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Old 2013-06-06, 11:33   Link #3421
DarkHollowIchigo
 
 
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Can somebody explain me this....how in the world did the 1000 year younger version of Yhwach get into the soul of Ichigo and manifest himself as ichigo's zanpaktou?

While "Whitey" ...was Ichigo's original Zanpaktou.
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Old 2013-06-06, 11:35   Link #3422
Pyrokinetic
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poor kubo :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
I doubt Kubo is going to bother coming up with new powers for them, so they'll likely keep their fullbring.
loooooool kubo kubo kubo, ya can tell he is just dragging on the plot recycling whatever material he's used to cash in his check and make his bosses milk out whatever that is left of bleach before they cut him off, there is no passion in his work anymore, he probably didn't plan for the story to run this long so he gotta pull out whatever bs he can on the spot n i guess in that situation he is not doing such a bad job coz i am still reading his materials in hope that atleast it wont be just bitter taste thats left in my mouth when it ends. he is just doing enough to fool the average idiot n keep some of us happy that have been a longtime fan with a little hope that bleach will end with some sort of credit and dignity, maybe he thinks showing us the long awaited bankai's here n there is all that he can offer the fan base, might as well before the shitritters steal it so everyone who wasn't planned to have one CAN HAVE IT!!!! i am sure he will pull something out his ass for each character, aslong as its easy enough for the ritters to use and easy enough to explain to us, so no more broken powers we have enough questions already unaswered. I can see where this is going, right now his focus is ichigo he cant possibly invest time in other characters thats too much effort so he will keep us updated here n there about their development only to show their face and show some kind of improvement make them pop a bankai or something n then the shitritters will shit on them like the irrelevant characters they are and its all about ichigo so he will gain some new hybrid quincy/shinigami powers and shoot a quincy arrow getsuga tenshou up bach's ass and kill him and saves the day and the END. i am sure he is filling the same pain as us, he just want it to end.
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Old 2013-06-06, 11:41   Link #3423
itachi-san314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace View Post
Here, someone put this together in the RC comments:

http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/2...0452059441.jpg

It doesn't "negate" or "overly complicate" anything:
umm... it does. where are all the panels of ichigo said to have shinigami powers? and calling bach zangetsu? and yoruichi's bankai training? etc... the panels they listed are all clearly ambiguous statements designed for future retconning. kubo knew he wanted to make ichigo some sort of hybrid, yes of course. that's why he's slightly different and people notice. that way kubo could do literally anything and 'it all makes sense' to you. if you can't see the sloppy writing in all this by now, then i doubt you ever will

Quote:
1. Aizen knew that Ichigo's Hollow side came from his experiments. He also knew Ichigo's life because he was monitoring his progress the whole time.

2. Urahara knew that Ichigo was a mixed breed because he was there when it happened and knew how it worked due to his own involvement with Hollowfication.
sure. so what? these are facts that have nothing to do with my post

Quote:
3. The CC and SS are idiots, but who ever argued they weren't? Even the story itself highlights their incompetence from time to time. In many cases, even when they had competence, they undid it with arrogance and ignorance/indifference.
i agree. if you read what i wrote i never said people argued against it. i said SS are idiots. is it really good writing to make the leaders of a place called Soul Society in charge of the world's balance complete morons? how did they get to be so powerful and in charge of everything if they're so stupid?

Quote:
You claim it's horrible writing to have him have all these powers, but wouldn't it be equally horrible if he was able to mimic abilities?
my point was simplification. either way it's bad writing. i would prefer ichigo to just be a hollow/shinigami. the fullbring/quincy crap is what over-complicates him and makes it bad writing imho.

Quote:
It's hilarious you mention Heroes, which became incredibly convoluted and ridiculous as the story progressed. They couldn't even be bothered to conclude it, as the show was cancelled.
it's hilarious because you didn't get my point at all... i never said heroes was good writing. i was merely offering a way for kubo to have ichigo have every power without making things so excessively complicated. i think a character with every power is lame, boring, and yes poorly written
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Old 2013-06-06, 12:01   Link #3424
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHollowIchigo View Post
Can somebody explain me this....how in the world did the 1000 year younger version of Yhwach get into the soul of Ichigo and manifest himself as ichigo's zanpaktou?

