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Old 2014-08-16, 20:10   Link #421
zerozeronine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somerand View Post
Because the MCA is in his head, his instant regeneration activates using the MCA as it's origin. As long as the MCA isn't damaged he should be able to instant regrowth. The human body doesn't instantly die when the head is cut off, simply put his regrowth speed that surpasses cognitive ability is faster than death from having your head cut off. So he will regen using his head as the origin point before his body dies from decapitation.
But why does he have to be wary of his heart and head in the vol 13 spoilers?I mean cutting off one's head,it automatically loses it's oxygen supply.(But Deadpool did survive being turned to ice,shattered into tiny pieces and still regenerate in an issue of Uncanny Xforce vol 1,so it's kinda hard to tell how fast one can die in fiction.)
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Old 2014-08-16, 20:19   Link #422
somerand
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Originally Posted by zerozeronine View Post
But why does he have to be wary of his heart and head in the vol 13 spoilers?I mean cutting off one's head,it automatically loses it's oxygen supply.(But Deadpool did survive being turned to ice,shattered into tiny pieces and still regenerate in an issue of Uncanny Xforce vol 1,so it's kinda hard to tell how fast one can die in fiction.)
He has to be wary of his head because if for example his skill gets penetrated and his MCA damaged he's dead. Getting his head cut off at the neck shouldn't matter but if he got stabbed through the head and his MCA gets stabbed through he would probably be dead, aka he needs to be careful of his head getting hit directly, not cut at the neck.

The time for his regrowth to take effect is literally only a few milliseconds, the oxygen supply wouldn't matter in this situation to the best of my knowledge.
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Old 2014-08-17, 04:08   Link #423
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Destroy his head would obviously kill him, but from V13 spoilers he would die if he his heart is hit too, if you connect this to the sniper scene in V6 it makes sense. So his hear is also a weak point, but cut his head off would not kill him.
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Old 2014-08-17, 05:40   Link #424
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Reminder that the MCA is not a physical area in the brain, but rather the area in which the magical powers project themselves through the magician. Think of it as a filter of sorts.
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Old 2014-08-17, 08:46   Link #425
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
Destroy his head would obviously kill him, but from V13 spoilers he would die if he his heart is hit too, if you connect this to the sniper scene in V6 it makes sense. So his hear is also a weak point, but cut his head off would not kill him.
How did you come to that conclusion?

In the spoilers, it said that the pain he was receiving from the attacks almost cause problems with his processing ability. Now, just imagine how much trouble he would have if his head or heart were to be wounded.
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Old 2014-08-17, 09:09   Link #426
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Originally Posted by amtro View Post
Reminder that the MCA is not a physical area in the brain, but rather the area in which the magical powers project themselves through the magician. Think of it as a filter of sorts.
It's not physical but it is in the consciousness, like a thought.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ophis View Post
How did you come to that conclusion?

In the spoilers, it said that the pain he was receiving from the attacks almost cause problems with his processing ability. Now, just imagine how much trouble he would have if his head or heart were to be wounded.
Well, according to Flere he was tanking everything that doesn't include his head or heart, with the MCA in your head destroyed you can't use magic, but the heart has no importance for casting. It's not that he had trouble with his processing ability but that he was overusing it, like his grandfather, it was working but he would have died by overusing it. And I also connected this to the sniper scene.

Spoiler for Quote:


I don't see why he would try to protect his heart alongside with his head if he didn't think it could kill him, the restoration speed is near instantaneous after all and he was tanking all the other attacks.
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Old 2014-08-17, 09:36   Link #427
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How many First High students have seeing Tatsuya's persona Ooguro Ryuuya in action and what's the reaction after seeing him? (I know its old news, but the Volume again is a pain).
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Old 2014-08-17, 09:40   Link #428
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
Well, according to Flere he was tanking everything that doesn't include his head or heart, with the MCA in your head destroyed you can't use magic, but the heart has no importance for casting. It's not that he had trouble with his processing ability but that he was overusing it, like his grandfather, it was working but he would have died by overusing it. And I also connected this to the sniper scene.

