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Old 2013-05-01, 22:08   Link #41
Funkatron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
One possibility is that Chamber was deliberately programmed with insufficient data to locate Earth. Think about it from a commander's / Powers That Be perspective. You're sending a computer into battle against an enemy who wants to massacre your species. Are you going to program that computer -- which could be captured by the enemy -- with information on how to locate the home world? Would you let your pilot who's not even a full citizen in your culture know where to find the home world? What I'm suggesting is that Ledo may have been lied to by the Alliance and Chamber has been programmed to support that lie.
In other words, they have a Cole Protocol

In the "Halo" universe, all UNSC ships have standing orders to wipe all nav data when facing capture to prevent the Covenant from reaching Earth.
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Old 2013-05-02, 06:41   Link #42
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The Covenant threat, I can understand them hacking data out of the UNSC's ship computers.

The Hideauze, however, is still an uncertainty for me, because we haven't seen what it is they are. Are they intergalactic creatures that has no need for air to survive? Are they like a hive or colony, receiving orders from some Big Bad? Are the ships retaliating against the human attack automated or housing pilots? Automated attack vessels... huh, reminds me of Vandread.

The most important question, though, is whether or not they are computer-literate. Or a good enough substitute that they are able to decode encrypted data from chips that houses AI like Chamber.
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Old 2013-05-02, 07:45   Link #43
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Originally Posted by lightbringer View Post
I stand corrected, they really can sink. Even if the area in question is quite small. Thanks for that link! But I wonder what happened to the material it displaced... must've gone up somewhere else then?
It should work more or less like what happens when glaciers melt, all the water that is concentrated at high altitude in a localized point will melt and equally distribute to the whole surface of the planet.

So basically if all the land were to sink below the water level, the tectonic plates would be shaved of excessive materials (oceanic crust is thinner than continental crust) which would join the magma and the diameter of our planet would probably enlarge of a few millimeters or even less...

Naturally this is extremely unlikely to happen, and you'd probably need some kind of purely speculative phenomenon.

One realistic scenario for the earth to turn into a water planet would be the case of a major catastrophe that would turn our planet into a ball of magma and all the water into vapor. Then the surface of the planet would equalize due to gravitational forces and in a few million of years a new crust would form and water would cool down covering an almost perfectly even surface...

Obviously that's not what happened in this anime...
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Old 2013-05-03, 16:19   Link #44
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Originally Posted by JamJackEvo View Post
The Covenant threat, I can understand them hacking data out of the UNSC's ship computers.

The Hideauze, however, is still an uncertainty for me, because we haven't seen what it is they are. Are they intergalactic creatures that has no need for air to survive? Are they like a hive or colony, receiving orders from some Big Bad? Are the ships retaliating against the human attack automated or housing pilots? Automated attack vessels... huh, reminds me of Vandread.

The most important question, though, is whether or not they are computer-literate. Or a good enough substitute that they are able to decode encrypted data from chips that houses AI like Chamber.
If Gen is getting his inspiration from Starship Troopers, then it could be a scenario where the Alliance thought the Hakeuze was dumb until they proved otherwise. In the movie version of ST, the bugs were thought to be stupid until the humans realized there were brain bugs which could both coordinate attacks and literally suck out intel from captured humans
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Old 2013-05-08, 04:36   Link #45
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Subtitles for the upcoming episodes hint at the direction the series will take:

Ep6 - The Carnival
Ep7 - A Soldier's Fate
Ep8 - Separation
Ep9 - The Secret of the Ocean's Depths
Ep10 - The Island of Ambition
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Old 2013-05-08, 05:09   Link #46
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It sounds like the plot may kick into gear around episode 7. This would be the half way point and does make sense.
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Old 2013-05-08, 05:54   Link #47
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^ Yes, it does.

It maybe due to the title of the episode, but episode 8 has peaked my interest the most.
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Old 2013-05-08, 06:33   Link #48
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I suspect Chamber is going to be stolen or taken away from Ledo, and the end-game starting from ep9 will be Ledo and Amy going on an adventure to uncover the secrets of Earth and recover his mech. I'll be happy with such a direction. Less mecha, more Nadia.
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Old 2013-05-08, 07:56   Link #49
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Ep10 - The Island of Ambition
Confirmation perhaps that the world isn't wholly covered with water?
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Old 2013-05-08, 08:06   Link #50
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Confirmation perhaps that the world isn't wholly covered with water?
I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case.
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Old 2013-05-08, 08:09   Link #51
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Okay, here's a fittingly soul-crushing, Butcheresque theory courtesy of an ANN member.

