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Old 2013-03-28, 17:14   Link #241
Sansker
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Again, how that even matters? The power scale in this show was always confusing at best.
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Old 2013-03-28, 17:23   Link #242
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Considering Nanoha used Blaster-1 in a televised match with Signum and again during a team battle in ViVid ...both during her ordered rest time it seems we can assume it's pretty safely xDU
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Old 2013-03-28, 17:52   Link #243
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Again, I just blame Shari...

Who knows? Maybe they were able to tone down the effects just enough that it's no longer dangerously forbidden...

Maybe it's more like benching your max weight instead of going over it for a long period of time?

And, confusing, what's confusing?

It's not like Bleach, Sansker.
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Old 2013-03-28, 17:55   Link #244
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Fortunately, as far as Nanoha Franchise flaws go, still hasn't reached Bleach-levels of sillyness xD
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:14   Link #245
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
Fortunately, as far as Nanoha Franchise flaws go, still hasn't reached Bleach-levels of sillyness xD
It would have to reach YYH power level scaling first. Still hasn't done THAT yet.
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:37   Link #246
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Bleach is another complete different thing but as far as power levels go I think Nanoha is worse because Bleach doesn't have a scale, it just goes with high, higher, really high, and you get the idea how is going by now high, etc.
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:42   Link #247
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Sansker, what ARE you talking about with no scale?

*Ahem*

Captain
Vice-Captain
3rd seat
4th seat
5th seat
etc.

Not to mention the data books which showed Unohana, without her Zanpaktu, was around the same level as Aizen during Soul Society.

Then you have Hollows
Menos Grande
Adjudjas
Vasto Lordes

Vizordes
Arrancar

The Quincy...

ETC.

Yeah, no scale there, huh?

Besides, Ichigo's power level was constantly in flux, by the end of Soul society he shouldn't have even NEEDED the mask to do anything.

So, no, Nanoha is NOT worse than Bleach, despite your bias and assumptions.
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:54   Link #248
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That is an order of ranks and species, not a power level scale with numbers.

Nanoha has this scale with letters and I say is confusing because we see characters with similar ranks be completely different and then characters with inferior ranks pull out moves of characters with superior ranks. So, no, I still say that Nanoha is a little confusing on its overall power scale.
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:57   Link #249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sansker View Post
That is an order of ranks and species, not a power level scale with numbers.
I've lost count how many times they went "that's vice-captain level of power!" or something along those lines.

And Nanoha has always been consistent on their theme that while ranks equal raw power, raw power does not make one invincible and skill will always trump power.
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Old 2013-03-28, 18:58   Link #250
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What's confusing?

The only one confusing is you.

If you're that confused...

There's the manga.

It's not confusing at all.

Lower powered mages and knights can gather and use their magic faster for things than stronger level mages and knights can.

It's why Hayate has trouble in close range combat because most of her spells are "field nukes" that take time to charge up.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:00   Link #251
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Because the plot already made clear the power scale of the TSAB is very unreliable. Signum who is a rank lower than Nanoha managed to give her a decent fight. Erio also got to take down Fate despite being several ranks below her.

Vita who is likely the strongest average fighter (the highest ranked of the non "S" ranked) has got her butt handed to her practically once per season xDU

Fate constantly dances between being the weakest of the aces or the freaking strongest member of the cast, currently in FORCE she certainly seems to be at top condition as so far she has the gratest feats among the Section Six members (the FIRST member of the cast able to lay a finger on Curren Huckebein ladies and gentlemen!).

So yeah, Nanoha Franchise's power scale seems to be pretty inconsistent and all over the place xD!
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:00   Link #252
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Tbfh, I'm glad Nanoverse doesn't have straight numbers. It'd just limit the the potential battles in the plot. It also makes far more sense to use ranks and it depends more on, like kero said, skills and current battle conditions.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:00   Link #253
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Yes, they do say that, but that is rather just an assumption they never really put numbers on that so talking about “captain power level” or something like that is a really odd comment that I don’t consider as important because it doesn’t mean anything.

Now with Nanoha I mean the scale is confusing. Which it is. Not that power is everything.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:02   Link #254
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How is Nanoha's power scaling confusing?

I'm confused that you're confused.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:10   Link #255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
Because the plot already made clear the power scale of the TSAB is very unreliable. Signum who is a rank lower than Nanoha managed to give her a decent fight. Erio also got to take down Fate despite being several ranks below her.

