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Old 2010-06-18, 10:05   Link #3021
Honeysuckle
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Wikipedia : Kyōiku kanji
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%8Diku_kanji
Each kanji has a link to its own page.

For Japanese children, Monbu-kagakushō (文部科学省 ministry of education and science) made "list of kanji by school year" (学年別漢字配当表).
Wikipedia says "it can also be used as a sequence of learning characters by non-native speakers as a means of focusing on the most commonly used kanji".
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Old 2010-06-18, 13:45   Link #3022
nikorai
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Honeysuckle

Quote:
Wikipedia : Kyōiku kanji
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%8Diku_kanji
Each kanji has a link to its own page.
Awesome list.
I checked myself and I can say that most look familiar to me. YAY!
漢字を分かるみたいです。イエイ!
まあ、大部分書けないけど、読めます。

These are tough
これらが難しいです。

奮う(ふるう)- to wield
絹(きぬ)- silk
臓(ぞう)- bowels
蔵(くら)- warehouse
蚕(かいこ)- silkworm
陛(へい)- highness (as in your Highness)
班(はん)- group (=集団)

OK, what next?
次は?
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Old 2010-06-18, 15:14   Link #3023
Kylaran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikorai View Post
Honeysuckle
奮う(ふるう)- to wield
絹(きぬ)- silk
臓(ぞう)- bowels
蔵(くら)- warehouse
蚕(かいこ)- silkworm
陛(へい)- highness (as in your Highness)
班(はん)- group (=集団)
These aren't too bad. I think they get a lot harder when you start reading specialized scientific articles. This past quarter at university we had to learn some pretty random vocab like 孵卵 (incubation).

It gets to a point where you really can't forcefully study kanji, and a lot of it comes down to exposure. A lot of the kanji you listed are easily learned if you widen the variety of topics you read about in Japanese.

臓 is easy since I love grilled innards, and I learned that one fast. Plus it's used in a lot of jokes. 陛 isn't bad if you like historical plays/dramas/anime. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qikz View Post
Quick question, I've finished off the Kanji chart the site I was learning from was using for lessons, as in I've written them all down, it's about 300 in all, what's the best way of going out to find new Kanji to learn, would Translating my way through something work?

I could use that to double effect as in effect I'm learning new words and Kanji at the same time, if I see a Kanji I can go look it up to find the other meanings and write a word down for that, while translating, do you think that would work?
I actually think that's a really good idea -- if you focus on easy things, like slice-of-life manga (not comedy based). You might want to pick up more kanji from the chart Honeysuckle linked, but it never hurts to just go for it.

Last edited by Kylaran; 2010-06-18 at 15:35.
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Old 2010-06-18, 19:19   Link #3024
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Quote:
It gets to a point where you really can't forcefully study kanji, and a lot of it comes down to exposure.
はい、分かりますけど、独学はやっぱり難しいですね。新しい漢字を覚えてみると頭が痛くなっちゃいます。勉 強を頑張っても結果は残念です。私は日本語が超苦手です。

Quote:
This past quarter at university we had to learn some pretty random vocab like 孵卵 (incubation).
孵卵ですね。Zergのハッチェリーと関連付けて考えています。
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:32   Link #3025
suiryoku
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I've learned a bunch of words in Japanese, but I'm still unsure about my forming of sentences... so if someone could check over a couple for me, that would be fantastic.

Anata wa kerei hito desu

Watashi wa tsukau Google Maps
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Old 2010-06-27, 17:36   Link #3026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suiryoku View Post
I've learned a bunch of words in Japanese, but I'm still unsure about my forming of sentences... so if someone could check over a couple for me, that would be fantastic.

Anata wa kerei hito desu

Watashi wa tsukau Google Maps
Place the "na" particle after your adjective when modifying a noun. (kirei na hito).

The verb should come at the end of your second sentence. When using a verb transitively on your noun, use the "wo" particle. (Google Maps wo tsukau).

Your second sentence could form a grammatically valid clause, but probably not as you intended. I'm assuming you simply wanted to say "I use Google Maps". In it's current form, it's more like, "Google Maps, which I use, ...". This is because your verb clause (watashi wa tsukau) becomes an adjective which modifies the noun that follows it.