Spoiler for Quote:


I don't see why he would try to protect his heart alongside with his head if he didn't think it could kill him, the restoration speed is near instantaneous after all and he was tanking all the other attacks.
Sigh~ I think you should read Flere's spoilers again.

Spoiler for Vol 13:


It clearly states that it was a processing ability problem. Tatsuya had to touch the P-Dolls to reconstruct the spell and was tanking the attacks so he could do this. Now, if he was to be hit on the heart, just imagine how much more pain he would feel. It's not a matter of wether Tatsuya will not die from a shot in the heart, the pain would interrupt his spells.
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Old 2014-08-17, 10:23   Link #429
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About the heart,if he instantly dies from a fatal shot to the heart he dies.For head,it depends if it's a kill shot shot,he dies.Regrowth doesn't work on the dead.

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Originally Posted by tuckersister View Post
How many First High students have seeing Tatsuya's persona Ooguro Ryuuya in action and what's the reaction after seeing him? (I know its old news, but the Volume again is a pain).


Spoiler for for question:
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Old 2014-08-17, 10:43   Link #430
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Originally Posted by Ophis View Post
Sigh~ I think you should read Flere's spoilers again.

Spoiler for Vol 13:


It clearly states that it was a processing ability problem. Tatsuya had to touch the P-Dolls to reconstruct the spell and was tanking the attacks so he could do this. Now, if he was to be hit on the heart, just imagine how much more pain he would feel. It's not a matter of wether Tatsuya will not die from a shot in the heart, the pain would interrupt his spells.
He was destroying and reconstructing their programs, right but it has nothing to do with his self restoration, when he was attacked he took care not get hit on the head or his heart, he was tanking the rest. Self Restoration is automatic, he can stop it only if he wants. The way I interpret it, he tanked the rest because he knew he could restored the injuries but he took care to not get hit on the head or the heart because it would be fatal, the continuous attacks activated his Self Restoration and they were so numerous that it started to overwhelm is MCA like Genzou or Miya. The need to touch is irrelevant for self restoration to work.
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Old 2014-08-17, 11:23   Link #431
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
He was destroying and reconstructing their programs, right but it has nothing to do with his self restoration, when he was attacked he took care not get hit on the head or his heart, he was tanking the rest. Self Restoration is automatic, he can stop it only if he wants. The way I interpret it, he tanked the rest because he knew he could restored the injuries but he took care to not get hit on the head or the heart because it would be fatal, the continuous attacks activated his Self Restoration and they were so numerous that it started to overwhelm is MCA like Genzou or Miya. The need to touch is irrelevant for self restoration to work.
oh god.... it's starting to get annoying already It clearly states that Tatsuya's problem was THE PAIN. It doesn't mention anything about MCA getting overwhelmed. Even if his Self-Restoration is instantaneous, Tatsuya still feels the pain from wounds. Stop creating BS arguments out of nowhere for your own convenience and read the damn spoiler that Flere posted properly.

PS: I don't know about the head but Tatsuya surely would not die from a shot in the heart.

Spoiler for Vol 6 Chapter 2:


Spoiler for Vol 8 Chapter 16:


Even if you shoot Tatsuya's heart, his "Regrowth" will heal him before the "state of death" can even been established.
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Old 2014-08-17, 11:56   Link #432
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oh god.... it's starting to get annoying already It clearly states that Tatsuya's problem was THE PAIN. It doesn't mention anything about MCA getting overwhelmed. Even if his Self-Restoration is instantaneous, Tatsuya still feels the pain from wounds. Stop creating BS arguments out of nowhere for your own convenience and read the damn spoiler that Flere posted properly.

PS: I don't know about the head but Tatsuya surely would not die from a shot in the heart.

Spoiler for Vol 6 Chapter 2:


Spoiler for Vol 8 Chapter 16:


Even if you shoot Tatsuya's heart, his "Regrowth" will heal him before the "state of death" can even been established.
...The processing ability was getting overwhelmed and a magician has processing skills thanks to the MCA, fatal injuries can lead to death, Honami was not injured severely but she still died, why? THe people he saved with Divine Left were not dead but they were dying.

