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Old 2009-04-26, 03:35   Link #2341
Doraneko
The Owl of Minerva
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
謂う 【いう】 (v5u) is referred to as .., is called ..
云う 【いう】 (v5u) to say
言う 【いう】 (v5u) to say, (P)
いう
Casual use, common in conjunctions.
何といっても、・・・ (Especially...)
その点からいえば、・・・ (According to that point of view...)

言う
The most common one. "Say," "bring up," or whatever action that involves sound coming out of your mouth.
eg. 単刀直入に言う。 (Get straight to the point.)

云う
Definition (general)
eg. 正義と云う名の下に・・・ (In the name of justice...)

謂う
1.Definition (specific)
2.[Classical use] General use similar to いう・言う・云う. But may also be used for explanations.
eg. 車とは自動車を謂うところである。 ("Car" means automotive.)
eg. 過ちて改めざる、是を過ちと謂う。
(A man who has committed a mistake and does not correct it is committing another mistake.)

曰う
Can be used as quotations or in conjunctions.
eg. 《神農本草経》に人参は五臓を補うと曰う
(According to the book "Shinou Honzougyou", ginseng can help to balance body functions.)
eg. 一説で曰う・・・ (According to one theory...)

Last edited by Doraneko; 2009-04-26 at 03:57.
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Old 2009-04-26, 22:04   Link #2342
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Thx everyone.

黒田さんが言ってたけど、そんなにおいしくなかったそうよ。

=> Yeah, 黒田さん was talking about it like that, it doesn't look delicious.

I don't quite follow the translation here because そんなに => like that. Then what does "ってたけど" do? And "Yeah" ?
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Old 2009-04-26, 22:20   Link #2343
Raiga
tl;dr
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 22
I'm guessing that 言ってた is a casual contraction of 言っていた, + けど for "but/however."

I think the "yeah" is just sort of impressionistic... thrown in there to imitate the tone of the original sentence... don't trust translations to be word-for-word literal (for one thing, that's impossible in Japanese<->English).
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Old 2009-04-26, 22:27   Link #2344
ganbaru
books-eater youkai
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Betweem wisdom and insanity
The important part about ''ってたけど is ''けど (even if)
And ''Yeah'', it's because of the ''よ'' at the end of the phrase.

Edit my bad, Raiga posted a answer while I was typing mine.
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Old 2009-04-27, 17:28   Link #2345
xxanimefan4_ever
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doraneko View Post
謂う
1.Definition (specific)
2.[Classical use] General use similar to いう・言う・云う. But may also be used for explanations.
eg. 車とは自動車を謂うところである。 ("Car" means automotive.)
eg. 過ちて改めざる、是を過ちと謂う。
(A man who has committed a mistake and does not correct it is committing another mistake.)
yeah only seen it in lyrics to shiina ringo (gawd she's good) and she uses lots of weird kanji and all that

Like おこのみで

ooh different versions there too

different versiosn
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Old 2009-04-28, 14:05   Link #2346
Ryuou
進む道は武士道のみ
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago)
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Ah... I see now

I thought you guys were talking about the "wo" of "食事をして、映画を見ました." I didn't see the first "wo"

Thank you

BTW, is "お腹がいっぱいので必ずデザートを食べた人" correct? and 人 reads "jin" there?...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughnuts View Post
ひと。

This is the kinda phrase again where the whole verb clause is describing a person. じん is a noun suffix and shouldn't be alone like that.
Oh okay, haha. That's why you were getting confused.

Like Doughnuts said it's read "hito". That sentence seems odd though. It seems odd to have "taberu" be in past tense. Also, "people who will definitely eat desert because they're full," sounds odd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Thx everyone.

黒田さんが言ってたけど、そんなにおいしくなかったそうよ。

=> Yeah, 黒田さん was talking about it like that, it doesn't look delicious.

I don't quite follow the translation here because そんなに => like that. Then what does "ってたけど" do? And "Yeah" ?
Yeah (if you want) Kuroda-san was talking about that, it seems it wasn't very tasty.
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Old 2009-04-28, 14:33   Link #2347
waterchan
Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: どこでもいいや
What is the difference between どれくらい and どのくらい? If I want to ask a friend how long she will stay in Japan, is it better to say

どれくらい日本いくのか? or
どのくらい日本行くのか?

thanks
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Old 2009-04-28, 21:53   Link #2348
ghada
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: saudi arabia
arigato ありがと

thaaaaanx XD
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Old 2009-04-28, 22:33   Link #2349
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
@Raiga, gabaru, Ryuou: Thx

My bad. The sentence should've been : お腹がいっぱいでも必ずデザートを食べる人。(I hope it's right this time lulz)

Edit:

明日一人来ますか
いいえ、 明日は友だち来ます。

"も" = ?

