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View Poll Results: Monogatari Series Second Season - Episode 17 Rating
Perfect 10 29 59.18%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 13 26.53%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 3 6.12%
7 out of 10 : Good 2 4.08%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 2.04%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 2.04%
Voters: 49. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-11-17, 02:06   Link #21
HandofFate
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damn....
tbh, even back in Bakemonogatari, when Mayoi was like "I guess I upgraded to a wandering spirit"

I was like "what the..." Especially given how each arc just shows that rules are pretty strict.

Also, its only been 3 months since the first Snail story incident, and Mayoi passing on?

damn, busiest 3months I ever seen.
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Old 2013-11-17, 02:44   Link #22
Konakaga
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Just wow.

Of the feelings this show has made feel in the past, I've never expected it would actually pull off something so emotional that I would cry, but today I cried anyways the scene between Araragi and Hachikuji was just brilliantly written to their characters with top notch performance by their VAs to show the emotion for that scene. And really show just how much even Hachikuji meant to Araragi so well.

So this episode definitely earns it's 10 out of 10 from me.

P.S. If Hachikuji's time was a "bonus stage" then I hope Ougi is the "bonus boss" to Nadeko's "final boss" .
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Old 2013-11-17, 02:46   Link #23
MrFalcon
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Another good ending. Different from the others--no action, but meaningful nonetheless.

Araragi kissing little girls is a little creepy. Maybe it was different in the book. Like a little peck. The sister incest themes was weird enough, but at least we got funny scenes like the toothbrushing.

Still, there were some good morals to the story:

Don't be something that you're not (Shinobu acting as a god). Not clearing up a misunderstanding is the same as lying

Sometimes it's ok to be ok with someone dying or leaving. Be thankful for the good times, what you have learned, and the experiences you've had with people as they leave.

Overall, Nisioisin had to kill of Mayoi somehow. She was a fun character, but ultimately didn't serve to promote a higher progression in the storyline, just fun chit chat. Move over for Shinobu, Hitagi, Gaen, and Ougi to drive the main story.
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Old 2013-11-17, 02:51   Link #24
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Thank you Mayoi, you will be missed. Rest well.
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Old 2013-11-17, 02:51   Link #25
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I just can't believe that Mayoi is gone. She's easily one of my favorites and her banter with Araragi has always been one of my favorites(especially the "courage" banter). Monogatari with no more Mayoi orz
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Old 2013-11-17, 03:03   Link #26
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Forgot about this thread, was just torturing my heart by rewatching Mayoi's scene at least a dozen times. My body was never ready for it...

Bravo to Emiri Katou & Kamiya Hioshi for their spectacular performance in the episode.

Hurts having no more Hachikuji scenes. ;__;
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Old 2013-11-17, 05:46   Link #27
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The conclusion was rather sudden.

And because it was rather sad and shocking.

You'll be missed, Mayoi-chan.
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Old 2013-11-17, 07:56   Link #28
HandofFate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFalcon View Post
Overall, Nisioisin had to kill of Mayoi somehow. She was a fun character, but ultimately didn't serve to promote a higher progression in the storyline, just fun chit chat. Move over for Shinobu, Hitagi, Gaen, and Ougi to drive the main story.
I don't know about that, along with shinobu hijacking every arc, Mayoi is 2nd in hijacking arcs to always give araragi advice and direction to help solve the problem of the current arc he's in. All the conversations he had with mayoi was important in araragi's character progression and theme for their respective arcs. Where every other girl stays contained in their arcs and rarely appear outside of them.

The bit with Mayoi kissing Araragi, I guess you can throw the little kid spin on it, but practically, even though Mayoi's ghost is a little kid. She's been dead for 11 years or so before she met Araragi, so her form is a little kid, but her 'soul' is about 19-20years old.
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Old 2013-11-17, 08:32   Link #29
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T_T............................................... .................................

Hachikujiiiiiiiiiiiiiii WHYYYY I loved her appearances with Koyomi @_@....I'll miss looking forward to their next session of comedy.

Thinking about it, being "lost" with Hachikuji wouldn't work, since if they go about it that way...The place Koyomi wants to be is wherever Mayoi is, that's why they couldn't go back to town, at the time he wanted to go to where Shinobu is...

I think this is where Koyomi finally realizes his limits like Meme said...He can't solve all the problems of the people around him, he's been playing hero for everyone despite his circumstances....He would eventually run into something that he can't fix.
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Old 2013-11-17, 09:03   Link #30
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Okay so I've been roaming /a/ and /r/anime and I'm generally seeing the same type of reaction, full-blown denial of Snail's death and full-blown hatred of Ougi.

Some are trying to come up with scenarios where Mayoi comes back or she actually isn't gone. Well you know what, Mayoi coming back would be the WORST thing possible. You don't make an emotional scene like what we got and then ruin it with some deux ex machina. She NEEDS to stay dead.

However I do think we can bring "Mayoi" back in a way. When Araragi decides to settle down with whichever girl he chooses in the end, I hope he'll have a daughter and name her Mayoi. She might even be her reincarnation.

As for the hatred for Ougi, I think people are jumping to conclusions. She made it sound like she was Kurayami but are we really sure? She might be related but can we really say that she was 100% responsible? We'll have to see.
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Old 2013-11-17, 10:02   Link #31
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How the heck did Gaen even know about Shinobu's story? Is she really clairvoyant or something?