So the thing to remember is that your verb should come last, anything that modifies it comes before it, and anything that comes after it is modified by it. This rule is pretty much valid for all sentence parts in Japanese - if it modifies a word, it comes before it (excluding particles, which come after.)
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Old 2010-06-28, 02:24   Link #3027
Omusubi
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Smile an excellent explanation

I think Doughnuts wrote an excellent explanation on this.
As a Japanese, I'd like to add a bit in my bad English.

1. Anata wa kirei na hito desu (あなたはきれいな人です)
This is same as Doughnuts. A perfect sentence. IMO, adding the "ne (ね)" particle makes this sentence sounds more attractive!
(i.e. Anata wa kirei na hito desune (あなたはきれいな人ですね)
2. Watashi wa Google Maps wo tsukau (私はGoogle Maps を使う。)
Not bad. There's no grammatical flaw. But we don't use that phrase much in daily life.
I suggest you an alternative described below.

2+.Watashi wa Google Maps wo tsukaimasu (私はGoogle Maps を使います。 )
The difference between 2 sentences is tsukau/tsukaimasu difference.
Why I changed "tsukau" to "tsukaimasu"? The reason is, the word "Watashi" is a polite form of "I" subject, and the form is suitable in public/business scene. According to use of "Watashi", I changed a verb "tsukau" to "tsukaimasu". "verb+masu" form is more polite than "verb" form.

If you find odd/weird point in my English writing, please correct.
Invitation to language exchange is also welcome.

Last edited by Omusubi; 2010-07-05 at 03:34.
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Old 2010-06-28, 07:06   Link #3028
Mystique
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Welcome to Animesuki, I hope you have a pleasant time here and make good online acquaintances over the month. ^^
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omusubi View Post
If you find odd/weird point in my English writing, please correct.
Invitation to language exchange is also welcome.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure you'll find many people who will take you up on your offer from this forum, lol.
Most of us all love Japanese culture in some way and would love to interact with native Japanese people, so I think you'll find some good language partners

As for correcting...
Offers for language exchange (practice) are also welcome.
or more relaxed
Any offers for cultural or language exchange are also welcome.
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Old 2010-06-28, 15:17   Link #3029
Omusubi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
As for correcting...
Offers for language exchange (practice) are also welcome.
or more relaxed
Any offers for cultural or language exchange are also welcome.
Oh, thank you for your reply. I checked those phrases using Google.

BTW, I was surprised to know that some of foreign college/university students learn difficut words such as "孵卵(ふらん)". I suppose nearly 50% of all Japanese can't read "孵" correctly.

Last edited by Omusubi; 2010-07-02 at 17:05.
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Old 2010-07-04, 12:13   Link #3030
Raiga
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Random question, what's the difference between a 手帳 and a ノート?
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Old 2010-07-04, 15:50   Link #3031
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
Random question, what's the difference between a 手帳 and a ノート?
I'd love to bloody know myself.

Well the general rule with kanji terms over katakana is that the kanji are more formal or official, so I can imagine that 手帳 would be a term used at a bank, or office or in legal practices, but ノート would be used and referred to more casual settings such as school notebooks or diaries or notebooks at home.

That's my two pence anyways, these aspects of Japanese are where a native comes in handy cause it's only a nuance difference, not a meaning one...
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Old 2010-07-04, 18:04   Link #3032
Qikz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omusubi View Post
I think Doughnuts wrote an excellent explanation on this.
As a Japanese, I'd like to add a bit in my bad English.
英語が悪いですか・・・いいえ違いますあなたは英語が凄いね!

宜しくね

If what I said actually makes any sense, basically what I'm saying is your English is very good.

So don't worry about it, your English was better there than half of the English speakers who use the net. Going on Facebook makes me cry sometimes.
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Old 2010-07-05, 03:33   Link #3033
Omusubi
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Thanks Qikz.

The difference between a 手帳 and a ノート quiz is interesting.
I think thesaurus dictionaries or Google image search helps a lot.
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Old 2010-07-05, 08:37   Link #3034
Honeysuckle
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We Japanese use "手帳" for "palm-sized notebook" (often with calender,
can be a small diary), I guess.
In December and January, many "手帳"s are sold in stationery shops.

