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View Poll Results: Haruka or Mitsuki?
Haruka, and respondent is male 258 45.50%
Haruka, and respondent is female 53 9.35%
Mitsuki, and respondent is male 216 38.10%
Mitsuki, and respondent is female 40 7.05%
Voters: 567. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2006-12-18, 11:02   Link #161
Mentar
Sore wa himitsu desu!
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Age: 45
This post have been tempting me to reply several times, before I thought better of it and closed the window again. But there's just too much meat on the bones to skip on it ... in other words, good one, even though I happen to disagree with most of your conclusions - NOW.

In fact, were I 20 years younger today, I might have written most of this myself, with the fire of decency and idealism in my veins. However, since I was exposed to a situation with alot of similarities to Mitsuki's (while others were completely different), I've got to say that life experience changed my mind in many key aspects. And since you took quite some time to write down your thoughts, I wanted to offer some - let's say food for thought in return.

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Originally Posted by Tarot View Post
Weakness as an excuse
Mitsuki says it herself, she’s a weak person; but still, she tries her best to look after someone she cares about. Granted, she isn’t too bright and consequentially the way she goes about it is completely wrong, but she is trying. I have to give her credit for that.
I assume that by the "completely wrong" you mean moving in on Takayuki after a year of waiting? Okay, but I'd keep some circumstances in mind here:

1) When she did it, Takayuki was completely tilting. He just carried a comatose patient out of her bed, and he was forbidden to see Haruka again.
2) He was tilting after she did exactly what I think you wanted Mitsuki to do
3) The likelihood that Haruka would wake up again AT ALL was very slim after a full year.
4) Seeing a person you (secretly) love fall apart is bloody painful.

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The part I really didn't understand though, is where instead of (upon realizing her fallacy) trying to correct it and take steps to become a stronger person, she willingly decides to remain a weak person and kind of 'try to have things work even so.' To me, that is a total mistake. It felt like she was too unwilling to try and solve (at least her) part of the problem herself, and let things play out the way they will.
That's lofty theory, but in real life, things are very different. Before I misunderstand you here, please elaborate what exactly you mean by "becoming a stronger person". Should she to pamper Takayuki like before, hoping he won't turn insane completely (he was clearly close)? Should she confess to him openly, but not force herself on him - rather give him time to think and come around himself? Should she call it quits and leave him to his own devices, forcing him to grow up and regain some independence again? Learn to overcome her own nightmare of guilt and unfulfilled longing and just take everything with a smile?

What exactly should she do, in your opinion? What would make her a "stronger person" in your eyes?

And one comment early on: I wouldn't really consider Mitsuki "weak", because at least she's actively _doing_ something. Some good things, some questionable things, some stupid things, but at the very least she's eventually acting on her problems. It was her who scrapped her own life plans to take responsibility and care for Takayuki. It was her who forcibly tore him away from the comatose Haruka to learn to live again. It was her who was pushing Takayuki to start leading the life of an adult again. It was her who followed her senpai's stupid advice to cheat on Takayuki to make him jealous and force a decision. And - most importantly - it was her who called it quits when it seemed obvious to her that she was indeed just a surrogate for Haruka after all these years. A "weak" person would have kept hanging on and lamenting. And a "weak" person wouldn't have survived the year of hell (this is something I personally know about very well)

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Now, that's fine if she decides to do that, but then IF that is indeed what she decides, she has no right to feel sorry for herself/whine about it later. The part that really irritated me, is that she does (whine/pity herself).
That was a VERY realistic part of the show. No matter how "strong" you pretend to be, when you see your personal life unraveling before your eyes, you cannot evade feeling sorry for yourself. It's just impossible. The only question is whether or not you remain passive or if you pull yourself together and ACT on it, to somehow resolve the crisis. And keep in mind, she did. SHE did, nobody did it for her.

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Taking Responsibility

Point-blank, almost everything both Mitsuki AND Taka did was half-a$$ed. This is just my personal preference here but if you're going to do something, for god sakes, do it right (or at least mostly right).
*cough*

I sincerely hope that you never happen to come into a comparable situation. Keep in mind, Mitsuki gave up an extremely promising swimming career to care for the invalid Takayuki. She obviously kept him afloat for a full year to a staggering degree, without laying any claims on him. You call that "half-assed"? I mean, for real?

Things like these put some extreme strain on you, not just financially/vocationally, but also emotionally. I know this from harsh personal experience. You'll also always be confronted with disappointments, because the one you care for doesn't show any progress at all. On bad days you wonder what you're doing all this for because it's natural that your efforts aren't recognized or even rewarded, it's more likely that you're exposed to ridicule and hostility for doing it. And heck, if I'd have had a reason to develop a guilt syndrome like Mitsuki, I'd probably have snapped myself

So the big question is, what should she have done? She was clearly at the end of her own strength to maintain the mask - rewatch the scene in ep5. That's no conniving calculating bitch deciding that NOW is the right moment to strike, that's a vulnerable young girl who sees the guy she loves go to hell in a hopeless situation.

At the same time, you can find yourself in a self-imposed responsibility situation you can't shed like a snakeskin even if you wanted. What if you just don't have the strength left to continue to pretend and need to leave the limbo? Either by being accepted or by being rejected, and consequently to disattach yourself again?

In other words, today I'd be very careful with words like "half-assed". What Mitsuki did in the first year was very extreme. I believe all this requires more than your idealistic self seems to realize.

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Long story short, Mitsuki needs to learn how to take some god dang responsibility for her actions.
I don't consider her "responsible" for Haruka's accident by delaying Takayuki. I think I should better say that because some strange esoterics have been construing such a connection in the past. And as I outlined before, her actions go WAY beyond anything what realistic "taking responsibility" warrants. And whoever disagrees here needs to grow up and see the world a bit.

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If you’re willing to put your feelings ahead of your (comatose) friend’s and go after her boyfriend, then by all means, do so—it’s your choice.
Keep in mind, Takayuki was on the way over the brink, and visibly, Mitsuki was too. Would Takayuki have been alive if Mitsuki had disattached herself and left him to his own devices, in order to get away from the hurt she couldn't take herself anymore? Would that have been "stronger"? What should she have done, hm?

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I’m not judging, I’m not saying right or wrong, all I’m saying is that don’t prioritize yourself above your “best friend” and then pretend you didn’t. Take some responsibility and do the right thing.
Which is?

Also by the way, if I'd be comatose in the hospital, I wouldn't want my partner to suffer like a dog for a year or longer. Hell no. I'd feel like a selfish bastard if I did, and demanded from her that she waits for me no matter what. And guess what, even Haruka doesn't really blame Mitsuki for it, as we learn in the anime. Why do you?

