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View Poll Results: Attack on Titan - Episode 23 Rating
Perfect 10 41 35.65%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 35 30.43%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 25 21.74%
7 out of 10 : Good 9 7.83%
6 out of 10 : Average 4 3.48%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.87%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 115. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-09-17, 15:11   Link #261
Ledgem
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Join Date: Mar 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oompa loompa View Post
It's not just about that.. You have to appreciate armins brilliance; he specifically says 'they're going to kill eren' - thats the kicker. Annie needs eren, for whatever reason, and this is her last chance to get him. Otherwise in my mind I'm certain she wouldn't have agreed. Since it's implied she knew what was going on, especially with the ring tells me that she was planning on using the oppurtunity to capture eren. In fact, I would say as much as the survey corps are trying to catch her, shes trying to catch eren. The fact that she was crying as the FT, and the whole episode, leads me to believe that she is finally buckling under the pressure of living the double life. Still, shes a super powered super elite secret agent, so in the end she decides to laugh at the absurdity of the situation, and go all guns blazing.
Thanks for these points. I had a few theories as to why the female-form titan was crying after Mikasa and Levi saved Eren, and I was also wondering just how much Annie (and Armin/Mikasa/Eren) knew and pre-empted during episode 23. Your points make the most sense, in my mind.

This has been an insanely good series. I'm guessing that there will be a second season, but based on what I've read around the net, it won't be for quite some time. The anime is currently around chapter 33 (or so people say; I don't read it), and the manga is around chapter 49. That's a shame... waiting for the next season will be unpleasant.

On the bright side, when the second season does come then we'll have excuses to re-watch the first season all over again.
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Old 2013-09-17, 23:13   Link #262
Double_Edge
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post

What they checked was gas usage. Annie use her own gear to kill the Titans, and Marco's for the inspection. By that time, Marco was already dead, so I don't see what your complaint means.
My complaint is (I wouldn't call it a complaint, i was just looking for clarification): how would they determine anything from inspecting the gear? It's already shown that people use gas at different rates on top of relay teams giving out gas containers to those who needed them. Not even an odometer of some kind would provide any useful information considering how chaotic it is fighting titans in general.

Really, I just see it as a cheap way to keep Marco somewhat relevant. Because they seemed to be forcing him down our throats for some odd reason. When Eren was imaging Marco with the Recon cape, what was up with that? He made it clear he wants to be a a police officer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kitten320 View Post
The problem is, animators removed a scene from the manga.
I still have fingers crossed for it to be shown as flashback next week but if no I'll say it in tags.

Not a spoiler, just explanation. But you can read it after next week episode if you want to.

Spoiler for reason:
Ugh..... I don't think you understand the point I was making last week. Anything information not given to the viewer is a spoiler. Even if the information precedes any current events in the anime or if it is is very minor. I don't want manga readers steering me in the right direction (or in any direction). I can tell that this time your post wasn't malicious but I'm not really looking for any input from manga readers and I would appreciate it if you refrained from responding to my posts in the future. Try to understand how I feel. Thanks.

@ Monir: Do not give me a warning for this post because as you can see I was very nice about it.
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Old 2013-09-18, 02:13   Link #263
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by Double_Edge View Post
My complaint is (I wouldn't call it a complaint, i was just looking for clarification): how would they determine anything from inspecting the gear? It's already shown that people use gas at different rates on top of relay teams giving out gas containers to those who needed them. Not even an odometer of some kind would provide any useful information considering how chaotic it is fighting titans in general.
I suppose they all reloaded after the battle (just in case the Titans invaded again and they needed to leg it). Any suspect would then have to explain gas expenditure between that reload and the inspection.
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Old 2013-09-18, 03:31   Link #264
CrazyPerson
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In addition, blade usage is important as well. The blades get dulled or broken after use. If they're duller or missing after the battle is over, someone's going to ask exactly how and why you used them. They'll probably ask you to show exactly what was cut and where the blade fragments (if any) are located. I bet the quartermaster keeps track of how many blades someone requisitions and gas canisters too.
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Old 2013-09-18, 04:25   Link #265
Parchevich
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I suppose they all reloaded after the battle (just in case the Titans invaded again and they needed to leg it). Any suspect would then have to explain gas expenditure between that reload and the inspection.
Except Marco died in battle, so it stands to reason that his tank wasn't quite full. If someone topped it up so it could be assigned to another soldier, they would have also kept better track of it and someone would have realized a set of soldier's gear had gone missing. Also, ordinary soldiers can fill their own tanks as long as they have a gas bottle, which would have been easier to obtain than a whole new set of 3D gear.

