AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Current Series > Psycho-Pass

Notices

View Poll Results: Psycho-Pass - Episode 22 [END] Rating
Perfect 10 29 26.85%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 31 28.70%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 23 21.30%
7 out of 10 : Good 11 10.19%
6 out of 10 : Average 7 6.48%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 2.78%
4 out of 10 : Poor 2 1.85%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 0.93%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 0.93%
Voters: 108. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2013-03-22, 17:27   Link #121
creb
Hiding Under Your Bed
 
 
Join Date: May 2008
The scene surprised me, but I'd hardly argue it shouldn't have been included. I've never understood the idea in both visual and print media that things should be stripped down to only what's necessary. Why not have things just for flavor?

It certainly spawned a lot of responses, which is hardly a bad thing.

Then again, I went into that scene, seeing as it came on the tail end of them wondering about Kogami, thinking that magnificent bastard did manage to bag the "hot blonde", so it was less about a lesbian scene, and more of a "haha" moment when it turned out to be Yayoi.
creb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 17:36   Link #122
NoemiChan
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philippines
Age: 27
Send a message via Yahoo to NoemiChan Send a message via Skype™ to NoemiChan
Quote:
Originally Posted by creb View Post
Then again, I went into that scene, seeing as it came on the tail end of them wondering about Kogami, thinking that magnificent bastard did manage to bag the "hot blonde", so it was less about a lesbian scene, and more of a "haha" moment when it turned out to be Yayoi.
Man's rod are dirty.....
NoemiChan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 17:40   Link #123
jwai
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Age: 28
I don't know about you guys, but Shion and Yayoi having their own residence sounds like an improvement over making out in the computer room.

Judging from the empty unused office space in the ending credits, I imagine Enforcers now have more leeway with where they can go instead of being confined to quarters all the time?
__________________
Some people are alive simply because it's illegal to kill them.
jwai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 17:53   Link #124
Quadratic
SIBYL salesman
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I once made a reply to Quadratic where I listed off many of those flaws, but unfortunately I wasn't able to find that post.
Was it this one? It wasn't a reply to me, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
The system has way, way more faults than that.

1) People are treated like criminals even if they've committed no crimes.

2) There's no judiciary system. If you happen to have a bad Psycho-Pass reading one day, you go directly to jail or get killed. You don't get to speak out in your own defense in any meaningful way. You don't get your day in court. Should you go to jail, you're very likely to be there for the rest of your life (heavily implied during the Yayoi flashback episode).

3) The average human lifespan is declining in the world of Psycho-Pass, and this is due to the numbing effect of the Sibyl system. This was brought up during the Oryo arc.

4) Censorship, also brought up during the Oryo arc. The works of Oryo's father were banned. Then there's "authorized music", which should make anybody who values the arts simply cringe.

5) Much of the above would at least be theoretically defensible if Sybil really was purely mechanical based. At least then it really would be objective. But no, Sybil is a collective of 250 brains making life and death decisions for every citizen in the world of Psycho-Pass. And a good case can be made that these brains are probably a bunch of sociopaths or psychopaths. It shouldn't be necessary to explain the serious dangers inherent in a setup like this.


The Sybil system is a totalitarian oligarchy who's net effect on the Japanese people is quite possibly to their detriment. A strong case can be made that the Japan of Psycho-Pass would be better off being like the Japan of today.

If Akane tears down Sibyl, and replaces it with a proper judiciary system, is that really something you would take issue with? Personally, I would cheer it. Loudly.
Quadratic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 17:59   Link #125
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by JiCi View Post
Their relationship could have been better shown throughout the series... and the scene could have been longer. However, that feels forced and somehow censored. We have gotten people that got shot, stabbed, decapitated, mutilated, strangled and such in rather detailled images, as blood was aplenty... but seeing 2 ladies in a bed had to be covered. After seeing "statues" made of naked mutilated underaged schoolgirl bodies, would it really have mattered?