To wrap it up, we read the ep5 scene completely differently. You consider it a disgusting exploitation of a particularly weak moment in Takayuki's life, executed in cold blood with the purpose to finally take what's rightfully someone else's, because you always wanted it. I see it more than the crack of the self-worn facade which couldn't go on after seeing Takayuki get worse and worse over the course of the year, and who couldn't lie to herself anymore.

We're relatively close about Takayuki. I don't like him at all ... but at the same time I wouldn't want to be in his shoes. His reactions are all too natural and realistic - those who are pampered the most realize it the least. What made me so irate was primarily the lack of appreciation, and the lack of consideration for BOTH girls. If you want a "weak" character to spank, pick him. At least, in the very last episode (and only there) he redeemed himself to a major degree by giving about the only credible reason for picking Mitsuki there is: He realizes what she did, what he did, and that it's time for him to finally get his act together and do his part.

So, as a closing thought, the beauty of the show is that there were no real "bad guys", and yet we're treated to a wonderful first-rate train wreck. And while you're generally right with your "One should/shouldn't do that" comments, I invite you to consider the mitigating circumstances. I believe that you're a bit too optimistic about how easy or difficult it is to just DO what's "right" in crises.

Just a thought.
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Old 2006-12-18, 19:02   Link #162
Deathkillz
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omg! 2 walls of text i had to read through both of you guys get cookies for an interesting (indepth) argument ~ just to say mentar i support you all the way! mitsuki <3
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Old 2006-12-20, 05:02   Link #163
Tarot
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Talking Okay, everyone raise your hands for the big splash! - It's like reading a small book!

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That's lofty theory, but in real life, things are very different. Before I misunderstand you here, please elaborate what exactly you mean by "becoming a stronger person". Should she to pamper Takayuki like before, hoping he won't turn insane completely (he was clearly close)? Should she confess to him openly, but not force herself on him - rather give him time to think and come around himself? Should she call it quits and leave him to his own devices, forcing him to grow up and regain some independence again? Learn to overcome her own nightmare of guilt and unfulfilled longing and just take everything with a smile?
First of all, thank you for trying to clarify before judging here. Secondly, in response to your question I personally believe there are two different routes that Mitsuki could have taken that might have been ultimately better than the one she chose.
The first route involves a little of two things that you mentioned. The open confession + leave him to come to his own decision, combined with (not completely but provide him w/the bare minimum of help) calling it quits and letting him come back to himself, I think would have been a good course of action. Shinji was right on the mark about being careful not to let Taka become too dependent. You have to be very careful about helping manic-depressed people; they have a tendency to revert to a state of helplessness that can be difficult to get out of if all their needs are met while they are in that state. Eventually, though, many, if not most of these depressed people have survival instincts that kick in and say, 'I can't keep living like this, b/c if I do, things will get a lot worse to the point where there won't be anything I can do to fix them.' The end result usually follows them slowly regaining control of their everyday routines. (The reason I said Mitsuki should keep helping him after confessing is IF her confession throws him for a big loop [or if not and he just doesn't recover at a decent rate], she should do the bare minimum in order to keep Taka from getting sick/injured from literally wallowing in his own filth.)
The second route which I DO NOT recommend b/c it is by FAR the worse route to take, is comfort sex. The difference (from what Mitsuki did) being the NOT pursuing a full-time/official relationship afterwards. Reason: it gives him that distraction he needs to snap himself out of his downward spiral, but doesn't directly interfere (as much) with his current commitments. It leaves it open for the possibility that when/if Haruka wakes up, (and since they decided not to turn it into a full-time relationship until both had made up their minds about who they were truly committed to) being the understanding person that she is, I believe it would have definitely been possible for her to understand why Taka had a one-time fling w/Mitsuki, and thus be able to get back together w/Taka if that's what they both want. Pursuing the relationship post-sex nullifies that possibility (not that Takayuki couldn't choose to forsake his relationship w/Haruka for one w/Mitsuki).

Yes, Mitsuki does have extremely strong feelings for Taka, but let's switch this around for a second. If it were a guy who was taking care of an extremely upset, depressed girl, and he had sex with her, how many of you would call that "helping?" I mean, honest-to-god 'I'm doing this b/c I'm trying to do what's best for you and for no other reason,' helping? Even if he had some VERY strong feelings for her, he knows she's still got very strong commitments towards her (comatose) boyfriend, trying to distract her towards him and have her form feelings for him when she's very vulnerable is NOT cool (not to mention selfish). I know many people would call this taking advantage of someone, so I see little reason why since the gender roles are switched for this situation, it should be considered a selfless act of benevolence.

I'm not saying either one of these two courses of action would have been guaranteed to get a better result (and thus probably no dramatic anime), but based off of experience in real life I'd say they have a good chance.

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What exactly should she do, in your opinion? What would make her a "stronger person" in your eyes?
The short answer to this question is something along the lines of (once Haruka has woken up): being able to deal with the reality of the situation she's in instead of trying to go on with her little life (that was previously absent of Haruka) before her "best friend" woke back up.

The longer answer (containing the explanation) is as follows:
  • Being able to reign-in one's emotions to make the best possible (aka not the easiest) decision takes a strong person. Now, DO NOT misread this and think that the words "I think Mitsuki should have ignored her own feelings and sacrificed herself to make Taka happy" magically appear. That's not what I'm saying and so please do not assume that. In context of the anime I'd say that it takes a strong person to express their emotions at the right time, EVEN under extreme emotional stress (and before anyone says differently, it is possible to keep control of your actions under harsh emotional states, people do it all the time so there's nothing to say that Mitsuki was not capable of it).
  • After finding out that Takayuki is less-than emotionally (and dang near less-than physically) faithful to her, Mitsuki tries to keep him anyway! I know love is an overwhelmingly strong motivation for nearly everything, but where is this girl's dignity & self-esteem?! Most of the people (not just females) I've known throughout my lifetime who have allowed their significant others (boy/girlfriend/husband/wife/fiance/etc) to either emotionally or physically wander from their relationship for more than very brief periods of time, have been weak people, people unable to stand up to either their own emotions, or their significant others and tell them that they do not deserve to be treated like a 2nd hand item. Mitsuki makes it very clear at least twice in the anime that she doesn't like how Taka is being indecisive or not telling Haruka about their relationship, but she never gets the courage up to actually do anything about her discomfort until the very end of the anime where she falls victim to the feelings she's let build up over the course of time (and explodes in front of Haruka).
  • A strong person is able to come to terms with it (however slowly and painfully) when someone does not truly love them (much like Haruka). Mitsuki constantly denies this and just can't seem to understand why Taka isn't dropping Haruka like a stone for most of the anime. This could be argued, but Mitsuki I think on a very basic level going into the relationship w/Takayuki, knew that Takayuki had some less-than-residual feelings for Haruka. Yet, she turns out to convince herself what she desperately wants to believe- that Takayuki will eventually come to have feelings only for her (one way or the other). My definition of a strong person would be someone who doesn't need to convince themselves of a false reality (w/little or no basis) in order to act/make decisions, someone who can look at what's really there (a depressed Takayuki who loves Haruka) weigh the possible & probable outcomes of their actions (if Haruka wakes up, then I might be outta luck, I might never be able to get him to love me completely, there is a sight but not likely possibility that Takayuki will learn to love me as his one and only, etc) and then make a decision.
  • In summary, I define a strong person as someone who is able to deal with reality, make decisions based off of what exists in reality and handle it when reality comes crashing down around/onto them instead of retreating into what could be called a “private little dream world,” where everything’s magically convenient for them and life’s difficulties are not present.

