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View Poll Results: Ore no Imouto (Season Two) - Episode 14-16 Rating
Perfect 10 25 19.53%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 17 13.28%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 13 10.16%
7 out of 10 : Good 8 6.25%
6 out of 10 : Average 12 9.38%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 1.56%
4 out of 10 : Poor 4 3.13%
3 out of 10 : Bad 10 7.81%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 4 3.13%
1 out of 10 : Painful 33 25.78%
Voters: 128. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-08-20, 09:30   Link #281
SigUp
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Originally Posted by npal View Post
Ouch, there goes freedom of speech and expression...
Well, fiction in nearly every country is also regulated. In some countries games that are considered too violent or so can get banned, in others fiction that are overly sexual. But yeah, in this specific case I don't see why it should get restricted. It's not like he describes / alludes them to having sex with each other...
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Old 2013-08-20, 09:35   Link #282
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It's Japan, with their weird and completely inconsistent censoring.

I take it that the producers themselves have no idea what they are doing. Anyways, I like the final product, so at least the interference wasn't that bad.
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Old 2013-08-20, 09:36   Link #283
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Originally Posted by Wilshere View Post
I don't know on who I should be mad more now. Publishers?Maybe, but we are lucky to get this ending by all means.Anime staff?For me,yes.They forced their ''own'' interpretation of the epilogue, and ignored the author's intentions of the kiss. Maybe its just me, but had they went for what he wanted, it might have put the ambiguity to bed(although there will always be arguments).
I totally agree with you on that. I also think that if they followed the advice of Tsukasa, ambiguity could have been ruled out for sure. I read the novel and I enjoyed the ending of the anime. But If I look at the anime, from a point of view of an anime watcher. I can totally understand why they react like that towards the ending.

We already know that it has to do with restrictions etc, but putting those things in it (kiss on the lips etc), I can't seem to understand why they would fear something if they did it (laws etc).

The only reason I can think of why the anime staff left those things out is because they wanted to give the story another interpretation.

Last edited by Sakura_Tsuki; 2013-08-20 at 14:27.
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Old 2013-08-20, 10:03   Link #284
vadrigar848
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I just read the epilogue again and I was just wondering about that last kiss. At first I thought it was just on the cheek, but some of you are saying that it was on the lips.

Did the author state that it should be on the lips in an interview or something?
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Old 2013-08-20, 10:08   Link #285
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Originally Posted by vadrigar848 View Post
I just read the epilogue again and I was just wondering about that last kiss. At first I thought it was just on the cheek, but some of you are saying that it was on the lips.

Did the author state that it should be on the lips in an interview or something?
He did(he preferred it), when he was asked about the final 3 episodes. He wanted to see more change in the hair styles of Kirino and Manami too. If you want to see them, go check Volume 11.
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Old 2013-08-20, 10:26   Link #286
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Originally Posted by vadrigar848 View Post
I just read the epilogue again and I was just wondering about that last kiss. At first I thought it was just on the cheek, but some of you are saying that it was on the lips.

Did the author state that it should be on the lips in an interview or something?
Here is a post out of the anime spoiler thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by nls View Post
About Episode 16
Yuma: Fushimi-san, what did you think of Episode 16?
Fushimi: Overall I'm satisfied with episode 16 but there are two dissatisfactory elements, I'm not saying this officially but personally I'd have preferred for the last kiss to have been on the mouth.
Fushimi: Also, I said this to the director many times but I'd have liked for Kirino and Manami's hairstyle changes to have been kept, as happened in the original work. For the fans who want to see them, please buy the novel.
Yuma: So who was it that responded to Fushimi-san's request?
Kashiwada: About the kiss scene, the siblings had gotten back to being normal siblings, thus the kiss on the cheek. It's in Kirino's character to draw the line and take responsibility.
Miki: You're looking at it from the little girl's point of view, huh?
Kashiwada: And you're looking at it from Kyousuke's point of view.
Miki: As you can see, there are disagreements even within.
Yuma: No, there are no disagreements, none! (hurriedly ends the conversation)
Yuma: Before we finish I'd like a word from everyone.
Fushimi: I'm filled with emotions, thank you so much for everything.
Kanbe: I'll be happy if people like this work no matter what.
Monorail President: People will sill hype up Oreimo after this, I think
Miki: The work is over but I'd like to bring some more life into the Oreimo franchise if possible
Kashiwada: The work ended beautifully so I'm thankful
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Old 2013-08-20, 11:21   Link #287
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And so it ends~

Oreimo S2 definetily worth the waiting, back in 2010 when the series first aired I was still a newborn into the anime world, what caught my interest into watching Oreimo? The -Wincest- of course, but man oh man, Kirino was so annoying back then.

