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Old 2013-06-04, 10:09   Link #1181
AmeNoJaku
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Join Date: Apr 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aohige View Post
WE HAZ FOOD GOOD FOOD.
And they don't cost arm, leg, and a kidney like dem fancy snobby Kyotonians!
Yes, Osaka and Hiroshima have the best food in Honshu, and is usually cheaper then in Kyoto and Tokyo. But that was part of my original point, not explicitly stated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aohige View Post
Well, and a freakin' castle of former ruler of Japan in smack middle of the city.
Oh! that 90's (as in 1990's) reconstruction? and which ruler Hideyoshi? he died while the castle was being built and his son living there was never a ruler of anything, rather spend his short years trapped inside by the besieging Tokugawa rulers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
I thought Osaka is the centre of Yakuza activities.

Which means I can find pink salons manned by loli JS and JK! Hell yeah!
That would be Kobe, nearby

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
Speaking of Izumo....that place should be a must go for anyone interested in Shinto.

Much much better than Ise
I disagree, the kami of Ise is much more important then the one in Izumo and the complex much more vast and varied, on the other hand some structures in Izumo are really otherworldy, nevertheless both grand shrines are magnificent and it will be a tough call which to visit after the more accessible (and popular) ones in Kyushu and Kyoto.
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Old 2013-06-04, 10:27   Link #1182
Cosmic Eagle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmeNoJaku View Post

I disagree, the kami of Ise is much more important then the one in Izumo and the complex much more vast and varied, on the other hand some structures in Izumo are really otherworldy, nevertheless both grand shrines are magnificent and it will be a tough call which to visit after the more accessible (and popular) ones in Kyushu and Kyoto.
Ever since Amaterasu's cult gained prominence of course. Izumo is apparently the oldest.

Plus I still can't believe it used to be 10 storeys tall....
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Old 2013-06-04, 11:20   Link #1183
AmeNoJaku
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Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
Ever since Amaterasu's cult gained prominence of course. Izumo is apparently the oldest.
The worship of Amaterasu was always prominent among the nobility... as for which is the oldest, both were mentioned in Nihon Shoki, so I have no clue... and in any case they are much younger then most monuments in the Mediterranean so to me this matter is trivial.

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Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
Plus I still can't believe it used to be 10 storeys tall....
I need more proof then the basis of the supposed staircase's pillars to be persuaded.
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Old 2013-06-04, 13:45   Link #1184
Kirarakim
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I've been to Kyoto and Osaka, I personally preferred Kyoto (sorry Aohige)

I will probably try to go back to Osaka one evening though on this next trip.

The one thing I did really enjoy about Osaka is the aquarium. That was very nice. There was also a cool Ferris wheel there, but I didn't go because my friend wouldn't go up with me and I didn't want to go alone.
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Old 2013-06-04, 14:04   Link #1185
aohige
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmeNoJaku View Post
Oh! that 90's (as in 1990's) reconstruction? and which ruler Hideyoshi? he died while the castle was being built and his son living there was never a ruler of anything, rather spend his short years trapped inside by the besieging Tokugawa rulers.
Oh please. As if any of the castles are not repaired and reconstructed.
The castle has always been there, even back when I was born there in the 70s, it's not like they built that thing out of nowhere in the 1990s.
Hell, I bet you weren't even BORN when I was taking a stroll through the castle!

Also, details, details. I can just SMELL your hate on the monkey, I KNEW you were one of those east-biased Osaka hater, ya Kantou spy!
The whores of the sneaky fat tanuki always piss on history and never acknowledged Toyotomi first ruled Japan.

Jokes aside, I do think you're being a wee bit unfairly judgmental and pessimistic about the Osaka castle.
EDIT: Or, rather, looking your posts above, it seems about sites in general.
Yikes, I'm starting to read your critiques imagining your avatar as "Jigoku no Misawa" style! lol

Last edited by aohige; 2013-06-04 at 15:07.
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Old 2013-06-04, 15:44   Link #1186
AmeNoJaku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aohige View Post
Oh please. As if any of the castles are not repaired and reconstructed.
The castle has always been there, even back when I was born there in the 70s, it's not like they built that thing out of nowhere in the 1990s.
Hell, I bet you weren't even BORN when I was taking a stroll through the castle!

Also, details, details. I can just SMELL your hate on the monkey, I KNEW you were one of those east-biased Osaka hater, ya Kantou spy!
The whores of the sneaky fat tanuki always piss on history and never acknowledged Toyotomi first ruled Japan.

Jokes aside, I do think you're being a wee bit unfairly judgmental and pessimistic about the Osaka castle.
EDIT: Or, rather, looking your posts above, it seems about sites in general.
Yikes, I'm starting to read your critiques imagining your avatar as "Jigoku no Misawa" style! lol
You know there is a reason why they say that there are only 12 original castles left, because the rest are modern reconstructions... not reparations, renovations, etc. but complete modern reconstructions of at least the main keep. In Osaka castle's case if I remember correctly only the outer wall remained from the original complex after the WW2.
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Old 2013-06-04, 17:47   Link #1187
Soliloquy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Can you be a little bit more specific about your interests? That's like saying "I like food. What do you recommend I eat?"