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And one comment early on: I wouldn't really consider Mitsuki "weak", because at least she's actively _doing_ something. Some good things, some questionable things, some stupid things, but at the very least she's eventually acting on her problems. It was her who scrapped her own life plans to take responsibility and care for Takayuki. It was her who forcibly tore him away from the comatose Haruka to learn to live again. It was her who was pushing Takayuki to start leading the life of an adult again. It was her who followed her senpai's stupid advice to cheat on Takayuki to make him jealous and force a decision. And - most importantly - it was her who called it quits when it seemed obvious to her that she was indeed just a surrogate for Haruka after all these years. A "weak" person would have kept hanging on and lamenting. And a "weak" person wouldn't have survived the year of hell (this is something I personally know about very well)
Here is where I think you and I differ in our definitions of a strong person. Your definition (please correct me if I'm wrong) seems to be:
strong person = someone who does something instead of moping around.
My definition is:
strong person = someone who does the right thing instead of the easiest thing (instead of moping around)

I also feel the urge to address the actions you listed as evidence for Mitsuki being a “strong” person, because I do not believe these actions are as selfless as many people are making them out to be:
It was her who scrapped her own life plans to take responsibility and care for Takayuki.
Are you talking about the swimming career here? If so, I don’t see why people are making this out to be a completely selfless act. If you’ll remember, the first/last practice we see Mitsuki attending is the one where she does so horribly that the coach asks her “what is wrong with her” and says there’s no place on the team for someone who doesn’t want to be there. It’s obvious, she can’t concentrate. She’s trying really, really hard, but she can’t. Because of that, the coach basically asks her to leave. This doesn’t really fall into the category of “I’m giving it up because I want to,” it’s more in the “I’m giving it up because I [b]can’t[/u] do it anymore” category b/c for one reason or another, she’s unable to swim as fast as she was before. On the other hand, IF she was able to swim just as fast as before and was still headed straight on the road to the Olympics and she still decided to give it up to care for Takayuki, THEN it would be a selfless/self-sacrificing act.

It was her who forcibly tore him away from the comatose Haruka to learn to live again.
I’m not so sure the purpose for tearing him away from Haruka was solely to get him to “learn to live again.” Clearly, she wanted more from Takayuki than just for him to live life fully. She wanted him to live life fully with her. If the purpose was just for Takayuki to live life again, Mitsuki could’ve just as easily called the relationship off after he’d started getting out the apartment again. Takayuki would be saddened by it, granted, but I’m sure he would still know that he had Haruka if she ever woke back up. Either way you slice it, Mitsuki tearing Taka away from comatose Haruka is the most beneficial thing she could do for her own situation. I’m not saying she did it maliciously or to get back @ Haruka or anything (I think she actually did care for the girl), but you can’t ignore the cold hard fact of the matter that she does end up getting what she wants thanks to this “selfless act.”

It was her who was pushing Takayuki to start leading the life of an adult again.
True, I’ll give you that Takayuki started resuming daily life thanks to Mitsuki’s actions. My big thing is that I’m just not convinced that sleeping with him was the only way to do it.

It was her who followed her senpai's stupid advice to cheat on Takayuki to make him jealous and force a decision.
Again, this is the main one where our definitions differ.
Strong person by your definition: someone who follows stupid advice and cheats on their boyfriend = something
Strong person by my definition: someone who thinks and doesn’t follow stupid advice to cheat on their boyfriend = nothing (or possibly something different)
In this instance I think doing nothing (or something different) would be the best way to go.

And - most importantly - it was her who called it quits when it seemed obvious to her that she was indeed just a surrogate for Haruka after all these years.
Yes, now this one I will fully agree with you on because quite frankly, I was cheering for Mitsuki at this point. She finally grows a backbone and refuses to be a simple stand-in for someone who clearly doesn’t feel as strongly about her as she does about him. Come to think of it, this was the turning point for me in terms of how much I liked her character. The only thing I was lamenting about it was that that moment couldn’t have come sooner.

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That was a VERY realistic part of the show. No matter how "strong" you pretend to be, when you see your personal life unraveling before your eyes, you cannot evade feeling sorry for yourself. It's just impossible. The only question is whether or not you remain passive or if you pull yourself together and ACT on it, to somehow resolve the crisis. And keep in mind, she did. SHE did, nobody did it for her.
I completely agree with what you’re saying about how people will feel sorry for themselves no matter what. What I meant to imply by my original post, however, was that Mitsuki needs to accept that fact that she put herself in that situation, which is something she never does. She spends most of the series focusing on what she wants others to do, or how she wants things to work out. In regards to the acting part, I agree w/what you said about pulling yourself together to resolve the crisis. The problem is, that Mitsuki didn’t act to resolve the crisis, she acted and made it worse. (Granted, there wouldn’t be an anime unless she made it worse, but….) A quick runthrough reveals:
  1. Get your two friends together b/c they like each other (good idea)
  2. Find out you have feelings for one of the two
  3. Act on those feelings (BAD idea)
  4. Try to interrupt their spending time together to get that person’s attention focused in on you (not the best idea)
  5. Sleep w/someone’s boyfriend BEFORE he’s renounced his girlfriend (Bad, BAD idea—and while we’re on the topic I can’t think of virtually any real-life situation where this is actually a GOOD idea)
  6. Keep the relationship a secret from the girlfriend after she’s reentered the picture (again, not the best idea)
  7. Find out that your boyfriend has feelings for his old girlfriend
  8. Get fed up with yourself & your boyfriend for not dealing w/the situation directly/pussy-footing around the issue to avoid it and go sleep with someone who’d not your boyfriend (Bad, BAD idea—again)
  9. Realize that you’re no more than a psudeo-Haruka and end the relationship (Good idea)
  10. Mope around b/c you ended the relationship (WTF?)
  11. Have the old girlfriend break it off w/boyfriend so he comes crawling back to you (good idea for the old girlfriend)
  12. Be so happy that the guy who almost cheated on you (and basically treated you as his second choice for a looong time) is back in your life (bad idea—I still don’t know what she saw in him, but they end up happy I guess….)
All in all, if you think about it, it actually ends up being Haruka that resolves the situation (by dumping Takayuki), not Mitsuki. We all see that Mitsuki is horribly dysfunctional after she breaks up with Taka, so much so in fact that we actually start to worry about what’s going to happen to her. Thankfully though, Haruka makes the wise decision and dumps Takayuki’s indecisive butt and because of that he goes back to look for Mitsuki.

