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Old 2010-07-24, 05:57   Link #3081
demetris
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Cyprus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post

I ended up writing the kanji and english meaning in all of the top and bottom margins, still got another 100 pages to go

It's up to you, but for the light novels I'm reading (my new challenge for this year), in pencil, i'm writing the readings and kanji in the book, so i can refer to it if I'm truly at a loss while focusing on the prose itself.
Got my first Japanese novel today Kind of exciting.

Probably, I will pencil the readings in the book (pardon me for verbing a noun btw) and keep the rest of the notes elsewhere. In a blog maybe.
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Old 2010-07-24, 08:20   Link #3082
Orizuru
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Nice to meet you!
I'm Japanese who came here for the first time.I am amazed that everyone is studying hard about Japanese language and culture.
I am not good at English...but I will work hard to learn English through reading this forum.

...I doubt if I am writing correct English...;;
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Old 2010-07-24, 08:25   Link #3083
demetris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orizuru View Post
Nice to meet you!
I'm Japanese who came here for the first time.I am amazed that everyone is studying hard about Japanese language and culture.
I am not good at English...but I will work hard to learn English through reading this forum.

...I doubt if I am writing correct English...;;
I'm new here as well, but welcome.
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Old 2010-07-24, 08:32   Link #3084
Doraneko
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orizuru View Post
Nice to meet you!
I'm Japanese who came here for the first time.I am amazed that everyone is studying hard about Japanese language and culture.
I am not good at English...but I will work hard to learn English through reading this forum.

...I doubt if I am writing correct English...;;
Welcome!

Your English is far better than my Japanese (or maybe even my English ). We would certainly appreciate if you could share your knowledge regarding the language and culture of Japan. Please enjoy your stay here. See you around!

Quote:
Originally Posted by demetris View Post
A critical question for the beginner/intermediate people who read light novels:
Would you annotate the book (put furigana readings, mark grammatical functions, vocabulary), would you do so in a dedicated notebook or you won't annotate what you are reading at all?
Personally I have never annotated stuff on my novels as I sometimes resell them .

Although I have a dedicated notebook for grammar and vocabulary notes, recently I have become so lazy that I have never opened it for almost a year.

I mostly just check the history of my electronic dictionary for revision.
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Old 2010-07-26, 00:24   Link #3085
Aaerul
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ちょっと聞きたいんですけど…

仮定形+ば
I am running into this construction quite often. Normally since it is hypothetical I would translate it as 'if'. But here I am certain it is not If. Some other person told me that this form can be translated as 'soon after'. But that doesn't fit in the below example either...

交通事情によって30分で行けることもあれば1時間以上かかることもある。

any ideas ty.
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Old 2010-07-26, 04:03   Link #3086
Orizuru
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Quote:
ちょっと聞きたいんですけど…

仮定形+ば
I am running into this construction quite often. Normally since it is hypothetical I would translate it as 'if'. But here I am certain it is not If. Some other person told me that this form can be translated as 'soon after'. But that doesn't fit in the below example either...

交通事情によって30分で行けることもあれば1時間以上かかることもある。

any ideas ty.
This expression is neither 'If' nor 'soon after'.

30分で行けることもあれば1時間以上かかることもある。
         ↓↓
Sometimes we can arrive there in 30 minutes,sometimes it take us more than an hour to arrive there.


for example...

テレビを見ることが好きな人もいれば本を読むことが好きな人もいる。
         ↓↓
Some people are fond of watching television,while the others prefer to read a book. 


Sorry...It is difficult for me to explain this expression

Last edited by Orizuru; 2010-07-26 at 05:30.
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Old 2010-07-26, 05:42   Link #3087
Honeysuckle
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Location: jpn
ば[助詞]
2-5 口語の活用語の仮定形に接続して、同趣の事柄を並べる。
---広辞苑第三版
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Old 2010-07-26, 05:59   Link #3088
Doraneko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honeysuckle View Post
ば[助詞]
2-5 口語の活用語の仮定形に接続して、同趣の事柄を並べる。
---広辞苑第三版
Random translation for anyone interested:

Quote:
BA [particle]

2.5 Connected with the conditional conjugated form in colloquial speech, it is used for lining up matters of the same subject.

