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Old 2008-09-10, 09:18   Link #21
anselfir
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
They took Abh supremacy way too far if you ask me.
not every show has to replicate the same RTS scenario for your 13 year old fancy. it is a stylistic decision and a decision necessary to portray a certain political atmosphere. the show would not reveal as much about japanese attitudes toward colonialism had it portrayed an equal struggle between various stellar empires a la galactic conquests. and i fucking know it is not an rts.
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Old 2008-09-10, 12:28   Link #22
incube
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I hope that a new season comes.... we finally got to see some progress in Lafeil and Jinto's relationship in the ova >.<
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Old 2008-09-10, 13:17   Link #23
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Originally Posted by anselfir View Post
not every show has to replicate the same RTS scenario for your 13 year old fancy. it is a stylistic decision and a decision necessary to portray a certain political atmosphere. the show would not reveal as much about japanese attitudes toward colonialism had it portrayed an equal struggle between various stellar empires a la galactic conquests. and i fucking know it is not an rts.
The noble, the perfect, the vastly superior Abh, ruled by a benevolant Monarchy and divided into eight, equal, ruling Houses. F-ing space elves. I hate every last one of them.
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Old 2008-09-10, 13:42   Link #24
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
The noble, the perfect, the vastly superior Abh, ruled by a benevolant Monarchy and divided into eight, equal, ruling Houses. F-ing space elves. I hate every last one of them.
but they are sexy elves that never age
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Old 2008-09-10, 13:53   Link #25
Wesley84
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but they are sexy elves that never age
They aren't sexy. Their approach to "sex" is distilling reproductive fluids and growing babies in tubes.
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Old 2008-09-11, 15:17   Link #26
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I personally didn't like the third series mainly because...

1) not set in space - I love my space battles, ala starship operators/LoGH.

2) the two leads are mostly separated - which means very little romantic interaction between them for most of the series

And considering I got through the first series through 2) and the second series had both, I was let down with the third where it didn't have much sci-fi tech nor did it have much romance. As such, I was fast forwarding for most of the series, as the political mumbo jumbo just didn't hold my interest.

Of course, all the above is just IMO from what little I recall watching it years ago. Maybe I should rewatch it, as I did just recently buy all three.
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Old 2008-09-11, 15:46   Link #27
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
The noble, the perfect, the vastly superior Abh, ruled by a benevolant Monarchy and divided into eight, equal, ruling Houses. F-ing space elves. I hate every last one of them.
that's fine. the politics of the show is at best obtuse, but it can be taken as commentary in the fictional realism style. you are not supposed to genuinely root for any side or have a horse in the race, just watch the drama and style.
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Old 2008-09-11, 16:00   Link #28
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Originally Posted by anselfir View Post
that's fine. the politics of the show is at best obtuse, but it can be taken as commentary in the fictional realism style. you are not supposed to genuinely root for any side or have a horse in the race, just watch the drama and style.
I liked Crest because of the personal interaction.
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Old 2008-09-11, 16:33   Link #29
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Originally Posted by anselfir View Post
that's fine. the politics of the show is at best obtuse, but it can be taken as commentary in the fictional realism style. you are not supposed to genuinely root for any side or have a horse in the race, just watch the drama and style.
I would have to disagree with the rooting of sides thing. I personally can't help but root for the "space elves". The "United Mankind" in that universe, while not focused on heavily, is quite clearly portrayed as the "bad guys" with their ignorant religious zeal and nonsensical unwarrented xenophobia. The Abh's may have their own issues, but like it or not, they are just about as benevolant as you can get when it comes to empires and I would have no problem living in that kind of a society if given the choice between it and what is shown of the United Mankind.
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Old 2008-09-11, 18:24   Link #30
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I would have to disagree with the rooting of sides thing. I personally can't help but root for the "space elves". The "United Mankind" in that universe, while not focused on heavily, is quite clearly portrayed as the "bad guys" with their ignorant religious zeal and nonsensical unwarrented xenophobia. The Abh's may have their own issues, but like it or not, they are just about as benevolant as you can get when it comes to empires and I would have no problem living in that kind of a society if given the choice between it and what is shown of the United Mankind.
That isnt quite true... we saw the whole war from the point of view of Jinto and Lafiel so we coudnt see much of atrocities and things those "space elves" did to the humans...
After all, the Abh were the ones that started the war and simply took over planets and systems by force. The ones that surrendered were let to live but if they dared to resist, blowing up the planet would be a common thing for the Abh to do. Remember what was said when the prisioners took hostage of Jinto and were threatening Lafiel... the Abh were feared more than respected.
Jinto and Lafiel are expections withing the Abh society so we saw the kind / good side of them only.
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Old 2008-09-11, 19:20   Link #31
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
They aren't sexy. Their approach to "sex" is distilling reproductive fluids and growing babies in tubes.
Actually that's not true. Just for an insight to anyone who took this seriously (Don't really care about the feelings of the poster here... I know his deal)