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*cough*

I sincerely hope that you never happen to come into a comparable situation. Keep in mind, Mitsuki gave up an extremely promising swimming to care for the invalid Takayuki. She obviously kept him afloat for a full year to a staggering degree, without laying any claims on him. You call that "half-assed"? I mean, for real?
Okay, I’ll say that up to this point Mentar, your arguments have been fair, well-thought out and responsive, but for someone who originally posted “I don’t think we’re really in a position to compare Mitsuki and Haruka b/c their situations are way too different,” you seem over exuberant about judging my character based off of one post that I wrote AND an incorrect assumption, not to mention the very colorful translation of “I think that Mitsuki’s giving up a promising swimming career to care for an invalid Takayuki, afloat for a full year to a staggering degree, without laying any claims on him is half-a$$ed,” that you inserted into my original post. My friend, I do not know what post you took that from, but it CERTAINLY was not mine. Did you even read the last 40+ lines of my posting (everything that concerned exactly what I thought was half-a$$ed)? NOWHERE in there does it say anything of that sort, so I fail to see where you’re drawing this ludicrous conclusion from.

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Things like these put some extreme strain on you, not just financially/vocationally, but also emotionally. I know this from harsh personal experience. You'll also always be confronted with disappointments, because the one you care for doesn't show any progress at all. On bad days you wonder what you're doing all this for because it's natural that your efforts aren't recognized or even rewarded, it's more likely that you're exposed to ridicule and hostility for doing it. And heck, if I'd have had a reason to develop a guilt syndrome like Mitsuki, I'd probably have snapped myself
Thank you for sharing that little bit of insight, but I’m not sure if you’re doing this because you think that either I or anyone reading this has not been through these experiences, or because you simply wish to share knowledge with us.

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So the big question is, what should she have done? She was clearly at the end of her own strength to maintain the mask - rewatch the scene in ep5. That's no conniving calculating bitch deciding that NOW is the right moment to strike, that's a vulnerable young girl who sees the guy she loves go to hell in a hopeless situation.
That’s pretty much what I saw in that episode. I don’t know how you got “conniving calculating b!tch” anywhere out of what I said, because once AGAIN, never did I say or imply that Mitsuki was a bad person or that she did what she did w/malicious intent.

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In other words, today I'd be very careful with words like "half-assed". What Mitsuki did in the first year was very extreme. I believe all this requires more than your idealistic self seems to realize.
Okay, this is sounding just a tad hostile, and I don’t know if that is your intent. Me and my “idealistic-self” however, would be very much obliged if you would go back and read my original posting more carefully in its entirety before you respond to it, so that you do not make mistakes like the two quoted above (and more quoted below). Once again, I find it amazing that someone with your ultra-accurate perceptional ability has graced us with your presence. Seeing as how you seem to be able to tell everything about a person’s personality by one thing that they write (WITHOUT any additional clarification), you must be a genius beyond anyone I’ve ever met personally. I was very careful about how I used the term “half-a$$ed,” you just weren’t very careful about reading the entire explanation. In fact, I wrote 40+ well-organized lines about why I thought that Mitsuki as a best friend and Takayuki as a boyfriend were jobs that both characters did in a rather “half-a$$ed” way.

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I don't consider her "responsible" for Haruka's accident by delaying Takayuki. I think I should better say that because some strange esoterics have been construing such a connection in the past. And as I outlined before, her actions go WAY beyond anything what realistic "taking responsibility" warrants. And whoever disagrees here needs to grow up and see the world a bit.
(scratches head) Did I say that I blame Mitsuki for Haruka’s accident? No…I think I must have schizophrenia or something because I’m totally lost as to what part of my post you’re trying to quote here.

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Keep in mind, Takayuki was on the way over the brink, and visibly, Mitsuki was too. Would Takayuki have been alive if Mitsuki had disattached herself and left him to his own devices, in order to get away from the hurt she couldn't take herself anymore? Would that have been "stronger"? What should she have done, hm?
Not that these wouldn’t be good topics of discussion, but why even bring these questions up? What’s the point? There’s no way to know what the alternate outcomes could have been, what would have worked and what wouldn’t have. It seems like they would just lead to mindless arguing about what may or may not have actually happened, had the situations been different—which is why I was intentionally avoiding saying things like “Well, she should have done this,” or “If they hadn’t done this, then Haruka would have never gotten in that accident.” I know these are dumb things to say, which is why I didn’t bother with them.

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Which is?
Doing the responsible thing in this case would have been to be honest with everyone, especially Haruka and each other (speaking about Takayuki and Mitsuki). A lot of the uncomfortable situations could have been avoided if everyone had just been more forthright about what they were feeling and what they wanted/planned to do about it. A large number of dramas (such as this one) rely upon characters not confronting the issues and being indecisive about their emotions.

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Also by the way, if I'd be comatose in the hospital, I wouldn't want my partner to suffer like a dog for a year or longer. Hell no. I'd feel like a selfish bastard if I did, and demanded from her that she waits for me no matter what. And guess what, even Haruka doesn't really blame Mitsuki for it, as we learn in the anime. Why do you?
Do I? Well, the psychic’s telling me that I do, so I must…I guess… Wait, no I don’t. Oh yeah! I never said anything like that now did I? Oy, dude, your (incorrect) assumptions are starting to get quite frequent—you may want to be careful here. (and I don’t mean the sarcasm in an impolite way, I’m just trying to add some good-natured humor) As for the suffering part, we’re on the same page. There’s no way I’d want someone I care about to suffer like a dog either. But I’m not ashamed to admit that if I said, “Honey, you shouldn’t waste your life sitting by my bedside day after day,” and they replied “You know what, you’re right. I gotta look out for my own happiness huh? See ya!” and got up and left, I’d dump-em first thing after I woke up .

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To wrap it up, we read the ep5 scene completely differently. You consider it a disgusting exploitation of a particularly weak moment in Takayuki's life, executed in cold blood with the purpose to finally take what's rightfully someone else's, because you always wanted it.
Really? Is that what I think? You’re on a roll here. Why don’t you tell me about my views on abortion while you’re at it. (Once again, keep in mind, trying to add humor here)
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I see it more than the crack of the self-worn facade which couldn't go on after seeing Takayuki get worse and worse over the course of the year, and who couldn't lie to herself anymore.
You know what the crazy-funny thing is? This is actually what I saw too. You know, it was a long post, I’m thinking maybe by this time you just forgot that I said that I sympathized with Mitsuki in the beginning (it was a looong time before this).

