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Old 2003-12-06, 17:17   Link #41
Mr. Bushido
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy
And I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you read manga for the story... granted, the previous conversation was about Love Hina, so I could be wrong.
just because u dont like a series doesnt mean u have to go on and tell ppl that they shouldnt like it either. You act like ure the almighty manga god and that if you dont like the series it must be stupid and crappy. Learn snoopy ppl are different, and NO one will listen to you if you think ure opinions are higher than others.

I personally liked Love Hina a lot the anime sucked, but the manga is well worth it. You can act like ure opinion and taste is the base for good anime, but love hina got the best USA release of 2002. Its also extremely popular.

everyone makes mistakes, and tokyopop did make a lot, but its a lot harder than you think. Do you speak japanese or any other foreign language fluently? Lot of the expressions, words, and "emotion" is extremely difficult to translate. I speak korean and i worked as an interpreter at church. Its hard to say certain things in english from korean, especially jokes. These ppl actually manage to do it with the story intact. so why dont you stop, and look at the GOOD points they have for a second instead of saying all the bad things like you tend to do in all of ur posts here. How the hell would u like it if everyone just said ur work is shitty all the time? Wat if you invented a invisible suit and all ppl are saying is "yea its kinda expensive, that sucks" or "i can do better" or "yea i can still notice u if i stare at you for a long time and listen to ur movements"
be more grateful, and if you dont like it, dont friggin buy it or read it. Thats all u have to do.
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Old 2003-12-06, 23:40   Link #42
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http://www.snoopycool.com <--- That's me.

And to me, my opinions ARE higher than everyone else's.
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Old 2003-12-07, 02:18   Link #43
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Tokyopoop titles are hit and miss. When they hit, they're good (Tokyopop pulls in some BIG licenses). When they miss, you get this urge to burn the graphic novel, no matter how darn cheap it was. Do your research before you buy one. The worst of their translations, hands down, goes to Sailor Moon. When it wasn't crappily Americanized, then the translations were so sloppy and inconsistant that a character's name would change in the middle of the book (and it would STILL be wrong!). Though Sailor Moon is very close to Initial D, and I probably only rank Sailor Moon higher due to my own bias. Initial D was completely crapped on. The sad part is that Initial D had an accurate first volume before they decided to Americanise the entire plotline. Miracle Girls is another crappy one - I'm not sure what's changed plot wise, but the most recent releases were even this year and they STILL changed the names of every single character to really stupid American names (Mikage and Tomomi are "Mika and Toni." Oh, and their boy toys are now "Chris and Jackson." BLEGH!).

What's sad is they are the only people bringing out popular shoujo titles and a good number of them are getting some of the sloppiest translations to boot.

I've heard Love Hina was censored. Anyone know a little more? I'm just getting into it myself and if it's been censored in any way, I'm not buying another one.

As far as sound effects are concerned, I actually hate having the Japanese effects in there with no translation provided. It gets really confusing to have gigantic sound effect phrases in a foreign langauge thrown at you unless you know what they stand for. Probably one of the best methods I've seen was in Comics One's Onegai Teacher release, where the sound effects were retained, but an English translation appeared right near them so they could be understood.
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Old 2003-12-07, 03:36   Link #44
Alcy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebochan
As far as sound effects are concerned, I actually hate having the Japanese effects in there with no translation provided. It gets really confusing to have gigantic sound effect phrases in a foreign langauge thrown at you unless you know what they stand for. Probably one of the best methods I've seen was in Comics One's Onegai Teacher release, where the sound effects were retained, but an English translation appeared right near them so they could be understood.

That sounds like a good method for them, since the US fanbase is so divided on the issue. However, I strongly recommend to any big fan of anime/manga to learn a bit of the language-it's a lot easier than most think(I've never even had a class) and can really improve your enjoyment of any series! (Plus untrans is far cheaper when it's available)
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Old 2003-12-07, 04:01   Link #45
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I've been working on Japanese myself, though that's another story. I know my hiragana and bits of katakana, but sadly, just because I know what the word says doesn't mean I know what it means I like the method of combining the best of both worlds so that the art is retained without losing comprehension.

I agree with you about manga prices. You guys think Tokyopop charging 9.99 for manga is cheap? Try 5.00 in Japan. Actually, it's usually cheaper than that! Though I believe they also use cheaper paper quality in a lot of them..
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Old 2003-12-07, 04:57   Link #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebochan
I've heard Love Hina was censored. Anyone know a little more? I'm just getting into it myself and if it's been censored in any way, I'm not buying another one.
I have no idea where you heard this from. I have a scanlation of the originals and all 14 volumes of the TP release. There is absolutly no censorship in the Tokyopop release, and it is even rated OT for ages 16+ to cover their butts for such a thing.
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Old 2003-12-07, 06:41   Link #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebochan
I've been working on Japanese myself, though that's another story. I know my hiragana and bits of katakana, but sadly, just because I know what the word says doesn't mean I know what it means I like the method of combining the best of both worlds so that the art is retained without losing comprehension.