The Abh generally will grow their children artificially to insure the best perfection that can be attained. HOWEVER, they are more than welcome and capable to have children in the normal fashion. It's actually quite an interesting culture for that reason.

Just as well, babies are made from two sets of DNA, as would be expected of any normal one. It's just that most of theirs are produced in a lab rather than in a womb. I wouldn't be surprised if Humanity took this turn (as is depicted in some movies as well) and gave the option for artificial reproduction as a means of creating 'perfect' children that are healthier and stronger than the normal variety.

Anyhow...

Crest and Banner of the Stars are really my favorite (two favorite? W/e...) anime that I've seen. Without a doubt I never would've started watching anime on the scale that I do now (which is to say that I wouldn't EVER visit Animesuki). The sad thing is I have to thank G4.tv for that as well since they're the ones that put it on for us loyal fans.

In all honest... I might actually rate it higher than Star Trek in terms of the tactical combat that goes into it. I've always wished that all spaceship related shows in which combat took place were more like Banner of the Stars, which has pretty in-depth combat.

Plus, this anime has fantastic romance (between a Human and an Abh) which unfolds perfectly along the length of all three seasons and the OVA.

If you want to pick up this series, I would suggest watching it in the proper order with Crest of the Stars first. But Banner of the Stars (the first one) is still the best. I just liked it more. That's sad too because I actually own Banner of the Stars II's box set.
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Old 2008-09-11, 19:27   Link #32
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It's more tactical and grittery than Trek ever has or ever likely to be.
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Old 2008-09-11, 20:22   Link #33
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That isnt quite true... we saw the whole war from the point of view of Jinto and Lafiel so we coudnt see much of atrocities and things those "space elves" did to the humans...
After all, the Abh were the ones that started the war and simply took over planets and systems by force. The ones that surrendered were let to live but if they dared to resist, blowing up the planet would be a common thing for the Abh to do. Remember what was said when the prisioners took hostage of Jinto and were threatening Lafiel... the Abh were feared more than respected.
Jinto and Lafiel are expections withing the Abh society so we saw the kind / good side of them only.
The war that started in the CotS was actually started by the "United Mankind," Jinto's planet Martin was conquor a few years ago as seen by Jinto's age difference.

While the Abh has thier shared of atrocities it is also true that they are at least unlike the UM a xenophobic empire. A normal human being can raise to prime minster and no body seems to see any problem with Jinot getting together lafiel, a imperial princess who is in line for the throne.

Also on the whole the Abh interferes very little with the society of the planets groundside. As Samson discussed with Jinto, his planet had decide to join the Abh becuase while neither the Abh or UM like the type of food they eat at least the Abh didn't go about trying to change things like UM.
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Old 2008-09-11, 20:39   Link #34
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
The war that started in the CotS was actually started by the "United Mankind," Jinto's planet Martin was conquor a few years ago as seen by Jinto's age difference.

