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Old 2012-10-28, 13:15   Link #1881
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willx View Post
I think Dr. Casey is just surprised at the amount of negative feelings expressed on this thread about Romney. There's a difference between respecting both candidates and favouring one and hating on one candidate and supporting the other.

He seems to support one of them and respect both of them. Seems reasonable. You're all Americans after all. You are all citizens in a democratic process electing your chosen representative.
It gets difficult to retain respect for someone who has surrounded himself with some of the most misogynist religious extremists the US can muster. He himself might be a "nice guy" but the people he will be beholden to should concern the hell out of anyone who cares about the females in their life.

That's one of the few actual differences between the two candidates.
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Old 2012-10-28, 13:47   Link #1882
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
I realize that won't sit well with some of you, but like William J. Cooper once said "when you tell the truth, you piss everybody off."
I tend to do that.
Why wouldn't it sit well with me? Frankly I outright gave up on America caring about what is or isn't true after the first debate. Style over substance is what I keep hearing.
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Old 2012-10-28, 14:48   Link #1883
Green²
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Oh and BTW, Candy Crowley admitted that she was wrong and Romney was right in the debate. Let's not muck that up with disinfo. Here she is admitting it herself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=athcyCTnTTs
Candy Crowley was incorrect in that post debate correction. Obama did imply that within the speech at Rose Garden the day after the attack. And that is how I understood it as he told us the day after that attack. Many seemed to have failed to pick up at the point that begins with:
"...And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi.

As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe.

No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for..."
Or maybe because he doesn't say the word, "terrorist", some probably thought that "Acts of terror" probably meant that democratic policies have now begun to decend upon Benghazi, or something.
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Old 2012-10-28, 15:05   Link #1884
GundamFan0083
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Like Candy said, it's like arguing over what the meaning of "is" is.
Did the Obama administration screw up in Benghazi?
Yes.
Does it matter as much as the Republicans are making it out to be?
Not when compared to the Iraq war and those ever elusive WMDs, no.
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Old 2012-10-28, 22:02   Link #1885
ganbaru
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Close race makes up for waning zeal in expat vote
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...89R04A20121028

A question, could the ''Frankenstorm'' end up causing problem for the voting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
It gets difficult to retain respect for someone who has surrounded himself with some of the most misogynist religious extremists the US can muster. He himself might be a "nice guy" but the people he will be beholden to should concern the hell out of anyone who cares about the females in their life.
I would say than the masive amount of crap and lies he said could also be considered a good reason. A good example:
Quote:
As you may have heard, Romney on Thursday scared the bejeezus out of Ohio autoworkers when, during a rally, he cited a story claiming that Chrysler was moving Jeep production to China. Thousands of people work at a sprawling Jeep complex in Toledo and a nearby machining plant. Many thousands more work for suppliers or have jobs otherwise dependent on the Jeep factories. It’s fair to say that they owe their jobs to President Obama, who in 2009 rescued Chrysler and General Motors from likely liquidation. If Chrysler moved the plants overseas, most of those people would be out of work.

The story turns out to be wrong. As Chrysler made clear the very next day, in a tartly worded blog post on the company website, officials have discussed opening plants in China in order to meet rising demand for vehicles there. They have no plans to downsize or shutter plants in the U.S. On the contrary, Fiat, the Italian company that acquired Chrysler during the rescue, just spent $1.7 billion to expand Jeep production in the U.S. That includes $500 million to renovate and expand the Toledo facilities, with 1,000 new factory jobs likely to follow. On Monday, about the same number of people will report for their first day of work in Detroit, when Chrysler adds a third shift to a Jeep plant it operates there.
http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/109256...ama-gm-rescue#
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Old 2012-10-28, 23:30   Link #1886
willx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
I would say than the masive amount of crap and lies he said could also be considered a good reason. A good example:

http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/109256...ama-gm-rescue#
Election rhetoric, lies and exaggerations make me want to cry. That's why I think everyone should go to: FactCheck.org

http://factcheck.org/2012/09/obamas-stump-speech/
http://factcheck.org/2012/09/romneys-stump-speech/
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Old 2012-10-28, 23:54   Link #1887
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Aye, at this point - if people aren't using Factcheck.org (and a couple of others), then I consider them pretty much less-than-informed when they're swinging their claims around. Oddly enough - this doesn't turn out to be a equal critique. One side is considerably deeper inside a reality distortion bubble than the other.
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Old 2012-10-29, 01:42   Link #1888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willx View Post
Election rhetoric, lies and exaggerations make me want to cry. That's why I think everyone should go to: FactCheck.org

http://factcheck.org/2012/09/obamas-stump-speech/
http://factcheck.org/2012/09/romneys-stump-speech/
FactCheck isn't perfect though, so I'd be wary of holding it up as a gospel of truth. But as a reference, it's a good place to start when trying to ascertain how much of what someone says is factual or not.
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Old 2012-10-29, 06:49   Link #1889
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^True enough about having to occasionally factcheck the factcheckers. I personally prefer factcheck.org over politifact, because the latter can get screwy with its "truth meter".
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Old 2012-10-29, 07:27   Link #1890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post

It seems to be all negative all the time. It that what the nation deserves?
I have a feeling you already know the answer to this question
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Old 2012-10-29, 10:52   Link #1891
Netto Azure
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Sometimes I disagree with the fact checkers due to the difference in which the statement is viewed through policy preferences.