What I mean by "forced" is that, well, since we haven't got enough girl-girl action, they somehow had to add that in one scene. Honestly, that could have been better shown. Just have a good 5 minutes of Yayoi and Shion talking on their appartment's patio about the future of Unit One and end the conversation with a hug and a passionate kiss would have worked nicely. Right now though, it feels forced, like I said.
That sounds a bit too couple-y for me. I never got that vibe from them. They seem to generally not care about anything much (which also addresses the complaint about the contrast with their lack of reaction to the changes), including each other. To them, sex seems more like a hobby, like Masaoka's painting.
Anh_Minh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 18:11   Link #126
NoemiChan
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philippines
Age: 27
Send a message via Yahoo to NoemiChan Send a message via Skype™ to NoemiChan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
That sounds a bit too couple-y for me. I never got that vibe from them. They seem to generally not care about anything much (which also addresses the complaint about the contrast with their lack of reaction to the changes), including each other. To them, sex seems more like a hobby, like Masaoka's painting.
LOls, playmates? That's another possibility..
NoemiChan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 18:12   Link #127
Dengar
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 30
I liked the ending. It's not a ZOMGawesome ending. But for me it just fits into the narrative. Everything that happened leading up to this point.

Endings like this, how it continues is for us, the viewer, to decide.

Personally I'd like to think that Akane's got it right here.

I mean, I understand that Sibyl seems to think the correct course of action is to study Akane and to figure out a way to change the public into one that accepts them, but somewhere along the process, the world itself might evolve enough so that it no longer needs the Sibyl system.
Dengar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 19:46   Link #128
Chiaki_chan
Kubo GO TO HELL
 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: with Maki-sama
Age: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
That sounds a bit too couple-y for me. I never got that vibe from them. They seem to generally not care about anything much (which also addresses the complaint about the contrast with their lack of reaction to the changes), including each other. To them, sex seems more like a hobby, like Masaoka's painting.
My god...... yayoi and Shion is just sex-friends"!!!



...


I think
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic211239_32.gif
Chiaki_chan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 20:02   Link #129
Reckoner
Bittersweet Distractor
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 23
Very solid ending with a major implication of a next season.

Honestly, everything about this ending heavily implies a second season. Sibyl wasn't toppled, and it would have been silly if the "good guys" did it (There is no indication that any of them were going to do that and would be extremely OOC). Akanes ends the series with a bold statement of "sibyl has no future," and shows her disapproval of it, so her struggle is not yet over. Kogami completed his mission, but escaped alive so clearly there's more story to tell with him (What now for him that he's rogue?). The series even ends with a freaking "Sibyl continues..."

So why in the world were people expecting so much closure here? The obvious intention of this episode was to conclude the immediate conflict while allowing a possible continuation in the future. If they never come back and make more of this series, then yes, that's disappointing... But the fact of the matter is that they were in no position to create a reasonable, logical ending in which Sibyl is destroyed in one episode. That would have been the most terrible ending imaginable.

People commenting that this show ended up meaningless are honestly out of their minds. Just because you hated Sibyl does not mean we have to see it toppled. The government in 1984 wasn't toppled, and that was an even more literal "looping back to the start" in terms of character and story. Did it change the commentary that the government in 1984 is bad? Heck no! And it doesn't change Gen's commentary here on Sibyl either.

The fact of the matter is that we were presented with 2 main perspectives in this episode. Makishima as always, is a champion of free will and believes that life loses its meaning and enjoyment under Sibyl, but his actions were morally reprehensible and destructive to society. He has to be dealt with in some way. Akane believes that people are there to protect the law and the law is not there to protect them. Kogami obviously feels differently as he took matters into his own hands.

But who is right and who is wrong? Akane made the more sound, logical choice. She isn't going to topple an entire society and send it into chaos. She realizes that society depends on the order of law setup by Sibyl. But is it really worth standing for? Makishima didn't think so, and perhaps Kogami doesn't either, but Kogami understands that Makishima cannot be let to run free. Kogami believes in justice, but not necessarily Sibyl's justice. He perceived his actions as wrong and felt that he needed to be judged, whether or not the law allowed him to do so. The law isn't serving the people for Kogami.

No matter which person you look from, they all felt Sibyl was bad. The message could not be any clearer. The only difference is in how each character thinks they should deal with it. The series never set itself up for a complete resolution of the Sibyl System, and its implications of more to come could not be any more clear. For what they were aiming for, the ending could not be anymore solid IMO.

-----


As an aside, the directing of Makishima's death scene was absolutely breath taking. Felt truly cinematic and had some awesome cinematography. Perfect BGM too. Great villain, and he will be missed, in a twisted way of course.
Reckoner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 20:06   Link #130
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 26
I think the ending was a bit weak myself. While there isn't anything truly objectionable, there isn't much closure either.

