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Old 2008-11-27, 17:48   Link #1821
LeoXiao
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Vereinigte Staaten
Age: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHonour View Post
I agree with that part on Japanese. Compared to Chinese, it's easier to read and I read it faster than Chinese.

Having only a mediocre proficiency (i.e. usage in most everyday situations but not professionally), I tend to be quite bad at reading Chinese.
Really? I find that as long as you know the characters well, Chinese can be read very quickly.
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Old 2008-11-28, 08:38   Link #1822
ZephyrLeanne
On a sabbatical
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Wellington, NZ
Age: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHonour View Post
I agree with that part on Japanese. Compared to Chinese, it's easier to read and I read it faster than Chinese.

Having only a mediocre proficiency (i.e. usage in most everyday situations but not professionally), I tend to be quite bad at reading Chinese.

Chinese does have a few social modes too but not as distinct as Japanese. At the professional level, Chinese does sound a little different because they substitute some words for others, and can be confusing to those who didn't learn it.

For example, the word 'sorry' i.e. 對不起 (dui bu qi) will be substituted as 抱歉 (bao qian) in formal situation. It's somewhat similar to Japanese 'sumanai' 「すまない」 and 'moushi wake arimasen' 「申し訳ありません」.
Well, Chinese doesn't have "social modes" like in Japanese, but it actually depends on the flexibility of the user and the place.

抱歉 in Singapore is usually only for written form. Rarely is it used in speech. However, in China, it is more or less common, more so than 對不起 - the standard way of apologising in Singapore.

Chinese, IMO, helps me to understand Japanese literature to a certain extent. But not to actually read it.
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Old 2008-11-28, 14:11   Link #1823
risingstar3110
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
Have some questions want to ask you guys, any opinions would be appreciated ^^

First, i do not understand any Japanese atm, and next year, i want to select Japanese for my language electives. Here are some additional informations:
a) i do not plan to learn Japanese to understand manga/anime (i planned to learn it even before i understand what "anime/manga" means), and unless i can master it (which is not likely) i won't use it much in future traveling to Japan. "One more language could be handy in the future", that's what i think (as my job will require me to work with Japanese scientists anyway, but using English i think)
b) Overall i enjoy learning new things, even when i am quite lazy.
c) i do have a second language(so have some experiences at learning new languages), but it's not Chinese, so it would be troublesome since i have to learn all Kanji from the beginning.
d)Spent two weeks trying and now I memorized Hiragana and Katakana.
e) kind of anti-social, so probably would be hard for me to pick random people to practice a language >.>

So what do you guys think? Is there anything that i should know/consider given my situation? Since i will have quite a lots of free time before next term start, is there anything i should try, (to test my ability for example) or learn (to make future study easier)? Any other recommends? :P
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Old 2008-11-28, 18:15   Link #1824
nikorai
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risingstar3110
Well, I'm personally terrible at japanese and I'm completely self-taught but I highly recommend getting some textbooks. I use only those that have back-translation excercises. Otherwise it's quite hard to memorize new grammar and words.
Quote:
it would be troublesome since i have to learn all Kanji from the beginning
So it is. But for me it's not the worst thing in Japanese. Grammar is a much more difficult part for me.
Speaking of written excercises, for 2 years I always wrote kanji by hand. But recently I switched completely to using wapro. It's bad for developing writing skills and even worse for memorizing kanji but it greatly saves time.
スペースバーを押すと、ひらがなを漢字に変えることができます。とても便利ですね。
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Old 2008-11-28, 19:28   Link #1825
LeoXiao
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Quote:
Any other recommends? :P
if it took you but two weeks to memorize all of hiragana and katakana, then it probably means that it won't be too much of a waste of time if you try to learn the rest of the language's basics.

here's what i would do:
a) get an audio set of Japanese lessons and study
b) using said lessons to build up knowledge of core language component, get lists of important vocabulary. Vocab is the hardest part of any language IMO because it is boring to learn (even more so than grammar) and very easy to forget if you don't immediately start to reinforce it.
c) watch a bunch of videos with Japanese audio (most likely you already do this since you're on this site) to get a better feel for the sound.
d) find a Japanese person or someone who knows the language. this is hard so only do it if you have someone available.