Vita who is likely the strongest average fighter (the highest ranked of the non "S" ranked) has got her butt handed to her practically once per season xDU

Fate constantly dances between being the weakest of the aces or the freaking strongest member of the cast, currently in FORCE she certainly seems to be at top condition as so far she has the gratest feats among the Section Six members (the FIRST member of the cast able to lay a finger on Curren Huckebein ladies and gentlemen!).

So yeah, Nanoha Franchise's power scale seems to be pretty inconsistent and all over the place xD!
Lemme point something out...

Hayate: Caro, in terms of power, would be A rank, but because of her experience, she'll be officially ranked A+

Don't forget that Hayate commented that she couldn't win against Caro during training (who was between C and A rank then) if Caro got in close to her.

Not to mention the old woman who fought a mock battle against both Nanoha and Fate, the 9 year old AAA+ ranked mages got their butts handed to them by a 60+ year old woman who used a basic device and was only AA ranked.

Rankings only really determine what kinds of missions you can go on, what kinds of spells you can handle, and some other things I can't recall off the top of my head.

As commented on by Nanoha in StrikerS to both Subaru and Teana, that, despite them being officially C rank, it would hurt their progress if they were stuck with C rank missions, so that's why Nanoha was going to help them pass the B rank test ASAP.

Remember, in A's? Chrono's a AAA ranked mage and he used Stinger Blade on Zafira, (A rank Guardian Beast) that did nothing.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:14   Link #256
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Talking about confusion then.

In any case is rather simple. The scale is use the measure raw power level but also as a rank system. Like Subaru and Teana taking an exam to be Rank B. Now you have B power level or you don’t have B power level, there is no way around it. How is an exam that measures skill is going to prove you have certain power level when is say inferior ranks can pull similar actions as superior ranks? So the scale was use to measure overall skill or raw power, but if is use for both then is confusing. Do I get B skill rank but S power level or maybe the other way around?

Also using the same scale with spells. So if I am a B rank how can I shoot a AA spell? I mean my power is B, so I can shoot B level spells because if I can use AA then my rank should be AA or that means I need to be AA skill to use the spell but I can be C rank power wise? Yes kind of confusing. And even if we can explain it that doesn’t mean is a little tricky to get it when it should not be that way. All that I am saying.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:15   Link #257
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I also remember Signum commenting something during the StrikerS manga along the lines of "us, the four captains, are so close in power that we could fight several matches and get different results each time". I don't know if that's still true in FORCE, though.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:20   Link #258
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I'm still confused that you're confused.

It's not confusing, at all.

Go re-watch StrikerS, okay?

Remember that Variable Bullet Tea fired?

That's an A rank spell.

See the difficulty she had firing it?

Just because you're at a lower rank doesn't mean you can't use a higher ranked spell, it just means you won't be able to do it as well as someone who's at a higher level.

See Crossfire Shoot versions of Nanoha (restricted to AA) and Teana (under A). Nanoha could do it with one finger, Teana needed her device to do it.

It's only confusing if you try to make it confusing.

So, yes, Teana could fire an A rank spell just after getting to B rank, does that make her A rank?

No! She doesn't have the ability, skill, experience or mana to be at that level.

Sansker, if a B rank mage can only fire one AA rank spell, that does NOT put them at AA rank. Compare to someone like Nanoha who can fire AA rank spells without much problem because she's an S rank.

I don't see the problem you're having.

Quote:
How is an exam that measures skill is going to prove you have certain power level when is say inferior ranks can pull similar actions as superior ranks?
Because, as I said, it affects what missions you get and spells you can use. Just because you've got power doesn't mean that you're going to be able to use it properly, you know?
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:30   Link #259
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I still think is a bit confusing.
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Old 2013-03-28, 19:36   Link #260
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Lemme give you a comparison to real life then...

Let's say a pitcher in baseball can, on average, throw a fastball at about 89 mph. Sometimes he'll hit around 100. But only on occasion.

You have another pitcher who can throw a fastball at 93 mph and only tops out at 96 mph.

Yet, despite the fact that the first one can, once in awhile, throw a faster fast ball, he's rated as having a slower fastball than the other guy.

Or, if you go strength wise here...

You have someone who can, at max, bench around 600 lbs when really motivated and/or fresh, but tends to average around 250 while someone who averages at 400 maxes out at 500 more constantly.

Who would be rated with a higher strength? 250 who can hit to 600 in certain circumstances or the guy who can do 400 and max out at 500?

Or if you want some martial arts here...

a 6th dan black belt vs a 7th dan black belt, both using different martial arts styles.

When it comes down to it, the 7th dan black belt is ranked higher, but the 6th dan black belt can beat him cleanly despite being lower ranked, depending on the styles and techniques used.
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