Generally, the series fizzled a bit in it's second half, generally because it didn't have the world-building of the first half. I think this series is an example of a somewhat common Anime phenomena "A great setting in want of a plot". The central plot isn't as compelling as it's setting.

Unfortunately, I can't think of any easy way to improve it, but they may have been better off if they had made it a tragedy of some kind. Break Akane and have her fall. Have everyone in the show get a bad Psychopass and be implacably eliminated by Sibyl.

Makishima was an inferior antagonist as well, as if you think about it, most of the really vile acts we see in the first half are more associated with the "criminal of the week" then with Makishima himself. The only villainous act we can really associate with Makishima is the cold blooded murder of Akane's friend, which comes a bit too late.

The other alternative would have been to retain the "monster of the week" format of the first half, which also would have worked fairly well. One of the compelling elements of the first half was that it got you cheering for what amounted to the in-world equivalent of a Totalitarian Secret Police force. They could have still retained Makishima, but have given him a more concrete shorter arc of his own, and maybe filled the rest of the series with more backstory a la episode 12. They could have had the final act be the Helmet arc, and had Makishima die there, maybe in the Sibyl control room.

Makishima, for his part, wasn't a great villain because he was a bit too cold. Now having a cold manner is fine, but the other villains were more compelling because they had real vices, while Makishima didn't seem to have any. A natural fit for Makishima would have been Pride.
DonQuigleone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 20:09   Link #131
NoemiChan
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philippines
Age: 27
Send a message via Yahoo to NoemiChan Send a message via Skype™ to NoemiChan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiaki_chan View Post
My god...... yayoi and Shion is just sex-friends"!!!



...


I think
Come to think of it... No risk of pregnancy
NoemiChan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 20:38   Link #132
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
People commenting that this show ended up meaningless are honestly out of their minds. Just because you hated Sibyl does not mean we have to see it toppled.
I didn't have to see Sibyl toppled. I could have taken it if Akane had rebelled and lost (well... maybe not. Sibyl is so weak, I can't help but wonder how it held out this long.)

I could have taken it if Sibyl had been destroyed, but the ensuing chaos left it doubtful it was a good idea.

But to see her just... bowing to the psychpaths' self-serving logic and delude herself into thinking things will get better if she just waits around doing nothing? There's no way I'm going to find that satisfying.
Anh_Minh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 21:23   Link #133
JiCi
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montréal - Québec - Canada
Age: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
That sounds a bit too couple-y for me. I never got that vibe from them. They seem to generally not care about anything much (which also addresses the complaint about the contrast with their lack of reaction to the changes), including each other. To them, sex seems more like a hobby, like Masaoka's painting.
"It seems"... but is it really...?

Either make it subtle with hugs and soft kisses here and there, or make it obvious by modifying the scene in this episode. Sure you can have both ladies in the appartment, same lighting, have Shion on her back and Yayoi on top of her in the missionary position, both naked, have the camera travels from their toes to their heads, without sheets, light or shadows to cover their bodies, and have them kiss passionately as if they just finish having one torrid moment off-screen. Then have them discuss a bit about Division 1 for 5 minutes while remaining tucked to each other. That would make their relationship obvious to the viewer.

However, as erotic as it gets, that'll come out as awkward, gratuitous and misplaced. Why? Because that wasn't explained throughout the series. We didn't get a kiss here and there, we didn't see flirts from either of them, we didn't get a scene both women are making out, be in a bedroom or in their office and have a phone call or even someone else to disrupt them; y'know, have Akane pushing the door and stumbled on them kissing wildly and have all 3 (or both Akane and Yayoi only) get all embarrassed.

Right now, the scene at the end comes out as "oh yeah, here's a little reward for watching our show"... but it also shows that the writers didn't touch the subject much. Then again, that wasn't part of the core idea, but there wasn't something that could have stop the writers from developping it.

That's why I think that they should have made the relationship between Shion and Yayoi subtle at the beginning and then slowly makng it obvious and concrete. It might sound too couple-y... but why not have it that way? If sex is their "drug" or hobby to escape the horrors they see everyday, why not put a little more emphasis on that? Shion might like it, while Yayoi might be reluncant about it, because of her past relationship with Rina. That could have been develop into an addiction, not into a love affair until the end of the series. Hell, when was the last time Yayoi smiled back at Shion again?