類語国語辞典 (大野晋 浜西正人 角川書店)では、
『帳面:文字などを書くための紙をとじたもの』
の項目に "ノート" や "手帳" があり、
説明はそれぞれ、「ノートブックの略。帳面。筆記帳。雑記帳」
「心覚えを書くためなどの小さな帳面 (手帖)」となっています。


生徒手帳:手帳 + student ID + school rules + School song
警察手帳:+ Police ID (ja wikipedia "警察手帳" is linked en eikipedia "Police notebook")
預金通帳(貯金通帳): passbook or bankbook

トリビア:中学、高校ではID兼用の生徒手帳、大学だと独立した学生証、というケースが多い気 がします。
確か「涼宮ハルヒの憂鬱」に、SOS団設立の申請をハルヒに命じられたキョンが、
生徒手帳の同好会設立の規定が書かれたページを読むシーンがありました。
(あ、英語で始めたのに結局日本語だ。スミマセン)

Last edited by Honeysuckle; 2010-07-05 at 11:08. Reason: Grammar
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Old 2010-07-05, 13:38   Link #3035
Raiga
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I think that clears it up a bit, thanks. So a 手帳 might be similar to what we call an "agenda" or "planner" here? (looks like this)

I'm asking because there was an example in a textbook I'm reading, that went:

それは ノートですか。
…いいえ、そうじゃ ありません。手帳です。

Which kind of confused me, especially because it was an early lesson. XD
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Old 2010-07-05, 13:46   Link #3036
Honeysuckle
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If you are tired of studying Japanese,
please watch this video and forgive Japanese.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sAHN...eature=related
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Old 2010-07-05, 14:47   Link #3037
yononaka
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Some additional stuff about 手帳、 ノート and other words related to taking notes and writing things down from 類義語使い分け辞典 for those interested.

「ノートする・ノートをとる」は授業や講義の内容・何か思いついたことを書きとめること。「ノート」は書き とめるための、同型の紙を何十枚かとじた物。ほかに「フットノート(脚注)・ハイ〔ブルー〕ノート」など、 書きとめたもの・音楽の調子を表したりする。「メモ(を)する・メモをとる」はメッセージや買い物をする品 名など、忘れないように簡単に書いておくこと。メモするための小さな紙(の束)は「メモ(用紙 )」。
「筆記(速記)する」は「筆記試験〔用具〕・口述筆記・速記記号」など、見たり聞いたり尋ねられたことを、 紙・用紙・ノートなどに(速く)書くこと。「記入する」は申請用紙・解答用紙などの所定の欄に、必要事項を 書き入れたり、本の空白などに思いついたことを書き込むこと。
「帳面」は外来語「ノート」の漢語的表現。ほとんど使われていない。「手帳」は長期の使用・携帯に耐え、見 栄えをよくするために、表紙が丈夫にできている 815cm くらいの大きさのノート。年間の予定が書き込めるように、カレンダー式になっている物が多い。「ノート」は これよりも大きいが、最大の「大学ノート」で A4 判の大きさ。「帳簿」は金銭の収支・物品の出し入れなど、会計上の必要事項を記入するノート。
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Old 2010-07-07, 14:45   Link #3038
Toleen
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thanx ^_^
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Old 2010-07-08, 23:59   Link #3039
Theowne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honeysuckle View Post
If you are tired of studying Japanese,
please watch this video and forgive Japanese.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sAHN...eature=related
Haha.....

I have to admit, I miss the days when I thought I was a bigshot for being able to figure out basic sentences (the kind that no one in Japan actually uses in speech, apparently). Now that I've moved onto "intermediate" stage, it's finally hitting me, the sheer amount of I still need to learn: all the little quirks, heaps of vocabulary, the little strange exceptions, the idiomatic expressions, all these little things that you take for granted about your native language, you have to re-learn for another. And boy, that can be a pain. Still, it's fun, mostly because Japanese is delightfully logical. A nonsensical, inconsistent language like English, on the other hand....
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Old 2010-07-09, 01:32   Link #3040
Sin of Memories
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@_@ I think I am going to go grab rosetta stone....
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