For example the statement about "vouchering Medicare" the counter argument was that it's the same premium support system under Obamacare, but it doesn't take into account that seniors live under a fixed income and are past their prime-income producing times and therefore would be burdened by even more cost under such a system.
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Old 2012-10-29, 13:54   Link #1892
ganbaru
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Obama Is Even in TV Ad Race Despite PACs
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/29/us...pite-pacs.html
Quote:
But Mr. Obama has been helped by a structural advantage, stemming from differences in the ways he, Mr. Romney and their allies have built their war chests. Both men are on track to raise $1 billion along with their parties this election cycle, with much of the money budgeted for advertising. And when the super PACs are included, the final tally will include hundreds of millions of dollars more, most of that benefiting Republicans. Mr. Romney has raised a much larger proportion of his money to date for the Republican National Committee.

But Mr. Obama and the Democrats, buoyed by millions of small donors, have raised a vast majority of his cash directly for his campaign committee, which under federal law is entitled to preferential ad rates over political parties and super PACs.

On the Republican side, super PAC spending has been a far greater necessity because of the Romney campaign’s cash shortages over the summer. More than half of pro-Romney advertising spending to date has come from super PACs, which sometimes pay double and triple what candidates pay for TV time.
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Old 2012-10-29, 15:21   Link #1893
Vexx
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Interesting phenomenon of social media - the number of people (relatives, friends,etc) no longer speaking to each other over this election or worse, shriek-raging at relatives and friends at toxic levels. I don't know that anyone is doing the numbers, but I'm certainly seeing a fair share of it - both directly and indirectly

Like I told my aunt and uncle (who are catching hell from people they thought were lifelong friends), you're just finding out that these people were always like this but the thin veneer is gone. They're racists or extreme zealots and mean-spirited, possibly to the core.
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Old 2012-10-29, 16:53   Link #1894
Anh_Minh
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So, after the elections... Will everything be forgotten?
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Old 2012-10-29, 16:59   Link #1895
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
So, after the elections... Will everything be forgotten?
Definitely not, especially if Romney loses.
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Old 2012-10-29, 17:00   Link #1896
ganbaru
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Probably not, or at least it will take a lot of time.
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Old 2012-10-29, 18:08   Link #1897
Vexx
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Romney Land in regard to the medical needs of the peasants ...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2008710.html

A significant part of the US jobs are uninsured service sector. The ramifications of medical bankruptcy, impact on people who are able to get insurance, the inequity of distribution, etc. bleh.
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Old 2012-10-29, 18:37   Link #1898
Ithekro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
So, after the elections... Will everything be forgotten?
Everything of what?
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Old 2012-10-29, 19:14   Link #1899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xacual View Post
Definitely not, especially if Romney loses.
Read the Newspaper today(Might be a day or so old) and found it interesting that a test on racism was done. Turns out that racism against blacks and Hispanics, subconsciously, has gone up since the last election even for those that don't believe they're actually racist. They talked about it maybe costing Obama some votes but there was also an increase in blacks being bias to Obama as well. It isn't as large as the bias against Obama because he's black but it almost evened out the difference.

In the test they offered obvious questions for racism which lead to far more Republicans than Democrats having racist tendencies against blacks. Another test was than done, where they weren't outright asked obvious questions about possible racism(One part involved a white, black, Hispanic, and than a random Chinese guy at the very end than they were asked about the Chinese guy flashing on a screen or something.), it revealed that the % between Republicans and Democrats had evened up mostly with Republicans only edging out by around only 10% more(While the first test had them at a far wider margin and Democrats only sitting at around 20%).

Kinda interesting that they're so close in that regard but mostly Republicans are the ones slapped with the racist card even if they aren't being racist.(It was only a little over half of Republicans in the tests were identified as having racist tendencies while Democrats hovered in the 45%-46% area).

FYI, I'm Independent but I'm all for Obama against Romney so this is just my observation.
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Old 2012-10-29, 20:15   Link #1900
Mr. DJ
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Saw plenty of racism before Obama was even elected, it's saddening really, especially when parents laugh because their child says something racist like it was cute.
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