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Old 2004-08-30, 19:03   Link #21
SaberDicer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itachistyle
also remember how easily he beat 3 adult uchihas with full mastered sharingan when he was 12 or13!! it easily shows that itachi was really a special case even in the uchiha clan




do you really believe that?just an example, do you think that oro has a better justu speed??
Oro is a once in a decade genius, I don't see anyone saying that about Itachi. Also remeber Kakashi's reactions to both of them. He laughed at the prospect of facing Oro because it was so ridiculous, while he showed no hesitation while going to fight Itachi, and it was pretty accurate when he judged there strenghts, since he had known both of them. Also Itachi was afraid of Jiriaya ( well maybe not afraid, but from his comments and his not engaging he was hesitant to fight) while Oro showed no fear when engaging. Itachi is definetly strong, but hes not the strongest character in the series
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Old 2004-08-30, 20:11   Link #22
knubbe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaberDicer
Oro is a once in a decade genius, I don't see anyone saying that about Itachi. Also remeber Kakashi's reactions to both of them. He laughed at the prospect of facing Oro because it was so ridiculous, while he showed no hesitation while going to fight Itachi, and it was pretty accurate when he judged there strenghts, since he had known both of them. Also Itachi was afraid of Jiriaya ( well maybe not afraid, but from his comments and his not engaging he was hesitant to fight) while Oro showed no fear when engaging. Itachi is definetly strong, but hes not the strongest character in the series

Actually Kakashi was initially pretty confident in facing Orochimaru, but Orochimaru laughed at him and Kakashi realized how silly he was being. Kurenai and Asuma were pretty confident going against Itachi and Kisame but that turned out to be a joke, as did Kakashi vs Itachi. Kakashi hadn't seen Itachi for four years, but even when Itachi was 13 he'd probably defeat Kakashi. Itachi's fear of Jiraiya is most likely based on reputation while Orochimaru, having worked with Itachi in Akatsuki, has a much better idea of how strong Itachi is. Orochimaru admits he is weaker than Itachi and that he cannot beat him, simple as that. Whether Itachi can defeat Jiraiya has nothing to do with whether or not he can defeat Orochimaru, or whether Orochimaru can defeat Jiraiya.
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Old 2004-08-30, 20:20   Link #23
itachistyle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaberDicer
Oro is a once in a decade genius, I don't see anyone saying that about Itachi. Also remeber Kakashi's reactions to both of them. He laughed at the prospect of facing Oro because it was so ridiculous, while he showed no hesitation while going to fight Itachi, and it was pretty accurate when he judged there strenghts, since he had known both of them. Also Itachi was afraid of Jiriaya ( well maybe not afraid, but from his comments and his not engaging he was hesitant to fight) while Oro showed no fear when engaging. Itachi is definetly strong, but hes not the strongest character in the series

it s very simple:few people know or knew itachi well,don t forget that he left konoha when he was only 13 after he destroyed his clan so it s a bit normal that not many people (nobody ?)in konoha know his real power now that he s 17 and so don t rate him as high as the senins by example.
look by example at asuma:when he encountered first with itachi and kisame , he was absolutely not afraid and he said that he would smack them both !!!would he have been so confident if he knew that itachi is NOW stronger than oro???we know the answer.

in comparaison ,oro when he left konoha was already(or nearly) at his prime so effectively if kakashi compares itachi at 13 with oro at his prime then no surprise if he s more afraid by oro..

also,if you look well, the 2 situations were a bit different :when he met oro, he didn t need to fight cause oro did nothing(but still he was ready to ,cf chidori) but with itachi ,it was a bit different,itachi was attacking asuma and kurenai so it was a bit more urgent for him to fight probably ,also it s itachi who attacked first and all that kakashi did then was defending
also remember what kakashi said when he met first with itachi :"it s the worst situation we could be in...".

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaberDicer
He laughed at the prospect of facing Oro because it was so ridiculous, while he showed no hesitation while going to fight Itachi, and it was pretty accurate when he judged there strenghts, since he had known both of them
well he certainly knew itachi 's strenghts....when itachi was 13!!
but hehe now itachi is 17 and he is stronger than oro so 4 years are a long time(he has probably improved a lot during this time)...

Last edited by itachistyle; 2004-08-30 at 20:33.
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Old 2004-08-30, 21:54   Link #24
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oro himself was the genius of the sannin..except he's more sick and twisted...jiraiya's a pervert, and tsunade has a gambling problem....
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Old 2004-08-30, 22:13   Link #25
evil|plushie
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Originally Posted by gangsta905_04
uchihas are hardworking, intelligent, adaptable...etc
We've never really seen any indication of whether they're more hardworking/intelligent/adaptable than any of the other ninja clans. I mean, if we take Sasuke as an example, he's a good genin but I would hardly say he's any more hardworking/intelligent/adaptable than the average nin. The only thing that really stands out about him is his desire to prove himself, but then even that pales to the truly hardcore, like Neji, Rock and Naruto.
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Old 2004-08-30, 22:58   Link #26
Genei Killua
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The Uchiha's were the most feared clan in the Naruto world. This is mainly due to their bloodline talent, the sharingan. Itachi himself says that as a whole they are superior shinobi, and that only because of this can they be the police force of Konoha. So yeah, they're not all geniuses, but they're on average much more talented than other shinobi.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:01   Link #27
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Spoiler:
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:13   Link #28
evil|plushie
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Shrugs, everyone says that Sasuke was a genius, but I've yet to see any sign of him being extraordinarily talented. Same for the majority of the Uchihas. So I don't quite think they're a genius clan, just a very well respected clan.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:14   Link #29
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isnt what kakashi sed good enuf proof for u?
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:19   Link #30
evil|plushie
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No, not really since i've yet to witness any of Sasuke's so called genius. It may be I have too high a standard for someone to be considered a genius. The only people I consider a genius in Naruto would have to be Neji and Haku. For Naruto's age group at least.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:25   Link #31
Genei Killua
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I think Sasuke is a genius. He achieved in a month the speed that it took Lee years to achieve. Gai seemed very shocked at his improvements. Furthermore, while he was building up that speed, he learned an A-ranked jutsu, the chidori. This is some massive improvement.

