AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > General > General Chat

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2009-03-24, 12:20   Link #2201
Ryuou
進む道は武士道のみ
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago)
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagato View Post
Ah, found it.
And again me too, tricked by the lacking of comma there.
だって月明かりがあるとはいえ、夜は夜、暗いことには変わりは無い。

it's easier to understand now. But yeah, omitting one extra は sounds better.

だって月明かりがあるとはいえ、夜は夜、暗いことに変わりは無い。
Yeah, throwing a comma in there is probably the nicest way to go about it. Hmm...I agree with you on omitting the second は.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guernsey View Post
I don't know if it is true for all japanese but why is it difficult for Japanese (or any other culture in general) to speak our language fluently?
Are you talking about Japanese people speaking English? If so, then I would say it has a lot to do with two things. First, would be the difference in sounds that are used for the respective languages. English has many words that end on consonants. Every sound in Japanese; however, ends in a vowel except for "n". So cutting off the sound seems to be pretty difficult. The other would be the system used for teaching English (and really almost everything) in place in schools. It's not a good system. Too much focus is placed on grammar, writing, reading and tests. Hardly any attention is placed on conversation, and thus, most Japanese people can't get enough practice with speaking and pronunciation. That's why English conversation schools are so popular, but I don't know how well they work.
Ryuou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-24, 13:29   Link #2202
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Thank you all
BTW:

だって月明かりがあるとはいえ、夜は夜、暗いことに変わりは無い。

What is it translated into?

Next question:
申し訳ねえ。ボス。

How do you read that? (in reality). I can't seem to hear "shi wa" in there...
iLney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-24, 14:09   Link #2203
ganbaru
books-eater youkai
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Betweem wisdom and insanity
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Next question:
申し訳ねえ。ボス。

How do you read that? (in reality). I can't seem to hear "shi wa" in there...
Moushi wake nee. bosu.
__________________

ganbaru is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-24, 15:05   Link #2204
Rembr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Thank you all
BTW:

だって月明かりがあるとはいえ、夜は夜、暗いことに変わりは無い。

What is it translated into?
Even though there is moonlight, night is night, there's no changing the darkness.
Rembr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-24, 16:54   Link #2205
Alchemist007
自分のチームにいるよ。
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Age: 25
Agh, I hate the english grammer words used to describe some things. Verbal compound gerund T_T yet the concept itself isn't nearly as formidable.
__________________
Alchemist007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 12:44   Link #2206
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Thx all
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Moushi wake nee. bosu.
Uhm, no matter how many times I listen to it, it's always "Mo sha ke ne, bosu."
(male voice, from a movie I guess)
iLney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 12:47   Link #2207
Circular Logic
土は幻に
*Fansubber
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Vowels often get elided together, particularly in casual/caricatured (i.e. anime) speech.

shou ga nai -> sha nai
sore wa -> sorya
sou desu -> sousu

etc.
Circular Logic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 12:49   Link #2208
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
"Often"?

Is there a list, a rule or something like that?
iLney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 12:51   Link #2209
Circular Logic
土は幻に
*Fansubber
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
"Often"?

Is there a list, a rule or something like that?
Not really unfortunately It doesn't really hapen when people speak formally.

Other than that you'll just have to get used to it; it's not something that gets taught in textbooks realy.

You can often work it out if you think about it though. At least that's how I get most of them.
Circular Logic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 14:39   Link #2210
aohige
( ಠ_ಠ)
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
Well, first of all, all three examples Circular mentioned are diffrent in origin. That's why there's no uniform rule.

sha-nai is originally kansai dialect (as well as sha-arahen)
soryaa is standard (and not really modern) broken speech
and ~ssu is a very modern slang used by young people as abbribiation of "desu".
I don't know the origin, but it definitly was popularized among the youth in kantou first.
__________________
aohige is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 15:06   Link #2211
Vexx
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryuou View Post
Hardly any attention is placed on conversation, and thus, most Japanese people can't get enough practice with speaking and pronunciation. That's why English conversation schools are so popular, but I don't know how well they work.
From JET and other folks I've heard from -- the problems are:
1) not enough classroom time.
2) students are terrified of individual attention; they'd rather huddle in a group and form a consensus of the "answer" rather than just try free-form conversation at the individual level.
3) Many JET folk find they got a much better result by getting the students off-campus. Item 2 seems to be due to the typical classroom protocol of all their classes, not just English.