A lot has happened since then, and three years have passed, and I think I still have a lot to learn about anime, but finding stories like Oreimo at least for me are hard to find. The ending for me was Very good 9/10. I mean wow! I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw Manami hitting Kirino!! The most touching part for me was on Ep14 with Kuroneko's arc conclusion. My boat sink at that very moment. But her revenge was funny as hell to watch.

Since I'm an Anime-only viewer, I still have hope for a Kuroneko ending. And also thanks to all the comments from the guys here at the forum, I think I'll give the Light Novels a shot. Oreimo deserves it.

Great show, great story, great acting!
Oreimo is in my top 10 anime of all time now =P

PS: Does anyone know if the LN's will be licensed for the U.S.? Or how many physical novels are out there?
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Old 2013-08-20, 12:14   Link #288
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Originally Posted by Grimoire View Post
PS: Does anyone know if the LN's will be licensed for the U.S.? Or how many physical novels are out there?
It could be licensed but I highly doubt it even tho stories like A Song of Ice and Fire exist and even they have their own share of controversial content. :/
No physical copies available unless you can read Japanese. There might be a Chinese version available tho but not sure. :/
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Old 2013-08-20, 16:51   Link #289
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Wait Kirino has a fanbase? That shocks the hell out of me, It's rare to find a more unlikeable character than that raging bitch. Kirino has literally zero, nilch, nada, not one redeeming quality.

Finale was disappointing. Kyousuke needs a kick in the ass. Break up with every girl to "be with" your sister for X time and then break up? Ever heard of not burning your bridges? You're a teenager, you'll be glad of all these girls being interested in you when you are in college. If you are going to go for the wincest ending at LEAST stick with it, not this "Oh, lets be TOGETHER but its not really together it's only temporary even through we tell all our friends that it's together and we love each other!"

Why go through the whole damn Manami scene and fight if you are just going to break up anyway? Why not just enjoy it without ramming it down all your friends throats, then let it quietly end and move on your with lives?

I live in Japan and every Japanese person I've spoken with has not liked the anime because they don't like the Kirino character. The author tried waaaay too hard to make her perfect.

Pretty? Nope, she has to be a model
Athletic? Nope, she has to be a star runner
Creative? Nope, she has to write a successful light novel

Girl trips over success all while being a c*** about everything. I hate that loathesome bitch and this ending makes me rage.

Last edited by Chysamere; 2013-08-20 at 17:02.
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:12   Link #290
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Dude, I get that you're angry that you watched this whole show and it didn't go the way you'd like, but please tune down the vitriol. Not everyone's tastes are the same as yours.
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:25   Link #291
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Originally Posted by Chysamere View Post
Pretty? Nope, she has to be a model
Athletic? Nope, she has to be a star runner
Creative? Nope, she has to write a successful light novel
She has to be a model, in a way for getting money for fuelling is madness about Little Sister Eroge, a complex she had get for getting is brother changing for someone she admired and loved to a normal guy;
She has to be a star runner, in a way his brother was before the things that happen in the LN, not explained in the Anime;
She has to write a successful light novel, again see first quotation from me to what you said.

All of this was also as "bragging rights" to his brother, as shown in the S2, E13 during the talk with Ayase.

Yes they exist a Fan base for Kirino, as for the others characters. I probably are included in that Fan base.

I loved the way she was strong outside but soft inside, saying something but doing the opposite. Calling is brother as "Gross" and "Disgusting" and "Hate" but in the end she means the opposite. I was captured by his character way of doing things, probably because I also show something outside, a strong impression but inside I'm meaning something completely different.