~ The Koujien Dictionary (3rd Edition)
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Last edited by Doraneko; 2010-07-26 at 06:10.
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Old 2010-07-27, 02:18   Link #3089
Aaerul
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Thank you. Helped me a ton
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Old 2010-07-27, 09:20   Link #3090
Tenken's Smile
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How do you say "Please excuse my Japanese" (because it's not good)?

And how to say, "Thank you for spending your time reading my letter"?
I don't know how to say = "[ spending your time ] kono tegami wo yonde kudasatte arigatou gozaimasu"
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Old 2010-07-27, 18:07   Link #3091
Mystique
Honyaku no Hime
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: In the eastern capital of the islands of the rising suns...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenken's Smile View Post
How do you say "Please excuse my Japanese" (because it's not good)?

And how to say, "Thank you for spending your time reading my letter"?
I don't know how to say = "[ spending your time ] kono tegami wo yonde kudasatte arigatou gozaimasu"
Just add sumimasen, and it's fine. That says everything and nothing in one word
日本語はまだまだので、すみませんです。
nihongo wa mada mada no de, sumimasen desu.
(there are probably a billion ways to say it, depending on who you're saying it to, so I'm giving a generic one that I often use)

As for the other, the 'yonde kudasatte' already has the emotional nuance of 'going out of your way to read my 'lame ass letter', Japanese are a humble lot. Once you start tossing in keigo, the humility aspect is in your sentence and the feeling conveyed, so no need to literally translate everything little thing.
English is literal, Japanese is contextual.

手紙を読んでくれてあるがとう!
tegami wo yonde kurete arigatou! (close mate)
手紙を読んでいただいて、ありがとうございます
tegami wo yonde itadaite, arigatou gozaimasu (normal generic keigo)

I asked my friend about the difference between kurete and moratte and she said that it's the same thing...but moratte is used when someone you don't know too well does you a favour.
Like...

お母さんは手紙を読んでくれた
店員は手紙を読んでもらった
My mother read my letter.
The shop clerk read my letter.

もらうVS くれる、ニュアンスによって、どう違いますか。 復習したいなぁ。。
All that comes to mind now is Bruce Lee's famous line in "Enter the Dragon"

Lee: *slaps the kid's head*
Don't think, feel~~
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Old 2010-07-28, 02:09   Link #3092
Doraneko
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
店員は手紙を読んでもらった。
The shop clerk read my letter.
店員手紙を読んでもらった。
Or if you had intended to say that "the clerk has his letter read by someone else", then your sentence would have been correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
もらうVS くれる、ニュアンスによって、どう違いますか。 復習したいなぁ。。
In もらう, the benefited party is the subject, whereas in くれる, the benefiting party is the subject. Accordingly the particles to use are also different.
Quote:
私はBからCをもらった。/ 私はBにCをやってもらった。
I received C from B. / B did C for me (upon request).

Bは私にCをくれた。/ Bは私にCをやってくれた。
B gave C to me. / B (actively) did C for me.

It follows that くださる (from くれる) highlights that the action-in-question is initiated by the benefiting party. This inherently implies that the benefited party is thankful for the action.
Quote:
教えて下さってありがとうございます。
Thank you very much for teaching me.
(Implied: thank you for taking the initiative to teach me.)
On the other hand, いただく (from もらう) highlights that the benefiting party did the action-in-question on request of the benefited party. This inherently implies that the benefited party owes the benefiting party a favour.
Quote:
ご協力頂きありがとうございます。
Thank you very much for your assistance.
(Implied: thank you for responding to my request for help and lent me a hand.)

いただく is regarded as more polite than くださる by many. This may be attributable to the fact that many people think that the feeling of owing something is heavier than a simple feeling of gratefulness. It is true that traditional linguists separate the use of two very clearly. For example, they would oppose to the use of ていただいてありがとう as they find it grammatically unsound. Nonetheless in modern daily use the two are largely interchangeable.

