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Old 2013-11-02, 19:09   Link #1021
Endscape
The Mage of Four Hearts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Adam doesn't speak for everyone in the group though. I find it hard to believe that Blake was the only odd one out.
True, but if Adam was the one that overstepped boundaries, why did Blake end up leaving? Shouldn't she have rather gone back, reported him, and let him get kicked out?
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Old 2013-11-02, 19:14   Link #1022
saravis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Replace every instance of "faunus" with "african american" and see if you still find it unbiased.
Why do you suppose that I said this was a very common racial issue? Its an issue where people base their judgment, negative or positive, on race as opposed to individual. If Blake wants to defend that not all Faunus are bad, that's one thing, but she wasn't. She was saying that they were misguided and that they were pushed first. She was defending criminal activity because of circumstances.
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Old 2013-11-02, 19:23   Link #1023
Tenzen12
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Okay, let me ask it differently. How -should- she have acted then, if you (or CBredbeard, who made the comment) think that Blake was let off easily?
It was CBredbeard who made comment. And I already made clear where I stand: there is no difference between Blake and Weiss in this case.

And fact that Blake hidden being Fauna from her teammates? I guess it might be reason to be mad, but I was never into that "friends should tell each other everything" stuff, so I am not sure myself., less decide what is appropriate reaction to that.
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Old 2013-11-02, 19:44   Link #1024
FredFriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Or -maybe- they really aren't blood related and the similarities are due to the fact that it's an animation v_v.
Yes, of course there's that. I might be able to do the same thing with Yang and Blake, or Blake and Weiss, or perhaps Nora and Penny.

Quote:
And as much as I dislike the idea of labeling a group of extremists "terrorists" without more info (a terrorist in one person's eyes is a freedom fighter in another's), your argument of "since there is no proof, the opposite must be true" is a bit... out there.
Huh? Are you talking to me? When did I ever make such a claim? If you're going to suggest that I said that the White Fang never committed murder, or that they aren't a terrorist organization, I'd like to see proof of that, as well. Please don't try to speak for me. I am quite capable of putting my foot in my mouth myself.

Nonetheless, if I was accused of murder, I would hope that I would be considered innocent of the charge if there was no proof that I did so.
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Old 2013-11-02, 19:48   Link #1025
Tenzen12
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We saw at least one member of White Fang who intended blow up train with people in it. I think it is pretty conviving Circumstantial evidence...
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:09   Link #1026
shadow1296
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Originally Posted by Tenzen12 View Post
It was CBredbeard who made comment. And I already made clear where I stand: there is no difference between Blake and Weiss in this case.

And fact that Blake hidden being Fauna from her teammates? I guess it might be reason to be mad, but I was never into that "friends should tell each other everything" stuff, so I am not sure myself., less decide what is appropriate reaction to that.
yeah you might be mad, but would you blame her for hiding it? you saw how badly Scarlet was picked on by cardin right? i'm pretty sure blake got the same treatment when she was younger only far worse to a point where she felt like she had to hide the fact she was a fauna
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:11   Link #1027
Dengar
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Originally Posted by Boduar View Post
Weiss is not racist ... you guys are overreacting wayyy too much. That is like saying batman is racist against humans because humans killed his father and every time he sees a human criminal he punches them in the face -for racism- ... no he just does not like criminals ... and those criminals tend to be human. I do not think Weiss would have approved of a non-fauna acting like a monkey thwarting the law and acting in such a fashion either as she seems rather pro-Order.
That makes so little sense I'm not even sure what you're trying to say.

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Originally Posted by saravis View Post
Why do you suppose that I said this was a very common racial issue? Its an issue where people base their judgment, negative or positive, on race as opposed to individual. If Blake wants to defend that not all Faunus are bad, that's one thing, but she wasn't. She was saying that they were misguided and that they were pushed first. She was defending criminal activity because of circumstances.
I still don't call it "defending" them. I'm sorry, maybe you all think I'm weird. The world doesn't consist of "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists".


And then there's all you "she's only against the white fang not against all faunum", yet all of you conveniently shy away from my argument that she literally said:

Faunum + didn't pay for his boat ticket = terrorist

Seriously, why is no one addressing this if you're all so convinced that she's "clearly only against the white fang and not against faunum in general".
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:22   Link #1028
chaos_alfa
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
That makes so little sense I'm not even sure what you're trying to say.



I still don't call it "defending" them. I'm sorry, maybe you all think I'm weird. The world doesn't consist of "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists".