I did all these things and I picked up basic knowledge of the language rather quickly (in about half a year).
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Old 2008-11-28, 20:04   Link #1826
nikorai
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Quote:
it took you but two weeks
As for me it was a matter of 2 days, not weeks. Though I must admit the initial result was not 100% perfect. I had to refer to the help note for quite some time after that.
字幕がなしでテレビとかアニメとか見れるようにがんばりましょう。
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Old 2008-11-28, 20:56   Link #1827
LeoXiao
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikorai View Post
As for me it was a matter of 2 days, not weeks. Though I must admit the initial result was not 100% perfect. I had to refer to the help note for quite some time after that.
字幕がなしでテレビとかアニメとか見れるようにがんばりましょう。
Well I guess it depends on how hard you study them and reinforce the knowledge.
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Old 2008-11-28, 21:56   Link #1828
oompa loompa
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 28 37', North ; 77 13', East
Age: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by risingstar3110 View Post
Have some questions want to ask you guys, any opinions would be appreciated ^^

First, i do not understand any Japanese atm, and next year, i want to select Japanese for my language electives. Here are some additional informations:
a) i do not plan to learn Japanese to understand manga/anime (i planned to learn it even before i understand what "anime/manga" means), and unless i can master it (which is not likely) i won't use it much in future traveling to Japan. "One more language could be handy in the future", that's what i think (as my job will require me to work with Japanese scientists anyway, but using English i think)
b) Overall i enjoy learning new things, even when i am quite lazy.
c) i do have a second language(so have some experiences at learning new languages), but it's not Chinese, so it would be troublesome since i have to learn all Kanji from the beginning.
d)Spent two weeks trying and now I memorized Hiragana and Katakana.
e) kind of anti-social, so probably would be hard for me to pick random people to practice a language >.>

So what do you guys think? Is there anything that i should know/consider given my situation? Since i will have quite a lots of free time before next term start, is there anything i should try, (to test my ability for example) or learn (to make future study easier)? Any other recommends? :P
mmm get a textbook.. or some tapes.. 'nakama' is a good one (sorry i cant write japanese on my computer).ive found that initially basic japanese sentence structure and grammar is relatively simple ( no its not the same with every language ), and within a few months you should atleast be able to ask and respond to simple questions ( if you do self-study that is )
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Old 2008-12-01, 08:50   Link #1829
Butternuts
お金があればそれだけて生きることができ る
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: 西宮北口!!!
OMGOMG NONONONONO JLPT 2KYUU TEST THIS SUNDAY!!!


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

STUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUDYYYYYYYYYYY YYYYYYYYY

*watches anime*

>_______________>
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Old 2008-12-01, 11:00   Link #1830
Eddward
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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Hi. I'm new here as you might know, anyway I would like to ask one thing here.


Quote:
Hello = kon nichi wa
Spelled "konnichiha" when in kana, but "konnichiwa" is just as correct when still in romaji.

What do you mean with: "When in Kana"?.

Thanks Eddward.
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Old 2008-12-01, 11:12   Link #1831
Isegrim
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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A question concerning Kansai-ben.

分かれへん can mean either "can't understand" (negative potentialis) or "don't understand" (plain negation), but as far as it has been taught to me, 分かる does not have a potentialis. Is 分かれへん a correct expression, or should I go with simply 分からん ?
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Old 2008-12-01, 11:39   Link #1832
nikorai
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Eddward
Quote:
What do you mean with: "When in Kana"?.
In kana it's like this - こんにちは。
は is pronounced wa in this case (see basic grammar rules).

Isegrim
Quote:
Is 分かれへん a correct expression, or should I go with simply 分からん ?
Perhaps it'd be best to check this discussion thread:
http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp...il/q1112406061
Among other things the replies point out the differences between Kyoto and Osaka dialects.
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Last edited by nikorai; 2008-12-01 at 13:23.
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Old 2008-12-01, 12:29   Link #1833
RandomGuy
ここに居ってんねん
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Osaka
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isegrim View Post
A question concerning Kansai-ben.