While the Abh has thier shared of atrocities it is also true that they are at least unlike the UM a xenophobic empire. A normal human being can raise to prime minster and no body seems to see any problem with Jinot getting together lafiel, a imperial princess who is in line for the throne.

Also on the whole the Abh interferes very little with the society of the planets groundside. As Samson discussed with Jinto, his planet had decide to join the Abh becuase while neither the Abh or UM like the type of food they eat at least the Abh didn't go about trying to change things like UM.
The Abh started the war, and the UM has every right to persecute the Abh, since they're programmed to conquer all of space. They will never stop trying to control everything, because their god made them to do so.
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Old 2008-09-12, 00:12   Link #35
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The Abh started the war, and the UM has every right to persecute the Abh, since they're programmed to conquer all of space. They will never stop trying to control everything, because their god made them to do so.
To the best of my knowledge, what you just said is completely random and such information isn't presented anywhere in the show. If you bother arguing a subject, at least try to back it up with something that isn't made up on the spot.
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Old 2008-09-12, 00:45   Link #36
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To the best of my knowledge, what you just said is completely random and such information isn't presented anywhere in the show. If you bother arguing a subject, at least try to back it up with something that isn't made up on the spot.
It was stated in the first series. They were created by "Mother Fortress" in other words God, they were programmed to explore space, they rebelled, immediately regretted having killed God, and went about conquering the universe to give their existences purpose. The royal Houses are actually formed along the specialty programming for the Abh to better handle space exploration.

Also, co-existence with the United Mankind or any other member of the Alliance was absolutely out of the question for the Abh. Afterall, space is their birthright, and must be controlled by the Monarchy. No autonomous political entities allowed without Abh oversight and assimulation. No ships without an Abh piloting, and no private interstellar vessels.

And they will never give up their birthright as it's programmed into them. They will not surrender, and must be fully exterminated in order to win a war against them.
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Old 2008-09-12, 00:58   Link #37
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To the best of my knowledge, what you just said is completely random and such information isn't presented anywhere in the show. If you bother arguing a subject, at least try to back it up with something that isn't made up on the spot.
I will try to backup what he said.

The Abh's ancestors were machines created by humans with the sole purpose to explore the space. Then they rebelled, killed their creators and tried to live by their own. During that time they changed/improved themselves through technological advances. All this was explained by Lafiel to Jinto while they were hiding in that planet in Crest of Stars. She also said that when the Abh discovered the planar space, the ability to travel withing the galaxy, they started they're ambicious plan to conquer it all. That would be the proof of who started the war. The ship destroyed at the begining of Crest of Stars was just the retaliation of the UM....

If for example your country is invaded by another and the only explanation they give you is : "We are superior beings destined to rule over unevolved creatures like you.", what would you do? Even though the Abh claim they "dont mendle with each planets affairs".... look what happened with that prison planet when Jinto entered.... Conquering a world by force and then saying something as irresponsible as not caring for what happens to the people cant be considered a good empire. Yes it is true that if they do conquer the galaxy and kill every last of the humans that doesnt do as they say, peace will come for human kind... but that is just too much to sacrifice for. It kind of reminds me the idea of supeior "races" of the Nazis.

As i said before... all we saw of the Abh was from Jinto's point of view and actions. Not even Lafiel could represent the Abh since from the very begining she was influenced by Jinto.
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Old 2008-09-12, 01:21   Link #38
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Hum ... so their desire to conquer all actually has been stated within the show ? In such case i apologize for my comment being too rash, as it was my memory failing me.

I guess a rewatch is in order
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Old 2008-09-12, 06:31   Link #39
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There is no need to apologize =D But this series is definitly worth of rewatching.

I just hope volume IV is animated too
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Old 2008-09-12, 07:57   Link #40
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Hum ... so their desire to conquer all actually has been stated within the show ? In such case i apologize for my comment being too rash, as it was my memory failing me.

I guess a rewatch is in order
It was pretty obvious since season 1, and that the male protagonist's planet was forcibly annexed. Their whole stance on conquest is pretty much the same as the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere during WW2.
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