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Old 2006-12-08, 11:02   Link #41
Sasuke_Akatsuki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILikeSquiReLz View Post
Don't forget the bluff about the Anbu's that Gai mentioned, and he didn't want to fight Kakashi either, he wanted no confrontations with anyone as far as I can tell. he never made a jesture to fight, it seems to me he just doesn't care, he has other motives and that a fight will only prolong him from what he needs to do. And I hate how people make it seem like he feared something from anyone, cause he really didn't(ie he didn't want to fight Kakashi either, but he still wasted him like he was nothing when it came to it) Jaraiya in the other case he seemed to show some concerns about(ie "I can't believe I had to use Ameterasu" Itachi), since he knew next to nothing about this Legendary sanin, and plus he has already used up alot of his Chakra, and even with Jaraiya present he didn't hold back on using Tsukyomi on Sasuke which I think says alot, even tho he knew Jaraiya was there he still used a technique he knows drains alot of his chakra.... just some things to think about.
Thank you!!!!! i hate when people say Jaraiya would beat Itachi!

Episode 83 [Kisame talking to Itachi about the Demon Fox]

Kisame:Perhaps you can fight him evenly...but i cannot, he's too strong.

Itachi:Yes, If we both fought him, we would both be killed...or in a good case, we might kill him, but we'd die along with him.Even if we had more men that, that result would not change.

Kisame: HIS CARETAKE IS A LEGENDARY SANNIN Konoha's Uchiha Clan and the Mist's Seven Shinobi-gatana seem petty before his name.

Itachi: Yes,but...All strong opponents have a weakness.


Episode 85 [After leaving Jaraiya's weird frogs stomach Tech by using Amaterasu]

Kisame: Why must we retreat?...You could've...
Itachi: There is no need to hurry with Naruto at his current level.Also, i must rest myself somewhere for a while....I had to use the Tsukuyomi and was even forced to use Amaterasu.

He didn't even acknowledge Jaraiya! He used the Tsukuyomi X2 and the Amaterasu which seems to use alot more Chakra!
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Old 2006-12-08, 12:45   Link #42
Uchiha_Gaara
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Itashi > oro = Jiraya at max
we really can't say that jiraya would ever beat itashi ! From what we know at this point asll leads to itashi > jiraya but we'll see...
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Old 2006-12-08, 13:37   Link #43
Suna no tate
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Originally Posted by Hunter View Post
Gai didn't talk about a second methods, it's merely a mistranslation.
He just said that a method was needed to fight someone just by looking at his feet but that he hadn't the time to teach it to Kurenai and Asuma.
Mistranslation? Yes I've heard that before but how credible the source is who knows. Regardless of if gai knows a second way, this thread is essentially a discussion of alternate ways to counter the sharingan. Chiyo definitely said there were several ways (no mistranslation there).

Personally I find the fact that someone touching you can disrupt genjutsus particularly useful. In theory if you have a kage bunshin or two around, if you get hit with genjutsu, one can fight off the attacker and the second can touch you and pull you out of it. That would neutralize the genjutu. With that you could look at him in the eye all you want (provided he doesn't do the MS) since as soon a clone sees you're hit, it can touch you and pull you out. (THIS IS ALSO WHY I THINK NARUTO WILL KICK ITACHI'S MONKEY ASS. ITACHI IS NOT ALLOWED TO KILL HIM WHICH MEANS NO MS AT ALL).

As for the suggestive effects of the sharingan that he used on zabuza, I'm not really sure how thats countered. To tell the truth, it seems it only works on weak ninja since Kakashi certainly doesn't do it on any of the Akatsuki members. But zabuza's not weak though...so that area is a little confusing.