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We're relatively close about Takayuki. I don't like him at all ... but at the same time I wouldn't want to be in his shoes. His reactions are all too natural and realistic - those who are pampered the most realize it the least. If you want a "weak" character to spank, pick him.
You know…I think I spent the last 25 lines of my post doing just that (and I enjoyed every minute of it—still say he should’ve gotten dumped by both, but unfortunately that wasn’t a choice ). Although, I do agree with how realistic it was (I hope you aren’t implying anything about how realistic I thought it was, seeing as how I never said anything about that in my original post). I’ve actually seen a few guys in real-life that have done that.

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So, as a closing thought, the beauty of the show is that there were no real "bad guys", and yet we're treated to a wonderful first-rate train wreck. And while you're generally right with your "One should/shouldn't do that" comments, I invite you to consider the mitigating circumstances. I believe that you're a bit too optimistic about how easy or difficult it is to just DO what's "right" in crises.
OK, this is probably getting a bit old by now, but I feel the need to point it out so that you know what not to do next time you post. Did I say anything about how it was “easy” or how “hard” it was to do the right thing? No. Did I even imply that it was easy or hard? No. Come to think about it I don’t even think I addressed the issue of how difficult life choices are.

(I mean this in a helpful way) All in all, I think that based off of how much you are able to tell me about myself (which is based off of information gained from 1 posting) you are either very, very perceptive, or very presumptuous and (unfortunately) as much as the world would be benefited to have a very, very perceptive person, based off of the (approx) 6 items quoted above, you seem to be more the presumptuous type. I know I don’t know you very well or anything, but will you let me give you some helpful advice? Please, please don’t go judging a person’s character, classifying their personality profile, or telling them what they think until you’ve at least me them face to face.

The whole point of my (extremely long) post was that the reason you have for doing something does not change the (moral) status of the thing that you do. It may make it understandable, it may even justify it, but it does not change right and wrong. It is when we start to believe that it changes it that we’ll run into problems.
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Old 2006-12-20, 08:25   Link #164
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Whoa, that was long indeed

First, let me apologize for obviously getting you riled up about some (obviously incorrect) assumptions on your position, which I had derived from what you said before. That wasn't my intention. I think it all started about the discussion of Mitsuki's "half-assedness", which I based on this remark of yours:

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Originally Posted by Tarot View Post
Point-blank, almost everything both Mitsuki AND Taka did was half-a$$ed.
That's where we have to agree to disagree - because in my opinion, almost everything Mitsuki did was extreme. Being half-assed is one of the few things you really CANNOT accuse her of, IMHO. Anyway, no harm intended.

I'll reduce my replies to only those parts where I strongly object.

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The first route involves a little of two things that you mentioned. The open confession + leave him to come to his own decision, combined with (not completely but provide him w/the bare minimum of help) calling it quits and letting him come back to himself, I think would have been a good course of action.
I guess that this is the general direction I'd have tried to go too, but remember this scene. Takayuki has just returned from the infamous coma patient abduction and is near-catatonic. Mitsuki is on the edge of losing it and even slaps Takayuki silly to make him listen to her - without effect. What do you do now? Go home and try again, to come back to confess at a better time? Maybe so, but I wonder how you'd feel if something ugly happened in the meantime. Suicide in situations like these is not uncommon, and keep in mind, he just lost his anchor in live, being forbidden to see Haruka again. By acting here, Mitsuki is gambling on giving him a new focus (on HER), and by jumping his bones, she at least manages to rip him out of his state.

Objectionable? Certainly. Risky? Absolutely, but the alternative would have been risky either. Half-assed? (j/k)

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After finding out that Takayuki is less-than emotionally (and dang near less-than physically) faithful to her, Mitsuki tries to keep him anyway! I know love is an overwhelmingly strong motivation for nearly everything, but where is this girl's dignity & self-esteem?!
Oh, after sacrificing your career for someone (which is a big deal in Japan with its company-sponsored semi-professional programs) and living together with him for three years, fighting for the guy you love isn't all THAT uncommon. Are you going to throw away that much of your life for pride, especially since it's still not clear who he's going to decide on in the end? In Mitsuki's situation, you can conclude alot, but who says you're right? I think this criticism of yours is unjustified because once once she got a _confirmation_ for his Haruka fixation (the mumbling in his sleep and his lack of reaction to her confession of her one-night-stand), she DOES break up with him. And, to top off the irony, incorrectly, because we know from the narrative perspective that Takayuki was beginning to lean in Mitsuki's direction at that point.

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strong person = someone who does something instead of moping around.
My definition is:
strong person = someone who does the right thing instead of the easiest thing (instead of moping around)
I doubt that this is a helpful distinction, because this would require knowledge what the "right thing" is. Even we with our omniscient narrator perspective can't seem to fully agree on it. Persons who do the "right instead of the easiest" thing are what I'd call "smart" or "prudent". Or did you find evidence in the anime which showed that Mitsuki did have a conscient choice between what she considered to be "right" and what she perceived "easier" and where she chose the latter?

A "strong" person in my opinion is someone who manages to confront problems in real life, and who manages to act on it to resolve them, for the better or worse. A person who manages to suffer through hardships without losing the independence, and who moves on when (s)he has.

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[*]Keep the relationship a secret from the girlfriend after she’s reentered the picture (again, not the best idea)
That's what the doctor ordered. Keep in mind, it was Mitsuki who was consistently pushing to tell the truth, but Takayuki (based on the doctor's order) refused.

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[*]Realize that you’re no more than a psudeo-Haruka and end the relationship (Good idea)
And - again - _erring_ in this realization. Which is a morbidly-delicious irony. Takayuki used the very severe term "ai shiteru" exclusively for Mitsuki, and it was her he was hallucinating of before he collapsed. So much for the help of pride and self-esteem ^_^;

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Mope around b/c you ended the relationship (WTF?)
Err, no? After her dropping the ring in the cup, we only see Mitsuki a single time, and that was when she went to see Haruka in another well-intentioned but poorly-conceived attempt to convince her that the years in which she were together with Takayuki meant nothing - and that Haruka and Takayuki could easily resume their relationship with no harm done. Boy, did that backfire.

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[*]Have the old girlfriend break it off w/boyfriend so he comes crawling back to you (good idea for the old girlfriend)
Here, I'm sorry to say that IMHO you're completely wrong and seem to remember the final two episodes incorrectly. Mitsuki did no such thing. And more importantly, Haruka never dumped Takayuki. (see below)

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[*]Be so happy that the guy who almost cheated on you (and basically treated you as his second choice for a looong time) is back in your life (bad idea—I still don’t know what she saw in him, but they end up happy I guess….)
Based on what we can see in the anime, yes. In the game version, things were much clearer. Also, a slightly unfair criticism, because when Takayuki came back, she first resisted, because she did NOT want to get back to the old life. It took Takayuki some major convincing with the right reasons before she relented.

