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Old 2003-11-27, 10:21   Link #1
Shii
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Question Optimal encoding settings?

I have a high-quality 300MB DivX raw on my hands. Now, I don't really need to reencode because I'll be using softsubs, but I have a feeling 300MB is more than most people would like to have on their hard-drives for this underdog anime, so I'm going to turn it into an XViD. Some people on this forum tell me they could encode at 80MB for a hardsubbed episode of Naruto and still get good quality. If I want to retain most of the excellent quality of this 300MB file, what settings should I use?
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Old 2003-11-27, 11:29   Link #2
Sakaki-
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashibaka
I have a high-quality 300MB DivX raw on my hands. Now, I don't really need to reencode because I'll be using softsubs, but I have a feeling 300MB is more than most people would like to have on their hard-drives for this underdog anime, so I'm going to turn it into an XViD. Some people on this forum tell me they could encode at 80MB for a hardsubbed episode of Naruto and still get good quality. If I want to retain most of the excellent quality of this 300MB file, what settings should I use?

Everything depends on your raw.

And the most important part is to filter out as much noice as possible out of the picture to be abel to compres it good.
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As does a lot of the anime airing now adays

and the leechers too, they're the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked
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Old 2003-11-27, 15:09   Link #3
GipFace
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Ara?

Some people on this forum tell me they could encode at 80MB for a hardsubbed episode of Naruto and still get good quality.

You'll never get a "good" encode at 80MB. Acceptable, but not good. Look at all the 175MB encodes around us ... they have many issues.
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Old 2003-11-27, 15:35   Link #4
K_R
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Three things for good encoding (watch my encodes and judge for yourself if I'm sprouting crap):

1. Get the best possible raw you can. Crap in, crap out. This may mean downloading a dozen or more raws...
2. Light filtering.
3. Use dev-api4 with settings: h.263, gmc, VHQ4, chroma me, cartoon mode, bvop: 2/1.5/1.0, i:2/4 p:2/7 b:2/10, trellis r-d


General:
Always do 2pass encoding, do not discard the first-pass, it may come out at a filesize that is appropriate for you, or you can use it as a reference for the second-pass size calculation. As a general rule you don't want to go under 75% of firstpass (you'll probably find that a lot of fansubs dip below 50%).

Even if you have a QB=100, QM=MPEG, no bvop raw, there will still be compression noise, so you will still need to do some light filtering, I recommend 2dc(3,1,1).

Don't go crazy on the warpsharp.

Don't use bvops unless you have to.
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Last edited by K_R; 2003-11-27 at 15:50.
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Old 2003-11-27, 18:19   Link #5
Shii
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woo double post!

Last edited by Shii; 2003-11-27 at 18:23. Reason: Please delete this double post
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Old 2003-11-27, 18:19   Link #6
Shii
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Well, I'll read a bunch of encoding guides to figure out what the hell you're talking about , then I'll probably go with your settings and aim for 150-200MB. I am already pretty sure I have the best raw; at least, it's a billion times better than the one the other fansubbing group doing this is using.

Thanks, K_R!
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Old 2003-11-27, 20:06   Link #7
Enragin_Angel
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ashibaka: you probably quoted me on that 80MB encode thing. I never said that 80MB would be GOOD quality...I said that 80MB would MATCH the quality of all these new naruto fansubber's group's encodes.

Anyway... in response to K_R's settings...don't use GMC...it tends to produce weird blue artifacting...and don't use trellis r-d because you want to compress it...trellis r-d doesn't really help much in this area. That's all I'm really gonna comment on...

Oh, and you may want to use 1 b-frame instead of 2...the key here is that if you distribute your fansub...you want as many ppl as possible to be able to view your fansub without difficulty...it may look good on your computer...but it won't on theirs. And do you really want to tell a bunch of leechers "download this and that and this...and have it on this setting and that setting and this...and you should be able to watch it perfectly"
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Old 2003-11-27, 20:50   Link #8
Shii
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I found most of this makes sense once I actually installed dev-api4, but where are gmc and bvop, and how do I add the filter "2dc(3,1,1)" in VirtualDub? And that means minimum 1 b-frame, right? ^_^;

[edit] I tried encoding, but all the video vanished entirely...
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Last edited by Shii; 2003-11-27 at 22:02.
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Old 2003-11-27, 22:00   Link #9
zalas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashibaka
I found most of this makes sense once I actually installed dev-api4, but where are gmc and bvop, and how do I add the filter "2dc(3,1,1)" in VirtualDub?

And that means minimum 1 b-frame, right? ^_^;
He's talking about _2DCleanYUY2() I believe, or one of those 2d cleaners. It's a avisynth thing.
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Old 2003-11-27, 22:03   Link #10
Shii
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Ah, AVIsynth. Let's see if I can do that.

[edit, for people who would like to follow these instructions] So I made an AVS file and added to it,

AVISource("G:\xapsterneko\Incoming\Winny\filename. avi")
ConvertToYUY2()
_2DCleanYUY2(3,1,1)

and loaded that into VirtualDubMod. It needs the 2dc plugin.