Countering the MS is more difficult as those attacks are near instant and cause knockout type damage. Tsunade would be fine since she can heal from near death and so would Hidan since pain doesn't really do anything to his mental state of mind. A normal ninja however would not be so lucky. Still itachi has to convert his eye to the MS and then use the technique. We know that while he can sustain an activated sharingan eye, he can't do so with the MS eye. Rather he turns it on specifically to do the techniques and then turns it off. That takes time, a couple seconds which is enough for a skilled ninja to respond. My response would be kage bunshin (about 10) and spread them out coupled with taijutsu. The idea is as long as he can't find the real one, the cost of amaterasu and tsukuyomi are too high and so he can't use it since he may hit a clone. Tsukuyomi genjutu isn't an area affecting jutsu and amaterasu covers only about the size of 2 doorways (if 2 doorways tired him out so much, you really think he can cover a wider area? that may kill him! 2 doorways is about the size for amaterasu). The point is he'll have targeting issues and that will keep him from using the MS.

Its not sure fire, but its a start.
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Old 2006-12-08, 15:00   Link #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suna no tate View Post

Personally I find the fact that someone touching you can disrupt genjutsus particularly useful. In theory if you have a kage bunshin or two around, if you get hit with genjutsu, one can fight off the attacker and the second can touch you and pull you out of it. That would neutralize the genjutu. With that you could look at him in the eye all you want (provided he doesn't do the MS) since as soon a clone sees you're hit, it can touch you and pull you out. (THIS IS ALSO WHY I THINK NARUTO WILL KICK ITACHI'S MONKEY ASS. ITACHI IS NOT ALLOWED TO KILL HIM WHICH MEANS NO MS AT ALL).
...... Dude seriously? Naruto? He didn't kill Kakashi...He'd just go into Naruto's mind and eat cookies in Naruto's face for 72 hours and watch he go crazy.
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Old 2006-12-08, 15:14   Link #45
Suna no tate
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Itachi cannot kill naruto under any circumstances or the AL and the rest of akatsuki will make him pay for it. That mean amaterasu is out of the question. Tsukuyomi is also out of the question as it has been said to be able to kill a person because of the mental stress. If you see the fight that itachi and naruto had, itachi tried to have naruto go to sleep with genjutsu and also tried to use genjutsu to in a way hypnotize naruto into coming with him. Neither worked since one genjutsu was to weak to work on naruto and the other was broken by chiyo and sakura touching him.

I say naruto has the best chance of beating itachi in battle because 1)itachi cannot kill him, 2)itachi cannot use his best jutsus (not just because the reasons stated about. there are also problems that occur when naruto goes into a kyubi state that would seriously make itachi think twice about using tsukuyomi and amaterasu), 3) naruto's bunshins can break whatever genjutsu itachi uses through contact and chakra release to a genjutsu trapped naruto. We've seen that itachi and kakashi's level of taijutsu are about equal. So far itachi is a trickster like naruto and thats where the battle will really be fought. But in truth, it should be clear that of all the people around, naruto is the person who starts off on the best ground against itachi simply because naruto can fight to kill, while itachi can only fight to incapicitate.
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Old 2006-12-08, 19:31   Link #46
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Originally Posted by Suna no tate View Post
Itachi cannot kill naruto under any circumstances or the AL and the rest of akatsuki will make him pay for it. That mean amaterasu is out of the question. Tsukuyomi is also out of the question as it has been said to be able to kill a person because of the mental stress. If you see the fight that itachi and naruto had, itachi tried to have naruto go to sleep with genjutsu and also tried to use genjutsu to in a way hypnotize naruto into coming with him. Neither worked since one genjutsu was to weak to work on naruto and the other was broken by chiyo and sakura touching him.

