AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Valvrave the Liberator

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2013-05-30, 09:42   Link #61
Nayrael
The Faceless One
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Varaždin, Croatia
Age: 25
Send a message via MSN to Nayrael
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I similarly felt that Saki was impressed by badass-mode Haruto (whereas the other two with them were dismayed by it). I also had the impression in earlier episodes that Saki didn't know Haruto well. I don't think Saki was particularly interested in Haruto until he went into badass mode. I think she's attracted to alpha males.
Well, she did only send him a Friend Request only at the end of ep1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Also, while I don't think that Saki is downright bloodthirsty, she's also no pacifist. Which honestly, I find refreshing. What kind of pacifist willingly flies a weapon of mass destruction, and uses it against an enemy army? This is why I've never liked the idea of pacifists flying big, giant mechas. I can certainly respect those who try to keep casualties (on all sides) down to a minimum, but you shouldn't be flying one of these things if you're not willing to kill an enemy soldier if necessary.
In Haruto's defense, he ain't exactly a pacifist: he likes killing Dorssians and feels remorse for their deaths.
Actually, I am not getting actual pacifist vibes from any of the characters. Even Saint Shouko finds Haruto's will to kill people a positive thing
__________________
Nayrael is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 10:11   Link #62
Triple_R
Senior Member
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 34
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nayrael View Post
In Haruto's defense, he ain't exactly a pacifist: he likes killing Dorssians and feels remorse for their deaths.
Actually, I am not getting actual pacifist vibes from any of the characters. Even Saint Shouko finds Haruto's will to kill people a positive thing
Oh, I'm not criticizing any character in this show with my comment on pacifism there. Rather characters in some older mecha shows. Are you familiar with Kira Yamato?
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 11:04   Link #63
Ledgem
Love Yourself
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Also, while I don't think that Saki is downright bloodthirsty, she's also no pacifist. Which honestly, I find refreshing. What kind of pacifist willingly flies a weapon of mass destruction, and uses it against an enemy army? This is why I've never liked the idea of pacifists flying big, giant mechas. I can certainly respect those who try to keep casualties (on all sides) down to a minimum, but you shouldn't be flying one of these things if you're not willing to kill an enemy soldier if necessary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Oh, I'm not criticizing any character in this show with my comment on pacifism there. Rather characters in some older mecha shows. Are you familiar with Kira Yamato?
I figured you were harping on Kira Kira was willing to kill, but he wasn't happy about it. I thought that was part of what made him a great character. The concept behind his actions is sort of similar to the way that real-world nations arm themselves with nuclear weapons and other military capabilities. It's not a case of having these things to use them, it's all about having them so that you don't have to use them. It's deterrence. The Gundams were pretty poor deterrence, but it was a way for Kira to get his ideology into the game. Would it have been better for him to give it up and let someone else handle the power?

Valvrave started by addressing some of those philosophes right from the start. Haruto was talking about how it would be nice if everyone got along, and L-Elf brought up the concept that you need to fight for your own interests. Gundam Seed arguably contained that philosophical difference but never really addressed it. Valvrave has positioned itself a bit better to do so.

The problem with having characters that don't react to the deaths of others is that it becomes difficult to interpret, or unrealistic. In Saki's case it almost seems like she doesn't realize what she's doing. She slashes through a mech and it blows up - does she realize that there was a person inside? It doesn't seem like it, but assuming she does, then does she care? Is she a psychopath who is so obsessed with her own fame that she's willing to kill others to achieve it?
__________________
Ledgem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 12:47   Link #64
Triple_R
Senior Member
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 34
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
I figured you were harping on Kira Kira was willing to kill, but he wasn't happy about it.
He took it to a bit of an extreme in Gundam Seed Destiny, imo. But that's off-topic for this thread, so...


Quote:
Valvrave started by addressing some of those philosophes right from the start. Haruto was talking about how it would be nice if everyone got along, and L-Elf brought up the concept that you need to fight for your own interests. Gundam Seed arguably contained that philosophical difference but never really addressed it. Valvrave has positioned itself a bit better to do so.
Agreed.


Quote:
The problem with having characters that don't react to the deaths of others is that it becomes difficult to interpret, or unrealistic. In Saki's case it almost seems like she doesn't realize what she's doing. She slashes through a mech and it blows up - does she realize that there was a person inside? It doesn't seem like it, but assuming she does, then does she care? Is she a psychopath who is so obsessed with her own fame that she's willing to kill others to achieve it?
To a certain extent, I think that Saki is (somewhat ironically) following Haruto's lead. Haruto was ruthless in his initial response to the Dorssian military. I think that Saki saw that as strong, admirable, and practical.