While "Whitey" ...was Ichigo's original Zanpaktou.
Quote:
Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
umm... it does. where are all the panels of ichigo said to have shinigami powers? and calling bach zangetsu? and yoruichi's bankai training? etc... the panels they listed are all clearly ambiguous statements designed for future retconning. kubo knew he wanted to make ichigo some sort of hybrid, yes of course. that's why he's slightly different and people notice. that way kubo could do literally anything and 'it all makes sense' to you. if you can't see the sloppy writing in all this by now, then i doubt you ever will
How about you guys give Kubo a chance to explain what's going on, before you say it doesn't make sense?

A few weeks ago, people were complaining about retcons when Isshin said Yhwach was involved in Masaki's death, and it turned out he was barely a part of it. Just give the guy a chance.
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Old 2013-06-06, 12:14   Link #3425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
umm... it does. where are all the panels of ichigo said to have shinigami powers? and calling bach zangetsu? and yoruichi's bankai training? etc... the panels they listed are all clearly ambiguous statements designed for future retconning. kubo knew he wanted to make ichigo some sort of hybrid, yes of course. that's why he's slightly different and people notice. that way kubo could do literally anything and 'it all makes sense' to you. if you can't see the sloppy writing in all this by now, then i doubt you ever will
I never said it was great writing, ffs. I said it made sense. "Future retconning"? It's called foreshadowing. Yes, even leaving things intentionally ambiguous, it's a way of giving yourself leeway later on in the story.

What exactly does he do as a Shinigami outside of shikai, bankai, and cleansing? "Powers" is really vague considering how different all of the Shinigami are to each other. He can do what they do. He's got the robe and sword. Everyone knows he's got his powers from Shinigami.

Calling Bach Zangetsu? He thought Hollow Ichigo was the abberation, not the Old Man. Remember that unlike "official" Shinigami, he has had zero training and has no historical understanding of Soul Society. And it's not like you can just peer into someone else's sword and see the guy inside. The only reason the Zero Squad guy can is because it's his specialty.

Yoruichi knows Urahara, but Yoruichi doesn't know everything that he does. Why would it be surprising that she, like most everyone else, would take things at face value and assume that Ichigo was "just" a Shinigami?

Quote:
sure. so what? these are facts that have nothing to do with my post
You said it was convoluted and overly-complicated. I supplied a few simple facts to show that it's not that hard to follow.

Quote:
i agree. if you read what i wrote i never said people argued against it. i said SS are idiots. is it really good writing to make the leaders of a place called Soul Society in charge of the world's balance complete morons? how did they get to be so powerful and in charge of everything if they're so stupid?
Because they were nothing more than ruthless bandits with a flawed sense of justice, who eventually banded together under a "strong rule the weak" principle that turned into centuries of rules of traditions that ended up shackling them down. SS is not filled with wise men, it is filled with soldiers who will slaughter people if it means "balance". It's precisely why the Quincy hate them so much, even if they were/are doing the same thing.

Quote:
my point was simplification. either way it's bad writing. i would prefer ichigo to just be a hollow/shinigami. the fullbring/quincy crap is what over-complicates him and makes it bad writing imho.
It's your opinion, fair enough.

Quote:
it's hilarious because you didn't get my point at all... i never said heroes was good writing. i was merely offering a way for kubo to have ichigo have every power without making things so excessively complicated. i think a character with every power is lame, boring, and yes poorly written
But he doesn't have every power. He has some of every power. He doesn't know Kido, he can barely use his Hollow/Fullbring powers, can't Resurrection, his Bankai doesn't grant him new abilities, and his Quincy powers basically amount to him stopping blood loss for a bit.

I'm not arguing that Kubo plays up the "Ichigo is the chosen one" bit too much, but this goes back to my criticisms about Bleach in my previous post, where I stated that the power system and other aspects weren't written as well as they should have been.