I say naruto has the best chance of beating itachi in battle because 1)itachi cannot kill him, 2)itachi cannot use his best jutsus (not just because the reasons stated about. there are also problems that occur when naruto goes into a kyubi state that would seriously make itachi think twice about using tsukuyomi and amaterasu), 3) naruto's bunshins can break whatever genjutsu itachi uses through contact and chakra release to a genjutsu trapped naruto. We've seen that itachi and kakashi's level of taijutsu are about equal. So far itachi is a trickster like naruto and thats where the battle will really be fought. But in truth, it should be clear that of all the people around, naruto is the person who starts off on the best ground against itachi simply because naruto can fight to kill, while itachi can only fight to incapicitate.
It's been shown that Itachi can use Tsukuyomi non-lethally if he chooses to. In fact, the jutsu has never been shown to kill anyone. Even as a young child, Sasuke was able to survive 2 Tsukuyomi attacks in one night. I'm sure Naruto (who also has the healing powers of the Kyuubi ) could withstand an attack without dying. He would not be able to use Amaterasu, but he only seems to use that when he's in a desperate and unescapable situation anyway. And Itachi certainly wouldn't feel the need to be careful about hurting Naruto. As we've seen Akatsuki members won't hesitate to beat a jinchuuriki into an unconscious bloody pulp if necessary. Also, the point about dispelling the genjutsu with kage bunshin will only work for sure if Naruto enters battle having already made kage bunshin (which he almost never does). Otherwise, Itachi could immediately trap in a genjutsu before he has a chance to perform the technique. I don't think Naruto can defeat Itachi one-on-one yet. If he did face Itachi, he would need the support of a squad or at least one other comrade to stand a chance.
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Old 2006-12-09, 18:10   Link #47
Suna no tate
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Tsukuyomi to me, if not used to torture as in kakashi's case, is no different from other genjutsu then. After all, it'd simple achieve the same effect that Itachi's finger genjutsu did. In my reference to it, I meant the form that kakashi was exposed to. Tsukuyomi used to show disturbing images and cause mental stress is somewhat stupid on itachi's part, as other less chakra consuming genjutsu. Personally thinking, i don't see a tsukuyomi other than one that causes kakashi type damage bringing down naruto, with his high recovery and strong mind. Genjutsu may put him to sleep though...


Still its one thing to kill someone and another thing to beat him up badly. If I give you a gun and say don't kill the target, you might have a little difficulty especially if he's running around trying to kill you. Itachi's gun is his wide variety of killing techniques. He may have trouble using those in a non killing fashion. Its a little different for Hidan and Kakuzu as basically they could do whatever they wanted to the biju. Do enough damage and simply, the host reverts. I don't think you can kill a biju thats sealed in a jinchuuriki...
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Old 2006-12-09, 18:50   Link #48
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Originally Posted by Deth moad ue View Post
So i've two questions RE: Gai's methods. It seems there are two. One is to concentrate on the feet of the user. The other is unknown.

1. What do you all think this other method is? If I recall, Gai mentioned that he didn't have time to teach the others in the heat of the moment. the phrasing makes me think that it's a painfully obvious.

Me guess is fighting with the eyes closed and relying on sound and changes in wind to fight...
of course, i don't think it's a very good method...as it doesn't account for jutsu or explosive bunshins and what have you...but short notice.
eyes closed? relying on sound?

Dude, Gai is not the guy from Ninja Scroll of Rurounin Kenshin.

He just look at Itachi's feet.

Quote:

2. Do you really think it would be effective against itachi, or even sasuke after a little growth? I don't. Gai's only had kakashi to train against...and His sharingan, powerful though it may be, does not have the same power as that of a true bloodline user...

It's kinda like practicing swinging at a nerf ball to train for Pro baseball in my eyes.


So..what say you all?
Gai would be safe from Sharingan genjutsu, but not from Itachi's jutsus, especially MS.
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Old 2006-12-10, 00:51   Link #49
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A good low-tech way to counter the Sharingan is lots and lots of smoke bombs. The Sharingan isn't the Byakugan, it can't see through things. It could probably see through a darkness Genjutsu, but not regular smoke. The smoke then puts the two people on a more level playing field.
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Old 2006-12-10, 01:11   Link #50
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Originally Posted by Yogi View Post
A good low-tech way to counter the Sharingan is lots and lots of smoke bombs. The Sharingan isn't the Byakugan, it can't see through things. It could probably see through a darkness Genjutsu, but not regular smoke. The smoke then puts the two people on a more level playing field.
Apparently not many are as smart as Kiba. But seriously, it wouldn't help much, because Uchiha are master in fire jutsu.
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Old 2006-12-10, 01:34   Link #51
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It's obvious. Gai uses his shiny white teeth to deliver a white flash that blinds Itachi. Game over.
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Old 2006-12-10, 02:02   Link #52
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Naruto vs. Itachi? Come on...Itachi doesn't even need his ultimates to put Naruto down...he snapped Sasuke's wrist quickly enough and I'm sure he could turn naruto into a pretzel in short order too on regular jutsus and fighting skills alone. He's not a one-trick pony, mind you, and it isn't like everything he has drops off after the MS...just look at Kakashi...he has MS but also has a whole slew of techniques...you think Itachi hasn't picked up on his fair share of uber jutsus over the years? Come on, don't be silly...