Spoiler:


Orochimaru said he sensed potential in Sasuke's eyes greater than Itachi's. Now, if that's not genius, I don't know what is.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:35   Link #32
evil|plushie
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Lee's speed? You mean the speed he has while he's still wearing his uber heavy plates? -_- Keep in mind he was already fast when he fought with Lee, just not that fast. And he also has the sharingan to help him master any techniques. Though if you consider improving quickly an aspect of being a genius, I'd have to say Naruto is the biggest genius in the entire series considering how much he improves during the entire course of the manga.

Sasuke has a lot more drive than Itachi though. Itachi seems kinda laid back for a serial killer who killed off his entire clan. But then again, he still owned Sasuke at their last meeting.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:38   Link #33
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I went and re-watched the Itachi v Kakashi fight and it seemed as though Kakashi held his own through most of the match, He wasnt taking any hits, but he wasn't dealing any either. Itachi used his best technique on Kakashi, which is when Kakashi ultimatly messed up by looking into his eyes. Other than that it seemed in Itachi's favor but really not by that much. Itachi is only a level or two above Kakashi IMO, adding the mange increases that difference by a lot.

Also has anyone every considered what would happen if Itachi and Oro fought, and Oro used edo tensi and brought back the 3rd and the 4th to fight Itachi. I really doubt he'd be able to deal with either of them. And Itachi wouldn't find some counter to the technique, I mean the god of shinobi had to use the 4th's ultimate jutsu around it, I doubt some 17yr old kid could beat them. But what if Itachi used Tsukiyomi to cripple Oro/Sarutobi/Yodaime. Well it seems Tsukiyomi takes concentration, so you could easily make shadow clones and circle around Itachi, as he can't target everyone at once, and I doubt hes faster than the shinobi he'd be fighting, much less concentrate and use tsukiyomi.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:39   Link #34
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itachi knoes sasuke's weakness, he cant hate
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:42   Link #35
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Umm.... doesnt Sasuke hate his brother enough to kill him?
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:46   Link #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evil|plushie
Lee's speed? You mean the speed he has while he's still wearing his uber heavy plates?
No, I mean he attained Lee's without-the-uber-heavy-plates speed. That was the speed that Lee needed to be able to hit Gaara, and that's the speed that Sasuke got that allowed him to hit Gaara.

I would definitely say that being able to improve rapidly is the mark of a genius. It's not a sole requirement, but is a mark. Naruto is definitely a genius, but so is Sasuke. In addition to all my previous examples...

Spoiler:


He has defied expectation in many of his fights. Against Haku, against Orochimaru, against Temari, against the chakra-hands guy, against Gaara (first time,) and against the mist chuunin whom he whupped in the beginning. He was the number 1 rookie, and if he's not a genius, then maybe only Itachi, the 4th, and the Sandaime are.
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Old 2004-08-30, 23:58   Link #37
evil|plushie
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Well, him being no.1 in all subjects might have something to do with the fact that he comes from the Uchiha household, everyone expects results from him, his own father expects results for him and he was trained before he went to school.

Anyway, if you consider the ability to improve as being a genius, then Sasuke can be considered one. But he's hardly the best genius in the entire series though.
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Old 2004-08-31, 00:10   Link #38
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it's partly from his blood, but also because he works hard. check out how hard he worked as a kid. he was usually always out till late by himself. i remember at one point he collapsed from his shuriken throwing training. also, the fireball technique he worked all day and night for. he was never acknowledged by his dad till shortly before he died, itachi never helped him with anything, so that only leaves his mom, and i doubt her training had any real effect on him being number 1 in his class.
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Old 2004-08-31, 00:11   Link #39
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yea...neji is a genius...and u cood say shika is one too...cuz like wen he was facing temari...i didnt realize he'd use the natural resources to defeat her...
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Old 2004-08-31, 02:35   Link #40
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Everyone is making such a big deal out of Itachi because he killed the whole clan. That doesn't mean much, all we know is that he killed the whole clan, but not HOW he did it. Did anyone see him do the deed? Could he had help? It's not as if the whole clan went against him at once, if he did do it single handedly, it's most likely that he killed 1-3(4 at most) of them at a time to avoid getting swarmed. They probably never saw him coming. And finally, not every single Uchiha possess the Sharingan or even know martial arts.
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