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Old 2013-10-05, 17:34   Link #101
MartianMage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Byakou View Post
Depends on the mmo. On the mmo I play mob attacks have a minimum value, so for instance regardless if your defense is 100 or 500, mob X will always hit at least 75. If your defense is lower than 100, then it goes up exponentially. A single mob could never take you down but a horde will.
I've played an MMO like this too(RF Online) but thing is even with a raised minimum damage capped players would still have no problem tanking minimum damage.

Well like I mentioned earlier... not really a complaint but it's just funny that they look like they're fighting a serious battle when they are 3 lvl90s against 8 or so lvl27s
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Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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Old 2013-10-05, 17:52   Link #102
Byakou
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I did a little experiment. On said mmo I have a lvl 120 character. I got into a fight with 6 lvl 40 mobs. My HP is 1450, after a minute not doing anything my HP was 800. Another minute and my HP was 500. At which point I started fighting back and I finished the fight with 250 HP. Almost died basically lol. But I do realize that the mmo I play is atypical in the sense that low lvl mobs seriously can kill you.
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:04   Link #103
MartianMage
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Well yeah they could but as you have mentioned it's not even your typical MMO and even then you have to go through the extra effort(or rather in this case no effort at all lmao) to even get close to dying.

The idea of a character fighting mobs that are grossly underleveled and having trouble winning is just... well silly
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Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:10   Link #104
Byakou
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Yep but who says elder tale has to be typical? From a story perspective, it's probably a lot more interesting that every mob has the capacity to kill them. Although now that they've figured out that they need to instinctively use spells, I don't reckon that'll happen again.
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:17   Link #105
Utena
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
I've played an MMO like this too(RF Online) but thing is even with a raised minimum damage capped players would still have no problem tanking minimum damage.

Well like I mentioned earlier... not really a complaint but it's just funny that they look like they're fighting a serious battle when they are 3 lvl90s against 8 or so lvl27s
I've played RF Online too, and in one of the latest updates they have introduced a new system of calculating damage, so a lot of low-level mobs could really kill a high-level character (of course, not very quickly, but still...). Sorry, it would be rather long to explain the mechanic, but believe me, it's not that rare in MMO ^^

If people think this scene in first ep was unrealistic, they just had't played hardcore MMO
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:28   Link #106
MartianMage
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Originally Posted by Utena View Post
I've played RF Online too, and in one of the latest updates they have introduced a new system of calculating damage, so a lot of low-level mobs could really kill a high-level character (of course, not very quickly, but still...). Sorry, it would be rather long to explain the mechanic, but believe me, it's not that rare in MMO ^^

If people think this scene in first ep was unrealistic, they just had't played hardcore MMO
Like I said... unless you go through the extra effort of dying low level mobs just ain't gonna pose a serious problem to capped players. The part that is silly is the fact that three lvl90s are having a hard time against 8 lvl27s.

And believe me, I've played a lot of MMOs, Korean ones to boot(and I can't recall any MMO I played that I didn't cap), I can't even recall the exact number of MMOs I've played anymore.
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Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:50   Link #107
Utena
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
And believe me, I've played a lot of MMOs, Korean ones to boot(and I can't recall any MMO I played that I didn't cap), I can't even recall the exact number of MMOs I've played anymore.
Just joking ^^

What's more important, this scene is made to show the difference between playing MMO and living in such a world that have became real. If I get into MMO which I've never played before and which is totally different from everything I've ever experienced... I guess I would be confused too >_>
And at the end of the battle, when characters learn how to use controls, they kill the mobs easily.
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:52   Link #108
RobotCat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
Like I said... unless you go through the extra effort of dying low level mobs just ain't gonna pose a serious problem to capped players. The part that is silly is the fact that three lvl90s are having a hard time against 8 lvl27s.

And believe me, I've played a lot of MMOs, Korean ones to boot(and I can't recall any MMO I played that I didn't cap), I can't even recall the exact number of MMOs I've played anymore.
They only had a hard time at first because they didn't know how to use their skills (they were trying to fumble around with menus). Once they did they pretty much 1-shotted the critters.
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Old 2013-10-05, 18:56   Link #109
MartianMage
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It's more like an error in presentation for me really. The way they presented the scene makes it look like those low level mobs were an actual threat.
__________________
Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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Old 2013-10-05, 19:10   Link #110
Marcus H.
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Not really a complaint but from an MMO player's point of view I kind of find it silly how a bunch of lvl90 characters are having trouble against mobs that are more than 60 levels lower than them. Unaccustomed to new controls? lol if I logged out my capped char on a nub spot with aggro monsters and login back and for some reason my hotkey setup were all reset I can prolly setup my hotkeys while tanking nub mobs.
In RAN Online, characters can be easily killed by mobs half your level, even on one on one.

Anyway, I'm playing a similar class as Shiroe on Dragon Nest (a caster, basically, but with some additional tankiness due to belonging to the most tanky base class of six). And as someone who has played a lot of online games, I completely understand his gripes about joining a guild filled with unknown people.