分かれへん can mean either "can't understand" (negative potentialis) or "don't understand" (plain negation), but as far as it has been taught to me, 分かる does not have a potentialis. Is 分かれへん a correct expression, or should I go with simply 分からん ?
Both 分かへん and 分からん are equally correct; I hear them both all the time from students who don't study. 分かれへん is theoretically possible, but I've never heard it as such (though maybe 彼女と別れへん would work). I'd say, stick to the regular conjugation for the sake of non-ambiguity. 理解できへん/でけへん/できひん also works for the meaning you're trying to express, though obviously it's no longer a conjugation of 分かる.

From what I've seen, a lot of Osaka speakers actually use the passive conjugation, instead of the actual potential, in yodan verbs — the one that sticks in my mind is from trying to find shoes that fit, and being repeatedly told "はいられへん". Yeah, I guess I'll go with the Converse, again.

Last edited by RandomGuy; 2008-12-07 at 07:54.
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Old 2008-12-02, 17:04   Link #1834
Isegrim
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Kinki
Age: 28
おおきに!
えらい難儀やねん、関西弁
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Old 2008-12-02, 20:36   Link #1835
nikorai
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Isegrim
どう致しまして。お役に立ててうれしいです。
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Last edited by nikorai; 2008-12-03 at 14:53.
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Old 2008-12-06, 16:41   Link #1836
Mueti
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Join Date: Dec 2006
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Tomorrow's gonna be a relaxed day. Four hours by train, four hours JLPT, four hours back.
I'm not so confident anymore though, didn't learn anything in the past few weeks. I just can hope that all my reading will make up for it somehow. And hopefully I won't be too unsure about the result once it's over; I imagine that having no idea of whether or not I passed for about three months wouldn't be very cool...
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Old 2008-12-06, 17:52   Link #1837
Butternuts
お金があればそれだけて生きることができ る
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: 西宮北口!!!
People who are taking the JLPT today, good luck.

As for me I'm taking the 2kyuu, no confidence whatsoever, but ill give it a wing.

Had no prior test experiences, but i did takes some practice test...so maybe god is smiling towards me xD


ANYWAY GOOD TO LUCK TO ALL WHO IS TAKING THE JLPT

1hr and counting,,,,,
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Old 2008-12-07, 01:59   Link #1838
DarkHonour
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Join Date: May 2008
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Age: 27
Haha, it's over for me.

I got raped by it.
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Old 2008-12-07, 03:22   Link #1839
Cut-Tongue
ボクサッチ!
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Seattle
Age: 34
Is it kosher to ask for translations in this thread?

edit: well Ill just ask. Trying to describe my son's GUR symptoms to my mother in law. Whats the Japanese terms for 'heartburn' and 'stomach acid' in romanji? Please don't transliterate 'heartburn' as I imagine that would sound scary.
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Old 2008-12-07, 03:34   Link #1840
Kinny Riddle
Gone for Good
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
I... I'm lost for words at the Listening for Lv2 that I did today.

First the announcer asks the question, something in the lines of "Where is Mr X going next month?" "1. Town A, 2. Town B, etc"

OK, so I paid attention to the conversation, "Blah, blah, blah..." Before I even figured out what was being said and which part was related to the question, the conversation was over. I was like, OMG...

As for the third part, Comprehension and Grammar, starting from Lv2, you really need to master your time management skills, because you only have 70 minutes. Good thing I did a mock the day before and realized it took me nearly 15 minutes just to comprehend the first passage without even answering the questions, and there are 58 questions.

My strategy was to start off with the Grammar section first, it wasn't easy, but I hope it pays off as I now have time to go back and re-check any mistakes I've made.

Then I worked my way backwards, starting with the comprehension texts that only have one question, since they're quick to read, and each of these questions give you a whopping 5 points.

Right, I'll just have to hope for the best when the result comes in March.
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