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All in all, if you think about it, it actually ends up being Haruka that resolves the situation (by dumping Takayuki), not Mitsuki. We all see that Mitsuki is horribly dysfunctional after she breaks up with Taka, so much so in fact that we actually start to worry about what’s going to happen to her. Thankfully though, Haruka makes the wise decision and dumps Takayuki’s indecisive butt and because of that he goes back to look for Mitsuki.
I sense alot of irritation in this paragraph - but sorry, that's not what happened, Haruka never dumped Takayuki, it was Takayuki who for the FIRST AND ONLY time in the anime acted like a man and made a decision by himself, and voiced it. Please rewatch episode 14. Please don't take his only real call in the entire show away from him ... also, Mitsuki was never shown as dysfunctional in any way. She wasn't shown at all, but she had no problem initially refusing Takayuki's wish to return.

No, what happened was something else: Takayuki wants to have a talk with Haruka by the end of ep13. His face is stern, Haruka realizes that this talk isn't going to be jolly. At the beach, they're making uncomfortable smalltalk until Takayuki steers the talk to Mitsuki. Haruka admits to have slapped her because she was so sad, and she gets up and under great strain proves her determination by walking to the sea, before she collapses due to exhaustion, having Takayuki rushing to her side. Here, Haruka wraps his arms around Takayuki's neck and strongly kisses him, but while he doesn't resist, he clearly only lets it happen and doesn't return it. With a visibly sinking feeling, she offers a weak "I thought that we'd always be friends... but that's not possible, right? (Yappari muri da neh?)"

Here, Takayuki admits to love Mitsuki. That he realizes that without her, he wouldn't be here today, and that he wants to heal _her_ wounds in return this time. To which Haruka replies, that three years _have_ passed by, and so the Narumi-kun she once pursued isn't there anymore...

In other words, when Takayuki visited Haruka, he did it with the intention to break up and explain it to Haruka. Haruka still fought for herself and tried one last time, but when she realized that his mind made up, she did a very admirable thing and YIELDED, sending him off in good grace with good wishes. Takayuki did not return to Mitsuki because Haruka dumped him, but because it was his own decision to try to heal HER wounds in return now. Haruka's shining moments were the gracefulness of her acceptance of defeat, and especially later, her plea for reconciliation so marvellously coded into her "Hontou no Takaramono" book.

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The whole point of my (extremely long) post was that the reason you have for doing something does not change the (moral) status of the thing that you do. It may make it understandable, it may even justify it, but it does not change right and wrong. It is when we start to believe that it changes it that we’ll run into problems.
So as long as we do what you call the "right/moral" thing to do, we don't? Or the other way round, are there no situations in which doing the "wrong/immoral" things might lead to a good result while doing the "right/moral" thing won't?

I believe that the difference between our positions is that you're much more inclined to seperate things in light and dark, while I accept a much higher degree of grey. KimiNozo is full of grey. Which makes it such a beautiful show
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Old 2006-12-20, 08:41   Link #165
Perishthethought
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Takayuki needs some defence here, and it's going to be a challenge. Takayuki doesn't love either of the women. He was, in actuality, going to escape the whole situation at one point and run away (by taking the government position and just moving away). This occurs when he has been formally offered the position and Mitsuki has just left him, leaving Haruka expressing a desire to have him relate the missing three years back to him. The Ayu-Mayu theatre section actually makes a joke about this (with Taka crying "Freedom!" after the two women leave him) at the end of the episode.

Takayuki decides (or rather, is forced by Shinji's violent intervention) to consider that this would be merely running away in its most literal sense and instead elects to resolve the situation, for both the women's sakes. For Haruka, this involves informing her about Mitsuki (even though he's too late when he does). For Mitsuki, and this is where Takayuki's main character flaw comes in, it involves readdressing the balance of servitude. Notice how Takayuki speaks about Mitsuki - his motivation for getting back together with her is essentially to heal her wounds and repay her for all the effort she went to in ensuring his wellbeing.

Takayuki is a terrible boyfriend, it's true. But this is what happens when you don't really love the person you're in a relationship with. He doesn't love Haruka (their relationship was based off infatuation, convenience, Takayuki's guilt complex and some serious meddling by third parties) and he doesn't love Mitsuki (their relationship was based off some frankly questionable sex and resultant obligation). His response to Mitsuki's requests for an 'I love you' are almost robotic in their execution and his awkward proceedural conversation with Haruka demonstrates their lack of a middle ground. He makes it work, though, because he feels he has to in much the same way he felt he had to tell her he loved her.

I don't think he's a bad person per se, or rather, not intentionally bad. To claim his actions are akin to someone playing the field is a gross misunderstanding of his motivation. As Akane said, 'too kind can be cruel'. And he is too kind, to a detrimental extent. He cannot abandon the sick Haruka due to his obligation towards helping her recover (and the 'spell' was not solely to convince her of his dedication but to help with her memory's recovery - remember he originally didn't want to do it and told her "we'll do it when you've recovered" but it turns out that it was the only thing she could possibly remember), and when you suffer as much inordinate guilt as Takayuki does (remember, he blames himself for her accident as well, he admits this to Akane), it makes it very difficult to refuse. We get shots of Haruka's hands shaking and her palid features when Takayuki considers ignoring her advances, reminders to the viewer and to Takayuki of her frail condition.

There are a huge amount of unfortunate coincidences and 'nearly' moments in this series that in most cases make Takayuki their victim. For example, in one of the episodes his bus pulls up just as Mitsuki is running from the hospital after having been insulted by Akane - had he arrived minutes earlier he would have seen her and no doubt comforted her (she's running in the opposite direction of the street as his bus pulls up - you can even see her in the distance as he gets off). Similarly, if Mitsuki would have come later she would have missed Akane and gone straight to Haruka's room to (possibly) tell her about Takayuki's relationship with herself.

He also, upon Mitsuki's request, attempts to ignore her and to take his mind off the whole thing has his nights of arcade games and wandering around. It is only upon seeing Akane while taking out the rubbish that he is convinced something bad has happened to Haruka (possibly as a result of his non-attendance) and he rushes to see what it is, ditching work and taking a taxi, such is his worry. His ignorance of Mitsuki in this period is a real puzzler. His motivation for doing something so hurtful is questionable - he's probably angry at being made to do something for his 'girlfriend' that could impact negatively (as he sees it) on another girl's health, and punishes Mitsuki for it punitively. Mitsuki's slapping of him in the previous few nights before (because some time passes between him stopping seeing Haruka and Akane appearing) is the ultimate insult because it demonstrates that she thinks Takayuki is incapable of being faithful to her (although he doesn't help matters by going eerily silent upon being asked if he still has feelings for her).