Either way, we both agree the story doesn't have great writing. But it isn't written in such a way that it is difficult to follow, or that it doesn't make sense. Go check out Vampire Knight if you want something that makes Bleach seem like amazing writing.
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Old 2013-06-06, 12:28   Link #3426
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more rant

What i think personally where bleach went wrong is, kubo complicated things too much, he tried to do too much with his characters and tries to please his fans too much with all the fan service (re-introducing old characters and heck throwing some bankai's in there). when bleach started it was no doubt one of my favourite anime ever, the story had so much potential, even though most of this kind of stuff was done before it was still had some kind of fresh feel to it to the shounen community, the plot seemed solid, some intriguing captivating personalities and amazing character designs (ooooh how i love the captain haori's) with a great plot going, awesome powers and creativity, the whole katana samurai fighting spirits idea with unique powers was cool, had me pulling out my kitchen knives and shouting BANKAI!!! or when i am playing a game and i am about to go super leet mode, started to dig capes too some reason. Either way Bleach had potential to be one of the best shounen ever, till to the rukia ark, it had me at the edge of my seat after that it was like meh. he love his characters too much he cant even kill them without some sort of fan base CRYING OUT FOR PLEASEEEE SOMEONE JUST DIE SO THIS STORY ENDS QUICKER. he gave characters powers with plot holes he cant even explain so he just said f***k it i am just gonna try and outdo other shounen animes and come up with, i wouldn't be surprised if he is trying to complete with dbz for the anime with most plot holes and broken powers, so I HAVE A GOOD GUESS, the new ichigo power up is going to give goku super saiyan god a run for his money =] as ridicilous as the story seems i am looking forward to see what kubo will do with ichigo broken hybrid powers.
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Old 2013-06-06, 12:44   Link #3427
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So if I'm understanding this right he was basically using his quincy powers the whole time?... Ichigo never really ever had shinigami powers in the first place. could be why he couldn't achieve Kido. although thats another story all together.
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Old 2013-06-06, 12:50   Link #3428
DarkHollowIchigo
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
How about you guys give Kubo a chance to explain what's going on, before you say it doesn't make sense?

A few weeks ago, people were complaining about retcons when Isshin said Yhwach was involved in Masaki's death, and it turned out he was barely a part of it. Just give the guy a chance.
Not quite sure why you put my post in your quote, if you can find the part where i actually say that it does not make any sense?

I am only asking if somebody know's i would highly apriciate it, nothing more, nothing less.

You however, jump to certain untrue conclusions.

So i will ask again..for the people that might know..or do know...

Can somebody explain me this....how in the world did the 1000 year younger version of Yhwach get into the soul of Ichigo and manifest himself as ichigo's zanpaktou?

While "Whitey" ...was Ichigo's original Zanpaktou.


Thank you
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Old 2013-06-06, 13:06   Link #3429
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Here are my thoughts:

1. All fans cannot be satisfied fully no matter what the author does. Somebody has to be that one guy.
2. I don't see what the problem is in Bleach so far. Sure, it took some time to reach the current storyline development. When we look back at Bleach's storyline as a whole, I am pretty sure that everything is going to fit in the puzzle.
3. Looking at Bleach over the years, I agree with Solace. It isn't that hard to understand the plot. It is just that the author, Kubo, hasn't given all of the puzzle pieces, yet.
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Old 2013-06-06, 13:11   Link #3430
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Well I'm not even mad over it just because of the state Naruto has gotten in right now, along with Fairy Tail. In their case its not an asspull by any means yet Bleach's stupidity is somehow more satisfying...
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Old 2013-06-06, 13:23   Link #3431
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I never knew a qunicy can become a zanpacktou ?
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Old 2013-06-06, 13:35   Link #3432
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so wait...Byakuya was actually right when he said that Tensa Zangetsu wasn't a Bankai, right?
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Old 2013-06-06, 13:42   Link #3433
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHollowIchigo View Post
Not quite sure why you put my post in your quote, if you can find the part where i actually say that it does not make any sense?

