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View Poll Results: Little Busters ~Refrain~ - Episode 5 Rating
Perfect 10 3 11.11%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 9 33.33%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 9 33.33%
7 out of 10 : Good 4 14.81%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 7.41%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 27. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-11-02, 09:56   Link #1
Solace
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Little Busters ~Refrain~ - Episode 5 Discussion / Poll

Welcome to the discussion thread for Little Busters ~Refrain~, Episode 5.

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Old 2013-11-02, 10:19   Link #2
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Interesting episode. It's rather odd though how so many of the girls are missing and everyone just chalks it up to "they must be taking the day off" (even though at this point some of them would have been missing for multiple days, if not weeks). How irresponsible of them.
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Old 2013-11-02, 10:28   Link #3
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Well....that escalated quickly.

And this
Spoiler for :
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Old 2013-11-02, 10:47   Link #4
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Love the episode, can't wait for how the rest of the series will shape up
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Old 2013-11-02, 11:12   Link #5
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All the new Little busters have disappeared save for the only one I don't like, Komari. Dammit >_<

The mastermind was revealed, and to the surprise of absolutely nobody, it was Kyousuke. Riki doesn't seem to have realized the trials were meant to make him grow up as well.
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Old 2013-11-02, 11:53   Link #6
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I was quite surprised when the storm brewing at the end of last episode was gone in this one. I expected it to be used for the dramatic scenes, so as to truly dub this the successor of Sad Girls in the Snow.

Am I supposed to take that ending literally or is it just an artistic portrayal of someone fading into the darkness? He's kind of a jerk for letting poor Riki lie there either way.
That was another interesting episode, but I am worried that this one might have unintentionally told me much, much more than it should have. Or maybe it was intentional.. though it would strike me as rather strange to reveal the what I think will be the crucial plot point only 5 episodes in.
And yeah, Kyousuke was so obvious I couldn't help but suspect a red herring until this very episode.

And another week to wait.. alas that the story is gripping me so hard it feels like the episodes are over in 5 minutes.

Last edited by Narzia; 2013-11-02 at 12:09.
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Old 2013-11-02, 11:53   Link #7
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As I watched the monologue preceding and leading up to the point where Rin and Riki get into an argument, I kept thinking that the entire premise behind Riki's decision to urge Rin to go is very flawed. Rin did not make that circle of female friends by herself - Riki was the initiator of all those friendships in those cases, and Rin merely tagged along. The only way for Riki's thought process to remain believable, would be for Riki to be remarkably blind as to the dynamics of the newer members of the Little Busters.


The more I think about it, perhaps Riki just isn't that privy to what goes on with the girls, and leads to the assumption that the fact that Rin's friendship with the girls that in truth befriended Riki first, implies that Rin can make friends, without Riki as the initial mediator. It's a wrong assumption to make - perhaps, it also reflects the problem that Riki tends to sell himself a little short, and fail to really grasp that it's not Rin that's holding the girls together as friends. Yes, she appears to have initiated events, but that group of friends was won over by Riki, not Rin. Furthermore, I think that the girl holding the females of the Little Busters as a common clique (and they are, to an outsider) is not really Rin. And it's not completely Riki either, when Riki is not around.

Sometime ago, I commented that Kurugaya takes an analogous role that Kyousuke does among the boys, among the girls However, after looking at some of the Komari scenes, I think the place Kyousuke occupies among the boys (as heart and head) is split into two among the girls, with Komari as the heart.Infact, I am leaning towards Komari as the girl who turns the "friend of my friend Riki" group of females, into an actual group of female friends. I think it's rather unfortunate that they choose such a absurdly childish voice for Komari. Yes, it's meant to fit her character, but a voice closer to her age group would probably made her status as the emotional heart of the female Little Busters, and a elder sister figure in the group much more clearer. I suspect most of the female only Little Busters initiatives got in all the females, because Komari seems to be the one who convened all the girls together for those girls only activities- but that's just a theory of mine, and better informed readers could correct me of that.

It might be, that Kurugaya already takes the Anego status of the Little Busters female, so, the authors decided to make Komari childish in voice and appearance so as not to have a second "bigger" sister figure in the group. Which is the shame, because once you realize what kind of person Kurugaya is, you start realizing that she's not the actual "Anego" Figure, or the leading figure among the girls. Ironically, it might well be Komari instead, despite her voice. Is it also coincidence that she happens to be one of the taller and well endowed of the girls, despite her childish face and voice?