I agree with you about manga prices. You guys think Tokyopop charging 9.99 for manga is cheap? Try 5.00 in Japan. Actually, it's usually cheaper than that! Though I believe they also use cheaper paper quality in a lot of them..
It's 6 euro for the french versions here and those are imported so 9,99dollar is absolutely not cheap. XD
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Old 2003-12-07, 07:02   Link #48
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The printing and paper quality in Japan for tankouban releases is equal to that of translated mangas. At least it is for the english ones that I've purchased, while some of the japanese ones are actually superior (I have yet to buy an English manga with color pages or a special foldout art page, for example). And they're like $6.50. And if you buy them used, you can usually find perfectly fine copies for around 2 bucks. And those are the prices in LA, it's cheaper in Japan.
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Old 2003-12-07, 07:02   Link #49
Rebochan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maveric
I have no idea where you heard this from. I have a scanlation of the originals and all 14 volumes of the TP release. There is absolutly no censorship in the Tokyopop release, and it is even rated OT for ages 16+ to cover their butts for such a thing.
I just heard it on a message board. I was actually pretty skeptical anyway, seeing how if they didn't censor Su flipping through Keitaro's porn magazines (and proudly displaying them to Naru!), I couldn't imagine they'd censor anything else. Still, seeing how Love Hina kept coming up, I figured it couldn't hurt to find out while the topic was fresh
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Old 2003-12-07, 17:31   Link #50
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As far as Japanese manga quality, yes, it is much higher. Examples:

-Almost all Japanese manga comes with a high-gloss slipcover (the kind you find on most hardcover books in the US)
-Cover art is always from the original artist (Tokyopop tends to rearrange bits of artwork for some series-Love Hina comes to mind, and Ironcat did a terrible disservice to the covers of Futaba-kun Change)
-Many series contain colour front pages/foldouts/other extras (first prints especially contain nice goods)
-You can see the artist's real handwriting in omake sections! (though, many of them aren't very legible XD;
-Printing errors much rarer (I have yet to encounter any myself)

Ooh, I don't know how many of you guys know about these, slightly OT, but I just found out they have manga kissaten over there! (Cafes with large shelves full of manga, paid by amount of time spent in the place!)
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Old 2003-12-07, 17:55   Link #51
snoopy
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Yeah, I've heard about the manga kissaten craze... but I don't live in Japan, so I can't say that I've ever been to one

And I've actually found a few mistakes in printed mangas before. Mostly inconsistencies with place names. But usually things like that are weeded out between the weekly release and the tankouban release (you see a substantial increase in stupid mistakes in the weeklies). Granted, that's nothing to the incredible ammount of spelling errors and the like in translated releases.
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Old 2003-12-07, 18:08   Link #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alcy
-Cover art is always from the original artist (Tokyopop tends to rearrange bits of artwork for some series-Love Hina comes to mind...)
They only did this to volume 1. All the rest are the same as the Japanese relase
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Old 2003-12-07, 19:49   Link #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alcy
First off, I prefer untrans manga in general as long as it has furigana (face it, no matter how good a translation job, something will always be lost to language.)
I've been thinking of picking up some as well. Do you have anything you've tried and which wasn't impossible hard? I've been taking Japanese for half a year now, so while I'm still a beginniner I know my way around hiragana and katakana (and about 150 Kanji). Unfortunately no stores around here has any Japanese manga, and if I order there's no way of checking for furigana beforehand.

Now personally I rather like Tokyopop. They are a bit cheaper than others (almost half the price of DH here in Sweden) and for that I can tolerate some misses. Besides I like that they don't flip it (why pay more money for getting less quality and just plain stupidity?) and that they often keep the onomatope ("sound" effects) in the original form and add translations. The best way I've seen it done was in the Swedish manga magazin "Manga Mania". They had the original katakana/hiragana and below the frame they had the hiragana/katakana, the romaji transliteration (very nice IMHO) and naturally a translation (or comment on what was ment, since translation is not always possible).
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Old 2003-12-07, 20:37   Link #54
Mr. Bushido
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy
Not really. It just gets hella repetitive. Suu makes new mecha turtles, Naru falls a little bit more for Keitaru then beats him down, they find something new in the inn, they go and discuss everything in the bath and start groping each other, they kill Keitaru for listening to said groping. It's all terribly repetitive. If you don't believe me, count the number of times Keitaro walks in on Naru taking a bath then gets punched across the water, then come back and say that you were shallow enough to enjoy it every single time.

