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Old 2013-12-11, 22:28   Link #4661
saravis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
That's a really simplistic analogy that doesn't take compatibility between abilities into context.
This is Bleach we're talking about here, simplicity is appropriate, especially considering there are power levels of a sort.


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Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
Do you know what the masks do? They confer increased strength,speed and reiryoku. Rose isn't a direct type fighter like Kensei and Mask. What would be the point of challenging Mask to the type of fight he's best at? So that renders the increased strength and speed pointless.
Put on mask, go bankai, burn wrestler, attack wrestler while he's busy burning, hit him with new illusion if Wrestler shows signs of recovery, attack again. Even if Rose tells Wrestler his Bankai, he's giving him little time to throw together a counter. Aizen, again, for all of his arrogance, understood that if you hit an enemy with an illusion, you follow through. You don't just leave the enemy pondering the meaning of life.

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Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
You should reread the chapter. Rose clearly states that the illusions are the attack. If he hypnotizes a person into thinking they're burning, they will actually burn. That is the ability of Rose's bankai.
Fair enough, I'd still question the effectiveness of the Bankai alone, though. If after being engulfed in flame all that Wrestler is showing are some bare elbows and a six pack, then that isn't enough. Even if Rose hadn't told Wrestler about his Bankai, you expect Wrestler to just stand there and let Rose do as he pleases? He was going to attack eventually. Even with Rose being less capable in direct fight, his mask would have still helped if Wrestler made the attempt. Better to be better prepared than to hope the battle moves favorably.

Anyways, summarization: Rose, after seeing Kensei get beaten, should not have used the same level of power. He needed to step it up. If what you say is truly correct, that Rose cannot make use of his mask while in Bankai, then that sucks and his mask is useless. In which case, it would explain why he doesn't use it; he got screwed. Poor guy.

Last words are yours, if you like. Have fun.
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Old 2013-12-11, 22:52   Link #4662
Calca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saravis View Post
Doncha know, wrestlers know how to read lips. You expect them to be able to hear each other over their screaming fans.



Alright, here's an analogy for you as to what I'm talking about. Two friends are playing an RPG game. One is a mage, the other is a fighter and both are level 10. They come across a battle and the fighter says that he wants to take it. The fighter gets his ass handed to him and they both realize that being level 10 isn't going to be enough for that battle. It doesn't matter that the mage has different abilities, the abilities are of the same level and him attempting to fight at that level is going to result in the same failure. If either that fighter or mage wants to win that battle, they need to step it up.

As to it making no sense for Rose to use his mask, that makes no sense. He needs more power to win. If Kensei, at the level of power that he had, couldn't win, what hope could Rose have had, unless he stepped it up.

As to the illusions being the attack, if they actually had any offensive ability, they wouldn't be illusions now would they?
Think of it like the Matrix. When people get hurt in the Matrix they get hurt in real life right? The body makes it real.

Meanwhile, I wonder if Kubo is aware that there angry foreigners wondering why the hell these guys don't activate their hollow masks.
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Old 2013-12-11, 22:57   Link #4663
GDiddy
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Originally Posted by Calca View Post

Meanwhile, I wonder if Kubo is aware that there angry foreigners wondering why the hell these guys don't activate their hollow masks.
Someone's gotta die so Kubo can hype up Kenny/Ichigo/Renji
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Old 2013-12-11, 23:03   Link #4664
velvet nightmare
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Someone's gotta die so Kubo can hype up Kenny/Ichigo/Renji
semi bifurcation not enough?
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Old 2013-12-11, 23:29   Link #4665
solidguy
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The first rule of Bleach: who ever powers up first dies. Following this logic the Vizards were simply waiting for VR to go Vollstandig before whipping out their hollow masks
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Old 2013-12-12, 01:25   Link #4666
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saravis View Post
This is Bleach we're talking about here, simplicity is appropriate, especially considering there are power levels of a sort.
So why even bother arguing then?