A solid start for Log Horizon. 8/10.
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Old 2013-10-05, 21:25   Link #111
Kakkou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
It's more like an error in presentation for me really. The way they presented the scene makes it look like those low level mobs were an actual threat.
We were never shown their HP bars though, so for all we know they've been taking very little damage in the first place, except they were struggling because besides adapting to the controls, they're still unaccustomed to being physically in the game where there's a huge difference between shrugging off your character being attacked by a low level monster and having said monster gnarling a few inches from your face. Even if you took like, 5 damage from each attack you'd still be going "Oh shit!" and panicking when the now very realistic and dangerous looking claw/whip/fangs/whatever is headed towards you. It's not understandable to suddenly panic and forget you're in a game when up until now your body knows that if something like that were to hit you IRL, you'd be in a lot of trouble, if not dead.

There's also the matter of physically feeling the impact of the attacks, so even if it as Shiroe noted, didn't really hurt that much, you'd still recoil from being hit by a laser or being smacked by something large.
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Old 2013-10-05, 21:28   Link #112
Master_Yoma
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Well anther anime where people get trapped in a mmo but at less there Akatsuki a loli ninja

Weird there starting at lvl90
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Old 2013-10-05, 21:33   Link #113
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Originally Posted by Master_Yoma View Post

Weird there starting at lvl90
not really, the MC group are all veterans of the game. they have been playing a long time.
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Old 2013-10-05, 21:59   Link #114
jeroz
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I heard from somewhere that it's an error from the anime team to put in more tension. They were barely scratched at all supposedly. Then again, there's a possibility that he was trapped for a long time before being rescued and the anime just do a time skip

I shall file it under bug report.

Also I don't get the harem thing people suggested. Atm only Akatsuki is even remotely interested in the guy
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Old 2013-10-05, 22:47   Link #115
hamazura
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so basically, shiro and co have played this elder tale stuff for 2 years and suddenly there was an virtual reality update and they are trapped now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Utena View Post
I've played RF Online too, and in one of the latest updates they have introduced a new system of calculating damage, so a lot of low-level mobs could really kill a high-level character (of course, not very quickly, but still...). Sorry, it would be rather long to explain the mechanic, but believe me, it's not that rare in MMO ^^

If people think this scene in first ep was unrealistic, they just had't played hardcore MMO
well, in rf, my lv.50 mercenary can easily tank 10+ lv.47 (assasin builder) to help my race-mate to def/block PT farming...
but yeah, in return of dat defense, my atk super sucks

well, almost all mmorpg allow midlv mobs to kill high level, such as ragnarok, rf,seal,luna,perfect world, etc etc if the user doesnt play as knight type job (warrior/knight/paladin/etcetc) which has high defense.
thats why we have something called "party", without that, only paladin-type could solo mobs which lvls are equal to us (but yeah, paladin attack sucks, so time consuming)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
Like I said... unless you go through the extra effort of dying low level mobs just ain't gonna pose a serious problem to capped players. The part that is silly is the fact that three lvl90s are having a hard time against 8 lvl27s.

And believe me, I've played a lot of MMOs, Korean ones to boot(and I can't recall any MMO I played that I didn't cap), I can't even recall the exact number of MMOs I've played anymore.
korean mmo so (super) popular in my country, i've played tons of them too, theres no one in school who didnt play online game in my country (except those anti-social )

nope, they beat those lvl28 shit super easily as soon as they understood the system
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Old 2013-10-05, 22:52   Link #116
Xacual
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Originally Posted by hamazura View Post
so basically, shiro and co have played this elder tale stuff for 2 years and suddenly there was an virtual reality update and they are trapped now?
If I understand it right, Elder Tale is an old, but popular MMO. Naotsugu quit playing two years ago but came back to try the new expansion. For some reason everyone after logging into their account to download the new update lost consciousness and next thing they knew they were in the game.

It was a keyboard and mouse MMO.
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Old 2013-10-05, 22:54   Link #117
Random Wanderer
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Originally Posted by hamazura View Post
so basically, shiro and co have played this elder tale stuff for 2 years and suddenly there was an virtual reality update and they are trapped now?
Not a virtual reality update, just a regular expansion. It's as if everyone who was playing World of Warcraft when Cataclysm or Mists of Pandaria came out were suddenly transported inside the game the instant the expansion went live. You can tell that this wasn't a virtual reality game, because of how nobody is used to the way their bodies move in that world, or how to fight properly there, or any of that.

We don't know how they ended up pulled inside the game. Right now let's say a wizard did it.
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Old 2013-10-05, 22:56   Link #118
hamazura
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Originally Posted by Xacual View Post
If I understand it right, Elder Tale is an old, but popular MMO. Naotsugu quit playing two years ago but came back to try the new expansion. For some reason everyone after logging into their account to download the new update lost consciousness and next thing they knew they were in the game.

It was a keyboard and mouse MMO.
so shirou and co already lvl.90 / 99cap from 2 years ago? and now 2 years later, they're still in lvl.90? lol noobs
maybe they didnt know a quest to unlock exp stuck? (like in rf, we must kill 50(?) hum baba to gain exp again so we could reach lv.51 and so on)
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Old 2013-10-05, 22:58   Link #119
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Level 90 is the cap. That's as high as it gets. Unless the cap was raised with the expansion, there is no way for them to level any higher.
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Old 2013-10-05, 23:08   Link #120
Feng Lengshun
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^ Actually, I think it was just raised to lv 100 with the new expansion.
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