I don't see how what you quote contradicted what I said. V13 spoilers indicated that getting hit at the heart was dangerous, same for the head(for obvious reasons). Tatsuya never got hit at the heart before and in V6 it mentioned that he avoided the fatal injury but still felt pain, it hints that it would have been fatal for him, it was written that he avoided that fatal attack and hit his lung. Then they talked about fatal attacks in general. I am not saying that I am 100%(even I find it odd that a hit on his heart would kill him) correct but by connecting the 2 it makes perfect sense.
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Old 2014-08-17, 19:08   Link #433
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...The processing ability was getting overwhelmed and a magician has processing skills thanks to the MCA, fatal injuries can lead to death, Honami was not injured severely but she still died, why? THe people he saved with Divine Left were not dead but they were dying.

I don't see how what you quote contradicted what I said. V13 spoilers indicated that getting hit at the heart was dangerous, same for the head(for obvious reasons). Tatsuya never got hit at the heart before and in V6 it mentioned that he avoided the fatal injury but still felt pain, it hints that it would have been fatal for him, it was written that he avoided that fatal attack and hit his lung. Then they talked about fatal attacks in general. I am not saying that I am 100%(even I find it odd that a hit on his heart would kill him) correct but by connecting the 2 it makes perfect sense.
getting hit at the heart was dangerous, but maybe that won't kill him instantly. he can use regrowth but if the parasite doll keep attacking him and damage him constantly that would be a very dangerous situation and he will die...... maybe........
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Old 2014-08-17, 21:42   Link #434
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
...The processing ability was getting overwhelmed and a magician has processing skills thanks to the MCA, fatal injuries can lead to death, Honami was not injured severely but she still died, why? THe people he saved with Divine Left were not dead but they were dying.

I don't see how what you quote contradicted what I said. V13 spoilers indicated that getting hit at the heart was dangerous, same for the head(for obvious reasons). Tatsuya never got hit at the heart before and in V6 it mentioned that he avoided the fatal injury but still felt pain, it hints that it would have been fatal for him, it was written that he avoided that fatal attack and hit his lung. Then they talked about fatal attacks in general. I am not saying that I am 100%(even I find it odd that a hit on his heart would kill him) correct but by connecting the 2 it makes perfect sense.
Did you even read the quotes Ophis posted? They clearly say he can regenerate from "Fatal injuries". When they say fatal injuries they mean injuries that are classed as one hit kills, a hit in the heart is a one hit kill even for Tatsuya but he can instantly regenerate from the dead.

"Even if the heart had already stopped, the brain shut down, the throat torn open, if that was the extent of their injuries then revival was still possible. Even an instantly fatal wound, as long as rebuilding the body and restarting the circulation of blood would have had even the faintest chance of resuscitating the person, his ‘Regrowth’ could be said to give life to the dead".

A shot to the heart clearly isn't fatal for him... He would regenerate from it like any other attack. The problem is his tolerance to pain. Obviously normally fatal hits to the heart or brain would interfere with his casting and cognitive reasoning momentarily which is something that gives the enemy an opening, which is not acceptable mid combat.

The reason he avoided the bullet in volume 6 is because he wanted to return fire straight away with magic, which meant he had to avoid the pain of the shot to the heart. Read carefully about "Regrowth could be said to give life to the dead". When it says fatal it means by a normal persons standards, Tatsuya will perhaps be dead for like 0.000001 ms before regrowth kicks in and revives him.
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Old 2014-08-18, 06:06   Link #435
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Did you even read the quotes Ophis posted? They clearly say he can regenerate from "Fatal injuries". When they say fatal injuries they mean injuries that are classed as one hit kills, a hit in the heart is a one hit kill even for Tatsuya but he can instantly regenerate from the dead.