For all his kissing of Haruka and for all his 'nearly' sex, Takayuki's relationship with her is a pretence. It's a responsibility, it means nothing. He knows this and tells Akane point blank that it is, in the taxi ride home after he fondles her forehead. He's frightened to death of her getting worse and her reduction into a further comatose state upon Akane reaching breaking point and revealing the truth demonstrates this as a valid concern. Remember, he didn't even want to see Haruka in the first place - it was Mitsuki that prompted him and even promised to go see her together. Lo and behold, Takayuki expectantly cracks but it is Mitsuki, whose insecurity over their relationship demands a test (in much the same way as having relations with Shinji was a 'test') and who pushes him towards her.

Now, before we begin to think that I am painting Takayuki to be a saint, he most definitely isn't. He procrastinates, he's an idle, lazy and somewhat childish little man. He punishes Mitsuki terribly, he is callous and ignorant of her suffering, and is ultimately quite weak willed. But, and here's the crucial part, he's not vindictive in his conduct and when he tries to do the right thing, he always makes the 'right' decision (in his head). In a way it's easier for him to do the 'right' thing than the wrong thing because his moral compass is so unshakeable, it removes any reasoned appraisal of a situation (like kissing Haruka, for example). He's woefully short sighted - he needs to please, and he will do whatever he can to make the person in closest proximity to him happy. At work, he's at the floor all the time (they make a joke out of this in Gundam parody by having him slaving away in the engine room), with Mitsuki, at school, he was always carrying home her bag (apparently), with Haruka he has to make out he loves her. Mitsuki comes to the realisation that Takayuki is always kind to the person he is closest to (literally) and as a result their love was merely resultant from such proximity - and she leaves him after nursing him back to health.

So, he's not blameless. But he guilted himself into a relationship with an infatuated Haruka, felt obligated to the nursing he had at the hands of Mitsuki and felt responsible for Haruka's condition upon her waking from her coma. He tries to be a one-woman guy, and had Haruka not have awoken, he probably would have made it. If Haruka didn't have an accident, I'd wager he would have stayed with her. We'll see in the 'Haruka route'. But he is most definitely not attempting to play with the women. That he ended up doing so was not by design.
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Old 2006-12-20, 09:28   Link #166
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thats the problem with most of these male leads ~ they are unable to leave an emotion unattended or alone...but if you think about it if taka didnt do the things that he did there wouldnt be a story in the first place...if he had just been straight with the girls the whole time then he didnt have to suffer as he did ~

but as the male gene would have it ~ taka did respond to haruka's feelings (even if he didnt love her back) which caused all the future heart pains...but as time got along he did started to like haruka so it wasnt a totally one sided thing like you (perish) suggested ~ they even nearly had sex...

well thats when the tragedy hit home...haruka's accident caused him to fall into depression...why? because it showed that he did care for haruka in that way...it was a lot more deeper than when he first met her and altogether with the burden of it being his fault...it really cause the guy to fall under the weight

this lead on to misuki caring for him...being emotionally rattled as he is it was hard for him to accept any other forms of emotional care...but misuki didnt give up ~ she loved him and wanted him to do the same...when finally this got through to him i believe that taka did fall for her as well...

well with a new woman in his life naturally his memories with haruka would be diluted...and he started to devote his attention to misuki over the years (thinking that haruka would never wake up anyway) ~ well isnt this just selfish of him...but as i said before time moves on and you cant expect for a guy to wait for you to (if ever) come back to him...

well whe she did wake up this caused problems...he knew that he needed to help haruka get back to her life...by breaking the news slowly (hopefully) but already his heart is where misuki is...but dammit haruka effects him with guilt ~ so this causes him to waver between the lines ~ who to love?

its natural that things like this can happen but tbh taka is a very weak hearted young man...he just cannot make up his mind and struggles with his feelings...i see that he did love both of the girls at some point so he has the responsibility to tell them both straight...that would have saved a lot more tears...but it didnt happen...

then again...where would the stroy be if he did do all the things right?
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Old 2006-12-20, 09:50   Link #167
Perishthethought
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You'd be surprised how easy it is, when presented with almost exactly the same status quo as once before, to behave much akin to that time. Even the way Takayuki dresses relflects the regression of his mental state to that of when he originally dated Haruka. He tells her "I get to forget a lot of worries" when he's with her, he's essentially a child again, there's an optimism about it that he finds intoxicating. Through Haruka, he manages to recapture some of his lost youth. He knows he doesn't love her - even when they manage to get as close to doing the deed as they did, he still tells Akane that his feelings are merely a responsibility. He's playing a character somewhat in that he's the 'young Takayuki' around her, and he enjoys that feeling. It's a fascinating aspect of the series in that he can mentally revisit scenes from his past with a girl who still believes it is that time.

Try not to place too much stock in Takayuki 'almost' giving Haruka one. He doesn't, and the reason he doesn't is that he recognises the scar. He doesn't stop because he's somehow repulsed by her, it's because it is a graphic reminder that they are now in the present and that he has obligations elsewhere. He's shocked back into the present because up to that point in time, he behaves much as though nothing has changed and the more you behave in such a way and accustom yourself to thinking in such terms, the easier it is to get carried away.
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Old 2006-12-20, 09:57   Link #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perishthethought View Post
Try not to place too much stock in Takayuki 'almost' giving Haruka one. He doesn't, and the reason he doesn't is that he recognises the scar. He doesn't stop because he's somehow repulsed by her, it's because it is a graphic reminder that they are now in the present and that he has obligations elsewhere. He's shocked back into the present because up to that point in time, he behaves much as though nothing has changed and the more you behave in such a way and accustom yourself to thinking in such terms, the easier it is to get carried away.
actually i was talking about that they nearly had sex before the accident...and that it wouldnt have nearly happened if he didnt take a liking to her

oh yea its hard for him to forget...but still his love is too wishy washy...to be tempted by haruka on the hospital bed is quite shocking (that scar did make him snap out of it though as he remembered misuki...but to forget about her in the first place is dam bad in my books >.<)
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Old 2006-12-20, 10:09   Link #169
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In the game, I believe it is Takayuki who gets performance anxiety in that original bedroom scene and therefore they do not 'proceed'. In the anime, it seems like a consensual decision of deference due to Haruka's frigidity (read: discomfort) and impending Akane discovery. The reason they're in that situation is because it's almost as though they're following a script of what is expected to occur. They're alone, in the house (something Haruka is perfectly aware of), what else could happen? The mere fact that Akane returns to find Haruka's light on and Takayuki's shoes in the doorway means she's immediately put two and two together. To be in that situation and expect nothing to happen is hugely naive, which is interesting because we tend to think of Haruka as being that naive. We'll never know, eh?

