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Old 2013-04-16, 11:55   Link #81
GDB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness View Post
I never understood the concept that the Zombie is the perfect soldier or superhuman.
Assuming you can force them to obey you, they explained it in Fullmetal Alchemist. They cannot die, they do not sleep, they have no consciousness or morals, and they obey every command. Thus, the "perfect soldier". If you assume infection/classic zombie, then they also turn your fallen enemies into a larger army for you, as well.

The super human part comes from the idea of the mind implementing limiters on the body to keep it from destroying itself, which no longer function after turning.
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Old 2013-04-16, 12:47   Link #82
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Assuming you can force them to obey you, they explained it in Fullmetal Alchemist. They cannot die, they do not sleep, they have no consciousness or morals, and they obey every command. Thus, the "perfect soldier". If you assume infection/classic zombie, then they also turn your fallen enemies into a larger army for you, as well.
Yes, but I don't think even the zombies in Full Metal Alchemist got the whole "tool use" thing down. Zombies limited to melee attacks aren't exactly all that useful when you're fighting battles with tank and artillery divisions. Heck. Not even zombies capable of using small arms sound like they'd be THAT dramatically useful compared to all the effort you need to go through to manufacture/control zombie armies.
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Old 2013-04-16, 13:46   Link #83
LeoXiao
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
To be fair, just in terms of readily available military and strategic resources, America is more or less the top in all possible lists. America may have fallen far in terms of nearly every other aspect of modern life that actually matters, but as a military institute the ol' US of A is king of the hill.
It's too bad that these zombie stories always assume that tough individualist survivalists will do better than better-trained and better-armed militaries. The battle of Yonkers was a joke, if that had happened in real life the zombies would have been completely routed.
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Old 2013-04-16, 13:57   Link #84
Dhomochevsky
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The problem with most zombie stories is that they do not explain how there came to be so many zombies in the first place.

Sure, if there are zombies everywhere, they are dangerous.
But if there are only a few zombies in the beginning, how does it spread?
They will get stuck in buildings. They will get stuck in walled gardens. Inside cars. They attack the nearest target without any kind of sneakiness, most likely in broad daylight and in front of several people filming with phones and such.
Word about the zombies should spread much faster than the zombie desease itself. People can easily run away from a single zombie.
That kind of desease, which requires to bite someone for transmission and has such a low incubation time could never spread.
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Old 2013-04-16, 14:37   Link #85
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Basically.

They go by the Rule of Dumb.

Everyone is too incompetent and dumb to stop it when it starts despite how easy it would be and someone ALWAYS breaks the containment zones for no reason. That and mobies have it one always breaks out somehow to infect an entire city despite being them dumb and being hounded by highly coordinated and skilled military forces.
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Old 2013-04-16, 14:40   Link #86
Kyero Fox
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Don't forget the stupid kids who need a super huge spanking and black eye for going into the NO GO HERE zone's to find mommy crap.
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Old 2013-04-16, 14:48   Link #87
Roger Rambo
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The best zombie origin setup for a zombie apoc is the Left 4 Dead universe. The zombie virus spread occasionally as airborne, with carriers who couldn't turn but could spread the virus running around and causing havoc. Standard combat oriented survival techniques and responses were insufficient, as any number of perfectly healthy survivors and refugees could turn out to be carriers.

Most of the human population had turned into zombies without even being bitten, and long before heavily mutated zombies started appearing.
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Old 2013-04-16, 15:44   Link #88
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Originally Posted by Kyero Fox View Post
Don't forget the stupid kids who need a super huge spanking and black eye for going into the NO GO HERE zone's to find mommy crap.
Which always results in one or a couple of people dying as they go to save the dumb kid and the kid is never punished for it.
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Old 2013-04-16, 16:47   Link #89
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by Destined_Fate View Post
Which always results in one or a couple of people dying as they go to save the dumb kid and the kid is never punished for it.
This does seem to be a strapping of post Apoc fiction that refuses to remember that it's post apoc fiction.

I recall there was this one part of that TV show falling sky, where this 10 year old boy nearly got a group of human resistance fighters killed (the boy was one of the resistance fighters) because he ran out of concealment when one of the alien robot mechs almost killed the dog they sent out as a decoy. The group barely escaped getting killed. Considering this was set 6 months after the aliens wiped out 90% of the human race...I found it preposterous that none of the survivors whooped that kids ass.


Though that's to be expected, since Spielberg was involved with it.
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Old 2013-04-16, 16:55   Link #90
Kyero Fox
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I was referencing the 28 weeks later movie. When the kids go out of the safe zone for some dumb shit from their house and bring back super infected carrier mamma and all breaks loose.
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Old 2013-04-16, 19:00   Link #91
LeoXiao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
The best zombie origin setup for a zombie apoc is the Left 4 Dead universe. The zombie virus spread occasionally as airborne, with carriers who couldn't turn but could spread the virus running around and causing havoc. Standard combat oriented survival techniques and responses were insufficient, as any number of perfectly healthy survivors and refugees could turn out to be carriers.

Most of the human population had turned into zombies without even being bitten, and long before heavily mutated zombies started appearing.
That's the kind of scenario I find easiest to take seriously, and also the most bleak for the same reason.
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Old 2013-04-17, 17:40   Link #92
Destined_Fate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
This does seem to be a strapping of post Apoc fiction that refuses to remember that it's post apoc fiction.