I'm not trying to change your way of thinking or the way you enjoyed this story. I respect your opinion, and I hope you respect mine. If everyone in the world liked the same colour, there wasn't other colours to choose for.

What make us, humans equals are the differences that we have between us and set us apart!
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:25   Link #292
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Sorry, but after reading through the whole thread, and seeing this, I still feel like the author blinked at the last moment. They go all through the trouble of having him reject everyone else - which I consider a big positive considering how this is usually hvandled - and then they kiss, and then "OK, that's it"...
It definitely wasn't a "last moment blink", in any case. The author knew the constraints he'd be under to write this ending in Dengeki Bunko all along. It was knowing the way it had to end that required him to ensure all the other heroines were cleanly-rejected, because that way people couldn't argue that he was keeping them as "backups" or that his feelings for Kirino were just a ruse. This is the same reason why they went through with the conflict with Manami even though they had their agreement, and also showed care to explain that Kirino had cancelled her overseas plans so she could stay with Kyousuke even after the "time limit" was up. All these points were there (along with the epilogue, Kirino's audio recording, their conversation at the hotel, etc.) so that, when the ending happened, people could look back at all the previous events and think "wait a minute, something doesn't add up..." It's the author's way of hinting at the ending he intended but being able to couch it behind an obvious excuse -- just like how Kirino and Kyousuke are using their status as siblings to hide their true feelings for each other.

While a more obvious ending may have been more-easily accepted, I have to admit that I am fond of the "puzzle" aspect of it all too. It's not quite as carelessly written as some think at first glance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chysamere View Post
I live in Japan and every Japanese person I've spoken with has not liked the anime because they don't like the Kirino character.
This anecdotal evidence is interesting, but conflicts with the fact that Kirino has been one of the central mascot characters for Dengeki Bunko for a long time now. In addition, as has been said multiple times, after the novel was released, anime pre-orders more than doubled within the next week. The last volume of the LN has also had sales that kept pace with its predecessors and continued to grow well in the weeks after the ending was well-publicized. So I tend to think your personal dislike of Kirino, and the confirmation bias of the people you are speaking to, don't really paint a full picture of the reaction to the ending.
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:27   Link #293
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I wouldn't say nothing happened. Especially after the Mikagami incident. After the Mikagami incident there was the Kuroneko dating, so they weren't around each other often. But when Kyousuke was sad, Kirino really did a good job comforting him, and then after Kuroneko forced Kirino to admit that she didn't want to see Kyousuke with a girlfriend they really seemed to come to a new understanding, as evidenced by the end of Episode 9. Then there was also that bike sequence in Episode 10. Subtle, but still present.
Taken from the other side and accepting those actions as their development, Kyousuke's trip to America alone was confession by action to where making Kyourino's development subtle in season two was pointless anyway. Interpreting his trip as just a really strong sibling bond is really pushing it, imo.
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:30   Link #294
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Originally Posted by Chysamere View Post
Wait Kirino has a fanbase? That shocks the hell out of me, It's rare to find a more unlikeable character than that raging bitch. Kirino has literally zero, nilch, nada, not one redeeming quality.

Finale was disappointing. Kyousuke needs a kick in the ass. Break up with every girl to "be with" your sister for X time and then break up? Ever heard of not burning your bridges? You're a teenager, you'll be glad of all these girls being interested in you when you are in college. If you are going to go for the wincest ending at LEAST stick with it, not this "Oh, lets be TOGETHER but its not really together it's only temporary even through we tell all our friends that it's together and we love each other!"

Why go through the whole damn Manami scene and fight if you are just going to break up anyway? Why not just enjoy it without ramming it down all your friends throats, then let it quietly end and move on your with lives?

I live in Japan and every Japanese person I've spoken with has not liked the anime because they don't like the Kirino character. The author tried waaaay too hard to make her perfect.

