demons' ruler. She wouldn't have to use such indirect means if they'd just listen to her.
- her goals are larger and more altruistic than personal ambition.
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:27   Link #1356
Xellos-_^
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借刀殺人

Tran - Borrow a knife to Kill someone else.

one of Sun Tzu 36 stratagem

From Machiavelli's pov Maou isn't selling out the demon world. What she is doing instead is using Humans to remove a obstacle to her rule in the demon world.
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:44   Link #1357
fukarming
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Actually, Ice General could have chosen to retreat with his men. He'd probably have made it. (It's not detailed in the anime, but the crusaders weren't really in shape to fight the demons - they were just there to scare them into abandoning their position, not to actually cut off their escape).
I must say I certainly don't see that in the anime. From what I see the ice general trying to retreat (otherwise why is he leaving the fortified fortress?), and yet mercilessly cut down by the female knight. The female knight after killing ice general even said "dont rejoice yet, exterminate the remaining enemy"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
As for you question regarding Maou, two things:
- she's technically the demons' ruler. She wouldn't have to use such indirect means if they'd just listen to her.
- her goals are larger and more altruistic than personal ambition.
Brutus and Wang JingWei have reasons to betray other than personal ambition (at least some scholar believe so), but in a universal sense they are well known traitor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
借刀殺人

Tran - Borrow a knife to Kill someone else.

one of Sun Tzu 36 stratagem

From Machiavelli's pov Maou isn't selling out the demon world. What she is doing instead is using Humans to remove a obstacle to her rule in the demon world.
Let me use an example: during Japanese warring states the puppet Shogun unite other Daimyo to fight against Nobunaga, that is "borrow a knife to kill someone". If he borrowed troops from China to fight Nobunaga, that is treason. Do you agree?
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Then they came for foie gras,I didn't speak up because I don't eat foie gras.
Then they came for Toro (bluefin tuna) sushi,I didn't speak up because I don't eat sushi.
Then they came for me and force me to be a vegan by that time no one was left to speak up.
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:48   Link #1358
Xellos-_^
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Originally Posted by fukarming View Post
Let me use an example: during Japanese warring states the puppet Shogun unite other Daimyo to fight against Nobunaga, that is "borrow a knife to kill someone". If he borrowed troops from China to fight Nobunaga, that is treason. Do you agree?
nope,

there are more then a few example of City-States during China Spring/Autumn Warring State period borrowing troops form barbarians.
Wu/Shu/Wei all made use of barbarian troops during the Three-Kingdom period as well.
Simon Lee, 2nd Emperor of the Tang Dynasty (Also counted as Greatest Emperor of China) also borrow barbarian troops during Civil War following the collapse of the Sui Dynasty.
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Old 2013-02-08, 19:49   Link #1359
XFire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fukarming View Post
Spoiler for My thoughts of ep 5:


While Maou has her reason to do what she does, but she actually unite with her race's enemy to hit her own kind for her personal gain (I think it touch on briefly that the demon world is not an absolute monarchy, and she has no direct control over other powerful demon lords. If the war against human ended the demon lord will fight against each other, so maybe they will fight her tribe too, and her tribe is not known for battle prowness). In history we have Brutus, Benedict Arnold and Wang JingWei, all are considered classic traitors despite all of them have their own reasons. What makes Maou different?
What makes her different? How about the fact that the "courageous" general took over that city in direct defiance of her orders? Or the fact that he was trying to provoke the humans through constant raids?

The reason Hero is running around in the Demon World is to prevent any of the other tribes from doing the same thing and causing an enormous bloody war that would last years.
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Old 2013-02-08, 20:04   Link #1360
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by fukarming View Post
I must say I certainly don't see that in the anime. From what I see the ice general trying to retreat (otherwise why is he leaving the fortified fortress?),
He attacked the human camp, which is on the opposite side of the escape route. (The Gate is to the south of the island, the humans came from the north.) Notice, also, that he's alone - he ordered his men to escape without him.
Spoiler for manga:


Quote:
and yet mercilessly cut down by the female knight.
Because he wanted to satisfy his pride with one last duel to the death with the enemy general. That was a mercy on her part. In the manga, she said something to the effect that he was a great warrior but, in the end, nothing more.

Quote:
The female knight after killing ice general even said "dont rejoice yet, exterminate the remaining enemy"
Because she didn't want them to let down their guard. What if the demons rallied before the humans consolidated their position? What if they left stragglers behind, waiting for an opportunity to kill officers, maybe even the Winter King?

Spoiler for manga:

Last edited by Anh_Minh; 2013-02-08 at 20:23.
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