I like Osaka and Kyoto, though they could hardly be more different. The fact that they're only 14 minutes apart on the Shinkansen makes that fact especially delightful. Kobe is an interesting place too, often overlooked.
I know Kyoto has a lot of temples and shrines. I'd like to go to some of the popular temples. And you mentioned Philosopher's Path. I would like to go there. There are already a few temples I will visit in mind like Kiyomizu Temple and Kinkakuji. Are there any more famous ones that I should visit? I also want to know if Manga museum is in Kyoto. For now all I want to do is visit any well-known place in Kyoto. I can't visit them all, since I'm staying there for only a week or so.

AS for Osaka, I do know where to go as far as I'm aware, I don't know any historical place in Osaka. Also I wonder if it's cheap getting around in Shinkansen.
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Old 2013-06-04, 19:07   Link #1188
Guardian Enzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soliloquy View Post
I know Kyoto has a lot of temples and shrines. I'd like to go to some of the popular temples. And you mentioned Philosopher's Path. I would like to go there. There are already a few temples I will visit in mind like Kiyomizu Temple and Kinkakuji. Are there any more famous ones that I should visit? I also want to know if Manga museum is in Kyoto. For now all I want to do is visit any well-known place in Kyoto. I can't visit them all, since I'm staying there for only a week or so.

AS for Osaka, I do know where to go as far as I'm aware, I don't know any historical place in Osaka. Also I wonder if it's cheap getting around in Shinkansen.
Kyoto has endless worthwhile temples and shrines indeed. Among the "greatest hits" I adore Kiyomizudera and Fushimi Inari, and I'd skip the overrated Ginkajuji and Kinkajuji. Less well known is the sublimely beautiful Ishiyamadera (Lady Murasaki lived there for a time while writing Genji Monogatari) in Otsu, about 20 minutes by train. The manga museum is very worthwhile if you love manga - there's no other place like it. I also highly recommend Uji, where the Phoenix Pavilion is located, just about 15 minutes by train.

If you don't have a JR or Kansai Pass no, Shinkansen isn't worth it between Kyoto and Osaka. You can get there on an express in about 25 minutes much cheaper. It's true that Osaka doesn't have that much of historical significance compared to Kyoto, but there is some stuff - while the castle is concrete, there are some historically important sights surrounding it. There's also Jinaimachi, a very well-preserved district a short train ride from the center of town. The headline in Osaka, really, is great food and some interesting nightlife. There's also Den-Den Town, Osaka's Akihabara.
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Old 2013-06-04, 21:20   Link #1189
Soliloquy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Kyoto has endless worthwhile temples and shrines indeed. Among the "greatest hits" I adore Kiyomizudera and Fushimi Inari, and I'd skip the overrated Ginkajuji and Kinkajuji. Less well known is the sublimely beautiful Ishiyamadera (Lady Murasaki lived there for a time while writing Genji Monogatari) in Otsu, about 20 minutes by train. The manga museum is very worthwhile if you love manga - there's no other place like it. I also highly recommend Uji, where the Phoenix Pavilion is located, just about 15 minutes by train.
That was the info I needed. Thank you. Ok, I'll probably ignore the Kinkakuji if I don't have the time to look at everything.
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Old 2013-06-04, 22:19   Link #1190
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by Soliloquy View Post
That was the info I needed. Thank you. Ok, I'll probably ignore the Kinkakuji if I don't have the time to look at everything.
How many days will you be in Kyoto. I wouldn't purposely skip anything, although there is no way to see everything. first research shrines & temples in Kyoto & see what interests you, not everyone is going to have the same tastes.

Actually there is a wealth of information at Kyoto station telling you which buses to take to get to different temples. Kyoto is very tourist friendly.

Be prepared to spend a good anount of time at Fushimi Inari & Kiyomizu Dera.
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Old 2013-06-05, 02:38   Link #1191
Soliloquy
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
How many days will you be in Kyoto. I wouldn't purposely skip anything, although there is no way to see everything. first research shrines & temples in Kyoto & see what interests you, not everyone is going to have the same tastes.

Actually there is a wealth of information at Kyoto station telling you which buses to take to get to different temples. Kyoto is very tourist friendly.

Be prepared to spend a good anount of time at Fushimi Inari & Kiyomizu Dera.
About 9-10 days I'm going to be in Kyoto. Kiyomizu Dera has already been recommended a few times, I'll be definitely going there and one of the other historical spot I'd go is Toji-ji. There are a few other temples I had in mind, I will have to keep checking the guidebook.
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Old 2013-06-05, 03:46   Link #1192
AmeNoJaku
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How could I forget Kiyomizu-dera Along with Fushimi Inari, Nijo-jo and the two Pavilions are the must go if one has only one day in the city... but Hell 9-10 days, you can really see everything

Anyway, I strongly recommend at least a day-trip to Nara, and another to Hiei monastery complex. Also if you want an original flatland castle Hikone is a little more then an hour train ride (since Himeji is still re-innovated), otherwise you can stick to Osaka Castle, and make Aohige proud
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Old 2013-06-05, 04:14   Link #1193
Guardian Enzo
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Originally Posted by Soliloquy View Post
About 9-10 days I'm going to be in Kyoto. Kiyomizu Dera has already been recommended a few times, I'll be definitely going there and one of the other historical spot I'd go is Toji-ji. There are a few other temples I had in mind, I will have to keep checking the guidebook.
If you're in late in the month - 25th I think - To-ji has a huge temple market that's a fascinating cultural education and a great place to hunt for bargains.