The last 3 or so volumes were less repetitive, I'll give it that, but that's only in relation to the beginning, not in relation to the rest of the manga you'll find at the store.
srry, but i had to respond to this as well....

Every anime has a some sort of repetition in it. Even the ones that seem so great and complicated has a repeating pattern. Its one of the base of anime.

to explain better, ill use Naruto, which almost everyone likes, as an example and comparison to Love Hina.

Quote:
Suu makes new mecha turtles
in the entire manga u only see: mecha tamago 1, 3, 4, 30. 30 comes in for one frame and leaves. even if you count ALL of Suu's machine, less than 10 survive 1 frame.

Naruto gets a new trainer every time. Iruka, Kakashi, Ebisu, and Jiriya. Thats just as much as mecha tamas as u see in Love Hina.

Quote:
Naru falls a little bit more for Keitaru
this is the BASE storyline of Love Hina. Its not a surprise it happens every volume. I could easily say Naruto gets stronger every volume. Sasuke does too, and lot of the gennins.

Quote:
they find something new in the inn
like wat? the secret passage ways in 2 chapters??

Quote:
they go and discuss everything in the bath and start groping each other
i dont know why ure complaining.... ANyways. Discussion in the bath is also rare, and groping in the bath has occured ONCE. So where is the repetition?

Quote:
they kill Keitaru for listening to said groping. It's all terribly repetitive. If you don't believe me, count the number of times Keitaro walks in on Naru taking a bath then gets punched across the water, then come back and say that you were shallow enough to enjoy it every single time.
so u decide to call the "signature" of an anime repetitve? THats just the same as saying the following:

Pokemon: Ash always throws his pokeball and flips his hat....
One Piece: Luffy always stretches to defeat opponents.
Digimon: they always digivolve.
Full Metal Panic: Sosuke's always hit by a fan.
Furi Kuri: things always come out of Naota's head
Naruto: Naruto always uses kage bunshin.

i could go on, but i rather not.

i understand u dont like the series, but give reasonable examples of why u dont like it. U just stated one of the base structures of writing a series. I write too, and im planning on a professional career with it. Some anime may seem complicated, but if u look carefully all anime have some sort of repetition. Its just that some writers are better at covering it and making the viewers feel like a new thing every volume or eps. From the way u wrote that post up there it doesnt even seem like u read the manga, just watched the anime.


As for the japanese and tokyo pop thing::

Quote:
First off, I prefer untrans manga in general as long as it has furigana (face it, no matter how good a translation job, something will always be lost to language.)
tat is true. Unless ure translating from british english to american english

Love Hina was not censored, and.... except vol. 1 all covers are the same as the japanese ones.
TP is expensive.... its 9.99 in the US. Japanese mangas are around $1, even in Korea a manga is $3. (around: 120 yen, and 3600 won respectively)

France and Germany gets it rather cheap too.... USA is always getting screwed over with expensive shit. But can u blame japan? if i got nuked twice....
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Old 2003-12-07, 20:49   Link #55
Maveric
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoro
in the entire manga u only see: mecha tamago 1, 3, 4, 30. 30 comes in for one frame and leaves. even if you count ALL of Suu's machine, less than 10 survive 1 frame.
Psst... Look at volume 5, page 165 last panel. You see Mecha Tamago #2
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Old 2003-12-07, 21:01   Link #56
Mr. Bushido
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maveric
Psst... Look at volume 5, page 165 last panel. You see Mecha Tamago #2
eh another 1 framer... so wat?
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Old 2003-12-07, 21:53   Link #57
Alcy
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I've been thinking of picking up some as well. Do you have anything you've tried and which wasn't impossible hard? I've been taking Japanese for half a year now, so while I'm still a beginniner I know my way around hiragana and katakana (and about 150 Kanji). Unfortunately no stores around here has any Japanese manga, and if I order there's no way of checking for furigana beforehand.

Now personally I rather like Tokyopop. They are a bit cheaper than others (almost half the price of DH here in Sweden) and for that I can tolerate some misses. Besides I like that they don't flip it (why pay more money for getting less quality and just plain stupidity?) and that they often keep the onomatope ("sound" effects) in the original form and add translations. The best way I've seen it done was in the Swedish manga magazin "Manga Mania". They had the original katakana/hiragana and below the frame they had the hiragana/katakana, the romaji transliteration (very nice IMHO) and naturally a translation (or comment on what was ment, since translation is not always possible).

-----------------------------------

Most publishers do use furigana. Some I recommend:

Hanatoyume (tajjii majjii, teruteru x shounen)
Asuka DX (Angelique...my current favourite!)
Kodansha/Kodansha Friend/Betsukomi (Lots of stand-alones...one I found particularly easy was "Dreaming Doll" by Hanae Tachibana, though it's long out of print-also responsible for Sailor Moon)
FC(BOX Kei!, Minmin!)