"Even if the heart had already stopped, the brain shut down, the throat torn open, if that was the extent of their injuries then revival was still possible. Even an instantly fatal wound, as long as rebuilding the body and restarting the circulation of blood would have had even the faintest chance of resuscitating the person, his ‘Regrowth’ could be said to give life to the dead".

A shot to the heart clearly isn't fatal for him... He would regenerate from it like any other attack. The problem is his tolerance to pain. Obviously normally fatal hits to the heart or brain would interfere with his casting and cognitive reasoning momentarily which is something that gives the enemy an opening, which is not acceptable mid combat.

The reason he avoided the bullet in volume 6 is because he wanted to return fire straight away with magic, which meant he had to avoid the pain of the shot to the heart. Read carefully about "Regrowth could be said to give life to the dead". When it says fatal it means by a normal persons standards, Tatsuya will perhaps be dead for like 0.000001 ms before regrowth kicks in and revives him.
Why Honami died then? Do you think that Tatsuya would have succeeded to save Miyuki and Miya had he not appeared in time?

Fatal attacks are not necessarily instant death for me, the people he saved were agonizing, they were not dead yet, their fatal injuries were killing him. Mist Dispersion on the whole body, Cocytus, Rupture, their are fatal attacks leading to death upon contact, true one hit kills(Cocytus kills the mind at least). He naturally would want to return fire with magic, that's the only thing he could do, he was attacked after all. The text says "even if he avoided a fatal attack, the blow still pierced his lung.", it means it was a fatal for him, that's how I interpret it here and after this there is
Quote:
The wound from the attack had already healed itself. Normally, even
fatal injuries would disappear in a flash so long as his magic was
active.
Still, that did not mean he could not feel pain.
Here I interpret it as fatal injuries in general. Anyway, I was saying that the fact that he was tanking everything excepted attacks targeting his head or his heart are reasons good enough to reach this conclusion. Hits to the head can clearly be fatal to him, if he doesn't risk death I don't see why he would take care of avoiding hits targeting his heart when he is tanking everything else. The sniper example was just to support my argument. You can disregard it if you want and tell me how that would make sense for him to avoid heart attacks.
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Old 2014-08-18, 07:03   Link #436
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
Why Honami died then? Do you think that Tatsuya would have succeeded to save Miyuki and Miya had he not appeared in time?

Fatal attacks are not necessarily instant death for me, the people he saved were agonizing, they were not dead yet, their fatal injuries were killing him. Mist Dispersion on the whole body, Cocytus, Rupture, their are fatal attacks leading to death upon contact, true one hit kills(Cocytus kills the mind at least). He naturally would want to return fire with magic, that's the only thing he could do, he was attacked after all. The text says "even if he avoided a fatal attack, the blow still pierced his lung.", it means it was a fatal for him, that's how I interpret it here and after this there is


Here I interpret it as fatal injuries in general. Anyway, I was saying that the fact that he was tanking everything excepted attacks targeting his head or his heart are reasons good enough to reach this conclusion. Hits to the head can clearly be fatal to him, if he doesn't risk death I don't see why he would take care of avoiding hits targeting his heart when he is tanking everything else. The sniper example was just to support my argument. You can disregard it if you want and tell me how that would make sense for him to avoid heart attacks.
It has already been explained perfectly clearly above why he can survive blows to the heart and how. There's even quotes from the light novel saying he can. I don't need to explain in any further, it's pretty clear.

We don't know the extent to which he can heal other people or the speed to which he can do so. The reason he can survive normally fatal blows himself is the speed of his regrowth that surpasses cognitive reasoning. When he uses it on other people clearly he needs his cognitive reasoning to think, to do so. In other words it's slower when casting on other people and they likely can't be brought back from instantly fatal attacks (Although it has never been stated to be impossible so who knows?).