And then there's all you "she's only against the white fang not against all faunum", yet all of you conveniently shy away from my argument that she literally said:

Faunum + didn't pay for his boat ticket = terrorist

Seriously, why is no one addressing this if you're all so convinced that she's "clearly only against the white fang and not against faunum in general".
I don't have much time right now so I'm going to keep it short.


Faunus + didn't pay for his boat ticket = bad Faunus
White Fan = bad Faunus

Monkey boy = bad Faunus = White Fang
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:29   Link #1029
Quol
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She is saying that he, who has shown to do something illegal will end up joining others (which is probably true in this case) If she is as you call racist then that would apply to that bunny girl too, yet you didnt hear her say "serves her right she is probably part of white fang since she is a faunus"

Your also conveniently avoiding how weiss showed clear disgust when that bunny faunus was being bullied, if she was a racist she would not have, so now its your turn.

Also rewatching this episode i found the combat skirt scene really funny especially how ruby and weiss did that high five. Also does penny remind anyone of nora just a little more weird?
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:33   Link #1030
Dengar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quol View Post
She is saying that he, who has shown to do something illegal will end up joining others
So basically what you're saying is we should just get rid of everyone who even so much as yoinks an apple from a fruit stand because they will inevitably become terrorists.

No of course you're not. It's just a hyperbole. The crimes don't add up. You don't consider someone a terrorist just because they didn't pay for a boat ride.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quol View Post
Your also conveniently avoiding how weiss showed clear disgust when that bunny faunus was being bullied, if she was a racist she would not have, so now its your turn.
I'm not sure how her being unsupportive of bullying (like any normal person would be) somehow nullifies the racist remarks she made in this episode.

Or conversely, how she can't possibly have made racist remarks just because she doesn't participate in nonsensical bullying?

Why is this mutually exclusive?
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:40   Link #1031
FredFriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenzen12 View Post
We saw at least one member of White Fang who intended blow up train with people in it. I think it is pretty conviving Circumstantial evidence...
Circumstantial evidence of what? The intent to blow up a train? The desire to blow up a train? The fondness for playing with explosives?

You, and everyone else can assume that, because Adam intended to blow up the train and didn't give a hoot about the crew, the White Fang is a group of murderers. But as circumstantial evidence goes, when we don't even know if the train was actually blown up (not that that even matters, since Blake separated the crew from Adam and the rest of the train), it's a far cry from pinning an actual murder of someone, somewhere, at some other time on a member of the group. The defense counsel would make mince meat of that "evidence."

Sure, Adam has demonstrated that he is cold-blooded enough to indiscriminately kill "innocent" people to further the White Fang cause. But he is the only one, other than Blake, who we know are or have been members of the group, and we do not know if any of the other members share his sentiments, or if he is a lone loose cannon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
I still don't call it "defending" them. I'm sorry, maybe you all think I'm weird. The world doesn't consist of "you're either with us or you're with the terrorists".
To some people, like Weiss, there is no middle ground.

Quote:
And then there's all you "she's only against the white fang not against all faunum", yet all of you conveniently shy away from my argument that she literally said:

Faunum + didn't pay for his boat ticket = terrorist

Seriously, why is no one addressing this if you're all so convinced that she's "clearly only against the white fang and not against faunum in general".

It's hard to keep up with all the posts from all the different forums. I've gotten about 40 notifications in the last four hours or so, which represents many, many more posts that one has to skim through (who's got time to read them all and to reply to some of them?).

It seems to me that even Yang got the impression that Weiss was categorizing all Faunus in her statement:

"Those Faunus only know how to lie, cheat, and steal."

to which Yang replied,

"That's not necessarily true."

Quote:
Originally Posted by chaos_alfa View Post
Faunus + didn't pay for his boat ticket = bad Faunus
White Fan = bad Faunus

Monkey boy = bad Faunus = White Fang
Sounds like racial profiling to me:

Latino + didn't pay for ticket = bad Latino

Latin Kings = bad Latinos

Jose = bad Latino = Latin Kings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quol View Post
She is saying that he, who has shown to do something illegal will end up joining others (which is probably true in this case).
Another case of racial profiling? Otherwise, considering we have next to no knowledge about Monkey Boy, that is certainly a very, very big stretch in the fabric of truth. If he is, indeed as suggested by Yang, competition in the tournament, it becomes even a bigger stretch, since he would be a student at another school of students who are learning to protect civilians.