And why "で" => "と" in the 2nd sentence?... Or should I ask why で instead of と in the 1st...

Last edited by iLney; 2009-04-29 at 09:08.
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Old 2009-04-29, 10:35   Link #2350
Doughnuts
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: England
Age: 27
If you said soemthing like,「私来ます」, it'd be an indication that you have a split personality. "I'll come with myself."
If you understood the と particle from your previous examples, it's the same here in that second sentence.

で in the first sentence is used to express (doing by means of). 「一人で来ます」 "I'll come by myself."

も conveys the idea of doing something in addition to something else. ie, "Will you come by yourself again tomorrow?"
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Old 2009-04-29, 12:28   Link #2351
ukiuki
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterchan View Post
What is the difference between どれくらい and どのくらい? If I want to ask a friend how long she will stay in Japan, is it better to say

どれくらい日本いくのか? or
どのくらい日本行くのか?

thanks
I recommended this どのくらい日本行くのか? is better than どれくらい日本いくのか? 
well there are not properly correct sentences.
if you want to say that how long to saty, you might say どのくらい いるのか?is much better.

learning must be fun http://wwjanime.blogspot.com
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Old 2009-04-29, 20:21   Link #2352
Ryuou
進む道は武士道のみ
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago)
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghada View Post
arigato ありがと

thaaaaanx XD
You're missing an at the end there .
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Old 2009-04-30, 05:32   Link #2353
RandomGuy
ここに居ってんねん
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Osaka
Age: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryuou View Post
You're missing an at the end there .
The う in ありがとう is frequently left off in casual speech/writing. I'd give it a pass.
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Old 2009-05-01, 11:16   Link #2354
iLney
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
@Dougnuts: Thx

啓二: 先生はとても親切だったよ。
孝: それはよかった。

Is it a general rule that if a person makes a comment in past tense, the reply must also in past tense too?

Edit: and 当ててみて = guess? What verb form is that?
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Old 2009-05-01, 11:56   Link #2355
ukiuki
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
@Dougnuts: Thx

啓二: 先生はとても親切だったよ。
孝: それはよかった。

Is it a general rule that if a person makes a comment in past tense, the reply must also in past tense too?

Edit: and 当ててみて = guess? What verb form is that?
keiji: teacher was very kind.
takashi:that's good.

I guess these conversation in english as above.
there is not rule for past or current or it might be "that was good for you" correct.
so the answer is past.

learning mu be fun http://wwjanime.blogspot.com
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Old 2009-05-01, 16:06   Link #2356
Ryuou
進む道は武士道のみ
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dying to get back to Japan (but currently near Chicago)
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomGuy View Post
The う in ありがとう is frequently left off in casual speech/writing. I'd give it a pass.
Oh yeah, you're right. A pass it is then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iLney View Post
Edit: and 当ててみて = guess? What verb form is that?
当てて is from 当てる (hit, strike, get/win as in a lottery). みて is from みる (it means "try" when used in verb-te-miru). So they're in their te-forms.
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Old 2009-05-01, 17:05   Link #2357
ukiuki
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryuou View Post
Oh yeah, you're right. A pass it is then.


当てて is from 当てる (hit, strike, get/win as in a lottery). みて is from みる (it means "try" when used in verb-te-miru). So they're in their te-forms.
みて- using for asking to you from a person who is close relationship or maybe from older than you..
みる - asking myself to be trying...
みろ・みなさい - force to do...

learn must be fun http://wwjanime.blogspot.com

I know japanese is complicated grammer...

Last edited by ukiuki; 2009-05-01 at 17:06. Reason: additional
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Old 2009-05-01, 17:08   Link #2358
Mystique
Honyaku no Hime
*Fansubber
 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: In the eastern capital of the islands of the rising suns...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukiuki View Post
みて- using for asking to you from a person who is close relationship or maybe from older than you..
みる - asking myself to be trying...
みろ・みなさい - force to do...

learn must be fun http://wwjanime.blogspot.com

I know japanese is complicated grammer...
*blinks*
Ryuou kinda nailed it when he said it's the 'te' form + miru = to try.
Not sure what you're trying to say..

and why you posting the anime dvd link?
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Old 2009-05-01, 17:31   Link #2359
ukiuki
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
*blinks*
Ryuou kinda nailed it when he said it's the 'te' form + miru = to try.
Not sure what you're trying to say..

and why you posting the anime dvd link?
"te" is て
”miru” is みる
as してみる、いってみる、やってみる、、、all those means are to try t o

if you do check current update daily japanese anime link, that is the one.
if it bothers you, skip it.
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Old 2009-05-01, 18:22   Link #2360
Jan-Poo
別にいいけど
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
Quote:
みろ・みなさい - force to do...
aah i finally understand the frequent "yatte miro!"

but how would a good translation be?

"let's give it a try!

or

"try it!"
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