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View Poll Results: Suisei no Gargantia - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 27 32.53%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 43 51.81%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 8 9.64%
7 out of 10 : Good 5 6.02%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 83. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-06-24, 01:49   Link #121
ArrowSmith
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Quote:
Originally Posted by durack View Post
This really feels like a 26 episode show spliced into 13.... at random

Watchable but utterly forgettable. A pity.
I disagree. I will long remember this series and yes it should have been 26 episodes.
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Old 2013-06-24, 02:35   Link #122
Dash_Hunter
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Good episode, the possibility of Kugel being dead and Striker doing things in his name crossed my mind when Striker first appeared.

My theory for the last episode:
The key that Gargantians have sends a signal to the portal that humans and hideauze used in the past, Ledo and Chamber can't destroy Striker so they plan to send it away from earth.
They use all the power that's left and cross the portal with Striker, the Gargantians close the portal and Ledo, Chamber and Striker are lost forever (or they return to the GA or appear infront of the hideauze)

Happy version:
The same but Chamber ejects Ledo before he starts the plan so he can stay in Gargantia.
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Old 2013-06-24, 02:43   Link #123
Dark Wing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by durack View Post
This really feels like a 26 episode show spliced into 13.... at random

Watchable but utterly forgettable. A pity.
Oh come on now I've seen way worse. This series may have been on the short side and would've been great if it was a bit longer but it's not forgettable.
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Old 2013-06-24, 02:54   Link #124
Irenesharda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by durack View Post
This really feels like a 26 episode show spliced into 13.... at random

Watchable but utterly forgettable. A pity.
I wouldn't say it's forgettable, but it did have wasted potential.

It actually almost feels as if there were 4 or 5 different writers writing 4 or 5 completely different stories and then they tried to make them all converge somehow, without really know what the other writer wrote.
  • You had one thing going on with the space battle and a future Utopian society that's not exactly what it seems.
  • Then you have the battle-hardened fish out of water story, who is trying to fit into a society that doesn't need him.
  • Then you have a romance harem slice-of-life antics story trying to squeeze in there.
  • And then you have the darker, moral-challenging plot line involving the Hideauze and what really makes us human, and where does one draw the line.
  • And now they've tossed that out AGAIN, to have a humanity vs. enslaving rogue A.I. rebellion storyline where the A.I. is trying to save humanity by taking over it and enforcing its mechanical logic.

They have all these storylines that would have been great plots singularly, but they instead tried to have them all fit in a single cour show, thus every single one of them is only half done and everything becomes haphazard.

This was a good episode, but this has been one off kilter show. I've come this far, I might as well see how it ends.
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Old 2013-06-24, 03:43   Link #125
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This was a pretty good and satisfying penultimate episode. Good cliffhanger end that sets up what should be a solid finale.

This episode was somewhat predictable, but its overall execution was quite satisfying, so that largely made up for the predictability.

I didn't really have a major problem with Chamber so easily going along with Ledo's decision to oppose Striker/Kugel. You could chalk it up to Chamber being programmed to be completely loyal to his pilot no matter what. Or, if you want, you could chalk it up to Chamber being smart enough to tell that something fishy was going on with Striker so that motivated him to take Ledo's position. Perhaps Chamber even feels that Gargantia's ways are ultimately more productive than the society that Striker has set up. In any event, I don't find it that hard to roll with.

The biggest question mark for the finale is that key, and exactly what it will do. It adds a nice touch of uncertainty to what would otherwise be a perhaps overly predictable finale. Oh, I now expect a pretty happy ending here, but who knows what'll happen if and when that key is used.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Irenesharda View Post
I wouldn't say it's forgettable, but it did have wasted potential.

It actually almost feels as if there were 4 or 5 different writers writing 4 or 5 completely different stories and then they tried to make them all converge somehow, without really know what the other writer wrote.
  • You had one thing going on with the space battle and a future Utopian society that's not exactly what it seems.
  • Then you have the battle-hardened fish out of water story, who is trying to fit into a society that doesn't need him.
  • Then you have a romance harem slice-of-life antics story trying to squeeze in there.
  • And then you have the darker, moral-challenging plot line involving the Hideauze and what really makes us human, and where does one draw the line.
  • And now they've tossed that out AGAIN, to have a humanity vs. enslaving rogue A.I. rebellion storyline where the A.I. is trying to save humanity by taking over it and enforcing its mechanical logic.