Anyway, the reason his love is too wishy-washy is because it's not love in the first instance. It would take a man of Takayuki's constitution to let himself be carried away to such an extent, although I don't think you could say that he is consciously intending to cheat on Mitsuki at that point.
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Old 2006-12-21, 14:37   Link #170
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I voted Mitsuki, and respondent is female

I think that Mitsuki is lonely in her own way. She is forced to bottle up her own emotions to help her friend. But she's still human! It's her nature to want Takayuki for herself. It's only natural that, seeing him in depression, wants to help him, wants to let him know how she truly feels. I feel sorry Haruka because in her eyes, she sees a best friend who betrayed her took away all happiness she had just gained. But she was in coma for 3 years! She couldn't have known what Mitsuki was feeling and how hard it was to be in a relationship that you know you shouldn't be in; that if you didn't stop, you would hurt the friend who had put all trust in you.
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Old 2006-12-21, 15:06   Link #171
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I don't hate Mitsuki but Haruka still gets my vote. In my opinion, she had a far better personality, really sweet, and she's the quiet, shy girl, who I always seem to have a weakness for What happened to her was pretty tragic but in the end, she chooses to let it all go and begin life anew.
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Old 2006-12-21, 23:57   Link #172
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I always did dislike Mitsuki because of her taking advantage of Takayuki when he is most susceptible to female charms, so to speak.

Haruka and Takayuki were meant to be. Rawrrrrrrr~
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Old 2006-12-23, 01:10   Link #173
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Originally Posted by be0wulf View Post
I always did dislike Mitsuki because of her taking advantage of Takayuki when he is most susceptible to female charms, so to speak.

Haruka and Takayuki were meant to be. Rawrrrrrrr~
I totally agree and that's why i can't wait for the remake and this time i will laugh as Mitsuki's heart breaks hahaha

Well if they do a Haruka remake, it won't be as sad because the reason why KGNE made me cry before was cause Haruka didn't get Taky!
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Old 2007-01-05, 14:05   Link #174
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I voted Mitsuki. Why? Because almost all of you treat her like junk when all she did was follow her own heart. I'm curious, how many of you would you take a chance to be with the girl/boy you love if she/he lost her boyfriend when something happened (accident, argument, you name it)? Mitsuki tries to act strong like some girls but she isn't, it's no one's fault she fell for Taka. She wanted her friend, Haruka, to be with Taka but later she realised she loved him as well. There's a saying ... "Every good deed is punishable" ... it explains a lot if you think of it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm sorry for Haruka but things like that happen in real life ... there's another, more popular, saying ... "Sh*t happens!". Haruka was just at the wrong time in the wrong place, Taka and Mitsuki couldn't have any idea that she would get into an accident for a few lousy minutes of delay.
Open your eyes, people! This is a realistic anime, this kind of sh*t happens even in real life. I'm tired of people saying Mitsuki is a traitor/b*tch just because she did what she thought was best for both her and Taka. Cut the crap, if you were in the same situation, I bet some of you would collapse from the burden ...
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Old 2007-01-05, 14:41   Link #175
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I voted Mitsuki. Why? Because almost all of you treat her like junk when all she did was follow her own heart.
hey now dont go stabbing all of us as people like me and Mentar are mitsuki supporters...
okey generally what you said was correct but you should try to evaluate more ~ putting things as you did is gonna spark off some haruka supporter into a reasoning war which is not good if there isnt any meaning in it >.<
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Old 2007-01-05, 15:04   Link #176
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I said *almost* because even in other parts of the internet almost everyone calls Mitsuki a b*tch for betraying Haruka. Hmph!
And don't worry, I'm not gonna start anything, I just spoke my mind and played my part as a supporter of Mitsuki, nothing more, this might actually be the last time I reply in this thread if I don't have anything else to add.
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Old 2007-01-06, 01:01   Link #177
theblackskys
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Join Date: Jan 2007
I Feel For All Three Of Them!

I couldn't vote either.

I know how it feels to choose your best friends happiness over yours. It's hard. Mitsuki loved Takayuki when he set him up with Haruka. But she did it because her friend cared for him... but even then... she can't just change her feelings for him. She's still going to love him no matter what... Yes, I do believe she shouldn't have stopp Takayuki whom was on his way to see Haraku the day of the accident but she couldn't help it... she liked being near him.

From personal experience I know how it is. Set up your bestfriend with the girl you love and yet you still talk to them and want their attention because they mean so much to you. I favored Mitsuki because she cared for him all those years. 3 years is alot of time... and she did her best to make him happy. But he neglected her... I do not believe she should have slept with his friend... but what was she to do? The relationship she was in was nonexistant! Takayuki acted as if he didn't care about her or even appreciated all that she's done for him.

I feel bad for Haruka because none of this is her fought. She does deserve him but she was in a come for three years! What if it was longer? What if it was 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Did she expect him to wait for her? I can see it if he will always care for her and lover her but she can't expect him to stay with her... he had a different life... but then again... it wasn't her fought. She didn't want to get hit by that car. She never wanted to be in a coma. She never asked for any of it... she's just a really nice girl.

I can't choose either. This is an impossible decision Takayuki had to make based on what he felt. He isn't left with any good options... he's left with a really hard choice and i'm upset at the fact that he's not to open about it. He doesn't say how he truly feels or even follows his heart until the end... but then he wasfaced with a serious decision... I do believe he could have handled it better but he did handle it and thats what counts. I'm not sure if i'm happy with the way it ended. I really feel bad for Haruka... but then happy for Mitsuki... but I guess the meaning of the story is... follow your heart no matter whats the consequences and be true to yourself.
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Old 2007-01-10, 18:37   Link #178
NaruAc
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
I voted Mitsuki and I am a male.

I think Mitsuki ultimately deserves Takayuki for the long love she held for him and how she cared for him for three years. Furthermore, I think she and Takayuki belongs together for the guilt and pain they both feel, and even more the pain Mitsuki feels about Takayuki. I also like Mitsuki better because she is more realistic and passionate about Takayuki.

Though this is none of Haruka's fault, three years have passed and when she finds out about how long has passed, she starts to realize its over for her. She, finally, (in my opinion) becomes realistic and tells Takayuki it's fine to be with Mitsuki.

Oh and ... long live Mitsuki : D.
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Old 2007-01-30, 10:03   Link #179
depthcharge101
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
early on I like Mitsuki more, cuz she doesn't look so loli looking plus i don't like those weak and shy shy kinda girl...

but after they all matured, and the story progressed more and stuff, I pity more and more and in the end I definitely side on Haruka...

so haruka for me.
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Old 2007-02-01, 08:18   Link #180
Tinkerbell
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Haruka and Mitsuki became Takayuki's friend because Haruka liked him. But what they didn't take in to account was the possibility that Mitsuki would fall for him too. Haruka always liked him. Mitsuki on the other hand was always Takayuki's friend but those feelings developed in to a liking beyond just friendship. They say the best relationships come out of friendship so I'm sticking with Mitsuki on this one.
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