I am only asking if somebody know's i would highly apriciate it, nothing more, nothing less.

You however, jump to certain untrue conclusions.

So i will ask again..for the people that might know..or do know...

Can somebody explain me this....how in the world did the 1000 year younger version of Yhwach get into the soul of Ichigo and manifest himself as ichigo's zanpaktou?

While "Whitey" ...was Ichigo's original Zanpaktou.


Thank you
The point is, how about you give Kubo a chance to explain, rather than ask about something that we'll most likely get next week, and that no one knows about yet?
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Old 2013-06-06, 14:07   Link #3434
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
The point is, how about you give Kubo a chance to explain, rather than ask about something that we'll most likely get next week, and that no one knows about yet?
If people have idea's why not let them speak about it? Luckily there is freedom of speech ...right...or isn't there any where you live?

What you want might not be what others want, therefore you should not push your will over others, that sounds a bit dictatorial hmmm?

For you it might be a pointless thing to talk about...but who said this also would be for others? Or do you speak for all others as well...
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Old 2013-06-06, 14:40   Link #3435
GDiddy
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I was thinking....I wonder if Urahara realizes that Bach's a part of Ichigo all this time...
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Old 2013-06-06, 14:50   Link #3436
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He is Urahara. He knows everything.

Oh, and people come back here to rant every fucking week because they read every new chapter in the hopes that Kubo will provide some semblance of sense in this convoluted mess OR that Kubo will remember that he has a megaton of characters that have been stagnant for God knows how long. When he doesn't provide that, people rant.

Patience paid off in Naruto - Kishi gave the rest of Naruto's generation the kind of spotlight they deserved. Even if it was too late, it is still enough for some (like me). I'm sure Kubo can come up with something similar. But, until then, expect the rants. Most fans are not that hard to please. For eg. I'm pretty much ready to ignore everything if Yoruichi comes back and kicks ass, Kenny gets the best Bankai ever(or among the best) and Urahara keeps being Urahara. See, not that difficult. I would guess, most people here would probably drop the rants if their favorite character got the light of day in Bleach.
The rants are pretty much the only form of activity this sub-forum sees these days anyhow
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Old 2013-06-06, 14:55   Link #3437
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Oh, and people come back here to rant every fucking week because they read every new chapter in the hopes that Kubo will provide some semblance of sense in this convoluted mess
No we come back here because Bleach is a certain type of bad we like. =P
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Old 2013-06-06, 14:57   Link #3438
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Oh come on, let me have my delusions
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Old 2013-06-06, 15:03   Link #3439
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHollowIchigo View Post
Can somebody explain me this....how in the world did the 1000 year younger version of Yhwach get into the soul of Ichigo and manifest himself as ichigo's zanpaktou?

While "Whitey" ...was Ichigo's original Zanpaktou.
Bach is the original Quincy if I remember correctly...so a piece of him being w/ all Quincies isn't too far fetched.
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Old 2013-06-06, 15:15   Link #3440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
How about you guys give Kubo a chance to explain what's going on, before you say it doesn't make sense?

A few weeks ago, people were complaining about retcons when Isshin said Yhwach was involved in Masaki's death, and it turned out he was barely a part of it. Just give the guy a chance.
Because whatever explanation he gives will be so "out there", it'll likely only create more questions. Here's what we know, a quincy is able to pose as a zanpaktou spirit completely with everything that such a thing is able to do; inner world, visibility only to its "master", shikai/bankai, etc. The only thing that's been established that could explain such a possibility is the bankai stealing. There's been nothing else ever, in all of Bleach, that could explain this new twist. In other words, Kubo will have to reveal new things to appropriately explain this possibility and he'll have a lot to explain for this not to be contradicted; Mugetsu, Zanpaktou materialization during bankai training, red energy, etc.

Personally I'm not at all angry or frustrated, I'm very much amused by this development, but it is undoubtedly absurd.
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