I doubt any human could claim ability of any kind similar to Kurayami. Just as there are different kinds of specialists, perhaps Ougi's area lies along the line of correcting oddities and she's perfectly fine baiting Araragi to do so.
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Old 2013-11-17, 10:30   Link #32
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Wow. Absolutely wow. I'm speechless.
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Old 2013-11-17, 11:30   Link #33
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Mayoi, don't goooooooooooooo!! ;_____________;

Similarly to how Mayoi's arc ended up being about Shinobu, this arc ended up being about Mayoi. I have to say I never expected Mayoi to disappear so suddenly. It was as much of a shock for me as it was for Araragi. I loved Mayoi and I've always thought she had the best chemistry with Araragi so I'm going to miss her a lot. Monogatari won't be the same without her. Goodnight, sweet princess.

When did the final scene with Ougi take place? Before or after Nadeko's arc? They're already suspicious of Ougi so I'm guessing after. What the hell is the goal of that girl, or should I say that thing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormenk View Post
How the heck did Gaen even know about Shinobu's story? Is she really clairvoyant or something?
I don't think an actual explanation is ever going to be given. She simply knows everything.
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Old 2013-11-17, 11:37   Link #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HandofFate View Post
I don't know about that, along with shinobu hijacking every arc, Mayoi is 2nd in hijacking arcs to always give araragi advice and direction to help solve the problem of the current arc he's in. All the conversations he had with mayoi was important in araragi's character progression and theme for their respective arcs. Where every other girl stays contained in their arcs and rarely appear outside of them.

The bit with Mayoi kissing Araragi, I guess you can throw the little kid spin on it, but practically, even though Mayoi's ghost is a little kid. She's been dead for 11 years or so before she met Araragi, so her form is a little kid, but her 'soul' is about 19-20years old.
That's also why Nisioisin felt she had to go. As the books go on, Araragi needs to figure out conflicts for himself to progress in character development, rather than have his friends give him the answers. Same thing for why Oshino had to leave in S1. Also Mayoi had a lot of constraints for how she could be used in a potential story given that only a few people could see her.

As for the kissing thing, yes, that's a popular trope for the Japanese to squeeze in the loli format. "No, it's actually ok to kiss that 10 year old appearing girl, or ok for you to think her butt is cute while she's in the bath. She's really 500 years old so it's all good in the hood!"
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Old 2013-11-17, 12:41   Link #35
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Originally Posted by MrFalcon View Post
Also Mayoi had a lot of constraints for how she could be used in a potential story given that only a few people could see her.
Couldn't she just stick around and at the end there be a 100 year time skip narration when all of his human girlfriends are dead saying something like Araragi, Shinobu, and Mayoi travel together dealing with oddities? I would've been perfectly fine with that since I care more about the characters than the actual plot when it comes to any piece of entertainment. Maybe I'm being biased here but meh, oh well.
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Old 2013-11-17, 12:44   Link #36
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Originally Posted by MrFalcon View Post
As for the kissing thing, yes, that's a popular trope for the Japanese to squeeze in the loli format. "No, it's actually ok to kiss that 10 year old appearing girl, or ok for you to think her butt is cute while she's in the bath. She's really 500 years old so it's all good in the hood!"
Girls in 10-year old looking bodies generally don't have much of a hood. Just saying. Admire the trunk all you want, though.
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Old 2013-11-17, 16:27   Link #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omimon View Post
Okay so I've been roaming /a/ and /r/anime and I'm generally seeing the same type of reaction, full-blown denial of Snail's death and full-blown hatred of Ougi.

Some are trying to come up with scenarios where Mayoi comes back or she actually isn't gone. Well you know what, Mayoi coming back would be the WORST thing possible. You don't make an emotional scene like what we got and then ruin it with some deux ex machina. She NEEDS to stay dead.

However I do think we can bring "Mayoi" back in a way. When Araragi decides to settle down with whichever girl he chooses in the end, I hope he'll have a daughter and name her Mayoi. She might even be her reincarnation.
As long as Nisio brought her back the right way it would be fine.
I have an annoyance with the thought of a revival making death cheap in fiction. If it is done right and NOT often, it is just fine. It doesn't take away from the lessons Araragi needed to learn and the pain we had losing her. We now know what he means to her, and what she means to him. So thematically, if he has a plan for Mayoi, I say we see what he can do rather than dread the possibility.

Basically if she stays dead, cool. If she doesn't, I'll wait to see how that happens before calling it cheap.
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Old 2013-11-17, 16:30   Link #38
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Dam i did not expect that to happen, sad to see Mayoi go.
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Old 2013-11-17, 18:21   Link #39
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Quote:
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When did the final scene with Ougi take place? Before or after Nadeko's arc? They're already suspicious of Ougi so I'm guessing after. What the hell is the goal of that girl, or should I say that thing?
It says "4 months later" on a text card and then 1st episode of this arc lists as "august 21sth" as a text card and Nadeko's arc began on "October 31st" and lasted a few day.

So this talk takes place well after it(January) and before the showdown towards her, which means Araragi is probably already suspicious of Ougi
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Old 2013-11-17, 18:28   Link #40
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Girls in 10-year old looking bodies generally don't have much of a hood. Just saying. Admire the trunk all you want, though.
Why don't you take a seat over there...
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