Pretty? Nope, she has to be a model
Athletic? Nope, she has to be a star runner
Creative? Nope, she has to write a successful light novel

Girl trips over success all while being a c*** about everything. I hate that loathesome bitch and this ending makes me rage.
Not only she had a fanbase, she had a BIG fanbase, and you just stomp their HQ my friend. Calm down. Afterward, if you like, feel free to come back and discuss her with us
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Old 2013-08-20, 17:35   Link #295
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Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto View Post
Taken from the other side and accepting those actions as their development, Kyousuke's trip to America alone was confession by action to where making Kyourino's development subtle in season two was pointless anyway. Interpreting his trip as just a really strong sibling bond is really pushing it, imo.
...You may think that, but a lot of people interpreted it that way. In fact, people continued to interpret every sign as just "a really strong sibling bond" all the way until the end. And some people even interpret the ending that way.

In the end, this whole story has sort of dangled the fact that they're siblings in front of everyone to have people question where the line was and whether they were crossing it. This is why I've said before that, knowing the final destination, it's a story where going back and rewatching the earlier episodes sheds a slightly different light on the motivations and feelings of the characters involved. In retrospect, things that were easily-dismissed in the past look more like smoking guns given where things ended up, but people may have dismissed them before thinking that the story wouldn't "go there" and thus put more weight on other things.
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Old 2013-08-20, 18:22   Link #296
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...You may think that, but a lot of people interpreted it that way. In fact, people continued to interpret every sign as just "a really strong sibling bond" all the way until the end. And some people even interpret the ending that way.

In the end, this whole story has sort of dangled the fact that they're siblings in front of everyone to have people question where the line was and whether they were crossing it. This is why I've said before that, knowing the final destination, it's a story where going back and rewatching the earlier episodes sheds a slightly different light on the motivations and feelings of the characters involved. In retrospect, things that were easily-dismissed in the past look more like smoking guns given where things ended up, but people may have dismissed them before thinking that the story wouldn't "go there" and thus put more weight on other things.
Actually, I'd really love to see a thread dedicated to this discussion. Why this is so widely considered a "surprise" ending?

I've been following this property nearly since day one. I remember reading fan translations of the first light novel long before an anime had even been proposed and being completely wowed. It always seemed obvious to me that Kirino and Kyosuke were going to end up together romantically. I mean, it was right there in the title! It was there in their constant sexual tension (which, admittedly, was somewhat downplayed by the anime). To me, the only real mystery was how Fushimi was going to give them both a happy ending together without drastically changing the atmosphere of the story. I figured a tragic Koi Kaze type ending was out of the question.

And yet, it seems the majority of viewers somehow managed to get the completely opposite impression, and I haven't the slightest clue why. With the mountains of evidence pushing the Kirino/Kyosuke pairing and imouto themed romances hardly being a rarity in anime, it seemed like there had to be some sort of mass hysteria form of denial going on for people to not see where everything was headed. Was it just wishful thinking on the part of people who didn't want an incest end but were somehow turned onto the show by the quality of its characters and self-depricating humor? Right before volume 12 was released there were so many people vehemently denying that this would be a Kirino win that they almost had me second guessing myself. Was there something I was missing?

Then of course the last light novel came out and I found I was more or less on the money, but I'm still puzzled by how everyone else drew the opposite conclusions. By the reactions, this seems far more drastic than the typical complaints people have when the characters they like lose out in a love comedy. People seem to have been honestly surprised with how the plot resolved itself.
Can anyone provide their thoughts? I'm trying to wrap my head around this.
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Old 2013-08-20, 18:23   Link #297
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Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
This anecdotal evidence is interesting, but conflicts with the fact that Kirino has been one of the central mascot characters for Dengeki Bunko for a long time now. In addition, as has been said multiple times, after the novel was released, anime pre-orders more than doubled within the next week. The last volume of the LN has also had sales that kept pace with its predecessors and continued to grow well in the weeks after the ending was well-publicized. So I tend to think your personal dislike of Kirino, and the confirmation bias of the people you are speaking to, don't really paint a full picture of the reaction to the ending.
Oh I agree with you 100%. I love the anime, I just hate Kirino so much. My anecdotal evidence is most likely influenced by the fact that I introduced the anime to men my own age (25-35) as well as women. Women in particular absolutely cannot stand Kirino. As to men, I'd like to think that older men won't tolerate that kind of rubbish, but I can't deny there's a baffling popularity to tsundere characters. Louise from Zero no Tsukaima, Taiga from Toradora, etc etc. However, none of those characters enrage me like Kirino does.