Gargantia doesn't exist. It's all part of a simulation to prepare Ledo for civilian life.

Think about it; obviously at the beginning Chamber is telling Ledo about how he's about to become a full-fledged citizen a la Starship Troopers (another literary reference for your Butcher Bingo chart). He's still mentally at war in the first episode of course, and as people keep saying, this show will be about him adjusting into a cheerful, peaceful lifestyle. Just like therapy.

Things could change of course, but five episodes in we still don't know a whole lot about Amy, Bellows, and the others. Do they have other family? Did they go to school? How did they get their jobs, speaking of finding a job? Does Amy have a boss or supervisor?

And maybe my memory's short, but there aren't very many scenes where the Gargantians aren't in the same vicinity as Ledo. The few scenes where he can't see them could be easily mentally inferred.

And lastly, I'll just add that, given Gen's love of gigantic conspiracies, the Hideauze are just a creation of the Alliance government to benefit the military-industrial complex and keep the working classes (the ones who often make up the bulk of soldiers) in line. And also keep their numbers under control. The Alliance bigwigs might suspect that Earth is now habitable, but they're beholden to the construction contractors who built and currently maintain Avalon, so they don't want humanity moving back.
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Old 2013-05-08, 08:50   Link #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andyjay729 View Post
Okay, here's a fittingly soul-crushing, Butcheresque theory courtesy of an ANN member.

Gargantia doesn't exist. It's all part of a simulation to prepare Ledo for civilian life.

Think about it; obviously at the beginning Chamber is telling Ledo about how he's about to become a full-fledged citizen a la Starship Troopers (another literary reference for your Butcher Bingo chart). He's still mentally at war in the first episode of course, and as people keep saying, this show will be about him adjusting into a cheerful, peaceful lifestyle. Just like therapy.

Things could change of course, but five episodes in we still don't know a whole lot about Amy, Bellows, and the others. Do they have other family? Did they go to school? How did they get their jobs, speaking of finding a job? Does Amy have a boss or supervisor?

And maybe my memory's short, but there aren't very many scenes where the Gargantians aren't in the same vicinity as Ledo. The few scenes where he can't see them could be easily mentally inferred.
This is an interesting and creative theory. But I see at least three significant holes to it:

1. You're right that there's not all that many scenes with Ledo completely off-camera and out of the vicinity of the immediate action. But there are some, and what we have makes little if any sense if this is all an elaborate VR simulation. The key example here is when all the Gargantian bigwigs met together to decide what to do about Ledo and Chamber. One of the leading ideas was to kill Ledo and take his mecha. With that in mind, I don't see how having a VR's NPCs plot to take out the player-character and steal his mech helps much if the whole goal of this VR simulation is to prepare the soldier-player-character for cheerful, peaceful lifestyle.

2. If this was all an elaborate VR simulation, one would expect Chamber to be "in" on it, and to be actively helping its pilot get used to a more cheerful, peaceful lifestyle. Yet Chamber often comes off as "Stop worrying about these Gargantians and fitting in with their society. You will be rejoining the Galactic Alliance in time." This is downright counter-productive of Chamber if the ANN theory holds true.

3. The Galactic Alliance has the time and resources to design, develop, and write elaborate VR simulations, just to prepare their soldiers for integration into peaceful society, but they don't have the time and resources to care for one sick, little boy? There's a bit of a contradiction there, imo.


In conclusion, I wouldn't completely rule out this ANN theory, but I do think it's pretty unlikely.
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Old 2013-05-08, 09:34   Link #53
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Originally Posted by duckroll View Post
I suspect Chamber is going to be stolen or taken away from Ledo, and the end-game starting from ep9 will be Ledo and Amy going on an adventure to uncover the secrets of Earth and recover his mech. I'll be happy with such a direction. Less mecha, more Nadia.
Wait a second, while Chamber does help Ledo to control his mech, nothing say that he is absolutely needed for that.
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Old 2013-05-08, 09:46   Link #54
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Oh, if we are starting with wild speculations I have an even stranger one.
Mind you that I also believe this is very unlikely, but I think it's a funny idea so I'll share it with you:


Ledo doesn't come from space, Ledo comes from the sea!

Okay, we already know that Ledo was taken from the bottom of the ocean, but what I mean is that he was there to begin with!
Confused? You haven't heard half of it!