Which, unless my imagination has gone haywire, brings me to conclude that Blake has seen the error of her ways regarding involvement with White Fang, and, by entering Beacon Academy, is making an effort turn over a new leaf in her life.
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:41   Link #1032
Quol
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Your missing the point, using an example from the book To Kill a Mockingbird the black guy was found guilty even though all the evidence was clearly saying he was innocent. To that extent if weiss was really a racist she would have seen the bunny girl as the guilty one and not have found it disgusting, maybe even feeling a little good.

Also fred, after a point in time you have to stop just looking at the evidence and make your own assumptions.
Bomb was dropped+You see huge explosion, but since you didnt see the big crater it obviously was a dud.

And what i said wasnt racial profiling, i'm saying that the story will probably go in a direction where the monkey gets blake to join the white fang and after some sweet moments with weiss and blake she comes back to the academy.
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:43   Link #1033
Dengar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quol View Post
Your missing the point, using an example from the book To Kill a Mockingbird the black guy was found guilty even though all the evidence was clearly saying he was innocent. To that extent if weiss was really a racist she would have seen the bunny girl as the guilty one and not have found it disgusting, maybe even feeling a little good.
No she wouldn't. Only a sadistic bitch would revel in that kind of stuff, and Weiss is not a sadistic bitch. Your argument makes absolutely no sense. Whatever did or didn't happen with the bunny girl is completely irrelevant.

If your definition of "racist" is "kicks puppies", then you need to rethink your definitions.
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:49   Link #1034
Tenzen12
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It's correct definition though.

It isn't racism unless it apply on every individual of certain race and Velvet definitely is such individual.
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:55   Link #1035
Quol
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...Your missing the point again. First lets start with my definition of racism - classifying an individual within a group and assuming that they all have a specific trait or more. (Stimulus Generalization but for races).
Next, if we assume weiss is a racist she will view all faunus as criminals and "degenerates" We also know that if she finds something bad she will ignore it (meeting ruby in the forest) or bash it (white fang). If the bunny girl was being bullied and she was a racist she would either
ignore the bunny-"she is a faunus so she has done something bad to them, its her fault"
or
bash it-"she is a faunus so whatever happens to her is because she is a a criminal"

But she didnt she showed clear disgust.
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Old 2013-11-02, 20:58   Link #1036
Dengar
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I don't see how displeasure with senseless bullying excludes someone from being prejudiced against them.
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Old 2013-11-02, 21:01   Link #1037
FredFriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quol View Post
Also fred, after a point in time you have to stop just looking at the evidence and make your own assumptions.
Bomb was dropped+You see huge explosion, but since you didnt see the big crater it obviously was a dud.
Your example is a very, very poor one if you're trying to seriously make your point. And, of course, it's only your opinion. Let's not forget that in the real world in the United States, historically, many people have been executed for crimes that they did not commit because they were assumed to be guilty and the circumstantial evidence corroborated the assumptions.

Quote:
And what i said wasnt racial profiling, i'm saying that the story will probably go in a direction where the monkey gets blake to join the white fang and after some sweet moments with weiss and blake she comes back to the academy.
I'm glad it wasn't meant as racial profiling, but you've got a vivid imagination going there. I can't even see any tenuous threads in the episode that would lead in that direction.
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Old 2013-11-02, 21:05   Link #1038
Quol
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I'm done.

I found this episode to be pretty interesting, weiss seems to conflict with the group the most, also the addition of penny is interesting. Penny seems to be another version of nora to me she also seems to be pretty strong being able to move really fast from weiss' reaction. Overall i think this is a good set up episode for the blake arc.

The idea of the tourney and juane is kinda funny, though he will probably end up either really strong from the training or still the funny pathetic guy we all love.
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Last edited by Quol; 2013-11-02 at 21:31.
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Old 2013-11-02, 21:39   Link #1039
JagdPanther
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredFriendly View Post
Well, not exactly. It's more like another side story about one of the main characters.

Wait a minute... What is the mainline story? Where is this show going? I thought it was supposed to be about four girls forming a team to protect humanity by fighting off monsters. No?
Nicely done.

I guess I meant more... story arc about a title character.
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Old 2013-11-02, 22:00   Link #1040
GDiddy
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Weiss has her reasons and considering how badly they treated her family and company, of course she wouldn't be too thrilled. And Blake only defended the very people that she probably has known all of her life and as we saw from her trailer, she's helped out on missions. Of course she'd be miffed at what Weiss was saying.

If this is supposedly ending next week for the season, I'm guessing something happens and the cliffhanger will be if 'Will Blake come back?"

Otherwise, Penny is fucking Creeepppppppppeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.........
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