I notice that no one attacked my core message - that Kirino has no redeeming qualities and that Kyousuke's actions are completely irrational.

All her "Star" qualities are accidents of birth or luck, nothing more. All wrapped up an an outer coating of the kind of person I wouldn't piss on to put out if she was on fire.
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Old 2013-08-20, 18:27   Link #298
Akito Kinomoto
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...You may think that, but a lot of people interpreted it that way. In fact, people continued to interpret every sign as just "a really strong sibling bond" all the way until the end. And some people even interpret the ending that way.

In the end, this whole story has sort of dangled the fact that they're siblings in front of everyone to have people question where the line was and whether they were crossing it. This is why I've said before that, knowing the final destination, it's a story where going back and rewatching the earlier episodes sheds a slightly different light on the motivations and feelings of the characters involved. In retrospect, things that were easily-dismissed in the past look more like smoking guns given where things ended up, but people may have dismissed them before thinking that the story wouldn't "go there" and thus put more weight on other things.
But that's what I'm saying. If the trip to America was a self-confession in hindsight, then in hindsight it was also pointless making Kyourino's development subtle. And the sibling barrier was only half-effective anyway between Kirino's childhood backstory, the amount of brother-sister visual novels she played, and her jealousy over Kuroneko and it was noticeable before hindsight.
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Old 2013-08-20, 18:33   Link #299
VORTIA
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Originally Posted by Chysamere View Post
I notice that no one attacked my core message - that Kirino has no redeeming qualities and that Kyousuke's actions are completely irrational.
I didn't because I wasn't sure you were actually interested in discussing them.

I like Kirino a lot, and I think she's got some great qualities! She's always there for her friends, she's outgoing, intelligent, passionate and dedicated. When Ruri dumped Kyosuke, she was there to comfort him and try to help him get his girlfriend back. When Kyosuke got kicked out of the house, she tried her best to take care of him without appearing too intimate.

Quite honestly, the only person she's ever been mean to was Kyosuke, and that was all because she was afraid if she got close to him she wouldn't be able to hold herself back anymore. Her personality is quite rational in my opinion.

As for Kyosuke, the sister he thought hated him and whom he barely knew suddenly is not only talking to him, she's depending upon him! Not only that, in helping her with all of her crazy antics, he finally breaks himself free of the malaise of his "normal" life, after years of oppressing his feelings thanks to his grandmother-next-door, Manami. Suddenly, he finds out the sister he barely knew is a fun, sexy, exciting woman. He's gobsmacked, and it brings Super Kyosuke out of that deep place he was hiding since so long ago.

Just to be clear, this isn't intended as an "it's all Manami's fault" post. I think Manami was doing what she thought was right, and trying to act in everyone's best interest. Unfortunately, her actions did more harm than good, and she didn't realize how she was inadvertently trying to control everyone around her to match her personal ideal.
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Old 2013-08-20, 18:36   Link #300
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I notice that no one attacked my core message - that Kirino has no redeeming qualities and that Kyousuke's actions are completely irrational.
There's no point in "attacking" this argument because you are too biased to be reasonable. Saying that any character in this story has "no redeeming qualities" means that you haven't actually paid any attention to the plot. And I would say this same thing if you were referring to any other character as well (Ayase, Manami, Kanako, Kuroneko, whoever), as they all have both flaws and strengths. This story has no characters that are purely good or evil.

Basically, your lack of objectivity makes your post essentially flamebait, and there's no sense in responding. You are allowed your opinion, but there's nothing to debate.


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Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto View Post
But that's what I'm saying. If the trip to America was a self-confession in hindsight, then in hindsight it was also pointless making Kyourino's development subtle. And the sibling barrier was only half-effective anyway between Kirino's childhood backstory, the amount of brother-sister visual novels she played, and her jealousy over Kuroneko and it was noticeable before hindsight.
No, it's not pointless because it builds suspense. The reason the story attracted so much interest in the second half because there was a growing question of how things would end. The sort of passion we see in this thread, for example, would never have happened if they had made Kirino and Kyousuke's romance more clear and obvious the whole time. That itself was an objective in the story: to keep people guessing and build hype. Whether you think that's a worthy goal or not... you can decide.
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