About blade usage - Annie could have just gotten Marco's blades and put them in her own gear, and since blades are disposable even Armin wouldn't have been able to tell where she got them from.

The only way it makes sense to me is if Annie stashed Marco's gear just in case, while she helped clean up the bodies in Trost. Then while killing the captured titans her own gear somehow got damaged, so she figured it was safer to use Marco's for the inspection than to explain how she broke her own. It would have been smarter to use Marco's gear for the killing in the first place, but I guess even Annie isn't perfect. Or perhaps she saw an opportunity to sneak in and didn't have time to go back and change gear.
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Old 2013-09-18, 05:13   Link #266
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by Parchevich View Post
Except Marco died in battle, so it stands to reason that his tank wasn't quite full. If someone topped it up so it could be assigned to another soldier, they would have also kept better track of it and someone would have realized a set of soldier's gear had gone missing. Also, ordinary soldiers can fill their own tanks as long as they have a gas bottle, which would have been easier to obtain than a whole new set of 3D gear.
Gas reserves are watched. It was all chaos during the battle, but normally, there's probably some kind of paperwork when you want to recharge.

Now, you could say finding Marco's corpse without his gear is suspicious... except they found plenty of soldiers missing body parts. Who's going to care about 3d gear?

So she either recharged both gears in the confusion of the battle's aftermath, or she recharged one gear and swapped bottles as appropriate so she'd still have full bottles for inspection. (Assuming the gas in Marco's was enough to carry out her operation, which isn't a stretch. He'd recharged shortly before dying.)

Quote:
About blade usage - Annie could have just gotten Marco's blades and put them in her own gear, and since blades are disposable even Armin wouldn't have been able to tell where she got them from.

The only way it makes sense to me is if Annie stashed Marco's gear just in case, while she helped clean up the bodies in Trost.
She probably got the gear during the confusing battle where people got separated and isolated all the time, rather than during the clean-up where people were working together. But yes, she stashed the extra gear in advance. Maybe she saw the titans get captured and knew she'd have to do something about it, maybe it was "just in case". It doesn't matter. Heck, it's possible she has more extras stashed in various places. She had to use something for her kidnapping attempt. (Then again, the MPs are so lax it's possible she can recharge whenever she wants, maybe even take spare 3d gear without anyone noticing.)

Quote:

Then while killing the captured titans her own gear somehow got damaged, so she figured it was safer to use Marco's for the inspection than to explain how she broke her own. It would have been smarter to use Marco's gear for the killing in the first place, but I guess even Annie isn't perfect. Or perhaps she saw an opportunity to sneak in and didn't have time to go back and change gear.
The reason she used her own gear is technically a spoiler.
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Old 2013-09-18, 05:20   Link #267
kitten320
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Duno, for me it is just trying to tie the lose ends that animators left for no reason.
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Old 2013-09-18, 06:14   Link #268
Parchevich
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
So she either recharged both gears in the confusion of the battle's aftermath, or she recharged one gear and swapped bottles as appropriate so she'd still have full bottles for inspection. (Assuming the gas in Marco's was enough to carry out her operation, which isn't a stretch. He'd recharged shortly before dying.)


The reason she used her own gear is technically a spoiler.
The thing is, it would have been easier and safer for her to swap Marco's bottles for her own, or fill her tank from his, than to switch their whole gear, unless hers was somehow damaged.

But if there's a spoilery reason for all that, nevermind.
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Old 2013-09-18, 07:56   Link #269
chaos_alfa
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The thing is, it would have been easier and safer for her to swap Marco's bottles for her own, or fill her tank from his, than to switch their whole gear, unless hers was somehow damaged.

But if there's a spoilery reason for all that, nevermind.
The 3DMG is probably routinely cleaned after use, just like guns. If she had an unclean 3DMG at the inspection, it would indicate she had used it recently.

And I think the reason she used her own gear rather than Marco's gear when she killed the Sonny and Bean is because she knows how her own gear behaves. If she used Marco's gear and it responded in a way she didn't expect it could jeopardize the mission. This does begs the question why she didn't try to practice with Marco's gear to get more familiar with it. Maybe she didn't have the time for it or it was too risky?
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Old 2013-09-18, 08:47   Link #270
Hmm....
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I agree it's not only about gas. It's also about routine maintenance. No matter what she did there will be a trace of usage on her 3D gear.