They have all these storylines that would have been great plots singularly, but they instead tried to have them all fit in a single cour show, thus every single one of them is only half done and everything becomes haphazard.

This was a good episode, but this has been one off kilter show. I've come this far, I might as well see how it ends.
To be fair, the only thing here that feels like a bit of a red herring to me is "And then you have the darker, moral-challenging plot line involving the Hideauze and what really makes us human, and where does one draw the line." The debates that this subforum had on this topic seems largely moot now. On the whole, the dark revelation about the Hideauze seems mainly to only be relevant to Ledo's character development, rather than anything tying into a larger theme.

Oh, it's possible that the final episode will delve a bit more back into this, but given that there's still a Striker that needs to be defeated, and a war to be won, and presumably some degree of an aftermath that includes Ledo happily reuniting with Amy and the rest of Gargantia, I doubt they'll have much time to squeeze in much more re-examination of the Hideauze.

Ultimately, this story really is mostly about one teenager/young adult's journey into adulthood, and everything that entails. It's just done against a very fantastical and somewhat dark backdrop, fitting of Gen's writing style and taste.

That being said, this show has been rather bloodless by Gen's standards, and I somehow doubt that the finale will get all that bloody.

However, Gen wanted to write the first and the last episodes, and that along with this mysterious Key plot element does suggest to me that there could be a big surprise or two in the finale.
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Old 2013-06-24, 04:00   Link #126
Om Nerabdator
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Great episode, and the first time i actually liked pinion too, he showed himself to be a boss ^^
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Old 2013-06-24, 05:02   Link #127
jeroz
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
To be fair, the only thing here that feels like a bit of a red herring to me is "And then you have the darker, moral-challenging plot line involving the Hideauze and what really makes us human, and where does one draw the line." The debates that this subforum had on this topic seems largely moot now. On the whole, the dark revelation about the Hideauze seems mainly to only be relevant to Ledo's character development, rather than anything tying into a larger theme.
actually with the recent revelation in the past two episodes, we also need to look at how GA operates and if it's as good as many mistakenly thought it was earlier in the season. Are they really human in those living conditions? Are you willing to say that the people on GA have better life than those who chose to be Evolvers?

Compare with those two, it's easy to see how much better it is on Gargantia without all the stupid inhibitions/restrictions/segregation. We don't know how the life is like as an Evolver, but I certainly would not want to live as part of the lifeless GA
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Old 2013-06-24, 05:11   Link #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dash_Hunter View Post
Good episode, the possibility of Kugel being dead and Striker doing things in his name crossed my mind when Striker first appeared.

My theory for the last episode:
The key that Gargantians have sends a signal to the portal that humans and hideauze used in the past, Ledo and Chamber can't destroy Striker so they plan to send it away from earth.
They use all the power that's left and cross the portal with Striker, the Gargantians close the portal and Ledo, Chamber and Striker are lost forever (or they return to the GA or appear infront of the hideauze)

Happy version:
The same but Chamber ejects Ledo before he starts the plan so he can stay in Gargantia.
This is what I speculated too. LOL
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Old 2013-06-24, 05:52   Link #129
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Ledo:I decide, and you(Chamber)execute(my decisions)…

Assuming Striker operates on the same principle as well, could it mean that all of Striker’s actions in commanding its fleet and enforcing the cult was due to some dying command given by Kugel himself?

Perhaps Kugel started the cult himself, and handed full responsibility to Striker before his death(if the long hair and stubble on Kugel’s corpse was any indication, I’d say he and Striker were out and about on Earth for quite some time before he died, given he was clean shaven and short-haired way back in Ep 1.)

Or was Striker acting independently on its own, falling back on Alliance protocol and tradition to enforce order with the loss of its pilot?

PS. Wonder if the squirrel following Ledo is male...if everything goes well, Grace's gonna get a new partner!
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Old 2013-06-24, 05:55   Link #130
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Striker's tech spec is waaay above Chamber. Not to mention the vastly superior add-ons such as energy rifle and double shoulder mounted missile pods.... Even with Ledo to pilot, Chamber was struggling all the time. I shudder to think if Kugel was still around to pilot Striker. Chamber would not have stood a chance!