Their relationship isn't genuine, that's what people would say about it. It's forced, tacked on, phoned in and shoved at the last minute. It could have been better developped throughout the series as a secondary character-specific point. Shion's a latent criminal turned scientist, Yayoi's an officier, and apparently, they love each other. Where's the play on that using their past? The series would still focus on Shinya and Akane, the main characters, but they could have developped the secondary characters in a better way, and that includes Yayoi, Shion and their love affair... and THEN the scene at the end would make sense.

I'm not trying to remove or to add sexual content to the series, I'm just trying to come out with a way to better justify its use... or come out with a way to remove it if it comes out as unnecessary.
JiCi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 21:37   Link #134
NoemiChan
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philippines
Age: 27
Send a message via Yahoo to NoemiChan Send a message via Skype™ to NoemiChan
I think I only saw them twice together.... I never seen them talking intimately.. All we got was them "ONE HELL OF AN AFTER SEX SHOW"
NoemiChan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 22:02   Link #135
Chiaki_chan
Kubo GO TO HELL
 
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: with Maki-sama
Age: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by JiCi View Post
"It seems"... but is it really...?

Either make it subtle with hugs and soft kisses here and there, or make it obvious by modifying the scene in this episode. Sure you can have both ladies in the appartment, same lighting, have Shion on her back and Yayoi on top of her in the missionary position, both naked, have the camera travels from their toes to their heads, without sheets, light or shadows to cover their bodies, and have them kiss passionately as if they just finish having one torrid moment off-screen. Then have them discuss a bit about Division 1 for 5 minutes while remaining tucked to each other. That would make their relationship obvious to the viewer.

However, as erotic as it gets, that'll come out as awkward, gratuitous and misplaced. Why? Because that wasn't explained throughout the series. We didn't get a kiss here and there, we didn't see flirts from either of them, we didn't get a scene both women are making out, be in a bedroom or in their office and have a phone call or even someone else to disrupt them; y'know, have Akane pushing the door and stumbled on them kissing wildly and have all 3 (or both Akane and Yayoi only) get all embarrassed.

Right now, the scene at the end comes out as "oh yeah, here's a little reward for watching our show"... but it also shows that the writers didn't touch the subject much. Then again, that wasn't part of the core idea, but there wasn't something that could have stop the writers from developping it.

That's why I think that they should have made the relationship between Shion and Yayoi subtle at the beginning and then slowly makng it obvious and concrete. It might sound too couple-y... but why not have it that way? If sex is their "drug" or hobby to escape the horrors they see everyday, why not put a little more emphasis on that? Shion might like it, while Yayoi might be reluncant about it, because of her past relationship with Rina. That could have been develop into an addiction, not into a love affair until the end of the series. Hell, when was the last time Yayoi smiled back at Shion again?

Their relationship isn't genuine, that's what people would say about it. It's forced, tacked on, phoned in and shoved at the last minute. It could have been better developped throughout the series as a secondary character-specific point. Shion's a latent criminal turned scientist, Yayoi's an officier, and apparently, they love each other. Where's the play on that using their past? The series would still focus on Shinya and Akane, the main characters, but they could have developped the secondary characters in a better way, and that includes Yayoi, Shion and their love affair... and THEN the scene at the end would make sense.

I'm not trying to remove or to add sexual content to the series, I'm just trying to come out with a way to better justify its use... or come out with a way to remove it if it comes out as unnecessary.
I agree with you, you said great, well done!
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic211239_32.gif
Chiaki_chan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 22:05   Link #136
kitten320
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Age: 24
Sorry to break it to you guys but that's how life is... a big circle!

Everything in life goes around and this series tried to be down to earth as much as possible. Ending fits.

I would prefer more but it doesn't change the fact that it is a pretty fitting ending.

Besides new comer already went through trauma, her best friend was turned into a living sculpture.


Yaoi/Shion suddenly kissing would be even more out of place considering that we never really had these type of scenes here. It was all about implications.

And what could be a bigger implication and confirmation than having 2 of them naked in bed?
It fits with the whole series setting and cancels all possible denials.