Spoiler for Spoiler for Komari vs Kurugaya:


I think it's interesting that in the anime, Riki is an insider to all the girls in the Little Busters, as a friend, but of the friendship between the girls themselves, he's very much an outsider. But while this might be too thin a thread to speculate on, I think from the brief glimpses of the internal dynamics of the Little Busters female, there's appears to be a very interesting parallel story going on here. From the outside, Kurugaya seems to take the same role as the leader of the girls, but inside, between them, Kurugaya isn't really capable of offering the same sort of emotional bedrock that Kyousuke provides for the boys, which Komari somewhat fills.

I think Riki somewhat fails to realize that within the Female Little Busters, Rin isn't the one keeping that group together. Riki's bridging the male and female portions of the Little Busters into one, but the females themselves aren't a collection of independent individuals bounded to Riki, but rather, a second group of female friends with a dynamics running often in parallel to the dynamics between the original group of male friends.

Perhaps Riki recognizes that this second cohesive group of female friendships exist in the new half of the Little Busters, but I think he fails to realize that the fact that such a group exist and that Rin now has a clique of females doesn't necessarily mean that Rin could make friends independent of Riki.

Spoiler for And before VN Readers point out....:


That was much longer than I anticipated. I originally intended to write how stupid Riki's thought process sounded to me, when I started out, and it somehow drifted into a discourse into the dynamics of the Little Busters. But it's a very interesting dynamics here.

And yes. I am aware that there are smaller, one on one relationships between the girls, besides that overarching "clique" that the girls have become. Rin and Komari is one example, and then there's the more special friendship that Kurugaya and Haruka seems to have implied to posses. There's Kud insecurity of whether she really belongs into that group, and unfortunately, the anime doesn't really go well into where Mio fits into that group - only that she indeed is in that group.

You know, you could axe (or genderbend) Riki, and even if this was one of those cute girls doing cute things story, the relations and characters of the Little Busters girl could make it one of those very strong "female-friendship" shows, in the vein of K-on, Yuru-Yuri, GJ-bu, etc, etc. The character depth of the Little Busters girls and their personalities, and even their back-stories can probably carry that show strongly.

But that would take away what makes Little Busters unique, and that's where we really have a mixed friendship group of boys and girls, where the boys actually really matter - and in this day and age of harems where the males are joke characters, or all female friendship stories, it's rather refreshing. Still, I don't think it's Rin that's keeping the girls together. Riki is the central link where the Little Busters relationships is increasingly flowing through.
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Old 2013-11-02, 13:55   Link #8
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JC Staff... Showing how to adapt a Visual Novel to a different medium all the while improving on source material is done... Having played through the game and knowing what's coming the whole episode was quite an intense affair.
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Old 2013-11-02, 14:48   Link #9
Reckoner
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I don't know how you anime only viewers felt, but this indeed was an intense affair. Things are really starting to be put in motion...
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Old 2013-11-02, 15:00   Link #10
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so Kyousuke plan all this since the beginning, I guessing Kengo and Masato knew this too.
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Old 2013-11-02, 16:08   Link #11
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Solid episode all around.
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Old 2013-11-03, 01:14   Link #12
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Why is it no one wonders where Kurugaya went?
Did they just cut the scene where they started to wonder about it or is there something behind that oO?

And... Yeah...about that one sentence:

Masato: 'I decided to not say anything from the beginning'

Is it just my imagination or is he smarter than we all thought and actually managed to figure Kyousuke's plan out
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Old 2013-11-03, 02:09   Link #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
All the new Little busters have disappeared save for the only one I don't like, Komari. Dammit >_<

The mastermind was revealed, and to the surprise of absolutely nobody, it was Kyousuke. Riki doesn't seem to have realized the trials were meant to make him grow up as well.
Annddd... poor Komari continues to be villified! Alas and alack for the state of contemporary... umm.... something or other.

Kinda liked novanalysis' thoughts on Komari as a possible explanation to why she is one of the girls still around, though. Hadn't thought of her like that, but I certainly think it is a real possibility.

Suck good storytelling in this series. Very well done!
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Old 2013-11-03, 02:59   Link #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower View Post
Annddd... poor Komari continues to be villified! Alas and alack for the state of contemporary... umm.... something or other.

Kinda liked novanalysis' thoughts on Komari as a possible explanation to why she is one of the girls still around, though. Hadn't thought of her like that, but I certainly think it is a real possibility.

Suck good storytelling in this series. Very well done!
I think you meant such.

In many ways, the problem I feel is that the Voice acting impacts our perception of Komari, If her voice was more age appropriate, but she was given the same lines, and even perhaps the same character design, she'd probably be regarded much more favorably as the most optimistic and positive of the girls, and the emotional heart among the Little Busters girls, rather than an annoyance that makes you want to choke the voice actress from across the screen everytime her nails on chalkboard voice fills the speakers.