Quote:
Put on mask, go bankai, burn wrestler, attack wrestler while he's busy burning, hit him with new illusion if Wrestler shows signs of recovery, attack again. Even if Rose tells Wrestler his Bankai, he's giving him little time to throw together a counter. Aizen, again, for all of his arrogance, understood that if you hit an enemy with an illusion, you follow through. You don't just leave the enemy pondering the meaning of life.
I repeat, did you notice the conductors baton Rose had in his hands? If he were to attack Mask mid bankai (which is still a bad idea, considering Kensei who's better than him at straight fighting got beat up and couldn't penetrate Mask's Blut Vene), then he would have to stop conducting, i.e. the effects would stop. Not really conducive to victory.

Quote:
Fair enough, I'd still question the effectiveness of the Bankai alone, though. If after being engulfed in flame all that Wrestler is showing are some bare elbows and a six pack, then that isn't enough. Even if Rose hadn't told Wrestler about his Bankai, you expect Wrestler to just stand there and let Rose do as he pleases? He was going to attack eventually. Even with Rose being less capable in direct fight, his mask would have still helped if Wrestler made the attempt. Better to be better prepared than to hope the battle moves favorably.
I repat: Rose's mask lasts 3 minutes. He cannot keep it on indefinitely. If he has to use it, he needs to save it for when he's absolutely sure it would do him some good.

Quote:
Anyways, summarization: Rose, after seeing Kensei get beaten, should not have used the same level of power. He needed to step it up. If what you say is truly correct, that Rose cannot make use of his mask while in Bankai, then that sucks and his mask is useless. In which case, it would explain why he doesn't use it; he got screwed. Poor guy.
Now you're getting it. Not everyone in Bleach is like Ichigo, Toushirou or Byakuya, whose Bankai can be used in pretty much any circumstance, or whose power fits their fighting style or personal preferences.

Some people are like Soifon, and get abilities that don't always work for them.
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Old 2013-12-12, 11:44   Link #4667
unameit
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Why nobody argues about the lame bankai? kensei bankai is useless if he can't land a hit and to make it worse, the last chapter show it's still useless even if he can land it..

rose bankai seemed can be countered easily but how many would willing to go deaf permanently? However his bankai is still lame because it's illusion that focusing to 'trick' the victim.. so if the victim is not tricked somehow then what good of that bankai?

As for bullshit theory not allowed to use hollow power, well yamamoto is dead, soul society is on the brink of extinction, ya think it's the time to worry about such stupid rule in such pinch time? Hitsugaya, soifon, doggy all used hollow power, no indication of taboo there..
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Old 2013-12-12, 12:34   Link #4668
itachi-san314
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i'm not saying superstar isn't deaf permanently, but we just saw him basically die and then get fully healed by his counterpart's cheers. so why can't his eardrums be healed too? they're just another body part.

but yea, it makes no sense that's he's already talking to renji. i'm also not saying any of this makes sense lol

oddly enough i kind of liked this chapter. i'm not sure why people like kensei and rose so much. they have always been sub-par good guys created for the sole purpose of getting beaten first so the top level good guys can look better. although the same could be said about renji of course. i think he'll beat superstar, but let's not forget that superstar is a sub-par shitritter created to make the top level shitritters look better. once renji wins, one of the better shitritters will appear and put him in his place
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Old 2013-12-12, 13:23   Link #4669
Enishi316
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This is so stupid....
Rojuro "Bankai"
Mask De "Oh No! how will I defeat him now?
Rojuro Don't worry, I'm going to tell you ever detail of my Bankai and even how to beat it.
Mask De " Oh thank you! it's no way in the world that could go wrong.

Even more better!