The only problem is that both of them were pushed to the side for biggest part of the series and didn't get explored enough but then again so was Kagari. The only real thing we got from him was his little outburst at Akane at the start of the series.
Psycho-Pass focused on story and not characters just like Madoka Magica. I would never guess that Mami and Kyoko used to be friends if not manga/Drama-CD.

That's one of the minuses. As much as I like story driven series, characters are also important but Psycho-Pass only focused on Akane/Kagami/Makishima and a bit on Ginoza.
Everyone else were pretty much non-existent with Yaoi getting the shortest end of the stick.
__________________
kitten320 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 22:28   Link #137
Reckoner
Bittersweet Distractor
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
But to see her just... bowing to the psychpaths' self-serving logic and delude herself into thinking things will get better if she just waits around doing nothing? There's no way I'm going to find that satisfying.
When did she bow to them? She flat out proclaimed they have no future . That doesn't seem like someone who is bowing down. No she isn't going to destroy them, but why in the world would she ever risk the safety of society at large? That would be completely out of character, and nonsensical. Yes, she's going to bide her time and struggle to find a solution to the problem. But she's not going to do it like Makishima, and she's not going to go down the same path as Kogami.
Reckoner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 22:34   Link #138
kakakka
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by JiCi View Post
"It seems"... but is it really...? *snip*
Fan-service aside, does it really need to show romantic hints and scenes just to explain them coming off from doing it? The blonde seemed to like to do it even without romantic connections, even offering her service to Kogami. Is it wrong to think that the two ladies was shown in scene just because they like doing it? I know it's immoral to some, but it's not far from the possibility.
kakakka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 22:52   Link #139
fict_ticious
I can has drinks?
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
*cough!*Kaname Madoka*cough!*
Sayaka was the one who represented the old hero archetype/altruistic one in this. In all the series timelines and in any of the extended media she always gets a bad end.
fict_ticious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-03-22, 23:30   Link #140
Merctrin
Immi
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Age: 22
One of my first thoughts after seeing this episode was pretty much, "Aha! That was why Yayoi got an episode! So we might care about her being the sole original Enforcer left in the end!"

...That from someone who is actually very fond of both her and her relationship with Shion.

I think this series could have made much, much better use of its cast. Kagari was basically around just long enough to make an impression in the early episodes so that he could die and have it make an impact, but they wouldn't have to put consistent effort into including him.

And a similar thing happened with Yayoi, though much more dramatically. She got a full episode to flesh her out, and then was basically discarded until her comments on Akane's behavior last episode.

It's too late at night for me to want to go back and be detailed about this, but really, there were moments all over the series, for every member of the cast, where it felt like, "Here, have this. Do you care about them now? Do you?"

Those moments weren't really as obvious with the characters that got more focus. Still, things like Kogami and Makishima's relationship never rang true to me because they felt more manufactured than natural. Intellectually, the conflict and series as a whole was satisfying, but there was more stuff that felt like a means to an end than I usually tolerate for characterization.

As for Shion and Yayoi's scene at the end... It didn't feel tacked on to me. They needed to show where all the surviving members of the original team were, and Ginoza and Akane were off having a subplot. Shion and Yayoi honestly didn't get enough development for it to be worth showing them in separate scenes handling the aftermath of The Plot, but at the same time, they're named characters that are alive at the end, so getting actual dialogue in the final episode is nice.

And I think it's appropriate that their final scene made their relationship clear. While I don't doubt for a second that side-relationships have been handled better, since the second episode I've been watching with the awareness that Shion and Yayoi are involved in some kind of sexual relationship.

From that point of view, I think the early hints would have felt tacked on without any direct confirmation. "See these two side characters? They might be having sex, but we're never going to mention it." Without having some kind of clarification at the end, it's just a dropped plot line.

...Though I will admit that being a yuri fan, I am well-versed in locating subtext (and considering how many lines they each got, there's kind of a ton), so maybe no one else would have noticed that.

Eh, to me it wasn't any more bothersome than a dozen other character-based problems I have with the show, and I was wondering if it would ever be brought up again, so it felt about par for the course.

I gave this episode 10/10 because of the pacing. As an individual episode, it was a very tight, sensible experience, and it fit whatever vague philosophical thoughts I had about how things should be handled in the end.
__________________
Merctrin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:54.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.