I recall there was this one part of that TV show falling sky, where this 10 year old boy nearly got a group of human resistance fighters killed (the boy was one of the resistance fighters) because he ran out of concealment when one of the alien robot mechs almost killed the dog they sent out as a decoy. The group barely escaped getting killed. Considering this was set 6 months after the aliens wiped out 90% of the human race...I found it preposterous that none of the survivors whooped that kids ass.


Though that's to be expected, since Spielberg was involved with it.
I don't understand why they feel the need to add in kids into Zombie movies and than make them dumb as heck while they never paying for it when they screw up. At least Walking Dead has kids get killed when they become dumb and adults actually talk about just ditching the very dumb ones, kid or adult, if they compromise the safety of everyone else.
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Old 2013-04-17, 18:12   Link #93
james0246
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^Instinctively we want to protect children (and some animals), so putting them in harms way in a horror film is a fast and easy way of creating thrills. Sadly, too often the kids end up doing something so stupid that the audience just wants them to die anyway...
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Old 2013-04-17, 18:14   Link #94
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
^Instinctively we want to protect children (and some animals), so putting them in harms way in a horror film is a fast and easy way of creating thrills. Sadly, too often the kids end up doing something so stupid that the audience just wants them to die anyway...
Could someone please explain to me that one scene in Jurassic park where the kids were trapped in the car with the T-rex, and for some reason, instead of hiding on the car floor, the girl decides to shine a flashlight right in the T-rexes face?

Could ANYBODY figure out why she did that?
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Old 2013-04-17, 19:34   Link #95
Kyero Fox
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Quote:
Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
^Instinctively we want to protect children (and some animals), so putting them in harms way in a horror film is a fast and easy way of creating thrills. Sadly, too often the kids end up doing something so stupid that the audience just wants them to die anyway...
AKA - Zombie Movie child behavior.. be DUUPID! XD
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Old 2013-04-17, 19:45   Link #96
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Originally Posted by LeoXiao View Post
It's too bad that these zombie stories always assume that tough individualist survivalists will do better than better-trained and better-armed militaries. The battle of Yonkers was a joke, if that had happened in real life the zombies would have been completely routed.
To be very fair, the book did state that the result of Yonkers was due to a lack on ammo on the side of the army. That and them underestimating the size of the Z army. (the line stretching all the way back to NY)
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Old 2013-04-17, 20:29   Link #97
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by JokerD View Post
To be very fair, the book did state that the result of Yonkers was due to a lack on ammo on the side of the army. That and them underestimating the size of the Z army. (the line stretching all the way back to NY)
Which is in and of itself kinda odd, since the US military is rather characterized by its ability to move huge quantities of ammunition all over the world. Yet in this one instance it can't move stuff in its own backyard. It seems somewhat odd overall (There's also the silliness that the Air Force could ever be not arrogant enough to not demand that they get to bomb the zeds coming out of New York first).


As for underestimating the size of the zombie horde...that kinda brings to question HOW the zombies managed to infect that many people in New York. You can kinda understand with infinite stamina runner zombies, but it seems a bit questionable when it comes to shamblers. Lets be honest people. HOW many people can a shambler be realistically expected to bite before the cops show up and shoot it? Maybe a couple if it gets lucky early on before everyone is aware of zombies being a threat? Those aren't the kind of reproductive odds that beat the eventual law enforcement crackdown when the NYPD all start donning riot gear and go on a zombie extermination spree.
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Old 2013-04-17, 21:03   Link #98
Destined_Fate
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I understand that, I just don't understand why they feel the end to make kids dumb and get people killed. It makes me wish that someone the group would just take the kid around back and put them down already for the good of the group.

It also brings into question why the military didn't use their expensive equipment, jets, planes, satellites, and the such to gather better info.
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Old 2013-04-18, 00:20   Link #99
Seitsuki
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When adults do stupid shit they die. Eventually, there are none left. Kids are reusable!
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Old 2013-04-18, 05:39   Link #100
JokerD
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Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Which is in and of itself kinda odd, since the US military is rather characterized by its ability to move huge quantities of ammunition all over the world. Yet in this one instance it can't move stuff in its own backyard. It seems somewhat odd overall (There's also the silliness that the Air Force could ever be not arrogant enough to not demand that they get to bomb the zeds coming out of New York first).


As for underestimating the size of the zombie horde...that kinda brings to question HOW the zombies managed to infect that many people in New York. You can kinda understand with infinite stamina runner zombies, but it seems a bit questionable when it comes to shamblers. Lets be honest people. HOW many people can a shambler be realistically expected to bite before the cops show up and shoot it? Maybe a couple if it gets lucky early on before everyone is aware of zombies being a threat? Those aren't the kind of reproductive odds that beat the eventual law enforcement crackdown when the NYPD all start donning riot gear and go on a zombie extermination spree.
Maybe not so much enough in inventory but didn't bring enough? The MLRS only had 2 reloads (or something) while they used tanks with HEAT ammo (talk about using a shotgun to kill a fly) To kill that amount of people they would most likely need a truck per soldier...

As for the horde, I'm guess some of those people are those trapped in highways trying to get out or those thinking eating the in-universe medicine will help them

I'm curious how they would portray it in the movies, like Resident Evil style or something epic like LOTR
(I'm not holding my breath though...)
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