So she is being similarly ruthless towards the Dorssian military.
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 13:05   Link #65
Nayrael
The Faceless One
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Varaždin, Croatia
Age: 25
Send a message via MSN to Nayrael
Mind you that Dorssians are enemy that wants to kill them so Saki wouldn't really have a reason to feel enough sympathy to care about their deaths.
People in general usually don't see solider killing a soldier on battlefield (battle) equally as human killing a human in other situations (murder), even though those soldiers do have their own lives and families.
__________________
Nayrael is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 13:15   Link #66
shadow1296
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
wow this conversation reminds me of a certain point in MGR revengeance,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nayrael View Post
Mind you that Dorssians are enemy that wants to kill them so Saki wouldn't really have a reason to feel enough sympathy to care about their deaths.
People in general usually don't see solider killing a soldier on battlefield (battle) equally as human killing a human in other situations (murder)
especially when you don't see their faces on the battlefield like in mechs, you can desensitize to the fact that you are fighting other pilots (like a gundam pilot did i forget which) and believe your only fighting the machine and not the human inside
__________________
shadow1296 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 13:46   Link #67
Ledgem
Love Yourself
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow1296 View Post
especially when you don't see their faces on the battlefield like in mechs, you can desensitize to the fact that you are fighting other pilots (like a gundam pilot did i forget which) and believe your only fighting the machine and not the human inside
Eureka Seven also included a segment on this, where Renton grew ill after he saw the arm of an enemy pilot with a wedding band on the finger amidst the wreckage. It will be interesting to see if Valvrave brings it up at some point too.
__________________
Ledgem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-05-30, 14:38   Link #68
Key Board
Donut
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Remember that Saki views herself as a vampire. She's a bit sociopathic in a way.

I'm going to say her ability empathize with humans are hindered
and if you're an enemy soldier, it probably doesn't exist

So it would be like us killing a human in a videogame.

now Haruto may have some remorse.. but it's also proven that he can drown them if he is angry enough.
__________________
Key Board is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-01, 08:51   Link #69
Key Board
Donut
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
http://daioh.dengeki.com/blog/%E6%B5...3%B4%E3%80%8D/

Saki spinoff official details from Dengeki Daioh

important notes:

This is a spinoff/sidestory. It is not an alternate universe story like say.. what Nightmare of Nunally was to Code Geass

It will be about her past and present. So it's not just a prequel.

VVV4 will make a lot of appearances
__________________
Key Board is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-10, 11:07   Link #70
Shinhwa
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Age: 25
I support Saki x Haruto Ohhhh yeahh~~~ x3
Shinhwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:24   Link #71
DevilHighDxD
I <3 u Lucina/dancer girl
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: In the arm of the Lucina... Duh!
Age: 19
Saki's face after the sex, look emotionless and kind of sad.
DevilHighDxD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:26   Link #72
II Maestro
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Data World
Saki will give birth to OS-chan~!
__________________
II Maestro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:27   Link #73
NeutralZero
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Earth
Probably she also read Shouko's speech and with what happen between her and haruto she's felling guilty or conflicted...
NeutralZero is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:28   Link #74
DevilHighDxD
I <3 u Lucina/dancer girl
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: In the arm of the Lucina... Duh!
Age: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by II Maestro View Post
Saki will give birth to OS-chan~!
How twisted can this show get now?
DevilHighDxD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:35   Link #75
queenSwild
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
I'm still a bit in the middle on Saki. I was confused by her "I hate everyone" attitude in her spotlight episode, but now this episode makes it clear that she REALLY yearns for a strong bond with someone. This is cool and all, but does she really have to ruin his bond with Shoko in order to get it? GAH! This make me hate her, but then the fact that she'll probably never get such a strong Haruto-Shoko bond makes me feel sorry for her.
queenSwild is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:42   Link #76
iCK
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeutralZero View Post
Probably she also read Shouko's speech and with what happen between her and haruto she's felling guilty or conflicted...
This is probably true, she wouldn't be sad if she accepted Haruto...

The fact that Shoko said that she wanted the culture festival was to confess to the boy she likes.

She knows that they both have mutual feelings for each other, and her betraying one of her closest friends would make her feel like that.

Other than the glasses girl, Shoko was one of her closest things she could call a friend.

Haruto, on the other hand is a love interest for her.
iCK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:47   Link #77
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Logician and Romantic
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCK View Post
Other than the glasses girl, Shoko was one of her closest things she could call a friend.
After the glasses girl died, Shoko was truly alone. She was the only person Saki truly talked to. So despite her death affecting Inu more, Saki was also affected. And her loneliness resulted in this episode.
__________________
Vallen Chaos Valiant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:47   Link #78
Key Board
Donut
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
anyway, I think by now, we can guess that her promise to Haruto is the promise to kill him should he ever irreversibly turn into a monster
__________________
Key Board is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:57   Link #79
DevilHighDxD
I <3 u Lucina/dancer girl
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: In the arm of the Lucina... Duh!
Age: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Key Board View Post
anyway, I think by now, we can guess that her promise to Haruto is the promise to kill him should he ever irreversibly turn into a monster
I don't think she can do it now, because if she did their children won't have a father.
DevilHighDxD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-06-13, 15:58   Link #80
iCK
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Key Board View Post
anyway, I think by now, we can guess that her promise to Haruto is the promise to kill him should he ever irreversibly turn into a monster
This is the first year of the war, the promise she was talking about in the time-skip was 213 years later. If it was 200 years later, the date would be 201 years of the war. We still need to keep watching to figure out what the exact promise was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD View Post
I don't think she can do it now, because if she did their children won't have a father.
We don't know if she isn't pregnant or not though.... Even though there was no contraception used, not all raw sex ends up in conceiving a child. Look at the wives trying to get pregnant, but have no luck.
It's called a miracle of life for a reason. For one or two sperm to reach an egg that is one hell of a travel.
iCK is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
characters

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:18.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.