I suspect the Gargantian Fleet key is the means to return to space. Will the Gargantians and Ledo seize the chance to reunite with their space brethren or will they continue to live their own existence on Earth?
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Old 2013-06-24, 06:30   Link #131
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Originally Posted by Irenesharda View Post
Here's a question: Why the HECK hasn't Pinion been wearing his hair down? He looks 10 times more awesome, and he seems to have gotten 10 times smarter too. Maybe all that hair gel was affecting his brain...
Showing my age ...

The first time Pinion appeared he immediately reminded me of early 60's teen heartthrob Edd Byrnes who played the role "Kookie" on a detective series called 77 Sunset Strip. Pinion had the same hairdo and the the same obsession with combing his lathered hair. Even though Byrnes couldn't sing a whit, a single was released with pop star Connie Stevens called "Kookie, Kookie, Lend Me Your Comb."



Now this all happened decades ago so I doubt anyone associated with Gargantia knew about Byrnes when they designed Pinion, but you never know. Those girls in the audience are collecting Social Security today.
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Old 2013-06-24, 06:37   Link #132
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Here's a question: "Rack" and Pinion - intentional pun, or coincidence?
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Old 2013-06-24, 07:13   Link #133
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Here's a question: "Rack" and Pinion - intentional pun, or coincidence?
I think you're just a perverted late 20's man
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Old 2013-06-24, 07:22   Link #134
Guardian Enzo
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In all seriousness, do most people know what a rack and pinion is? And would Gen know? It could just be a coincidence.
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Old 2013-06-24, 07:23   Link #135
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Did you see that?
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Old 2013-06-24, 07:26   Link #136
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Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
Well, I am surprised no one has brought up the other crazy possibility of a twist ending: Gargantia is a pre-preparation virtual program for those entering Avalon.
I actually thought about that, but the reveal "it was just VR!" has been done before and it never had a good reception.
In the end it isn't much different from the "it was all a dream" which is now universally considered a poor plot device.


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Originally Posted by jeroz View Post
actually with the recent revelation in the past two episodes, we also need to look at how GA operates and if it's as good as many mistakenly thought it was earlier in the season. Are they really human in those living conditions? Are you willing to say that the people on GA have better life than those who chose to be Evolvers?
I don't think it's fair to judge the Hideauze by looking at the whalesquids and I don't think it's fair to judge the GA by looking at the cultists of a faulty AI.

Ledo and Kugel weren't cultists, they had a mind of their own (proven by the fact that they both took independent actions), and Avalon is supposed to be an even less militarized place, so I have quite some difficulties at believing that the life in the alliance is the same as Striker's "ideal" society.

Of course I agree that Striker's utopia isn't really much better than the Evolver's.

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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
In all seriousness, do most people know what a rack and pinion is? And would Gen know? It could just be a coincidence.
I didn't know until recently, someone posted a list of names and the explanations, they are all specific names for mechanical parts or tools, sort of. Ridget sounds similar to Widget, Bevel is related too.
No it's definitely not a coincidence.
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Old 2013-06-24, 07:54   Link #137
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Originally Posted by bastek66 View Post
Did you see that?
Maybe it wasn't a coincidence how Kamina's seiyuu was chosen for Pinion's role (like how it probably wasn't a coincidence how Squid Girl's seiyuu was chosen for the role of Amy).

A lot of people have noted similarities between Bellows and Yoko Littner, so there could be some shipping possibilities there.

And on the previously linked Wikipedia article about bevels, did anyone notice another carpentry term in the first paragraph called "chamfer"?
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Old 2013-06-24, 08:48   Link #138
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One thing that bothers me a bit is how alert and focused the head female priestess is. I wonder if there are something that we overlooked
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Old 2013-06-24, 08:52   Link #139
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One thing that bothers me a bit is how alert and focused the head female priestess is. I wonder if there are something that we overlooked
I mentioned something similar yesterday. She seems to have more power, knowledge, & influence than I first thought from her episode 11 debut. I wouldn't be surprised if she turns out to be the cultists' final threat to Gargantia.
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Old 2013-06-24, 09:03   Link #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
I mentioned something similar yesterday. She seems to have more power, knowledge, & influence than I first thought from her episode 11 debut. I wouldn't be surprised if she turns out to be the cultists' final threat to Gargantia.
Most likely she was the one who set up the "religious" aspect of the cult so she had a sliver of power
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