Distinguishing the two in normal form maybe more of a headache as they are less interchangeable. For example if you'd like to thank someone for giving you a can of beer:
Quote:
O ビールを奢ってくれてありがとう。
X ビールを奢ってくれてすみません。
X ビールを奢ってもらってありがとう。
O ビールを奢ってもらってすみません。
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Last edited by Doraneko; 2010-07-28 at 08:56.
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Old 2010-07-28, 18:35   Link #3093
Tenken's Smile
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Above the Sky
@Mystique: ご協力頂きありがとうございます。

More questions How do you translate this into Japanese?
---> "In my humble opinion, Mr. A is more honest than Mr. B because he isn’t afraid to show what he is (personality-wise). Mr. A is Mr. A inside and out; he is blunt, never to decorate his words, unless for some good reasons (such as: testing/eliciting people's reactions)."
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Old 2010-07-31, 07:45   Link #3094
Orizuru
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Quote:
More questions How do you translate this into Japanese?
---> "In my humble opinion, Mr. A is more honest than Mr. B because he isn’t afraid to show what he is (personality-wise). Mr. A is Mr. A inside and out; he is blunt, never to decorate his words, unless for some good reasons (such as: testing/eliciting people's reactions)."

私見ですが、AさんはBさんより正直者です。何故ならAさんは自分自身を表現することを恐れな いからです。
Aさんは率直で、何か理由(他の人の反応を見たい時など)がない限り自分の言葉を飾ったりすることは決して ありません。
Quote:
Mr. A is Mr. A inside and out;
Aさんは中も外もAさんです(?)
Sorry,I didn't get this sentence...
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Old 2010-08-01, 19:44   Link #3095
Raiga
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 22
Quick question:

Would I call a college professor by the 先生 honorific or should I say 博士 or something else?
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Old 2010-08-02, 02:16   Link #3096
Mystique
Honyaku no Hime
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: In the eastern capital of the islands of the rising suns...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
Quick question:

Would I call a college professor by the 先生 honorific or should I say 博士 or something else?
Direct address as sensei as that's typically used for anyone in a profession that kinda 'guides or teaches' you generally.
(Even mangaka's are referred to as <name> sensei)
The hakase however, I guess it depends on the person if they want to be directly address as so.
I know on offical newsletters or pamphlets, they'd refer to that but in a general conversional level, not to sure.

Doesn't sound like a clear cut A vs B matter for me, but that be my two pence there, others may know better.
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Old 2010-08-02, 03:40   Link #3097
ryohei
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kyoto, Japan
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
Quick question:

Would I call a college professor by the 先生 honorific or should I say 博士 or something else?
I always call my professor "<name> sensei".
Doctor and Professor are very formal, so I don't use them in casual conversation.
And professor is professor. Of course s/he has doctoral degree, but professor isn't called doctor, s/he is professor. This is western manner.
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Old 2010-08-18, 14:03   Link #3098
ditn
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Belgium
Age: 29
I have a couple more questions

kyū what does ū mean here ?
what is the meaning of the surfix after words like oni one name,... politeness level?
And last something i was wondering,are verbs in japnese conjugated
like in french you have
je suis
tu est
il est
.....
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Old 2010-08-18, 22:36   Link #3099
Raiga
tl;dr
 
 
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Age: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditn View Post
I have a couple more questions

kyū what does ū mean here ?
what is the meaning of the surfix after words like oni one name,... politeness level?
And last something i was wondering,are verbs in japnese conjugated
like in french you have
je suis
tu est
il est
.....
You mean the line over the u? That means it's a long syllable. Alternate romanization is "kyuu," in kana that would be written as きゅう

The honorific is... uh, something like that. Like, depends on if you're addressing someone older than you/senior in a school or business/position of authority, etc. etc. Someone else can explain it better than I could, I'm sure. :\

And yes verbs in Japanese conjugate. To be more specific the language is agglutinative, which is kind of like super-conjugating (once you conjugate a verb you could conjugate it again and again, almost indefinitely).
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Old 2010-08-20, 10:44   Link #3100
Omusubi
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: seaside somewhere
"Teaching" Japanese

Hi

I happened to teach Japanese to a person whose mother tongue is English.
What point of Japanese grammar would be a big problem for Japanese learners?
Could someone tell me your opinion? Unfortunately, I can't manage to be objective to Japanese language.
I want to take your opinion into account, to make a better study plan for my first student.

This thread is full of hints. I have been reading this thread for 2-3 days.


Thanks.

(I know that the thread title is not "teaching Japanese", an inversed theme. hehe)
(Japanese character system is quite odd. I'm going to postpone those runes and teach actual sound first)
(It would be great that there's a summary of this thread somewhere. 155 pages are very tough.)
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