As I understand it, the standard explanation is that Komari's friendship with Rin is deepest amongst the girls. Riki's mistake is to assume that Rin's the driving force among the Little Buster females - but that isn't necessarily the case. Even if Rin has appeared to have initiated activities before, she still cannot do it by herself. In that case, Riki's reasoning to me, only sounds believable, if it was product of misjudging the dynamics behind the girls.
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Old 2013-11-03, 03:12   Link #15
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Sorry about the misspelling there. :-/
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Old 2013-11-03, 03:28   Link #16
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As an anime only viewer, this episode was good but nothing special.

We get confirmation that Kyousuke is the one behind the missions. They have been hinting strongly at that for several episodes so that was not as chooking at it might have been. Also, we did not really learn anything new about the mysteries. The only odd thing about that was that Kyousuke was willing to leave Riki behind while fleeing from the guard.

That the girls are disapearing is strange, but since the anime have not dealt with these things in the slightest there is no real emotional investment in this yet. It's just like "and there goes another"... I think that if the characters had atleast spent some time looking for them, being curious where they are, sad and angry and afraid that they can't find them, then there would be some emotional respons from the viewers. Now its just "meh".

Riki realized he was being selfish by influencing Rin to stay. To fix that he decided that he needed to force her to go?! I guess most of us have lived through situations like these, where close friends goes away for some time or forever. To me, the only way to hadle it is to point out that it is their choice and that I will love and support them either way. Had Riki and Rin been in love, truly, he should have done his best to make her stay though. But his feelings for her is not love, he simply cares alot about her.
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Old 2013-11-03, 08:20   Link #17
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Oh boy, here we go. We are going to see a lot of tradegies now.

Is it me or am I seeing parallels with Angel Beats?

I have to ask why does Kyousuke need to do this anyway? I am guessing something horrible will happen to them that can potentially break Riki and Rin. He is just readying them for that.
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Old 2013-11-03, 10:12   Link #18
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Originally Posted by orpheus2 View Post
Oh boy, here we go. We are going to see a lot of tradegies now.

Is it me or am I seeing parallels with Angel Beats?

I have to ask why does Kyousuke need to do this anyway? I am guessing something horrible will happen to them that can potentially break Riki and Rin. He is just readying them for that.
My theory is that Kyousuke is about to die in one way or another and wants to force certain people who always depend on him to grow up.
This has at least been hinted by the scene where he sits in the dark and said someting about when he is gone.
So I guess that void is LB's 'world that has already ended'
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Old 2013-11-03, 13:16   Link #19
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I'm starting to really like Rin & Riki's relationship.

FINALLY, Kyousuke getting a main part. I see awesome things out of the guy in the future....well at least hope to see.
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Old 2013-11-03, 15:45   Link #20
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Good episode. A lot happened during the episode, but it didn't feel rushed to me. The execution of the important scenes was really good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
As I watched the monologue preceding and leading up to the point where Rin and Riki get into an argument, I kept thinking that the entire premise behind Riki's decision to urge Rin to go is very flawed. Rin did not make that circle of female friends by herself - Riki was the initiator of all those friendships in those cases, and Rin merely tagged along. The only way for Riki's thought process to remain believable, would be for Riki to be remarkably blind as to the dynamics of the newer members of the Little Busters.


The more I think about it, perhaps Riki just isn't that privy to what goes on with the girls, and leads to the assumption that the fact that Rin's friendship with the girls that in truth befriended Riki first, implies that Rin can make friends, without Riki as the initial mediator. It's a wrong assumption to make - perhaps, it also reflects the problem that Riki tends to sell himself a little short, and fail to really grasp that it's not Rin that's holding the girls together as friends. Yes, she appears to have initiated events, but that group of friends was won over by Riki, not Rin. Furthermore, I think that the girl holding the females of the Little Busters as a common clique (and they are, to an outsider) is not really Rin. And it's not completely Riki either, when Riki is not around.

Sometime ago, I commented that Kurugaya takes an analogous role that Kyousuke does among the boys, among the girls However, after looking at some of the Komari scenes, I think the place Kyousuke occupies among the boys (as heart and head) is split into two among the girls, with Komari as the heart.Infact, I am leaning towards Komari as the girl who turns the "friend of my friend Riki" group of females, into an actual group of female friends. I think it's rather unfortunate that they choose such a absurdly childish voice for Komari. Yes, it's meant to fit her character, but a voice closer to her age group would probably made her status as the emotional heart of the female Little Busters, and a elder sister figure in the group much more clearer. I suspect most of the female only Little Busters initiatives got in all the females, because Komari seems to be the one who convened all the girls together for those girls only activities- but that's just a theory of mine, and better informed readers could correct me of that.