What we've seen so far of Itachi is that he's not one to aggravate a situation and go and kill people. He has his mission, and he is out to complete it. Heck, he had several opportunities to kill Asuma and Kakashi and Kurenai and the whole gang...he didn't.

Frankly, I don't think Itachi would lose to anyone alive 1v1 at the current moment, and if need be, he can obliterate them as well with Amaterasu.
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Old 2006-12-10, 09:26   Link #53
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Lol remeber the name of the series is naruto..

So one of the 3 cases can happen..

1) Naruto doesnt face Itachi (real) and he get killed by sum1 else..
2) Naruto doesnt face Itachi (real) .. because for some miracle they become allies..
3) Naruto faces Itachi (real) and for some miracle he wins...
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Old 2006-12-10, 12:12   Link #54
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Well in the end Sasuke faces itashi and naruto helps or naruto faces itashi and sasuke helps killing itashi.
Eithher way I think their both going to fight him together because alone neither as a chance and for the sake of the revenge thing Sasuke has got to be the one to kill him
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Old 2006-12-10, 12:14   Link #55
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Originally Posted by Yogi View Post
A good low-tech way to counter the Sharingan is lots and lots of smoke bombs. The Sharingan isn't the Byakugan, it can't see through things. It could probably see through a darkness Genjutsu, but not regular smoke. The smoke then puts the two people on a more level playing field.
Alternately, perhaps something like the Solar Flare from DBZ? It seems like that move would be devastating to a Sharingan user...
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Old 2006-12-10, 12:22   Link #56
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A possible way to couter and even turn to your favor the Amaterasu, since it burs every thing reflecetd in the eye, is to creat a mirror of ice/water kinda like Haku. Kisame could develop/know such a jutso...
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Old 2006-12-10, 12:23   Link #57
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Originally Posted by Uchiha_Gaara

Quote:
Well in the end Sasuke faces itashi and naruto helps or naruto faces itashi and sasuke helps killing itashi.
Eithher way I think their both going to fight him together because alone neither as a chance and for the sake of the revenge thing Sasuke has got to be the one to kill him
I think sasuke is gonna face him first and lose.. then naruto shows up and beats Itachi.. showing Sasuke that the way he gains power is wrong.. and true power comes from protecting others... something corny along those lines
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Old 2006-12-10, 12:27   Link #58
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I think that the lesson "Sasuke's way of gaining power is wrong" will be when Naruto becomes the greatest shinobi or Hokage or something like that... but Sasuke has got to kill Itashi. Itashi said himself the only one how can kill me is you!
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Old 2006-12-10, 22:03   Link #59
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Why do people continue to take what Itachi says as gospel truth? He has a good history of deception (fooling all of Konoha until he killed the Uchiha clan) and being wrong (Kakashi getting Mangekyou Sharingan without Uchiha blood.)
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Old 2006-12-11, 01:37   Link #60
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Originally Posted by Yogi View Post
Why do people continue to take what Itachi says as gospel truth? He has a good history of deception (fooling all of Konoha until he killed the Uchiha clan)
Then he wasnt a good deciever, because everyone in the village suspected he killed Shisui.

Quote:
and being wrong (Kakashi getting Mangekyou Sharingan without Uchiha blood.)
unless, Kishimoto hide a little fact, that Kakashi's mother is an Uchiha, or from Uchiha descent.
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