Japanese are frantic to find english natives who will help them. OTOH, its quite difficult to find Japanese who are willing to actually critique a non-native's attempts to get better at Japanese.... somewhat frustrating.
Vexx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 15:41   Link #2212
aohige
( ಠ_ಠ)
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
From JET and other folks I've heard from -- the problems are:
1) not enough classroom time.
2) students are terrified of individual attention; they'd rather huddle in a group and form a consensus of the "answer" rather than just try free-form conversation at the individual level.
3) Many JET folk find they got a much better result by getting the students off-campus. Item 2 seems to be due to the typical classroom protocol of all their classes, not just English.

Japanese are frantic to find english natives who will help them. OTOH, its quite difficult to find Japanese who are willing to actually critique a non-native's attempts to get better at Japanese.... somewhat frustrating.
I always took initiative in answering in English classes when I was in school.
Due to my experience living in US, I had far better knowledge of English than the teachers.

I was once told by someone who works for one of those English conversation class business that they wouldn't be interested in me teaching there part-time, because they want a caucasian teacher (so they can advertise LOOK WE GOT NATIVE WHITE DUDE to their clientele). This was quite a long time ago.
Which was absolutely ridiculous from practical point of view, considering that I am far more competent in teaching English speech lessons since Japanese and English are BOTH my native languages.
From this experience I learned that these classes are NOT interested in how well their students excel, just how many of them they can sucker into paying them.
__________________
aohige is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 18:48   Link #2213
Guardian Enzo
Seishu's Ace
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kagurazaka, Tokyo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
From JET and other folks I've heard from -- the problems are:
1) not enough classroom time.
2) students are terrified of individual attention; they'd rather huddle in a group and form a consensus of the "answer" rather than just try free-form conversation at the individual level.
3) Many JET folk find they got a much better result by getting the students off-campus. Item 2 seems to be due to the typical classroom protocol of all their classes, not just English.
I don't know - I hear the girls in Negi's class reading out loud all the time...
Guardian Enzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-25, 20:12   Link #2214
Circular Logic
土は幻に
*Fansubber
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
On a completely different note, has anyone tried surfing 2ch for practice?

The amount of specialised vocab is >______________<

Though I suppose people surfing 4chan and the like must feel the same way :/
Circular Logic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 00:51   Link #2215
Ryuou
進む道は武士道のみ
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago)
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
From JET and other folks I've heard from -- the problems are:
1) not enough classroom time.
2) students are terrified of individual attention; they'd rather huddle in a group and form a consensus of the "answer" rather than just try free-form conversation at the individual level.
3) Many JET folk find they got a much better result by getting the students off-campus. Item 2 seems to be due to the typical classroom protocol of all their classes, not just English.

Japanese are frantic to find english natives who will help them. OTOH, its quite difficult to find Japanese who are willing to actually critique a non-native's attempts to get better at Japanese.... somewhat frustrating.
Hmm...that second one is a big problem. Haha, yeah I know what you mean. It can get a little frustrating sometimes. Although I do have cousins that are all to quick to jump on my mistakes, haha.
Ryuou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 12:20   Link #2216
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Next question: (Thank those who helped me last times).

引っ越しの荷物だいぶ片付きました

も?
iLney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 13:27   Link #2217
Quarkboy
Anime Translator
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Age: 34
Send a message via AIM to Quarkboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Next question: (Thank those who helped me last times).

引っ越しの荷物だいぶ片付きました

も?
It means "already" in this case. So translation:

The luggage/boxes from moving have already mostly been unpacked/cleaned up.

Generally: A mo B past tense means "A has already B'ed"
__________________
Yomiuri Television Enterprise
International Media Strategy Chief
Sam Pinansky
Quarkboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 14:50   Link #2218
Circular Logic
土は幻に
*Fansubber
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarkboy View Post
It means "already" in this case. So translation:

The luggage/boxes from moving have already mostly been unpacked/cleaned up.

Generally: A mo B past tense means "A has already B'ed"
Are you sure you're not thinking of 'mou'?

I'd say the mo in this case either means a) also, as in 'I've also dealt with the luggage', or b) even, as in 'I've dealt with even the luggage'.
Circular Logic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 16:43   Link #2219
Yukinokesshou
ドジ
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: In a house
Just a random curiousity...

Is there any difference in usage between 「やさしい」 and 「簡単」 or 「容易」? I know the difference between the last two - simple vs. easy - since they're loanwords from Chinese. I'd only asking about 「やさしい」... is it just the native Japanese equivalent of the more specific Chinese loanwords, or are there subtle distinctions in usage? Thanks!
Yukinokesshou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009-03-26, 17:16   Link #2220
Raiga
tl;dr
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 22
What does はず mean and how is it used exactly?
__________________
Raiga is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hiragana

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 15:13.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.