I don't want to imply that Kinkajuji and Ginkajuji aren't beautiful, but they're so swamped with tourists and so sanitized for your protection that I never feel any inspiration from them. If you're a fan of Chihayafuru you might also want to check out Omi-Jingu, also in Otsu.
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Old 2013-06-05, 05:15   Link #1194
Kirarakim
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Yeah 9-10 days in Kyoto is awesome. If that's the case I definitely wouldn't skip Ginkakuji & Kinkakuji.

Nijo castle is also kind of fun to walk through.

I also agree with Enzo that Otsu City has some nice sites and it's always nice to get off the beaten track.

Btw has anyone done the Kurama to Kibune hike? I am thinking of doing that this time but since I don't have 9-10 days I want to hear other opinions.
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Old 2013-06-05, 05:22   Link #1195
Guardian Enzo
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I did that hike on my last trip there. It was beyond magnificent, but I have to say part of that was because there was a snowstorm happening at the time. Walking through those woods and seeing Kurama-dera ceremonies in the snow was pretty unbelievable. I have a load of pics and vids on the website.
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Old 2013-06-05, 07:26   Link #1196
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
I did that hike on my last trip there. It was beyond magnificent, but I have to say part of that was because there was a snowstorm happening at the time. Walking through those woods and seeing Kurama-dera ceremonies in the snow was pretty unbelievable. I have a load of pics and vids on the website.
I saw your pics, they were lovely. How was the hike itself?

You did Ishiyamadera on the same day right? So that was doable all in one day? Because I really want to visit that temple as well.

I am also finally planning on going to Nara.

Of course this is all more than 6 months in advance so who knows how my mind will change from now and then.

edit: Actually has someone been to both Hiei and Kurama? Of the two I am wondering what people would recommend. I don't think I would have time for both (unless I don't go to Nara).
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Old 2013-06-05, 07:49   Link #1197
AmeNoJaku
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As the boys said, 9-10 days all of us combined haven't spent there for sight-seeing

About the manga museum, my brother went there with a friend of his last year, both are decent at reading Japanese, and found some childhood favorites that both enjoyed... but if you can not read/speak Japanese, there is only one room (out of 20-30) that has some generic info about manga copied/pasted to death on-line by commercial websites as insights of their employees... and if nothing else it would give you an oversimplifying idea targeted to foreigners, instead of introducing you to a historical continuum from medieval folk art into the fascist and occupation suppression of art into the commercial bubble of these days... which is OK for tourists not generally interested in manga (wishing an understandable to them oversimplification without the "boring" details); but personally I think (based on second hand narrative, from a trusted by me source of course) that it doesn't worth it, nevertheless I recognize that one might learn some new stuff from a short visit, but to justify the entrance fee it would be worthy to either be able to read and/or converse with the staff in their or if lucky employing your own language.
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Old 2013-06-05, 07:59   Link #1198
Kirarakim
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As the boys said, 9-10 days all of us combined haven't spent there for sight-seeing
Well after this upcoming trip if I count my two other trips there I might have about 9-10 days.

Last time I didn't have a chance to see everything I wanted because I went with a friend and I didn't want him to miss things just because I saw them before.

And this time I might still go back to places I've been (like Kiyomizu) because I want to finally see the temple complex with leaves (every time I went before it's been bare).

The problem with Kyoto and the surrounding areas is there is just too much to see and do.
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Old 2013-06-05, 08:07   Link #1199
Guardian Enzo
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I saw your pics, they were lovely. How was the hike itself?

You did Ishiyamadera on the same day right? So that was doable all in one day? Because I really want to visit that temple as well.

I am also finally planning on going to Nara.

Of course this is all more than 6 months in advance so who knows how my mind will change from now and then.

edit: Actually has someone been to both Hiei and Kurama? Of the two I am wondering what people would recommend. I don't think I would have time for both (unless I don't go to Nara).
The hike is not especially difficult. It requires climbing a fairly steep mountain, but it can easily be accomplished in a few hours. I did in fact combine it with Ishiyama-dera and it was no problem doing it in a day.
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Old 2013-06-05, 08:23   Link #1200
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Going there by yourself in Kyoto without knowing how to read or speak Japanese in the first place would be really a bad idea. I do know how to read and since I do like manga, I would probably enjoy the hell out of manga museum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
If you're in late in the month - 25th I think - To-ji has a huge temple market that's a fascinating cultural education and a great place to hunt for bargains.
Is it in June and just one day? If so I'll definitely drop by To-ji. I might not be able to make it.
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