[edit2] Still no picture when I encode

Last edited by Shii; 2003-11-27 at 23:56.
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Old 2003-11-28, 01:24   Link #11
Enragin_Angel
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need more info...tell us all ur xvid settings as well. but for now....i guess u should take out the _2DCleanYUY2() line...either that...or download the 2DClean plugin from www.avisynth.org and put this line before everything else: LoadPlugin("...path\_2DCleanYUY2.dll")

then it wont ask for the plugin itself anymore....anyway...my suspicion is that you're using gmc...thats why u cant see any picture when you encode. And when i said 1 b-frame...i meant 1 max. Setting 1-max would allow it to be compatible with DivX 5...enabling b-vop compatibility with 2 or more b-frames is pointless.
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Old 2003-11-28, 01:32   Link #12
Shii
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It's not an Avisynth problem, before I encode with Virtualdub it looks fine.

Where do you turn GMC on or off?
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Old 2003-11-28, 01:33   Link #13
K_R
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Where are the other fansub encoders?

Ashibaka, you will need to use a YV12 build of 2dc, there is one at http://members.at.infoseek.co.jp/xeon533/

There is another filter that you should consider using, it's called dup - refer to its website for what it does.

http://www.avisynth.org/warpenterprises/ for a collections of avs filters.

In reply to FUD:
The build of dev-api4 I have doesn't have any GMC artefacting. Safe to use! This does depend on what build/cvs you have... enragin may be referring to api3 gmc (koepi's build, et al.)

In the current api4 cvs, trellis gives you a slight size reduction. It no longer has the luma flip bug though, which is good. But it will slow down your encode and the size reduction is very slight...

The only concern with bvops is the encoded stream's playability. The more b-frames you have, the more CPU it requires to decode. b-frame max=2 is playable on my celeron 750, and people with slower machines than that should upgrade.

Also, keep in mind bvops = quality loss. Depending on how big the first-pass is coming out, experiment with different bvop q-ratios, eg. 1.5, 1.25. 1.0. And if possible don't use bvops at all (gsg05 compressed so well, that I didn't use bvops).

dx51 and libavcodec (as used in ffdshow) can handle more than 1 consecutive b-frame.

onto the example avs:

LoadPlugin("dup.dll")
LoadPlugin("undot.dll")
LoadPlugin("_2DCleanYUY2_for_25.dll")

avisource("Gunslinger Girl ガンスリンガー ガール 第05話 「約束 -promessa-」 (640x480 DivX505 23m14s 23.98fps 160Kbps).avi").killaudio()

UnDot()
_2DCleanYUY2(thresholdY=3, radiusX=1, radiusY=1)
Dup(threshold=.4,show=false,maxcopies=20,copy=true ,blend=true,chroma=true)
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Old 2003-11-28, 01:53   Link #14
Shii
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_R
This does depend on what build/cvs you have...
Ah, I have the only binary I could find (from http://ed.gomez.free.fr/projects/xvid-devapi4/ ) because Googling it was easier than installing GCC.

Thanks for your AviSynth, looks nicer now... but again, where are these GMCs and BVOPs? I only see a disabled "BVOP sensitivity" in one of the dialogs. And I could select H.263 in my older build, but now I don't see it...
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Last edited by Shii; 2003-11-28 at 02:03.
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:03   Link #15
K_R
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Click on the ellipses next to "profile @ level". If you use bvops, do _not_ used 'packed bitstream' and use 'closed gov'.

Also, do a google search for a vdub version of warpsharp. I like to add a touch of warpsharp to tighten the edges, nothing more than (strength=15, blur=1). avs warpsharp doesn't behave the same and, quite frankly, the result are nicer using the vdub version.
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:04   Link #16
Shii
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Thanks, all working now. ^_^

[edit] except it still keeps on putting out a blank, black screen when rendered ;_;

It appears to be something I enabled, default settings work.

[edit2] I think two-pass is the culprit. (???)

[edit3] By the way, GMC utterly screws up ffdshow. That's really darn annoying.

Last edited by Shii; 2003-11-28 at 02:15.
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:14   Link #17
K_R
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If you set vdubmod to 'fast recompress' it doesn't output to the screen. Set it to 'normal recompress' or 'full processing mode'. I'm not sure about the lastest build of vdub though. Unless you mean something else?
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:16   Link #18
Shii
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No, the finished product doesn't show up when I encode it as the first pass of two-pass. I'm only encoding a little test strip... all black box.
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:21   Link #19
K_R
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Encoding type, select "twopass 1st pass" and click on the ellipses next to it. Uncheck "discard first pass". I think it defaults to dummy first pass (ie. doesn't write anything to the file).
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Old 2003-11-28, 02:23   Link #20
Shii
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OK, so XViD defaults to "do not work"... that's pretty retarded. Anyway, it's all perfect now!

I'll have to thank you in the credits...

[edit] I also learned something about ffdshow: it is not to be used to test encodes, because it drops stuff. Oh snap, now I'll have to reencode all those different tests.
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