I believe this is what Annie did. She took Marco's gear during battle. Sent it to routine maintenance after battle. Now Marco's gear is brand new and she kept it that way. She then continue using her own 3d gear, not only for killing two titans, but for her other intel gathering as a spy she is. When the next routine check up come around, she sent her own gear for maintenance. Now all evidences are erased.

There is no point in mastering Marco's gear either. She only need it when there is some inspection going on and her own gear happen to be in "used" state. Mastering two 3D gears at the same time would be quite.... troublesome. Normally, a chance of anyone notice it's not her 3d gear would be close to nil.
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Old 2013-09-18, 14:18   Link #271
kitten320
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Uuuhhh, just saw another sub version with slight changes.

I'm getting so frustrated. While changes are small, they still significantly change the meaning and I duno which one to trust now x_x
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Old 2013-09-18, 17:34   Link #272
Preciize
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I know you are joking but Annie is the same age.
Is she the same age? If she's originally a titan, I'm thinking she might be older but just looks young.
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Old 2013-09-18, 18:02   Link #273
kitten320
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Well going by episode 2, she is still a kid there.

Besides as far as I remember Isayame himself said that she is 16.
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Old 2013-09-18, 21:29   Link #274
Preciize
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Well going by episode 2, she is still a kid there.

Besides as far as I remember Isayame himself said that she is 16.
Oh she's actually 16? O.o It's implied that she infiltrated the wall when it broke down 5 years ago meaning she was 11 at the time?
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Old 2013-09-19, 00:02   Link #275
Leo_Otaku
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I found nothing wrong with the laugh scene at all. But I can understand the issue people had with the change. But then author wanted the change so I don't see the problem then *shrug*
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Originally Posted by Parchevich View Post
He probably will sooner or later, along with Erwin. Levi is basically a Mikasa without an Eren, or a Mikasa whose Eren has died already, and Armin is shaping up to grow up to be a cuter Erwin, so the older mentor versions have to die heroic or not so heroic deaths at some point.
If so much, much later as he is the most popular character in the manga. So, unless there is a very good reason, there will be very angry fans. You don't want to make them angry now ...do you
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Old 2013-09-19, 06:14   Link #276
Hmm....
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Originally Posted by Leo_Otaku View Post
If so much, much later as he is the most popular character in the manga. So, unless there is a very good reason, there will be very angry fans. You don't want to make them angry now ...do you
I thought the author love making his fan angry
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Old 2013-09-19, 06:53   Link #277
kitten320
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If Isayama will have guts to kill off Levi, he'll be my hero.

Not because I dislike Levi, I like him. But because he actually will do what he wants and not fans as it happens a lot and ruins the plot.
Beach would be a good example.
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Old 2013-09-19, 10:52   Link #278
lateraldeath
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If Isayama will have guts to kill off Levi, he'll be my hero.

Not because I dislike Levi, I like him. But because he actually will do what he wants and not fans as it happens a lot and ruins the plot.
Beach would be a good example.
Do you know if he actually want to kill Levi? having the guts implies he intents to plot wise but hesitate. We don't know if he intends to.

Frankly he already proved he has guts with Petra, but ok.
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Old 2013-09-19, 20:14   Link #279
kitten320
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While Petra was loved, she still is a pretty minor character with no real significance.
At least I don't see her as anything more but part of Levi's squad just like Auruo, Erd and Gunther.

Levi on the other hand is a strong fighter, one of a kind like Mikasa. He is not someone you can easily replace. His fanbase is also 100 times bigger than Petra's.

Petra's death in comparison to his will be invisible both story and fan wise.


Though, story wise biggest loses would be Erwin and Hanji. Erwin is a leader/power who moves forces forward while Hanji is a brain. As far as I understood, she is the one who discovered Titan's weak spots. With her gone, chances of finding Titan's weaknesses will become drasticly smaller.
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Old 2013-09-20, 00:27   Link #280
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Frankly he already proved he has guts with Petra, but ok.
As far as narrative conventions go, having a group of seasoned veterans escorting the newbie Chosen One is generally a death sentence. For example,

Spoiler for anime:

Spoiler for movies:
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