Yes it was fatal for him, if he got shot in the heart he would be dead for a tiny amount of time (Milliseconds) Before regrowth repaired him and kick started his circulation at a rate beyond cognitive reasoning. As for why he avoided hits to the heart Ophis clearly explained it above. It's because the pain of a hit to the heart would interfere with his magic.
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Old 2014-08-18, 08:00   Link #437
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It has already been explained perfectly clearly above why he can survive blows to the heart and how. There's even quotes from the light novel saying he can. I don't need to explain in any further, it's pretty clear.
I take it as you evading the question. Regrowth "could be said" to give life to the dead, it doesn't revive the dead, when you are dead it's over. You don't want tell me why Honami died and can't affirm with certitude that he would have been able to save Miyuki and Miya had he come several minutes later at least. There are no quotes mentioning that he would survive hits to the heart but quotes mentioning that he can restore fatal attacks, you won't find a single quote with something like "Tatsuya can restore himself if hit to the heart" I am sure of it.

Quote:
We don't know the extent to which he can heal other people or the speed to which he can do so. The reason he can survive normally fatal blows himself is the speed of his regrowth that surpasses cognitive reasoning.
It's not because it surpasses cognitive reasoning, the others are unable to see the magic operating when activated, the effects of the magic who hit him and the magicians noticing the activation are 2 different things. Tatsuya got hit by Air Bullets, Air Bullet tooke effect but Mayumi and co didn't notice Regrowth activating and operating.

Quote:
When he uses it on other people clearly he needs his cognitive reasoning to think, to do so. In other words it's slower when casting on other people and they likely can't be brought back from instantly fatal attacks (Although it has never been stated to be impossible so who knows?).
I don't really see what cognitive reasoning has to do here either, it is slower because he has to select a target and use Divine Left on it, once the target is hit it will be restored as fast as if it was cast on himself. It won't be noticed by the cognitive reasoning of anyone too, they will be healed in a flash, Self Restoration is ready to activate at anytime because the target is his body, the restoration speed is the same.
It doe'snt make sense for Regrowth to be able to give life to instantly fatal attacks because once they are hit they are already dead. No way someone can be alive after getting hit by Mist Dispersion on the whole body, same for Rupture and Cocytus, the best he could do would be to restore the body to his former state but it would be a lifeless body.


Quote:
es it was fatal for him, if he got shot in the heart he would be dead for a tiny amount of time (Milliseconds) Before regrowth repaired him and kick started his circulation at a rate beyond cognitive reasoning. As for why he avoided hits to the heart Ophis clearly explained it above. It's because the pain of a hit to the heart would interfere with his magic.
It's BS, pain as no importance for calculations, he was tanking all the other hits, to the point it was overwhelming his MCA and yet he took care to protect his head and heart, he should have felt more than enough pain. Besides, pain has no importance when casting magic, Genzou was in a similar case and he was able to use Grim Reaper without problems, Genzou is certainly not more accustomed to pain than Tatsuya who got tortured and he was more on the verge of death than him, considering that his MCA got overwhelmed and killed him.

Spoiler for Quote:


And Regrowth is constantly active so Tatsuya's situation was very similar to Genzou's, who had already activated his magic.
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Old 2014-08-18, 08:54   Link #438
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Originally Posted by Echizen777 View Post
I take it as you evading the question. Regrowth "could be said" to give life to the dead, it doesn't revive the dead, when you are dead it's over. You don't want tell me why Honami died and can't affirm with certitude that he would have been able to save Miyuki and Miya had he come several minutes later at least. There are no quotes mentioning that he would survive hits to the heart but quotes mentioning that he can restore fatal attacks, you won't find a single quote with something like "Tatsuya can restore himself if hit to the heart" I am sure of it.


It's not because it surpasses cognitive reasoning, the others are unable to see the magic operating when activated, the effects of the magic who hit him and the magicians noticing the activation are 2 different things. Tatsuya got hit by Air Bullets, Air Bullet tooke effect but Mayumi and co didn't notice Regrowth activating and operating.