Renji Hello I'm Renji and somehow I will win this fight, were these 2 Captains couldn't.
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Old 2013-12-12, 13:25   Link #4670
GDB
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Originally Posted by Enishi316 View Post
Renji Hello I'm Renji and somehow I will win this fight, were these 2 Captains couldn't.
He'll win by not talking.
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Old 2013-12-12, 13:30   Link #4671
quigonkenny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
i'm not saying superstar isn't deaf permanently, but we just saw him basically die and then get fully healed by his counterpart's cheers. so why can't his eardrums be healed too? they're just another body part.
Little guy is no longer around, though, unless he's somehow back from the dead. Still, there's probably some ancient Quincy ability that uses reishi to construct new eardrums...

Quote:
Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
oddly enough i kind of liked this chapter. i'm not sure why people like kensei and rose so much. they have always been sub-par good guys created for the sole purpose of getting beaten first so the top level good guys can look better. although the same could be said about renji of course. i think he'll beat superstar, but let's not forget that superstar is a sub-par shitritter created to make the top level shitritters look better. once renji wins, one of the better shitritters will appear and put him in his place
It'll be the creepo that trollkilled Byakuya, who will of course be the one to show up and bail Renji out.
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Old 2013-12-12, 14:12   Link #4672
amaterasu4
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
He'll win by not talking.
He basically already won half of the battle. I mean the enemy is wounded and tired and Renji probably knows how his techniques work

If Renji doesn't win then he'll be the new Krillin
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Old 2013-12-12, 14:39   Link #4673
itachi-san314
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Originally Posted by amaterasu4 View Post
If Renji doesn't win then he'll be the new Krillin
beating superstar wouldn't put him above krillin. superstar is a horrible character who wasn't designed to be around very long. similar to barragan's embarrassing fraccion (although i do love that hisagi findor episode)
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Old 2013-12-12, 15:04   Link #4674
GDiddy
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Originally Posted by velvet nightmare View Post
semi bifurcation not enough?
Apparently not.

Keep Rose dead, Kubo. Actually with the exception of Soi, Shinji and Iba(all who had their VCs with them anyway), keep Hitsu, Matsu, Kensei and anyone else down dead.
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Old 2013-12-12, 16:13   Link #4675
quigonkenny
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Originally Posted by amaterasu4 View Post
He basically already won half of the battle. I mean the enemy is wounded and tired and Renji probably knows how his techniques work

If Renji doesn't win then he'll be the new Krillin
Renji is already the old Krillin, at least in Bleach. But even Krillin wins a battle now and again. As suggested earlier, Renji (or Rukia) will wipe out Mask fairly quickly (probably next chapter), only to get nailed by someone more dangerous.

Like I said, my money is on the guy who whacked Byakuya (before he got better), leading, of course, to Byakuya saving Renji's ass.

It's probably not the case, but it would be right up Byakuya's alley if he'd refused to use Urahara's "tasteless" method of taking back his Senbonzakura Kageyoshi, and instead taught himself how to defeat it, and Äs Nödt, while with the Zero Squad...
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Old 2013-12-12, 20:04   Link #4676
solidguy
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"Beam of a hero" .... and not a single arrow was fired
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Old 2013-12-13, 12:04   Link #4677
Mr. DJ
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Originally Posted by felix View Post
"Who are you?"

(as if he could hear the answer)

Only kubo can fuck up his plot on the same page.
To be fair, we didn't see Superstar's reaction to Renji's answer but...Kubo will probably screw it up :3
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Old 2013-12-13, 12:50   Link #4678
shalala
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"Beam of a hero" .... and not a single arrow was fired
He is a wrestler. Of course he not going to fire an arrow instead a beam would do. It's not like he is a quincy or anything like that is known for shooting stuff if their bow and arrows.

Rose's Bankai looked pretty cool and his face in one shot looked like he was going to kill someone. Which sure he did but it could have been better. I do hope Kubo isn't just showing off bankai's just for the sake of it.
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Old 2013-12-13, 12:53   Link #4679
GDB
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To be fair... Uryuu used a sword that was basically the same as an arrow. Using that logic, why not a forehead laser?
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Old 2013-12-13, 19:54   Link #4680
Mr. DJ
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we all can't get something as awesome as Love Love Tenkyoken ;D
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