It might be, that Kurugaya already takes the Anego status of the Little Busters female, so, the authors decided to make Komari childish in voice and appearance so as not to have a second "bigger" sister figure in the group. Which is the shame, because once you realize what kind of person Kurugaya is, you start realizing that she's not the actual "Anego" Figure, or the leading figure among the girls. Ironically, it might well be Komari instead, despite her voice. Is it also coincidence that she happens to be one of the taller and well endowed of the girls, despite her childish face and voice?

Spoiler for Spoiler for Komari vs Kurugaya:


I think it's interesting that in the anime, Riki is an insider to all the girls in the Little Busters, as a friend, but of the friendship between the girls themselves, he's very much an outsider. But while this might be too thin a thread to speculate on, I think from the brief glimpses of the internal dynamics of the Little Busters female, there's appears to be a very interesting parallel story going on here. From the outside, Kurugaya seems to take the same role as the leader of the girls, but inside, between them, Kurugaya isn't really capable of offering the same sort of emotional bedrock that Kyousuke provides for the boys, which Komari somewhat fills.

I think Riki somewhat fails to realize that within the Female Little Busters, Rin isn't the one keeping that group together. Riki's bridging the male and female portions of the Little Busters into one, but the females themselves aren't a collection of independent individuals bounded to Riki, but rather, a second group of female friends with a dynamics running often in parallel to the dynamics between the original group of male friends.

Perhaps Riki recognizes that this second cohesive group of female friendships exist in the new half of the Little Busters, but I think he fails to realize that the fact that such a group exist and that Rin now has a clique of females doesn't necessarily mean that Rin could make friends independent of Riki.

Spoiler for And before VN Readers point out....:


That was much longer than I anticipated. I originally intended to write how stupid Riki's thought process sounded to me, when I started out, and it somehow drifted into a discourse into the dynamics of the Little Busters. But it's a very interesting dynamics here.

And yes. I am aware that there are smaller, one on one relationships between the girls, besides that overarching "clique" that the girls have become. Rin and Komari is one example, and then there's the more special friendship that Kurugaya and Haruka seems to have implied to posses. There's Kud insecurity of whether she really belongs into that group, and unfortunately, the anime doesn't really go well into where Mio fits into that group - only that she indeed is in that group.

You know, you could axe (or genderbend) Riki, and even if this was one of those cute girls doing cute things story, the relations and characters of the Little Busters girl could make it one of those very strong "female-friendship" shows, in the vein of K-on, Yuru-Yuri, GJ-bu, etc, etc. The character depth of the Little Busters girls and their personalities, and even their back-stories can probably carry that show strongly.

But that would take away what makes Little Busters unique, and that's where we really have a mixed friendship group of boys and girls, where the boys actually really matter - and in this day and age of harems where the males are joke characters, or all female friendship stories, it's rather refreshing. Still, I don't think it's Rin that's keeping the girls together. Riki is the central link where the Little Busters relationships is increasingly flowing through.
While I do like your take on Komari, I have to say that you seem to have taken Riki's monologue the wrong way. Riki's choice had nothing to do with Rin's capability of making friends by herself. That was not the point of his monologue. The other girls even told Riki at the end of season 1 that he's the one who brought them all together. What Riki was saying is that Rin grew up because of her friendships with the other girls. He never said anything about how these friendships came to be. Rin's less shy than she used to be now, but Riki knows that she still has a long way to go. He thinks that she's still too childish and that she doesn't understand love because of this. He wants her to keep experiencing new things, like going to the other school by herself, since he thinks that this will make her mature more. He's hoping that this will make her understand love and that she'll really fall in love with him in the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moridin View Post
Had Riki and Rin been in love, truly, he should have done his best to make her stay though. But his feelings for her is not love, he simply cares alot about her.
Riki does love Rin. That's why he didn't want her to go and even got angry at Kyousuke. He was even crying when he was thinking about the fact that Rin might fall in love with someone else because of his choice to send her away. Riki just thinks that Rin is still a child and that she doesn't know what love is. He's afraid that she's just doing what he says because they've always been together. By sending Rin away to the other school, he wants Rin to mature, so that she'll learn to understand love and then really love him back.

I think Riki is underestimating Rin's feelings though. She might not know much about love, but it's clear that she has romantic feelings for him.
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