I don't really see what cognitive reasoning has to do here either, it is slower because he has to select a target and use Divine Left on it, once the target is hit it will be restored as fast as if it was cast on himself. It won't be noticed by the cognitive reasoning of anyone too, they will be healed in a flash, Self Restoration is ready to activate at anytime because the target is his body, the restoration speed is the same.
It doe'snt make sense for Regrowth to be able to give life to instantly fatal attacks because once they are hit they are already dead. No way someone can be alive after getting hit by Mist Dispersion on the whole body, same for Rupture and Cocytus, the best he could do would be to restore the body to his former state but it would be a lifeless body.




It's BS, pain as no importance for calculations, he was tanking all the other hits, to the point it was overwhelming his MCA and yet he took care to protect his head and heart, he should have felt more than enough pain. Besides, pain has no importance when casting magic, Genzou was in a similar case and he was able to use Grim Reaper without problems, Genzou is certainly not more accustomed to pain than Tatsuya who got tortured and he was more on the verge of death than him, considering that his MCA got overwhelmed and killed him.

Spoiler for Quote:


And Regrowth is constantly active so Tatsuya's situation was very similar to Genzou's, who had already activated his magic.
You can be sure of it all you want, but you would be wrong.

"Even if the heart had already stopped, the brain shut down, the throat torn open, if that was the extent of their injuries then revival was still possible. Even an instantly fatal wound, as long as rebuilding the body and restarting the circulation of blood would have had even the faintest chance of resuscitating the person, his ‘Regrowth’ could be said to give life to the dead.
But once the state of death had been established, he was helpless."


Even with his heart stopped or his body momentarily dead he can come back. People die momentarily around the world on a regular basis. Have you never heard of a case of a dead person being resuscitated? If not I suggest you go google some real world cases. In Tatsuya's case it is similar to this except at a speed that is beyond cognitive reasoning. His heart would near instantly restore and his blood circulation would restart within a few milliseconds. It's just that the few milliseconds that regrowth takes to activate isn't enough to establish a permanent state of death.

You can call the pain interference BS all you want but apparently it's a outright stated fact in volume 13 so just accept it.
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Old 2014-08-19, 06:01   Link #439
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Chiaki hates Tatsuya but Tatsuya couldn't less. He clean up the mess she was partially responsible. I'm really puzzled in how their relation is during and after the incident.

I do believe Tatsuya doesn't hate her, just chooses to ignore her. Hopefull there will be more interactions now that they are in the same Magic Engineers course.

Again, Chiaki is blaming Tatsuya when it's herself is to blame.
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Old 2014-08-19, 09:15   Link #440
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I am extremely annoyed with the way most people who know of his true identities treat him, the only one who is really wary of him is Maya, but for the rest..
From what I've read from vol13 I don't understand most of the action taken toward Tatsuya. Kazama's superior officer was so afraid of Maya even when all she was doing was talking to her on the phone, just because she's one of the strongest magicians in the world and daughter of a guy who could kill someone without being present, even though she must've known Maya's specialty lies in light magic rather than mental interference.
First we have Fujiyabashi, I understand that she was in a difficult spot and had to obey her grandfather's orders, but come on, she's someone who knows of Tatsuya's abilities and personality first hand, did she really think she can just fool him and he wouldn't find out ? What if something went wrong and Miyuki got hurt, did she not think that maybe Tatsuya will slaughter her entire clan ?
Kamaza is also a character that I hate, he only sees Tatsuya as a useful tool and in vol13 his argument is just retarded, "I am his superior so I don't have any reason to give him infos". Tatsuya doesn't care about his country or what happens to it, the only reason he joined the army is to gain more allies when he needed them, the army got the best strategic class magician in the entire universe, one of the strongest combat magicians in the world with abilities that no one can imitate and the best magic engineer there is who even designed their mobile suits and all Tatsuya wanted in return was for them to give him infos when he needs them and the likes, yet Kazama pulls a retarded excuse not to and doesn't even seem to care what would happen if Tatsuya finds out about this.
Then you have Kudou who is also trying to toy with Tatsuya and make him fight his dolls to prove their combat prowess.

To me it seems that the author is making almost every non fodder adult character in the series underestimate Tatsuya's intelligence and power.
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