The whole alliance is in the sea! The Hideauze aren't giant monsters, they are actually very little creatures that live in the sea! Yes they are the very same creatures that the Gargantia knows!
Humanity didn't actually escape in some far place of the galaxy, humanity found a way to miniaturize itself to live in a sort of microscopic universe!

Now think for a moment, how do the Gargantians call the vast agglomerate of bugs in the sea? Right! Milky way! In other words those are exactly like some sort of galaxy in the sea!

How could Ledo so conveniently go to planet Earth just from a random space jump? He didn't! He simply returned to its original size! And of course he then sunk to the bottom of the ocean and you know the rest.

I know, it's crazy! But isn't it fun?!
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Old 2013-05-08, 09:48   Link #55
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Wait a second, while Chamber does help Ledo to control his mech, nothing say that he is absolutely needed for that.
What? Chamber -is- the mech.
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Old 2013-05-08, 10:19   Link #56
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What? Chamber -is- the mech.
People are confused and somehow think the AI and Mecha are two different things.
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Old 2013-05-08, 11:18   Link #57
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Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
Oh, if we are starting with wild speculations I have an even stranger one
....
I know, it's crazy! But isn't it fun?!
I thought this is the speculation thread, not the doujin/fanfic thread
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Old 2013-05-08, 14:51   Link #58
andyjay729
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
This is an interesting and creative theory. But I see at least three significant holes to it:

1. You're right that there's not all that many scenes with Ledo completely off-camera and out of the vicinity of the immediate action. But there are some, and what we have makes little if any sense if this is all an elaborate VR simulation. The key example here is when all the Gargantian bigwigs met together to decide what to do about Ledo and Chamber. One of the leading ideas was to kill Ledo and take his mecha. With that in mind, I don't see how having a VR's NPCs plot to take out the player-character and steal his mech helps much if the whole goal of this VR simulation is to prepare the soldier-player-character for cheerful, peaceful lifestyle.

2. If this was all an elaborate VR simulation, one would expect Chamber to be "in" on it, and to be actively helping its pilot get used to a more cheerful, peaceful lifestyle. Yet Chamber often comes off as "Stop worrying about these Gargantians and fitting in with their society. You will be rejoining the Galactic Alliance in time." This is downright counter-productive of Chamber if the ANN theory holds true.

3. The Galactic Alliance has the time and resources to design, develop, and write elaborate VR simulations, just to prepare their soldiers for integration into peaceful society, but they don't have the time and resources to care for one sick, little boy? There's a bit of a contradiction there, imo.


In conclusion, I wouldn't completely rule out this ANN theory, but I do think it's pretty unlikely.
Very good points. But up until he landed on Earth, a lot of Ledo's stimuli were filtered through Chamber.

My similar original theory was that this is actually some kind of loyalty exercise. It's all an exercise in self-denial. Ledo is supposed to resist the Gargantians' laid-back lifestyle. Pinon's plans to kill him may indicate how the Alliance wants him to remember these people are not to be trusted. Eventually the Alliance will return, guns a-blazing, and demand that he return to their ranks while they conscript the Earthlings. If Ledo obeys Chamber's commands and returns to them (as you pointed out), then he's passed and will become a full Alliance citizen. If he takes the Avatar route and sides with the Gargantians against his former comrades...well, you can probably guess what happens next.

The show may end with him giving a speech along the lines, "As for why I have no regrets in never being able to visit Avalon or live the life of a full citizen, I believe I lived more in the past three months than I did in the past 16 years. And now my final thoughts will be there."

Last edited by andyjay729; 2013-05-08 at 15:01.
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Old 2013-05-09, 00:22   Link #59
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Originally Posted by duckroll View Post
What? Chamber -is- the mech.
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
People are confused and somehow think the AI and Mecha are two different things.
Chamber - is - the AI. Think of he as Gundam's Haro. They are different things. People just like to group them together >.<
Beside, if he could remote control the mech, then steal it is even harder.
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Old 2013-05-09, 00:55   Link #60
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Chamber - is - the AI. Think of he as Gundam's Haro. They are different things. People just like to group them together >.<
Beside, if he could remote control the mech, then steal it is even harder.
No, Chamber is the mech. The mech has an onboard AI so it can talk. Ledo has a handheld device which allows him to talk to it from a distance.

It's explained very clearly here: http://gargantia.jp/#mechanic_0

Chamber is the name of Ledo's Machine Calibre. It is installed with a Pilot Support Interface System which allows it to communicate with the pilot to provide information and advice, and also act on it's own.

The AI and the mech are the SAME thing. Please don't spread misinformation.
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