As far as places that sell it, see if there's a Kinokuniya anywhere near you (http://www.kinokuniya.com), it's definitely the best chain located in the US. There are also many online stores, look around! (Sorry but I can't think of the URLs right now X_X;
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Old 2003-12-08, 03:00   Link #58
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Geh... those two posts were dripping with fanboi-ism... did you even look at them before posting? Where in the world should I begin?

I'll be blunt. I simply dislike manga with stupid characters and pointless love stories. I believe that I outgrew them before I ever started reading manga, actually (that would be when I was 16, btw). In the realm of shonen love stories, Love Hina is like the bastard child that I wake up to in the morning, slap around, then piss on, and it makes my day better. And people claiming to love it actually fuels that feeling.

Perhaps counting the scenes makes it seem less repetitive, but that's just a cop-out, my friend. If you read the 14 volumes in one sitting and say "Wow... they sure did <blank> a whole hell of a lot. It's like he ran out of ideas starting in chapter 2." Then you have a repetitive series. And the fact that the stuff between the fan-service was so mind-numbing made the repetition stand out all the more vividly (by comparison, most fighting mangas pull on the same things over and over, yet they're still entertaining... but Love Hina isn't a fighting manga... the 'story', as you so generously put it, is all it has).

If you want a love story for guys, read I"s or Video Girl Ai, or if you're up to it, read Ii Hito or SaiKano. If you want fan-service, then read Pretty Face or Ichigo 100%. If you want a half-assed blend of both with a little hint of pedophilia, read Love Hina.
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Old 2003-12-08, 03:40   Link #59
Mr. Bushido
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy
Geh... those two posts were dripping with fanboi-ism... did you even look at them before posting? Where in the world should I begin?

I'll be blunt. I simply dislike manga with stupid characters and pointless love stories. I believe that I outgrew them before I ever started reading manga, actually (that would be when I was 16, btw). In the realm of shonen love stories, Love Hina is like the bastard child that I wake up to in the morning, slap around, then piss on, and it makes my day better. And people claiming to love it actually fuels that feeling.

Perhaps counting the scenes makes it seem less repetitive, but that's just a cop-out, my friend. If you read the 14 volumes in one sitting and say "Wow... they sure did <blank> a whole hell of a lot. It's like he ran out of ideas starting in chapter 2." Then you have a repetitive series. And the fact that the stuff between the fan-service was so mind-numbing made the repetition stand out all the more vividly (by comparison, most fighting mangas pull on the same things over and over, yet they're still entertaining... but Love Hina isn't a fighting manga... the 'story', as you so generously put it, is all it has).

If you want a love story for guys, read I"s or Video Girl Ai, or if you're up to it, read Ii Hito or SaiKano. If you want fan-service, then read Pretty Face or Ichigo 100%. If you want a half-assed blend of both with a little hint of pedophilia, read Love Hina.
u call me a "fan-boy" but ur posts are nothing but "i dont like it so its stupid" like i said before, u think ur opinion is the base of what good manga is.

u still havent shown how its repetitive, which is ur only argument thus far of why this is a crappy series. All you said was: "if you read it all together then its repetitive" counting the scene makes it less repetitive cuz it ISNT so repetitive. (not more than any ohter anime anyways)


its YOUR opinion that its not entertaining, but thousands of ppl find it entertaining. Duh? Pointless? again ur opinion. Plus the only POINT in reading a manga is for self enjoyment, ure being verbiage over there with "its not entertaining, and its pointless"

Stupid characters... this is nothing but ure opinion, so i cant argue with u. We all have our opinions, maybe u should resepect other ppl's opinions for a change.

IF he ran out of ideas after volume 2: he couldve ended it there since thats when he takes the Tokyo U test for the frst time. u overexaggerate.

fighting mangas doing the samething over and over is not entertaining. But tats only my opinion.

Yes the anaology of u beating a bastard child and claiming that makes u feel better proves ure an moronic asshole. You have no difference from HItler who thinks what he belives in and thinks is the base of the world's thought. I dont care when u say u think the anime sucked and u didnt like it. But dont go on insulting ppl who like it, and ESPECIALLY DO NOT INSULT THE WRITER. Ive never been insulted for my work, but i know how it would feel. (bad essay scores is miniscule to it)

WHEN U MAKE A BETTER SERIES BY POPULAR OPINION NOT OF COUPLE OF INDIVIDUAL PPL, THAN START INSULTING US "FANBOYS" AND THE AUTHOR.
till than go beat ur wife and kids like the asshole u are.
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Old 2003-12-08, 03:48   Link #60
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Hm.. Love Hina to me.. is like one of the many soaps on tv. x)
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